PinbaII Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 (edited) Allow every activity to be played with less players, using bots/AI (whatever you call it) - Only downside is that they'll want bigger shares. (EG if you're playing with a friend, a 30/30/40 split where the bot gets 40%). A proper character creator with perks à la Skyrim/CP77, the ability to switch between your characters seamlessly, where you can also chose wether you wanna start fresh or have the same progression than another character (if that makes sense).  Limited fast-travel options. Public transportation is useless right now. Add a quick travel, like driving 1km to the airport, then hop-in a plane and get TPed wherever you want to avoid having to drive for 15 minutes to the north of the map. Bring back the guy that brings your car. Could be a paid valet feature (with ingame $) where you can wait for only a minute before requesting another car. If you can't pay for one, it'll just be a regular mechanic bringing it to you each 5 minutes.  Non-criminal jobs : Taxis, firefigther, (police ?), deliveries, etc... Not necessarily scripted, it can be a simple car on fire or a pedestrian about to die. Eventually redundant, but still a nice addition especially for newcomers. A realistic economy, nothing more to add to that. Decrease the heists payouts if people are too rich instead of locking everything behind a 1.000.000$ paywall. Set a miminum level requirement for high-end stuff perhaps.  A revamped AI accuracy and behavior. Remove the stupid feature where cars act stupid in order for you to "accidentally" ram them. Then remove npcs aim assist. Put more bots instead of making them OP as hell. Remove lock-on for every ground/water vehicle. Keep that for air-air (EG Helis/Planes) and heavily weaponized / hard to destroy ground vehicles (such as tanks). Also increase planes stall out speed to make ground targets harder to hit.  More realistic body armor, and food/health packs : Armors should limit the damage taken, not add a "second" lifebar. Food should only regenerate stamina, when health packs (could be an adrenaline syringe) are time-limited. Realistic damage for vehicles (EG : Planes shouldn't explode instantly, only kill yourself on the spot when the cockpit is hit too hard), and perhaps add VISIBLE body armor for vehicles, unless it's already integrated in when you buy it.  "Custom" lobbies : Uncheck what you do not want (For example, missile-lock on), and get sent to a lobby without it. If none is available, the game shows a similar lobby but with X/Y stuff still there and ask if you wanna go there anyway. Ability to set the phone to silent mode (Doubtful R* would ever do that, but that would be great). I don't mind a small notification telling me I haven't completed a side mission, but please no more unskippable calls where I end up dying.  --- And a lot of other stuff I forgot. I don't really know what to expect for GTAO2, but I trust R* to make something good. They definitely know how important the online aspect is, and they have enough resources to make it nicely.  Edited May 26, 2023 by PinbaII SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trafficante Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 5 hours ago, Jason said:  I do too tbh. The early years of GTAO and even RDO to a degree were them literally figuring out what they want to do and how they want to do it. There were a lot of lessons they had to learn themselves about online gaming and what people want as well. As a result, content updates weren't great until heists, and even post heist updates were very experimental for a while.  Based on interviews they've given it's only in the past few years that I think they've really figured out what they want to do with the game so I think come the launch of GTAO2 I expect they'll have a plan in place pre-release should result in a steadier stream of meaningful updates than what we got with GTAO's early days. Same here, man. I think they more then figured it out. Netting ~$1B ARR for a 10 year old game is no small feat.  Tbh I believe GTA6 Online won’t be as bare-bones as V or RDO when it dropped. Not only because R* knows what works, but because of the bleed through from V to VI.  People will finish the story in 1-2 weeks (or less, who am I kidding?) and they will want sufficient content online ASAP or they run. And by sufficient content I believe it has to be something like heists or similar. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-Ghost Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 Talk about Wish-lists, the next game better have that Creator on day one and not months later. Â Â And the effin Editor, I sure hope they don't pull an RDR2 with this one, it would be even more stupid. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tez2 Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 RDO's Gold as a second form of currency suffered the same as GTAO's model. Because the Collector role was RDO's "Cayo Perico" before Rockstar nerfed it.  Spoiler   Rockstar featured Arthur's Outfit within Outlaw Pass 2. Two years after, Rockstar brought it back with 2021's Blood Money update for those who missed it. Except it costs 52 Gold Bars now. And it's not just Arthur's outfit, but John's outfit too.  Spoiler  104 Gold Bars. Yet both outfits were included within the second Outlaw Pass that costed 40 Gold Bars. Which would net you back your 40 Gold Bars at the end. So if you ask me, I would take a Battle Pass over assigning individual prices to each piece of the BP content.  The same issue could happen with having Cryptocurrency, in VI's online, as a single value or type. A single integer that can be increased by both paying IRL money and excessive grinding. But having multiple types of Cryptocurrency could path a way for a solution. DODI3OG, Ishidacorp, SM Grunge and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 26, 2023 Share Posted May 26, 2023 Gold was weird. As an RDO player on PS4 from day 1 until I shipped off my PS4, I liked Gold in RDO because they gave you an easy way to rack it up if you were an active player - albeit dailies in general in games feel like chores, which I'm not huge on. The downside of that is it resulted in the same problem they have with GTAO which is that veterans had absolutely no reason to ever buy gold unless they were excessive spenders. Â So if they are looking to solve the problem of veterans not spending I'm not sure the premium currency which can be earned by playing is the best solution from their PoV. Â A full blown premium cosmetic store is the easy option, likely mixed in with a battle pass (more on that later). That's a widely adopted model that has been a huge success for various big games. It works and it works extremely well. The downside? It means there will be things in-game, cosmetic, that cannot be earned by playing. I personally don't have much of an issue with that at all but I know many GTAO players are against that idea. Further, there's the potential risk that new earnable in-game cosmetics become rarer and poorer quality as the best stuff is reserved for the cash shop. Also long term this type of model generally results in flashier and flashier cosmetics. Â Battle passes is the other big model, albeit battle passes are rarely the only form of monetisation. The generic level 1-X (60-100 generally) pass is boring as all f*ck and due to how over used battle passes are they have a real chore like feel to them. They also aren't as exciting as they can be, as yea they can put cool cosmetics in them but everyone then has these same cosmetics resulting in everyone looking the same - though GTA (like RDO) has much less of an issue in this area due to the fact you can mix and match stuff by nature. Â I have seen battle passes try different things, Rainbow Six Siege's recent battle pass was basically every reward was given a tile and the tiles were laid out with multiple paths and every level you got a tile unlock and you could progress through it and get to the things you wanted first, which I liked as it reduced the pressure to max out pass to get the cool cosmetic that's typically at the end. Â The main issue I have with battle passes though and this is something RDO PC has dealt with massively is the fact that in almost all games with them they are time limited. Miss a season for w/e reason? Buy the game well past launch? Saw a cool cosmetic from a battle pass you missed? Well you're sh*t out of luck friendo. That's just... dogsh*t. Battle pass cosmetics should remain earnable in-game in some capacity (Deep Rock Galactic does this) or the battle pass should not expire (Halo Infinite does this). I saw from Tez's post they later added some RDO BP cosmetics to Nazar at a massively inflated price which is a bit uhhhhh but yea, at least some of them are there. Â There's mandatory subscription stuff but GTAO is never gonna have that ever so that's not worth going into. Â So yea, when I lay the most popular options out in my head I don't know what I'd want for GTAO2. I don't like the current shark card model but at the same time there's downsides with premium cosmetics. Never the less, I think battle passes of some form will be coming in GTAO2 regardless of what they do tbh. SM Grunge and eejyool 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM Grunge Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 12 hours ago, Tez2 said: RDO's Gold as a second form of currency suffered the same as GTAO's model. Because the Collector role was RDO's "Cayo Perico" before Rockstar nerfed it.   Reveal hidden contents   Rockstar featured Arthur's Outfit within Outlaw Pass 2. Two years after, Rockstar brought it back with 2021's Blood Money update for those who missed it. Except it costs 52 Gold Bars now. And it's not just Arthur's outfit, but John's outfit too.   Hide contents  104 Gold Bars. Yet both outfits were included within the second Outlaw Pass that costed 40 Gold Bars. Which would net you back your 40 Gold Bars at the end. So if you ask me, I would take a Battle Pass over assigning individual prices to each piece of the BP content.  The same issue could happen with having Cryptocurrency, in VI's online, as a single value or type. A single integer that can be increased by both paying IRL money and excessive grinding. But having multiple types of Cryptocurrency could path a way for a solution. Up until recently I was assuming that cryptocurrency would be the equivalent to gold bars in VI. However, the taxi missions from January gave me a balanced idea. How about clean cash and blood money?  Blood money is the money you get from heists, drug deals, contact misssions or other criminal activities. You can't put it in yout bank account. You have to stash it in a safe at your office or your house. Blood money serves its purpose in the black market or fences to obtain weapons, pink slips or businesses that the IRS better not find out (like a cocaine factory) but it can't be used for buying more legal assets like an apartment, a car in a showroom, utility bills or any large purchase made from the internet.  Clean cash on the other hand is the money you obtain from legit jobs. For instance, taxi jobs, collectibles, Arena war sponsored activities, the arcade and the nightclub safes, pizza boy deliveries, sport tournaments or the bar earnings from your clubhouse. With the clean cash you can freely deposit it and withdraw it from your bank account and does not require a safe. You could also have businesses that could launder your blood money into clean cash. Clean cash can be freely used to buy anything you like in the game, the same way as gold in Red Dead. DODI3OG, babydracula and R a f a e 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty77 Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 I've never had any worse randoms in any multiplayer game compared to GTA Online. GTA online randoms are the most incompetent players I've ever played with. That's no exaggeration. Â So I hope in GTA VI online the communication between you and random players in your job improves. Features like adding a speaker icon to see if they can even hear you like Valorant does etc. Just make it easier. Â Also hope GTA VI online has proximity chat while free roaming SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 41 minutes ago, qwerty77 said: I've never had any worse randoms in any multiplayer game compared to GTA Online. GTA online randoms are the most incompetent players I've ever played with. That's no exaggeration.  So I hope in GTA VI online the communication between you and random players in your job improves. Features like adding a speaker icon to see if they can even hear you like Valorant does etc. Just make it easier.  Also hope GTA VI online has proximity chat while free roaming  GTAO was released in the days before non-voice chat in-game communication tools were massively improved, and adding those tools in post-launch has always been dodgy.  So I'd hope and assume GTAO2's ingame communcation tools are, for one, there, but also inspired by other games which have them instead of R* starting from ground zero and doing a basic as f*ck ping system. I still say Deep Rock Galactic has the gold standard co-op comms in any game though why it works there wouldn't quite translate to GTAO but definitely things like contextual pings are needed in GTAO2 I think. qwerty77 and SM Grunge 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sykotikOG Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 (edited) I'm curious if they're gonna try to pull a "GTA the MMO" angle. If they manage the infrastructure, it could allow for cross play and better cheat detection and mitigation I suppose. Plus, it should make the executives happy if they can make that GTA+ membership price mandatory. Could also allow for Los Santos to continue to exist but allow for other locations too. Edited May 28, 2023 by sykotikOG further thought SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DODI3OG Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 11 minutes ago, sykotikOG said: I'm curious if they're gonna try to pull a "GTA the MMO" angle. If they manage the infrastructure, it could allow for cross play and better cheat detection and mitigation I suppose. Plus, it should make the executives happy if they can make that GTA+ membership price mandatory. Could also allow for Los Santos to continue to exist but allow for other locations too. Crossplay and Cheat detection just don't get along well. That's why I avoid PC to Console crossplays. Last-gen crossplays also tend to be filled with hackers as more devs abandon the platform and less security updates are made for that generation. sykotikOG and SM Grunge 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 22 minutes ago, DODI3OG said: Crossplay and Cheat detection just don't get along well. That's why I avoid PC to Console crossplays. Last-gen crossplays also tend to be filled with hackers as more devs abandon the platform and less security updates are made for that generation. Â Cheats on PC are generally a lot rarer than people think lol. Â GTAO and RDO's cheat problems on PC stem from the fact it's not at all designed very well as an online game from a security PoV. This is why 360/PS3 GTAO (and IV MP) was a mess a well. There's a lot R* can do to improve that which will GREATLY cut out the cheaters in GTAO2. I play FPS's, MMO's, etc on PC and I can't remember the last time I ran into a cheater and the reason for that is because the developers behind those games aren't rookies. Â At this point cross play and cross progresion should be standard in any new online game and when ever I see a new online game ignore said features I take it as a massive red flag that they're not serious about their game. Gaming is becoming increasingly platform agnostic, people are playing together on console and PC. It's the future, and if you're releasing a game today that's intended to last 10 years then you're gonna have a real problem on your hands post-launch as you inevitably scramble to add cross play/progression to your game. Â The only exception is PC <> console in competitive shooters due to KB+M being quicker and more accurate in those games, though there's shooters where they fudge with the aim assist so much that there's a somewhat even playing field between controller and KB+M at most levels. GTA is technically part shooter but there's options like input based matchmaking and private sessions to make that a non-issue. SM Grunge, Moncastler and WhiterunGuard 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 8 minutes ago, Edward RDRIII said: Rockstar could make cross play between PS5, XBS and PC require the PC player to have a controler or something.  Input based matchmaking exists already in games - hell, GTAO PC last I played shows your input device next to your name in lobbies when you're waiting so GTAO already sorta tracks it lol. There are also shooters with PC and console crossplay where if you party up with PC players you will be matchmade into PC lobbies, but otherwise you matchmake into a shared console pool.  There's plenty of ways they could support all players playing together and GTAO2 is inevitably going to be such a gigantic game that they can easily afford to do so without running the risk of carving up the playerbase.  Crossplay aint some scary concept anymore, it's pretty damn well established with all the major issues pretty much figured out. In fact, by far away the main issue in console shooting games right now is M+KB adapters for console, something a lot of games leave unchecked though Rainbow Six Siege recently added measures to deter players from using those adapters and it's been a big success for the game, so it's likely we'll see more of that in the coming months/years. Agent Edward, SM Grunge and WhiterunGuard 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DODI3OG Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 @Jason by FPS, I hope you don't mean Call of Duty. I quit when they stopped supporting MW2019 since when Blops Cold War came out, there were cheaters every other lobby on my squad. This wasn't the case with regular MP, since I could find a match with crossplay turned off. On the contrary, Warzone doesn't seem to find me a match with crossplay turned off.  Battlefield V on the other hand, I didn't encounter cheaters so far. I'm on PS5 and I never ran into some fishy players. However, it's just PS to Xbox crossplay. The amount of hackers will probably rise on last-gen consoles, but I can't think of them investing time and money into older games unless they're that desperate to dominate. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 13 minutes ago, DODI3OG said: @Jason by FPS, I hope you don't mean Call of Duty. I quit when they stopped supporting MW2019 since when Blops Cold War came out, there were cheaters every other lobby on my squad. This wasn't the case with regular MP, since I could find a match with crossplay turned off. On the contrary, Warzone doesn't seem to find me a match with crossplay turned off.  Battlefield V on the other hand, I didn't encounter cheaters so far. I'm on PS5 and I never ran into some fishy players. However, it's just PS to Xbox crossplay. The amount of hackers will probably rise on last-gen consoles, but I can't think of them investing time and money into older games unless they're that desperate to dominate.  Call of Duty is one of those games developed by rookies. Also, admittedly, Warzone like all F2P titles are the most popular games w/ cheaters which is why CSGO avoided F2P for so long, but I really do have to stress that CoD is an extreme example. Modern day CS, AFAIK, has no real cheating problem of note despite it being F2P and hitting concurrent player counts of well over a million players a day, and that's literally the most competitive shooting game on planet Earth today.  I've personally spent the day playing BF 2024 on PC which has full crossplay between PC and console as standard (whether or not that's balanced for input reasons I have no idea lol) and didn't run into one cheater and that was in 32v32 lobbies. I could play for hundreds of hours and I'd still be surprised if I ever saw one cheater.  PC dues have cheaters/hackers and that's a fact but if that problem is particularly widespread that's because the developer has failed to address it properly.  It's also partly why I speculate that GTAO2 will be a seperate download/client, as that will make it easier for them to fix the aspects of GTA V that online hackers exploit. Plus, ya'know, helps save storage space for people who don't plan on playing SP again lol. DODI3OG and SM Grunge 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DODI3OG Posted May 28, 2023 Author Share Posted May 28, 2023 13 minutes ago, Jason said: I've personally spent the day playing BF 2024 on PC which has full crossplay between PC and console as standard (whether or not that's balanced for input reasons I have no idea lol) and didn't run into one cheater and that was in 32v32 lobbies. I could play for hundreds of hours and I'd still be surprised if I ever saw one cheater. Â PC dues have cheaters/hackers and that's a fact but if that problem is particularly widespread that's because the developer has failed to address it properly. Â It's also partly why I speculate that GTAO2 will be a seperate download/client, as that will make it easier for them to fix the aspects of GTA V that online hackers exploit. Plus, ya'know, helps save storage space for people who don't plan on playing SP again lol. Most MMOs I've played also have better anti-cheat, like you'll be banned after a daily scan. And these MMOs are F2P as well and ran by small-scale servers, unlike Call of Duty, so yeah, it's mostly the devs' fault. Â I agree on the GTAO2 having a different client. I'm sure they can find a way for it to work out without having to download each separately. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REVENGE777 Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 3 hours ago, Jason said:  No, that's not why they fail. Good SP DLC's have been commercial failures and that is why devs/pubs aren't interested in SP DLC. There's various accounts of this from respected people in the industry. It is because of this that some of these DLC's have been cut away from the main game and turned into smaller standalone experiences, or turned into fully fledged games.  Admittedly online mtx have better profit margins, no doubt, but commercial and critical success can drive interest from a dev/pub PoV in SP DLC but the commercial success isn't there for a lot of games.  Reality is that the vast majority of people don't revisit SP games once they're done with them. Per achievement data, the average completion rate for games is somewhere in the region of 25-45% depending on the scale of games. New Game+ achievements can be anywhere from 0-5%. As a result... these people aren't interested in buying SP DLC, and the DLC completion rates according to achievement data backs that up, along with industry figures first hand accounts of it as well.  I don't like it, I'd be down for say some RDR2 DLC for sure, but yea, there's a misconception that SP devs are sitting on a giant goldmine with SP DLC but based on all the evidence we have that's really not entirely true. I feel like both gta V and GTA VI could have/would have been exceptions to this rule. With gta v being the most profitable piece of media ever, a SP DLC would have no choice but be successful. It may not have worked for gta IV or other companies trying to capitalize off of that kinda stuff but GTA V and VI could have turned that sentiment around. Alas, we may never know. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 8 hours ago, DODI3OG said: Most MMOs I've played also have better anti-cheat, like you'll be banned after a daily scan. And these MMOs are F2P as well and ran by small-scale servers, unlike Call of Duty, so yeah, it's mostly the devs' fault.  Most online games, including MMO's, ban cheaters in waves as this can help make it difficult for cheat makers to pinpoint what exactly the developers were able to detect. Call of Duty does this too but yea they still don't really do a good job with it.  But also MMO's are developed and structured in a way in which virtually all of the common GTAO/RDRO hacks are a complete non-issue. GTAO/RDRO essentially lets you use trainers online due to a lot of variables being client side rather than server side. Simply changing this to a more typical MMO structure would diminsh GTAO/RDRO cheating by like 99%, leaving only things like the typical aimbots left, which are much, much rarer.  7 hours ago, REVENGE777 said: I feel like both gta V and GTA VI could have/would have been exceptions to this rule. With gta v being the most profitable piece of media ever, a SP DLC would have no choice but be successful. It may not have worked for gta IV or other companies trying to capitalize off of that kinda stuff but GTA V and VI could have turned that sentiment around. Alas, we may never know.  GTA V is the most profitable piece of media ever in large part due to GTAO, GTAO's succes does not 100% translate into SP DLC.  Also a GTA/RDR SP DLC would cost significantly more than SP DLC for most games, so the cost of development, time needed, all goes up, that means the minimum amount of sales for it to be commercially successful goes up.  It's possible that it could turn a profit, sure, but at this point it's basically risk assessment. A risky SP DLC that may not turn a profit or GTAO content which will? We all know the answer to the question and while it's not a very popular answer to people who don't enjoy GTAO/RDRO it it's at the least understandable.  While I'd be interested in a RDR2 SP DLC personally I'm not really fussed that it never got any, or that GTA VI won't get any (probably). I remember pre-RDR2 launch here there were people writing RDR2 off cause they were more way more concered about the game not getting SP DLC than the actual game we're getting being good. That's always the most important thing, the game actually being good. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tez2 Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 (edited) Take-Two rejected a proposal for dedicated servers a few years ago. They considered it cost-prohibitive for them.  So explosion shenanigans may still occur on VI. Because of how explosions are streamed from the closest player to them. Although, Rockstar keeps adding checks to explosion native functions. Much like GTAO recent Drug Wars update. Edited May 30, 2023 by Tez2 Tezdefanta, Riccoo, Gentlebreeze and 4 others 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SM Grunge Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 19 minutes ago, Tez2 said: Take-Two rejected a proposal for dedicated servers a few years ago. They considered it cost-prohibitive for them.  So explosion shenanigans may still occur on VI. Because of how explosions are streamed from the closest player to them. Although, Rockstar keeps adding checks to explosion native functions. Much like GTAO recent Drug Wars update. That's kinda selfish considering that V is the most sucessful entertainment product of all time and VI will probably beat the record. How much money does Strauss need? Catsooey and babydracula 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider-Vice Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 (edited) Other things can and will be server authoritative or similar, Destiny (and 2) do this and there's an entire essay on how their networking works as a hybrid of P2P and actual servers. GTAO already does this for some things such as matchmaking, transaction processing and so on. It doesn't need to be fully dedicated servers for everything as long as the right things are being controlled by servers.  Entity states (just one example) can be synchronised on a server kinda like what FiveM's own OneSync (just to keep the examples R*/GTA adjacent) does, and many other games do. This can help with syncing vehicles, pedestrians, explosions and what not via a server so everyone sees the same things, and can help with tampering, so on so forth.  RDR2 for instance already has major improvements in areas of its Online communication, including server-side session management, which can be seen via subdomains that R* uses such as ewrsession2-rdr2-prod.ros.rockstargames.com (EWR = New York in this instance), so it's expected that Americas/GTA VI will have a lot more improvements on this end. It's already harder to reverse engineer some things in RDO vs. GTAO, there's been improvements in how the underbelly of the Online Services work, so yeah you don't *need* dedicated servers for everything, just a proper online tech stack and more proactivity in looking for cheaters and so on to ban.  GTA V Online is an isolated matter of its own considering they never expected the game to grow as big as it is, they will have learned a lot since, it shows in RDO's online tech stack (of course it's not perfect), and will show in Americas' as it'll be a more recent game and what they will want to consider the newest definitive Online experience.   -------------------  Edit: I f*cking knew that Tez post would cause videos to pop up. There's a lot more to it than just "we need dedicated servers!", online services are much more complex than throwing dedicated servers at everything, in fact you could argue even GTAO has some critical services on dedicated servers (they do). But what am I gonna do when people take Tez's posts as gospel. Might still be the case but he did say "years ago", and people are reporting it as "won't happen". There's some evidence that R* seem to be working on making more things controlled by proper servers, even if not hosting the entire game.  Go back to what I linked above about Destiny, it works just fine. Not dedicated servers for everything, it is a hybrid, even RDO already is a little bit of this. Edited May 30, 2023 by Spider-Vice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 30, 2023 Share Posted May 30, 2023 Dedicated server usage was pretty well established a few years ago but they're now an expected part of the package of any online game. If T2/R* are still refusing to fully adopt them for GTAO2 then that is just a really bad look honestly. Â Much, much smaller games with a percent of the revenue GTA has use dedicated servers as standard. Not to mention literally every major shooter now uses dedicated servers, especially as many of them are large scale shooters. Sports titles like Fifa are now on dedicated servers as well. Â So if T2/R* don't have full dedicated server usage in GTA, any reason they use to justify that is bullsh*t. babydracula, LaszloR1, Xtra510 and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DODI3OG Posted May 30, 2023 Author Share Posted May 30, 2023 @SM Grunge  Good idea on the blood money concept. I think Blood money should be the primary currency for GTA:O, with Shark Loans being the 2nd.  Shark Loans are my new idea. Basically instead of buying Gold Bars to have a business, you get to buy that business using real currency online in the form of a "loan". In real life, it's safest to get a loan for something instead of paying Millions outright from questionable sources.  Also, I really don't like Battle Pass systems, basically every FOMO stuff. I don't have the luxury to pay for something and grind for its worth.  What if instead of Battle Passes, they give us clothing options with membership? E.g. Paying with real money for membership to Didier Sachs which let us buy exclusive clothing with in-game cash. It should be reasonably priced, of course. Or an members-only Pay N' Spray tier with exclusive liveries/paint jobs.  No vehicle should be MTX-exclusive, of course. Only businesses, properties, and cosmetics. Hell, if they want to give us a "Travel Pass" for Liberty State and San Andreas, I wouldn't mind paying. SM Grunge 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaszloR1 Posted May 31, 2023 Share Posted May 31, 2023 On 5/30/2023 at 1:51 PM, Spider-Vice said: Other things can and will be server authoritative or similar, Destiny (and 2) do this and there's an entire essay on how their networking works as a hybrid of P2P and actual servers. GTAO already does this for some things such as matchmaking, transaction processing and so on. It doesn't need to be fully dedicated servers for everything as long as the right things are being controlled by servers.  Entity states (just one example) can be synchronised on a server kinda like what FiveM's own OneSync (just to keep the examples R*/GTA adjacent) does, and many other games do. This can help with syncing vehicles, pedestrians, explosions and what not via a server so everyone sees the same things, and can help with tampering, so on so forth.  RDR2 for instance already has major improvements in areas of its Online communication, including server-side session management, which can be seen via subdomains that R* uses such as ewrsession2-rdr2-prod.ros.rockstargames.com (EWR = New York in this instance), so it's expected that Americas/GTA VI will have a lot more improvements on this end. It's already harder to reverse engineer some things in RDO vs. GTAO, there's been improvements in how the underbelly of the Online Services work, so yeah you don't *need* dedicated servers for everything, just a proper online tech stack and more proactivity in looking for cheaters and so on to ban.  GTA V Online is an isolated matter of its own considering they never expected the game to grow as big as it is, they will have learned a lot since, it shows in RDO's online tech stack (of course it's not perfect), and will show in Americas' as it'll be a more recent game and what they will want to consider the newest definitive Online experience.   -------------------  Edit: I f*cking knew that Tez post would cause videos to pop up. There's a lot more to it than just "we need dedicated servers!", online services are much more complex than throwing dedicated servers at everything, in fact you could argue even GTAO has some critical services on dedicated servers (they do). But what am I gonna do when people take Tez's posts as gospel. Might still be the case but he did say "years ago", and people are reporting it as "won't happen". There's some evidence that R* seem to be working on making more things controlled by proper servers, even if not hosting the entire game.  Go back to what I linked above about Destiny, it works just fine. Not dedicated servers for everything, it is a hybrid, even RDO already is a little bit of this. Let's be real though, the positives far outweight the negatives. Dedicated servers give you a bunch of basic protection just based on their architecture. I'd be fine with only e-sport tier cheating happening in gta games. That said Tez did say they decided on it years back so there is still a chance to walk it back, if they have architected the game in DDD they could relatively easily swap out the inner workings of their online play with minor impact. Although on the upside R*'s quest to keep P2P alive did allow us to play a bit of Old-Oldgen online on RPCS3 which was a delight. That said I'd still prefer GTA VI to have dedicated servers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YangSing1 Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 GTA 6 reportedly contains  • Drivable cars • Shootable guns Player_02 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent Edward Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 (edited) If Rockstar wants GTA6's Online Mode to last at least as long as GTAO they better leave this GTA+ thing to very late in its lifetime, if the game already starts with weapons, clothes, vehicles and perhaps even locations locked behind real money it will give the new game a very bad first impression compared to the previous game and people will end up buying GTA6 only or mostly to play its Story Mode as it happens with RDR2 nowadays. For anyone who thinks that Rockstar won't end up completely locking weapons, clothes and vehicles behind GTA+ eventually, either you're a fool or you want to be in Rockstar's good side for whatever reason. Â Spoiler Copy-pasted here from another topic. Â Edited June 9, 2023 by Edward RDRIII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapper Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 3 hours ago, Edward RDRIII said: If Rockstar wants GTA6's Online Mode to last at least as long as GTAO they better leave this GTA+ thing to very late in its lifetime, if the game already starts with weapons, clothes, vehicles and perhaps even locations locked behind real money it will give the new game a very bad first impression compared to the previous game and people will end up buying GTA6 only or mostly to play its Story Mode as it happens with RDR2 nowadays. For anyone who thinks that Rockstar won't end up completely locking weapons, clothes and vehicles behind GTA+ eventually, either you're a fool or you want to be in Rockstar's good side for whatever reason. Â You just can't introduce a subscription service late in a game's lifecycle without significant issues. GTA+ will be a big part of VI's online mode, and if implemented remotely well enough, it will be massively successful. Implementing GTA+ this late in GTAO's lifecycle is essentially to ensure that when VI comes out, it will become the norm, resulting in virtually zero backlash, whereas it would've been a lot worse if they introduced it with a new game. Â Practically every successful online game nowadays has battle passes, subscription services, cosmetic stores, premium currencies, and whatnot. GTAO's monetisation model is quite ancient (and forgiving) compared to all that, so you're fooling yourself if you think R* ain't gonna shake things up. Shark card makes veterans less likely to spend and results in inflated item prices very quickly. A subscription service works a lot better in that regard. I believe everything they're doing with GTA+ now is basically live testing for VI. Â And comparing RDR2 with GTA is utterly useless. GTA is an entirely different beast. Even without all that, RDR's setting alone pushes it into the backfoot. Plus, RDO was severely lacking in content and proper endgame items (the pandemic did play a big role in that) for a very long time until things got out of control. I wouldn't be surprised if VI manages to outdo RDR2's lifetime sales number within 12-15 months of release. Revenues even earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt5511 Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 All this paying benefits for GTA online makes me wonder if they will go too far with it in GTA 6, I look up to seeing it being top tier and one of the best but what’s the fun to it if it’s all behind a paywall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronPerfection Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 16 minutes ago, Matt5511 said: All this paying benefits for GTA online makes me wonder if they will go too far with it in GTA 6, I look up to seeing it being top tier and one of the best but what’s the fun to it if it’s all behind a paywall At least it’s just online, even if that sucks I can just play the story and have fun with that, it’ll just be another RDR2 situation if that’s the case. I’d obv love for the online mode not to be filled with Micro transactions and subscriptions but it will be and there’s nothing any of us can really do lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vice Cit Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, IronPerfection said: At least it’s just online, even if that sucks I can just play the story and have fun with that, it’ll just be another RDR2 situation if that’s the case. I’d obv love for the online mode not to be filled with Micro transactions and subscriptions but it will be and there’s nothing any of us can really do lol  20 minutes ago, Matt5511 said: All this paying benefits for GTA online makes me wonder if they will go too far with it in GTA 6, I look up to seeing it being top tier and one of the best but what’s the fun to it if it’s all behind a paywall Try not to wipe before you sh*t when it comes to GTAO2. We know nothing about it yet.  You need to remember R*/T2 NEEDS the next GTAO to last another decade and bring in more profits than the first. It's not gonna last the way they need it to if they put everything behind a pay wall and constantly shove microtransactions down our throats. They know their player base is used to getting consistent free to play content and they will continue to do so. Yes, they're going to have to have some enticing benefits to get more people to sign up for GTA+. Yes, there will be shark cards again and maybe even a premium currency. But, a big part of business is learning what works and doesn't work and I'm more than positive R* did a lot of learning when it came to the failure of RDO.  They will find a sweet spot for GTA+, what they're doing now isn't a good representation for it because the current GTAO wasn't built with that in mind. I'm sure there will be something you wanna wear, some building you wanna visit, who knows maybe even some vehicle cosmetics that you want to use that are GTA+ only. But it will not affect the core gameplay of GTAO2, it will only enhance it for the people who subscribe to it. Thousands of other games have implemented a premium subscription that benefits their subscribers without screwing the FTP players and I'm sure R* will do their best to do the same.   Spider-Vice and drdrimes 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronPerfection Posted June 10, 2023 Share Posted June 10, 2023 39 minutes ago, Vice Cit said:  Try not to wipe before you sh*t when it comes to GTAO2. We know nothing about it yet.  You need to remember R*/T2 NEEDS the next GTAO to last another decade and bring in more profits than the first. It's not gonna last the way they need it to if they put everything behind a pay wall and constantly shove microtransactions down our throats. They know their player base is used to getting consistent free to play content and they will continue to do so. Yes, they're going to have to have some enticing benefits to get more people to sign up for GTA+. Yes, there will be shark cards again and maybe even a premium currency. But, a big part of business is learning what works and doesn't work and I'm more than positive R* did a lot of learning when it came to the failure of RDO.  They will find a sweet spot for GTA+, what they're doing now isn't a good representation for it because the current GTAO wasn't built with that in mind. I'm sure there will be something you wanna wear, some building you wanna visit, who knows maybe even some vehicle cosmetics that you want to use that are GTA+ only. But it will not affect the core gameplay of GTAO2, it will only enhance it for the people who subscribe to it. Thousands of other games have implemented a premium subscription that benefits their subscribers without screwing the FTP players and I'm sure R* will do their best to do the same.   I’m not saying the online will be bad or good lol I’m just saying I don’t even like online games to begin with so I don’t have an issue on whether or not Online sucks because it could be the best online game ever made I still won’t play it nearly as much as I’ll play the story and Vice versa. I get why online players are scared though, GTAO, whether it determines the future or not, just isn’t setting a good precedent, even if it’s not what rockstar will do in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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