String Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Saw a topic like this on reddit and thought I'd make one here. For me it's flying missions. Anything to do with flying planes, choppers or RC toys, I know I am not in for a good time. MagicMike51, The Time Ranger, billiejoearmstrong8 and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
universetwisters Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Recently, the lack of integration of sh*t from Online to V. What the f*ck do you mean I have to be in a public lobby and risk getting killed by a ten year old on a flying bike just to be a criminal mastermind and rob a casino when I should be able to do it in single player to begin with? Universally though, it’s annoying how easy it is to get arrested. If a cop points a gun at you while you’re running you can at least put your hands up and then be like “sike lol” and run away. However, when you’re in a car (i.e. a moving vehicle that drives faster than you can run) and a cop pulls a gun on you, you give up quicker than me when I went to college. What the heck!?!?! Airwolf359, NightmanCometh96, Zello and 7 others 7 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946037 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Recruiting homies during a riot. They often run away when there are police helicopters around and it's f*cking annoying to do missions like Los Desperados. Super Shizuku, Cluckin Bell CEO and String 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946102 Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowTierDude Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 (edited) grindey drive from point a to b sh*t. especially prevalent in iv, v and online Edited September 12, 2022 by sabitsuki Airwolf359, Dr Busta, Cluckin Bell CEO and 4 others 7 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946120 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahraini_carguy Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Collectibles. (Long rant) If it's like GTA 3, Vice City, LCS and VCS then it wasn't all that bad since the maps were fairly small and you got rewarded each time you collected 10 packages. Additionally in VCS, you can actually check on the map which of the 99 balloons you have popped or not. On the other hand, San Andreas, IV and V felt too much of a chores. San Andreas is the least bad out of the three since the rewards are kinda decent but going through 250 collectibles in total was a tedious experience. GTA 4's 200 Pigeons is by far the worst one. The fact that the only reward you get for shooting all 'em birds is a helicopter located on top of a skyscraper (one that you could easily get in other locations, mind you) is pretty bad enough. I'm not even getting into the other reasons why it's the worst thing by far in GTA 4. Airwolf359, Dr Busta, The Prince Algie and 8 others 10 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946148 Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Ryan. Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 R*'s insistence of milking GTAO's tits so hard the milk turns to powder. Lord Criminal, Mister Pink, NightmanCometh96 and 4 others 4 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946511 Share on other sites More sharing options...
D T Posted September 13, 2022 Share Posted September 13, 2022 (edited) I feel like the "GTA universe" undermines the game's artistic value. These level designers put in ungodly work hours to accurately recreate cities in stunning detail, just so subpar writers can come in and slap a dick joke over it because "it's GTA." Turning on the radio just to hear an ad about pissing on hookers is funny exactly two times. Listening to DJs awkwardly shoehorn names like Los Santos or Liberty City is super painful, especially when the song lyrics on that same station contradict their existence. There's literally a song called Los Angeles on Channel X. It's mad corny. It's a very good thing to have satire, but there's too much of a disconnect when it's everywhere, all while the plot is begging us to take it serious. It made sense for the 3D era games, since things had to be gratuitous to stand out in lower fidelity, but now it just feels unnecessary to lean into it that heavily. Watch Dogs is a pretty good example of doing satire while maintaining a fairly grounded world. Edited September 13, 2022 by D T Pistol Bobcat, handy_fox, TP_ONE and 12 others 12 3 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946551 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cluckin Bell CEO Posted September 13, 2022 Share Posted September 13, 2022 22 hours ago, sabitsuki said: grindey drive from point a to b sh*t. especially prevalent in iv, v and online IV is the worst in this sadly. Other GTAs atleast have more variety in missions to change things up. Dr Busta, Super Shizuku and String 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071946622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahraini_carguy Posted September 13, 2022 Share Posted September 13, 2022 (edited) 16 hours ago, D T said: I feel like the "GTA universe" undermines the game's artistic value. These level designers put in ungodly work hours to accurately recreate cities in stunning detail, just so subpar writers can come in and slap a dick joke over it because "it's GTA." Turning on the radio just to hear an ad about pissing on hookers is funny exactly two times. Listening to DJs awkwardly shoehorn names like Los Santos or Liberty City is super painful, especially when the song lyrics on that same station contradict their existence. There's literally a song called Los Angeles on Channel X. It's mad corny. It's a very good thing to have satire, but there's too much of a disconnect when it's everywhere, all while the plot is begging us to take it serious. It made sense for the 3D era games, since things had to be gratuitous to stand out in lower fidelity, but now it just feels unnecessary to lean into it that heavily. Watch Dogs is a pretty good example of doing satire while maintaining a fairly grounded world. I quite like GTA's satire when it comes to, say talk radio stations or parodies of things like brands, cities, it's inhabitants and such. Sex jokes on the other hand feels very juvenile and cringey. 69 this, 69 that, names that resemble naughty words and "haha this logo looks like a genitalia". I honestly wouldn't mind if they tone that down in the next GTA. Edited September 13, 2022 by FalconKing Thejeffster, D T, The Tracker and 2 others 4 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zello Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 On 9/12/2022 at 2:32 AM, universetwisters said: Recently, the lack of integration of sh*t from Online to V. I finally got a nightclub in Online and I'm pissed. This is something that would have totally fit the singleplayer I could have seen Michael or Franklin owning one and it would have worked perfectly. bahraini_carguy, NightmanCometh96 and jazzbone 3 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947142 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilikebanana Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 On 9/12/2022 at 2:34 PM, Carl Theft Kumar said: Recruiting homies during a riot. They often run away when there are police helicopters around and it's f*cking annoying to do missions like Los Desperados. Oh boy. I always thought that was some kind of annoying bug that only happened to me. Seems like it was for everyone xD String 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947227 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilikebanana Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 On 9/13/2022 at 7:35 AM, D T said: I feel like the "GTA universe" undermines the game's artistic value. These level designers put in ungodly work hours to accurately recreate cities in stunning detail, just so subpar writers can come in and slap a dick joke over it because "it's GTA." Turning on the radio just to hear an ad about pissing on hookers is funny exactly two times. Listening to DJs awkwardly shoehorn names like Los Santos or Liberty City is super painful, especially when the song lyrics on that same station contradict their existence. There's literally a song called Los Angeles on Channel X. It's mad corny. It's a very good thing to have satire, but there's too much of a disconnect when it's everywhere, all while the plot is begging us to take it serious. It made sense for the 3D era games, since things had to be gratuitous to stand out in lower fidelity, but now it just feels unnecessary to lean into it that heavily. Watch Dogs is a pretty good example of doing satire while maintaining a fairly grounded world. Satire has always been a part of GTA games and there is a good point for having it. It is a game. Nothing is supposed to be that much realistic. I mean that's the point of playing games in general, right? You are not going to experience the same thing you do in your normal 24/7. This is like saying why the cops in GTA don't care if you drive at highspeed or go pass the lights but the moment you suddenly crash to them with a bicycle, the whole police department will show up to beat the sh*t out of you. There is no reason to make everything realistic. Having corny jokes and sarcasm in radio and TV is a way of mocking the real world situation of media, people, countries and imo they don't feel out of place in the game. String 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947233 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Bobcat Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 (edited) On 9/13/2022 at 4:05 AM, D T said: I feel like the "GTA universe" undermines the game's artistic value. These level designers put in ungodly work hours to accurately recreate cities in stunning detail, just so subpar writers can come in and slap a dick joke over it because "it's GTA." Turning on the radio just to hear an ad about pissing on hookers is funny exactly two times. Listening to DJs awkwardly shoehorn names like Los Santos or Liberty City is super painful, especially when the song lyrics on that same station contradict their existence. There's literally a song called Los Angeles on Channel X. It's mad corny. It's a very good thing to have satire, but there's too much of a disconnect when it's everywhere, all while the plot is begging us to take it serious. It made sense for the 3D era games, since things had to be gratuitous to stand out in lower fidelity, but now it just feels unnecessary to lean into it that heavily. Watch Dogs is a pretty good example of doing satire while maintaining a fairly grounded world. I would particularly agree with this for V, I loved V but they definitely tried TOO hard to hammer down the jokes; hipster this, hipster that, plastic people here, plastic people over there, lololol enemas lollolol enemas and colonics etc. GTA IV had satire too don't get me wrong but I didn't hear about certain factors every 5 damn minutes. Speaking of, now that I'm replaying IV I really hate how V takes a colossal dump on The Lost MC and their legacy (were they truly so mad about the DLC apparently not selling well?), Johnny killed like a chump, Terry & Clay also killed mere minutes later, the gang being a perpetual arch enemy and target practice for both Trevor and the Online protagonists. It was established already in IV that the AOD are a major organization who started in San Andreas... so... why not just use the AOD as Trevor's enemy and then bring Johnny and his gang into Online as a mission/phone contact for the Bikers update instead of Malc? Guess they just reaaaaaally wanted some shock factor for his intro. At least they had the mercy to not make us push Angus off mt Chilliad. Edited September 14, 2022 by Fox in a Box Zello, Airwolf359, D T and 5 others 8 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947243 Share on other sites More sharing options...
String Posted September 14, 2022 Author Share Posted September 14, 2022 11 minutes ago, Fox in a Box said: the gang being a perpetual arch enemy and target practice for both Trevor and the Online protagonists. To be fair even in the IV era the Lost kept getting their asses kicked. Whenever they appeared outside TLaD they were target practice for Niko and Luis too, and Jim and Jason just run away without a fight (Jason does at the end when his crew join him but even then gets got). Not being able to choose the colour when you go to a pay n spray in most games wad a minor but quite annoying thing. Xane_MM, Pistol Bobcat and Jeansowaty 3 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947251 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Bobcat Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 1 hour ago, AkshayKumar said: To be fair even in the IV era the Lost kept getting their asses kicked. Whenever they appeared outside TLaD they were target practice for Niko and Luis too, and Jim and Jason just run away without a fight (Jason does at the end when his crew join him but even then gets got). Also true, Jim made an embarrassingly poor effort to hide from Ray; goes back to the SAME alley he received the money at last time. "I'm gonna get the brothers" he says, is literally with one random dude when Niko confronts them. If Ray didn't have continuity armor they could've just iced him in the basement and been done with it, and did rockstar ever answer what happens to the $2 million? String 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947282 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Pink Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 (edited) GTAO, it's a cancer to GTA. Online GTA sounds fun. And it can be and is at times but overral, GTAO has been a success for Rockstar/T2 and a disaster for many original fans. Shark Cards Inflated economy (it's unrealistic, kills any sense of immersive play). Loading times No singleplayer DLC (neglected due to online focus). Shift in GTA catering to mutliplayer instead of delivering a good singleplayer experience and supporting it. MP isn't suitable for everyone. For guys like me that find it hard to maintain online gaming relationships due to an inconssitent scheduling in my day to day life I'm forced to play as a lone wolf. Online doesn't reward playing alone because to access some of the fun features in Online it requires other people. Strangers. You can't rely on strangers to complete missions in GTAO. Someone cancels and you're left stuck in the clouds/loading screens. It's this abysmal "gameplay" loop that is one of the reasons makes me detest GTAO. Shark Cards ensure we all live in an economy where some percentage of people payed to win, or payed to gain in a competitive world about chasing the almighty dollar. I'm shocked and appalled more people aren't offended by Shark Cards. It's literrally, paying to gain. Why would you want to share the same world in a game where 1 guy has 3 apartments and 20 supers but paid real cash to gain them. Where's the bragging rights? Where the display of success? Personally, I'd like to be in lobbies with people that have earned everything through gameplay. That way, wealth in GTAO is a sign of dedicated and/or skilled player. However, currently, wealth can mean credit cards and/or cheating. There's no way to discern between the how people got their wealth. I just don't want to compete with others in GTA if Shark Cards exist. Just like how I don't want to play poker if I knew a guy at the table could buy infinite amounts of aces. Yes, I could still probably play and "win" but the integrity of the game is absolutely compromised. Focus on multiplayer has just attracted a certain type of nitwit we didn't ever had to experience in singleplayer. You know that competitive casual dude-bro that's only ever played multiplayer and skipped all the storys/campaigns. Yeah, that's the guy in GTAO now. Rockstar wants now to appeal to that guy. I always thought Rockstar were a little more subversive. They were mavericks in the industry. Now they have joined the ranks of souless corporate wanker companies like EA, Ubisoft and Activision. I know I'm beging to sound like some spotty teenage edgelord but Rockstar sold out. They sold out on GTAO Shark Cards. They milked GTA into the ground. They oversaturated fans with GTA, one GTA for 10 years. No DLC, no hope of a spin-off. "Free updates" is only get people into the place to spend money on Shark Cards. Trust me when Rocktstar release a GTAO update, it's a pay day for them. Except we have deal with a freemium economy. It's a complete sham. Many of the ideas in GTAO are brilliant but wasted in online and should be implimented in singleplayer. If GTAO is game that is "a pursuit of the almighty dollar" and then you can buy those dollars with real cash, then how the f*ck is it a game? It's not a game, it's an online store. Edited September 14, 2022 by Mister Pink NightmanCometh96, LongHairedFreakyGuy, Máriommsdsdf and 7 others 3 7 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adminsaredicks Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 Giving ten years constantly middle finger to story mode players... And unnecessary ingame restriction, that started in GTA V . For me that game is huge step back in terms of replayability and fun. The Tracker, Xane_MM and String 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947372 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krooked_ Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 (edited) On 9/13/2022 at 6:05 AM, D T said: I feel like the "GTA universe" undermines the game's artistic value. These level designers put in ungodly work hours to accurately recreate cities in stunning detail, just so subpar writers can come in and slap a dick joke over it because "it's GTA." Turning on the radio just to hear an ad about pissing on hookers is funny exactly two times. Listening to DJs awkwardly shoehorn names like Los Santos or Liberty City is super painful, especially when the song lyrics on that same station contradict their existence. There's literally a song called Los Angeles on Channel X. It's mad corny. It's a very good thing to have satire, but there's too much of a disconnect when it's everywhere, all while the plot is begging us to take it serious. It made sense for the 3D era games, since things had to be gratuitous to stand out in lower fidelity, but now it just feels unnecessary to lean into it that heavily. Watch Dogs is a pretty good example of doing satire while maintaining a fairly grounded world. Disagree. The satire is what makes GTA stand out. I think it has become an inseparable part of the series and it wouldn't be the same without it. Also changing things such as location names, brands of cars, foods, drinks etc. gives them more creative freedom and it adds character to the GTA universe making it stand in its own right. About the radio DJs, I don't know, I always liked the way they give a shoutout to the different neighborhoods and even other cities. It makes the world feel more alive and connected. Edited September 14, 2022 by Krooked_ B Dawg and String 2 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071947391 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Time Ranger Posted September 16, 2022 Share Posted September 16, 2022 Pushing GTAO over single player content. They even tried to have a monetized RDR2 online mode but that didn't work out. It's been nine years since V, which we have seen ported to two generations of consoles. I think that R* are becoming predictable regarding gta. Milk online for as long as possible, release VI and repeat the process, at least that's what I think will happen. I get that a company goes where the money goes and R* are raking in in with GTAO but I fear it's potentially caused a shift in priorities regarding what type of content they release, in this case the newer online focused model rather than the great single player experiences of old which made them. I think with their massive success they might go too safe and predictable, there's a thread here about VI, people discussing release dates and speculation, that's cool and all but what happened to the non mainline games, where's the Vice City or San Andreas of this generation, the last non mainline gta was Chinatown Wars in 2009, RDR2 showed they can still do an epic single player experience, but will they be allowed to, will the suits at the top dictate what content to release? I get that's their job, to make money but I fear it will come at the cost of less risk taking and sanitation of Gta, obviously this is all speculation and I hope i'm wrong but is it implausible, we've already seen sharkcards, gta+ and the so called "Definitive edition," the only thing definitive about that is that it's lazy and sh*t. String, Máriommsdsdf and NightmanCometh96 2 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071948816 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrudgefromSanAndreas Posted September 16, 2022 Share Posted September 16, 2022 not dubbing not putting classic trilogy on gog inconsistent parody (vehicle) brands and names. putting multiple real brands into one parody. missed/wasted potential on choosing the right name, e.g. Benefactor Panto could've been just called Vollthrottel as it's actually a play on the word "smart", what has Panto do anything with it? theres more but i cant think of atm String 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071948818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
R2R_slimeway Posted September 16, 2022 Share Posted September 16, 2022 The damn police officers String and Xane_MM 1 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071948826 Share on other sites More sharing options...
atay26 Posted September 17, 2022 Share Posted September 17, 2022 The toxic GTA community Dr_Sprunk, Yinepi, Zello and 1 other 2 1 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071949079 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBreak16 Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 The NPC drivers, in every GTA games. I can't count the number of times that I have crashed, got my car destroyed or stuck, ended up with a wanted level, failed to escape the cops or have gotten killed because of these f*cking stupid, braindead and mentally retarded NPC drivers. I hate them String, handy_fox, Evil empire and 1 other 1 1 1 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071989436 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Americana Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 Not being able to buy a personal vehicle in Grand Theft Auto IV and V. Also, cars disappearing. The Time Ranger, Zello, String and 2 others 5 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071989475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Sprunk Posted October 12, 2022 Share Posted October 12, 2022 Me in 2012: GTA SA fanboys. Me in 2022: GTA IV fanboys. Fanboys are always the most annoying thing in ANY video game community. Why? Because they exist in real life unlike cops in GTA universe. atay26, Jeansowaty, String and 1 other 2 1 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071990658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil empire Posted October 12, 2022 Share Posted October 12, 2022 Globally speaking the missions that force me to pilot a plane, Freefall and Supply lines are the worst. Dr Busta, String and Jeansowaty 3 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071990792 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade Monke Posted October 12, 2022 Share Posted October 12, 2022 The GTA 5 community. Seriously I tell people I chose ending B and I get stormed with thousands of "Non-canon!!!!!!" And "Michael is the best!!!!!!!" Comments from toxic kids. atay26 and Jeansowaty 2 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071990799 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Time Ranger Posted October 12, 2022 Share Posted October 12, 2022 Whenever I played V, I could be speeding through Los Santos at 120mph in an infernus, doesn't matter, it's like death, inevitable, I expect it but it still frightens me every time, it's omnipotent, oh god it's happ... f*ck ME IN THE ASS String 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071990811 Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant remember Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 To me it would be R* 's constant habit of releasing the PC version later, saying it's going to be the "best version ever" and then delivering a janky neglected port. Here's my examples: - GTA3: PS2 looked smooth when running around, PC's mouselook just has claude's feet floating around with his back "fixed" to the camera. They promised us replay mode and ability to open/remove top of convertibles but does anyone remember how poorly this was implemented ? - Vice: Mouse-look still horrible. When you rob a store character doesn't even point his gun at the clerk, he just stares normally, clerk doesn't flinch either, floating money just appears together with wanted stars, it's soooo janky and poorly made. Seaplane doesn't even have an animation to get in or doors, when you jump out a moving car the door doesn't open. Doors that NPC's flee out of stay stuck in the open position. Flat tires is just the wheel clipping slightly through the ground and shaking while driving .... basically a ton of the features they added is of very poor effort. - San Andreas: Cars constantly kept honking abnormally, the cars getting dirty gradually mechanic was broken (all cars were 100% dirty, how did they even miss this?), certain voice clips were also broken for the PC version. - GTA 4: extremely badly optimized, it ran and looked horrible unless you had very good specs. Mafia 2 was its contemporary and it looked better and ran much better on mid-spec computers. - GTA 5: This is the first one where I didn't see any obvious problems with the PC port so this time they delayed it for a year and a half instead of the usual 9 months. MrBreak16 and String 1 1 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071991350 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twist Of Sugar Venom Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 (edited) Enemy AI - John Wick. Ally AI - Guy from Pulp Fiction that tries to shoot Jules and Vincent. Edited October 13, 2022 by TwistOfLime21 Dr Busta and String 2 Link to comment https://gtaforums.com/topic/985368-what-annoys-you-the-most-about-gta/#findComment-1071991374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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