Cfx.re (FiveM) is now a part of Rockstar Games

[Claude_Lib]

2 hours ago, Tez2 said:

Do you think the FiveM team wouldn't have analyzed the legal agreements from top to bottom countless times?

 

That tweet by NTA of him being involved in the future too is telling me the deal must have been agreed upon in a way that doesn't give T2 leeway to (despite being unlikely) shut it down.

It could've very well been an offer they couldn't refuse, coupled with NDA.

Sorry if I sound like a doomer, but I just can't be positive about anything related to R* anymore.

[Relax.]

i hope that with this purchase it will mean that GTA VI online will have dedicated servers that are community made and have active admins with hopefully cross-play support, think like Battlefield.

 

so for example you fire up GTA online choose a server with hopefully 64 or more players and play for 6 hours and you level up and get some cash, next day you join another server and all your data is synced to your R* social club account and you continue where you left off but on PC instead of PS5 like yesterday!

 

that honestly would be so good for GTA and it will largely eliminate the hacker problems on PC as it's mostly due to peer to peer connections

[Jason]

4 hours ago, DuduLima said:

Oh well, here's 5 examples.

 

1- Zenimax/Bethesda, later smaller companies of Zenimax were integrated into XGS - (https://www.eurogamer.net/microsoft-buying-zenimax-parent-company-of-bethesda-id-software-and-more-report).

2- EA-Criterion merging specific teams to work on franchise after buying Criterion.. - (https://www.eurogamer.net/ea-merges-criterion-and-codemasters-cheshire-to-work-on-need-for-speed).

3- Embracer adquiring multiple studios, merging and buying assets and IP's. - (https://www.ign.com/articles/embracer-group-enters-agreement-to-acquire-eidos-crystal-dynamics-square-enix-montreal-and-more-tomb-raider-deus-ex).

4- Embracer after buying, rebranding PWC and Cryptic into Gearbox and merging companies under its umbrella later - (https://www.gamesindustry.biz/perfect-world-entertainment-rebrands-to-gearbox-publishing).

5- Tencent buying 1C and later merging and rebranding after becoming major shareholder - (https://www.shacknews.com/article/129033/1c-entertainment-acquired-by-tencent-set-to-rebrand-in-2022).

 

You've listed acquisitions, not situations where a larger company has acquired a studio and then, within 3 years, crippled said studio.

 

Smaller studios merging is also not an example of this, due to the constantly rising amount of resources required to develop AAA games studios merging or otherwise supporting other studios is not unusual. Some of this has happened because the studios being merged into others or sent to support other studios created commercial failures, all of their own doing. Volition for example has been moved under Gearbox at Embracer after releasing Saints Row 22.

 

There is absolutely zero trend of what you originally said.

[Moncastler]

It's understandable to be pessimistic given the recent circumstances, but this time I think it's different. Why would they shut down FiveM or RedM? They're both extremely popular and some of Rockstar's PC sales are made because of the existence of these 2 platforms. There's a clear demand for community made servers, shutting down everything would just trigger an unprecedented backlash and a revenue loss.

I think Rockstar finally understood that, to keep a game alive, they need the community contribution... One of the reasons of the failure of Red Dead Online IMO has to do with the absence of a content creator, which was one of the best (if not the best) additions to GTA Online. Rockstar incorporating Cfx.re reassures me that there'll be some sort of SixM and that community made servers will be a selling point of GTA VI.

I also wouldn't jump to quick conclusions when it comes to the grade of freedom that will be given to custom servers, it's too early to judge and in the short term I don't think there will be any changes. IMO the responsibility of the content available on a community made server will always be on the IP's owner, nobody has ever accused Cfx.re of using real life brands illegally because all they do is provide a platform to developers.

 

Cross-play and cross-progression should absolutely be implemented in GTA VI, not only everyone would be free to play on their platform of choice but at the same time it guarantees parity of treatment and a secure PC version. I am of the idea that GTA VI Online won't transition to a dedicated server model because it would essentially split the playerbase in macroregions (like NA, SA, EU, etc.), P2P IMO fits more a game like GTA. P2P can be made secure, relay server for example could check various things and at the same time they would completely remove the NAT problem (which is a big issue given that a huge percentage of residential connections are assigned to a private IPv4 address).

Edited August 14, 2023 by Moncastler

[Jason]

2 minutes ago, Moncastler said:

I am of the idea that GTA VI Online won't transition to a dedicated server model because it would essentially split the playerbase in macroregions (like NA, SA, EU, etc.), P2P IMO fits more a game like GTA.

 

P2P still creates that exact "problem.". There's no magic fix for latency, if you play with someone on the west coast USA while in Europe you're gonna lag.

 

Typically games that utilise a megashard (global server) model allow you to play with who you want on any supported server but you will default to a regional server.

 

There is frankly zero excuse for R* to avoid a dedicated server model for GTAO, and zero excuse for not having cross-play and progression. I mean Rocket League came out in 2015 by a then tiny developer and ran entirely on dedicated servers for it's matchmaking, virtually every single major online game nowadays also runs on dedicated servers. They aren't as unrealistic or as expensive as they used to be.

[Relax.]

13 minutes ago, Moncastler said:

I am of the idea that GTA VI Online won't transition to a dedicated server model because it would essentially split the playerbase in macroregions (like NA, SA, EU, etc.),

i disagree with you but your point would be valid if the player base isn't already split, when i fire up GTA online now i join the Asian server or region which is full of Indians and east Asian people and west Asian Arabs, you would join an EU region an American is split into 3 regions East, Central or Western, you would not find an American player in the EU region Organically unless that American player was invited by a player in the EU region's lobby. Dedicated servers would still allow for that

Edited August 14, 2023 by Relax.

[Claude_Lib]

I highly doubt they will allow hosting custom servers for Online2, because that would certainly mean unmoderated content. MAYBE they will have a master server which will serve a curated list of servers to connect to and MAYBE you will be able to connect to any server regardless directly via IP, but that's a huge MAYBE.

[Jason]

11 minutes ago, Claude_Lib said:

I highly doubt they will allow hosting custom servers for Online2, because that would certainly mean unmoderated content.

 

Which wouldn't be on them. The type of servers we're talking about have existed for yonks, particularly in games like PC FPS's. For the same reason video hosting sites don't get sued for all the copyrighted material they host, R* wouldn't either. The liability is on the server owner.

 

I do think if they do go down the custom server path we're more likely to see console have either curated servers or servers otherwise made with tools R* provide, while PC retains it's more open nature.

[Claude_Lib]

I forgot to mention, custom servers can also allow unrestricted access to all the game content without forcing the player to buy shark cards, thus severely harming Strauss Zeldick's financial wellbeing.

[Moncastler]

What I was trying to say is that with P2P you can have players all around the world in a single session, of course you're still going to lag with someone that is on the other side of the world but there won't be problems with players living in my region. Let's say I have a friend on the US West Coast, to play with him I would have to connect to a US West Coast server which results in me having 200ms of latency. Most players in that session will almost surely be from that region, so I would be at an extreme disadvantage and my overall experience would be horrible. Let's also say that in that session there's also someone from France: even if we're close geographically if I interact with him the total latency would be close to 400ms, but at least we're both having an horrible experience I guess.

Rocket League is a competitive game where it's crucial to have consistently the lowest amount of lag as possible, to achieve that you need to split the world in macro regions with their own dedicated servers. GTA is not a competitive game, having less than 60-70ms of delay is nice but not always needed. Going back to my previous example, between me and my friend there would be around 200ms of delay, but at least both him and me have the chance of having a decent experience with the other players in the session. Simple things like driving would also feel much better in a P2P scenario, maybe my friend would see a bit of teleporting if he's my passenger but that's far better than me not being able to control the vehicle... On Rocket League if you play on a distant server it's next to impossible to control your car.

 

7 minutes ago, Jason said:

I do think if they do go down the custom server path we're more likely to see console have either curated servers or servers otherwise made with tools R* provide, while PC retains it's more open nature.

I agree, and I also think that Rockstar could provide some server IPs as well. Doesn't Minecraft do something similar?

[Spider-Vice]

49 minutes ago, Moncastler said:

I agree, and I also think that Rockstar could provide some server IPs as well. Doesn't Minecraft do something similar?

Yes, they have Minecraft Realms, and I do think R* might do something similar in future (FiveM currently partners with Zap Hosting), whilst still not stopping self-hosted servers, again much like Minecraft.

 

I'm of the belief that FiveM might start using a R* sanctioned mod shop or similar down the line, for developers who wish to monetise, instead of Tebex (a cut of mod sales already goes to Cfx currently anyway). This way, R* can get a cut of mod sales, people who wish to buy paid mods to install on their servers can, and developers can also continue making a buck for more complex mods.

[Jason]

8 minutes ago, Moncastler said:

What I was trying to say is that with P2P you can have players all around the world in a single session, of course you're still going to lag with someone that is on the other side of the world but there won't be problems with players living in my region. Let's say I have a friend on the US West Coast, to play with him I would have to connect to a US West Coast server which results in me having 200ms of latency. Most players in that session will almost surely be from that region, so I would be at an extreme disadvantage and my overall experience would be horrible. Let's also say that in that session there's also someone from France: even if we're close geographically if I interact with him the total latency would be close to 400ms, but at least we're both having an horrible experience I guess.

Rocket League is a competitive game where it's crucial to have consistently the lowest amount of lag as possible, to achieve that you need to split the world in macro regions with their own dedicated servers. GTA is not a competitive game, having less than 60-70ms of delay is nice but not always needed. Going back to my previous example, between me and my friend there would be around 200ms of delay, but at least both him and me have the chance of having a decent experience with the other players in the session. Simple things like driving would also feel much better in a P2P scenario, maybe my friend would see a bit of teleporting if he's my passenger but that's far better than me not being able to control the vehicle... On Rocket League if you play on a distant server it's next to impossible to control your car.

 

There's still something you've all gotta ping so the server knows where you are and what you're doing. Traditionally a peer to peer hosted session in a game has one person who acts as the server host, so if you're EU and that person is USW, that's who your pinging. If that person has a bad connection then it impacts the lobby on a whole. If you ever played Call of Duty in the P2P days this is where the famous "host advantage" kicks in, having host in those games made certain guns extremely powerful.

 

Driving would feel the exact same, you're not sending literally every input to a server, so if you have 200ms latency and you go to turn left you're no waiting for the reply to turn left. What happens in those cases is the other players will see you skip/teleport or otherwise lag about. This can and will happen regardless of who hosts the server, be it a player or a dedicated server.

 

Dedicated servers generally improve the overall quality of a session while at the same time making it significantly more secure. The latency you suffer from joining a US friend isn't going to be solved by peer to peer and frankly people playing with friends in other continents is a bit of an edge case that's not worth sacrificing the overall quality of the online experience for.

[Jimbatron]

2 hours ago, Moncastler said:

It's understandable to be pessimistic given the recent circumstances, but this time I think it's different. Why would they shut down FiveM or RedM? They're both extremely popular and some of Rockstar's PC sales are made because of the existence of these 2 platforms. There's a clear demand for community made servers, shutting down everything would just trigger an unprecedented backlash and a revenue loss.

I think Rockstar finally understood that, to keep a game alive, they need the community contribution... One of the reasons of the failure of Red Dead Online IMO has to do with the absence of a content creator, which was one of the best (if not the best) additions to GTA Online. Rockstar incorporating Cfx.re reassures me that there'll be some sort of SixM and that community made servers will be a selling point of GTA VI.

I also wouldn't jump to quick conclusions when it comes to the grade of freedom that will be given to custom servers, it's too early to judge and in the short term I don't think there will be any changes. IMO the responsibility of the content available on a community made server will always be on the IP's owner, nobody has ever accused Cfx.re of using real life brands illegally because all they do is provide a platform to developers.

 

Cross-play and cross-progression should absolutely be implemented in GTA VI, not only everyone would be free to play on their platform of choice but at the same time it guarantees parity of treatment and a secure PC version. I am of the idea that GTA VI Online won't transition to a dedicated server model because it would essentially split the playerbase in macroregions (like NA, SA, EU, etc.), P2P IMO fits more a game like GTA. P2P can be made secure, relay server for example could check various things and at the same time they would completely remove the NAT problem (which is a big issue given that a huge percentage of residential connections are assigned to a private IPv4 address).

 

I agree in that my hunch is this is R*s mentality and why they have gone ahead with this acquisition. How they will handle a split in the player base I don't know - but whether the standard GTA multiplayer experience is P2P or dedicated servers, as soon as you allow custom servers runs by third parties as in the FiveM model, you do split the player base to a degree. My best guess is you'll have a browser window with in the main game which will allow you to access "standard multiplayer" (for want of a better phrase for it, what you get with GTAO now, just new map and features etc), but also get a list of custom servers you can join and filter by criteria, search by name, etc. That way technically once you make your choice, the player base is being split, they are all coming off the same launch pad, you make it very easy for the same individual to switch back and forth. If you've got Social Club integration, potentially there's no problem from you getting an invite from a friend from one to another (although I stand ready to be corrected if someone with more knowledge tells me that isn't technically possible).

 

1 hour ago, Claude_Lib said:

I forgot to mention, custom servers can also allow unrestricted access to all the game content without forcing the player to buy shark cards, thus severely harming Strauss Zeldick's financial wellbeing.

 

I agree there's no way they acquire Cfx.re without plans about how they're going to monetise it, or allow it to exist as some free alternative with no shark cards (or where any revenue is just going to a third party server host).

 

My guess is if they went for a browser window approach as above, where you could either join "standard multiplayer" or a custom server is that you'll need a GTA+ subscription to join the latter, or something similar. "Standard multiplayer" could still be fee, but Shark Cards offer a way to get in game purchases quicker. That way the safe and understood income source they've enjoyed since 2013 is still there, but if people go into custom servers instead, then they've got to be a paid monthly subscriber. So either way, R* win.

 

1 hour ago, Spider-Vice said:

Yes, they have Minecraft Realms, and I do think R* might do something similar in future (FiveM currently partners with Zap Hosting), whilst still not stopping self-hosted servers, again much like Minecraft.

 

I'm of the belief that FiveM might start using a R* sanctioned mod shop or similar down the line, for developers who wish to monetise, instead of Tebex (a cut of mod sales already goes to Cfx currently anyway). This way, R* can get a cut of mod sales, people who wish to buy paid mods to install on their servers can, and developers can also continue making a buck for more complex mods.

 

Shared revenue for content creators is a business model that's shown many times to be highly successful - the most obvious examples being YouTube, Twitch etc. If you had a system whereby you have to be a GTA+ subscriber to join customer servers (or ++ subscriber if they need to up it, etc), a cut of that revenue could go to the third party hosting a given server based on the number of players who join it etc. This incentivises content creation (with no incremental effort required from R*), and also regulates what's charged to a standard price (or something close to that) - covering off the point I think @Jason mentioned about some FiveM servers currently/historically charging extortionate fees.

 

My experience of the FIveM scene is limited to some very brief toe dips in the water - so I'm sure I'm missing loads of practical challenges. But it feels like there's a lot of potential to get this to work well.

 

For all the flak they get, I don't think Shark Cards are actually as bad as is often made out. Certainly, I found it completely possible to enjoy GTAO without every considering going near them, but R* clearly made a decent sum of of them from people who are (notionally) happy to do so voluntarily. Microtransactions in RDRO didn't seem to be as well configured to get the right balance in my view, but hopefully they have learnt from that. So I don't think there's an automatic reason to assume they will definitely cock up the monetisation of this new acquisition, although it's equally an easy thing to get wrong. I think the key is not to be too aggressive, and trust with a large enough player base you'll make the money off a huge volume of tiny transactions. That's what I suspect had been a large part of the Shark Card model's success - they didn't get too greedy with it.

 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Jimbatron
Auto correct messing up my text

[qwerty77]

Does anyone know how long cfxre have been in talks/working with R*? Surely the idea didn't pop up the day they actually acquired the studio.

 

Like does the announcement mean they can finally start working together or have they already been working together before the announcement?

[rollschuh2282]

3 minutes ago, qwerty77 said:

Does anyone know how long cfxre have been in talks/working with R*? Surely the idea didn't pop up the day they actually acquired the studio.

 

Like does the announcement mean they can finally start working together or have they already been working together before the announcement?

i imagine this isn´t something that just happens overnight.

so might have been a while in the talks already

[Jason]

29 minutes ago, qwerty77 said:

Does anyone know how long cfxre have been in talks/working with R*? Surely the idea didn't pop up the day they actually acquired the studio.

 

The deal and agreement its self would probably take months to figure out and clear, there would be a lot of things that need sorting from a legal and business point of view to even stuff like how it's gonna be run. FiveM used to occasionally go down because the head of Cfx would throw a wobbler and turn the servers off, stuff like that would need to be straightened out lol.

 

From R*'s point of view this is probably a decision that has been 1-2 years in the making.

[Jimbatron]

By the way, is there a legal entity / company actually registered for Cfx.re? Depends on where it is based as to how easy it is to look up details (.re is a Reunion extension, although NTA is Dutch I think?)

[Jason]

The whole splitting the playerbase thing I think sounds like more than a worry than it is.

 

It can become problematic within a game, say, content that by design carves up the playable within GTAO can be a real problem as it'll result in dead modes and playlists, which for an official game is iffy.

 

For player hosted servers they tend to serve niches or otherwise move with the trends. Say if someone makes a custom mode that explodes in popularity a whole load of servers hosting that mode will crop up, if everyone gets bored all those servers change into the new trend.

 

In terms of splitting the playerbase it shouldn't really be an issue. For one, if done right, it could work out very well for R*. GTAO2 would be it's own thing and get updates every few months which bring people back, they play it, have fun, whatever, etc, and then alongside that to fill in the space between updates they can lean on the community hosted servers aspect.

 

I mean with GTAO we've seen them shift to 2 updates a year for a long time now which is no where near enough, so, including all the other reasons, this could be a way for R* to be able to fill the gap between updates. Not everyone will be interested but more ways to play GTA VI / GTAO2 probably won't be seen as a bad thing.

[thekingbutten]

3 hours ago, qwerty77 said:

Does anyone know how long cfxre have been in talks/working with R*? Surely the idea didn't pop up the day they actually acquired the studio.

One of the Nopixel owners(?) said on stream that they were in talks with Rockstar since November of last year when the TOS changes were pushed regarding RP content. Based on that it's safe to assume this has been in the works even longer than that considering Nopixel is just a server/community and not Cfx, the entity that operates the platform.

[videotechuk_]

New affiliate badge added, a new era begins. 

 

[Spider-Vice]

6 hours ago, qwerty77 said:

Does anyone know how long cfxre have been in talks/working with R*? Surely the idea didn't pop up the day they actually acquired the studio.

 

Like does the announcement mean they can finally start working together or have they already been working together before the announcement?

Quite a while I believe. It is indeed not something that happens overnight lol.

 

2 hours ago, thekingbutten said:

One of the Nopixel owners(?) said on stream that they were in talks with Rockstar since November of last year when the TOS changes were pushed regarding RP content. Based on that it's safe to assume this has been in the works even longer than that considering Nopixel is just a server/community and not Cfx, the entity that operates the platform.

Yeah, correct, this is when I heard something as well. When the RP TOS stuff came out, they were already working with R* and helped draft that IIRC.

[PhilPerlmutter]

 

They certainly will be limited by the need given by r*/t2 to make a cashflow environment out of it. This as a consequence will make a similar mod that is built around good gameplay instead of making profits impossible, because it obviously reducing the profit potential will not be tolerated.

I really would not even mind r* releasing multiplayer games with a constant cashflow design, for example pay yearly to play it, but I hate the fact that speaking of GTA Online, limits are set by its profit making design, such as not being able to use vehicles you have purchased in missions as well as other mechanics, or the very narrow checkpoint system in missions that sometimes makes otherwise fluent mission experience look very prescripted.

GTA Online could be so much better....

[aaronBLUEeyes]

Yeah, like all the one-time use vehicles that can never be used for anything else… I’m looking at you Wastelander & RCV.
 

We amass tons of specialty vehicles that could be used as assets in heists or other criminal endeavors, but Rockstar’s short-sided planning makes them expensive paperweights that are useless outside of one mission or heist.

Edited August 15, 2023 by aaronBLUEeyes

[PhilPerlmutter]

6 hours ago, aaronBLUEeyes said:

Yeah, like all the one-time use vehicles that can never be used for anything else… I’m looking at you Wastelander & RCV.
 

We amass tons of specialty vehicles that could be used as assets in heists or other criminal endeavors, but Rockstar’s short-sided planning makes them expensive paperweights that are useless outside of one mission or heist.

 

Yup, I remember in the beginning, I purchased vehicles because I had planned them in for a certain heist. It would'nt even cross my mind back then that they were blacklisted for certain heists.

For someone like me who does not consider it a real PvP game, that is really disappointing.

[G1V3M3YOUL00T]

Rockstar can be said to have taken on a team of modders, what could this mean for us in the future? Maybe we'll get official tools, documentation, or not-so-brutal restrictions on creating tools or mods for a future game? What do you think about this? Maybe they won't kill modding as much? 

[Tez2]

19 hours ago, Jason said:

If you ever played Call of Duty in the P2P days this is where the famous "host advantage" kicks in, having host in those games made certain guns extremely powerful.

Technically speaking, the "Client-Server model" model is the one used by Call of Duty, where the "server" here will be a client machine. But for simplicity's sake, it's best we continue to use the term P2P 

 

19 hours ago, Jason said:

Driving would feel the exact same, you're not sending literally every input to a server, so if you have 200ms latency and you go to turn left you're no waiting for the reply to turn left. What happens in those cases is the other players will see you skip/teleport or otherwise lag about. This can and will happen regardless of who hosts the server, be it a player or a dedicated server.

It would feel similar. But there is a difference with dedicated servers where only the server is regarded as the true game state. You won't see much delay with driving (on your local machine) thanks to client-side prediction. However, a few mispredictions and you'll experience rubber-banding. Sudden teleportation to the past.

 

Making the driving experience bothersome, and more irritating during races. If you think about it from a design perspective, especially for races, say you have a player with perfect latency, he would have a higher chance of streamlining his way to the finish line. Whereas a player with high latency would struggle upon securing 1st place, and depending on how laggy he is, he may end up being teleported back to 2nd or 3rd place. So the current model is sorta less punishing for such players. The high-latency may teleport sporadically which may give him an advantage. However, the smooth player can still regain the lead. And so does the high-latency player. While he may not be synced properly, his last updates/ticks would reflect him being more toe-to-toe with the low-latency player. Instead of bouncing him back a few positions.

 

Overall, VI's model can be done like Destiny 2's model. Much like the Engineering Lead stated,

Quote

Matt: Destiny 2 uses a hybrid of client-server and peer-to-peer technology, just like Destiny 1. The server is authoritative over how the game progresses, and each player is authoritative over their own movement and abilities. This allows us to give players the feeling of immediacy in all their moving and shooting – no matter where they live and no matter whom they choose to play with.

 

Rockstar's model is already more suited to adapt a hybrid approach with P2P & dedicated servers than a full-on dedicated server model. More similar to Destiny's approach. Since GTAO's model has similarity with Destiny 1 considering Rockstar utilizes a mix of two P2P approaches (Mesh P2P & Host/Client). That's how the game remains uninterrupted while performing host migrations. Whereas most FPS titles would have the game paused during a host migration.

 

Spoiler

More off-topic,

 

A GTA Online lobby has a session host and script hosts. The session host may not be the one handling the freemode logic, but whoever hosts the freemode script does. And the session host more-so handles players leaving and joining. But in some occasions, the session host himself could be the freemode script host.

 

The freemode script host is the most influential in terms of latency as his connection affects entering an interior or even the clouds loading phase. The process that takes the longest, in terms of cloud loading, is downloading the host broadcast data which involves all script hosts within the lobby.

 

You can see different hosts of different scripts,

 

 

 

 

 

 

Plus, clients communicating with each other. Which allows for seamless host migrations.

 

 llllllQwQllllll: CPedInventoryDataNode, 561
 llllllQwQllllll: CVehicleSteeringDataNode, 204
 llllllQwQllllll: CVehicleComponentReservationDataNode, 204
 llllllQwQllllll: CVehicleControlDataNode, 204
 llllllQwQllllll: CVehicleSteeringDataNode, 1568
 llllllQwQllllll: CPedCreationDataNode, 562
 	m_pop_type: 5
 	m_model: 0xC99F21C4
 	m_random_seed: 16026
 	m_max_health: 175
 	m_in_vehicle: YES
 	pad_0xD1[0]:  
 	m_vehicle_id: 253
 	m_vehicle_seat: 1
 	m_has_prop: NO
 	m_prop_model: 0
 	m_is_standing: NO
 	m_is_respawn_object_id: NO
 	m_is_respawn_flagged_for_removal: NO
 	m_has_attr_damage_to_player: NO
 	m_attribute_damage_to_player: 255
 	m_voice_hash: 0x0

 

The aforementioned player syncing the below pedestrian with me that was created on his client,

 

 

This is similar to Destiny 1's network model. Destiny 2 already implemented a hybrid approach with dedicated servers and P2P tech. That's what we could expect if Rockstar were to use dedicated servers with VI's online. Like the server may take over the freemode script host thus no longer facing issues with delays in terms of loading screens, the mechanic and other aspects of freemode.

 

However, the game relies on host broadcast variables being shared with others from whoever hosts the freemode script.

 

	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2648711, 1497, "GSBD");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2650208, 2156, "GSBD_BlockB");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2652364, 2655, "GSBD_BlockC");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2625825, 2757, "GSBD_MissionsShared");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2655019, 657, "GSBD_MissionRequest");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2655676, 210, "GSBD_MissionList");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2655886, 225, "GSBD_ExclusionAreas");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2656111, 841, "GSBD_ActivitySelector");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2656952, 581, "GSBD_Betting");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_2657533, 171, "GSBD_HoldUp");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_4535040, 132, "GSBD_SyncedInteractions");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1835504, 576, "GSBD_FM");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1885447, 33, "GSBD_Kicking");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1936397, 35, "GSBD_HeistPlanning");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1944302, 464, "GSBD_PropertyInstances");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1924276, 511, "GSBD_FM_events");
	NETWORK::NETWORK_REGISTER_HOST_BROADCAST_VARIABLES(&Global_1890378, 291, "GSBD_RandomEvents");

 

The way the game syncs Heist Cuts, for example, with other players when all four players are at the Heist Planning Board is with the "GSBD_HeistPlanning" array of the host being shared with other players. The host is essentially sharing his game logic with others. Now if a server were to be involved, the host would send that to the server and the server would broadcast that to others. I can't think of much benefits here, because it's kinda an extra step, other than security.

 

There's a recent trend within the cheating scene with modded heist lobbies where heist cuts are modified to values over 100% up to 500% or 700%. Even without a server, proper checks can be applied on the client-side of legit players to ensure their cuts don't go above 100%. But with a server involved, this can apply to the cheated host as well.

 

Rockstar can either do that or come up with a whole new way.

[Jason]

Every single latency problem that can exist with dedicated servers exists with any and all forms of P2P. Latency is latency, if you play with someone on the other side of the planet there's no getting away from the fact that you two are going to have a latency issue.

 

Destiny 2 (and earlier CoD's) could get away with it because their session size was drastically smaller and also less complex. GTAO is 32 players, could be 64 in GTAO2 if they up it, having that session ran on players home connections is a flat out terrible idea. Bad hosts ruin the session for everyone. Dedicated servers improve the overall quality of the session and are precisely why they are now standard for every major online game.

 

Again, the idea that R* should stick with the current model because of the very niche idea that two people on opposite sides of the planet may play with each other doesn't justify not going with dedi's. Any game with half decent matchmaking uses regional matchmaking as well, so GTAO2 running entirely on dedi's should be putting you with players in your region to reduce latency. If you go outside your region that's on you, and something the vast majority of players are aware of and are happy to deal with.

[Tez2]

A hybrid approach is the solution. Also, self rubber-banding with dedicated servers could remain an issue even with low latency.

[Jason]

The main sources of rubber banding and any sort of lag are latency between the client and host and the quality of the connections for both the client and the host. It can and does happen regardless if the host is a player (P2P) or a server.

 

Distance between the host and client can't be fixed, if you play with friends on another continent and experience latency that's on you.

 

The quality of your connection is also on you, though admittedly in certain parts of the world people have no choice, but that's nothing a developer can fix and is also something that shouldn't justify giving a poorer experience to other players.

 

The quality of the host however is something that can be controlled and this is why dedicated servers are essential. They provide a quality, stable and persistent host to everyone in the session. Racing is being thrown around as an example why the current model works best but the example used is such an edge case and could equally go the other way. Desync from bad latency can result in players jumping into first or being difficult to kill in PvP modes, the host in the latter always have an advantage as well. Dedicated servers are used in competitive games because everyone connects to the same host result in a perfectly even playing field, with the only variable being your own connection quality and the region you picked to matchmake (which is on you).

[neoslice]

The pessimistic side in me says restricting mods and banning any other non official online multiplayer clients. The optimistic one goes for an integration of roleplay servers and other tools that are on the custom servers in their official Online one.

 

FiveM is simply a better and fun experience for me so I hope it won't affect it too much but it will though in some ways. Oh well