Potential Rebalancing Discussion Thread

[Shadowfennekin]

Oh right, the MK II nerf is coming. I can't wait for it but I do hope the MK II is still a viable transport vehicle, it's pretty much what I use to grab Event Cargo and other Business Battle goods when I can't activate CEO's Buzzard...

 

The missiles are what needs to go

 

 

Staff Edit: To discuss what was originally announced with the release of current-gen that may be coming this Summer.

Edited July 2 by Spider-Vice

[Shiloh Comes]

5 hours ago, Shadowfennekin said:

Oh right, the MK II nerf is coming. I can't wait for it but I do hope the MK II is still a viable transport vehicle, it's pretty much what I use to grab Event Cargo and other Business Battle goods when I can't activate CEO's Buzzard...

 

The missiles are what needs to go

 

I'm not so sure Rockstar would be that keen on reducing the enjoyability of what, let's be honest, is the main reason most people below the age of 18 play this game. That bike is pretty much GTA Online and has been since it came out. If they make it less than it is, that is going to send away an awful lot of players at a time when they are having a commercial nightmare as it is in terms of the wider economy. Kids are idiots. They go where the fun is, it's hardwired. Are they going to drive them away?

 

Of course I get why, if you play with strangers in public lobbies you will not like this bike. I don't do that, so any boost to that enjoyment comes at the expense of people like me who want it buffed, not nerfed. I want it made much faster. It's too slow. I use it to make money and it's made me money faster than any other thing in the game. I'll have to accept it if it does get nerfed, but it will be a shame for a serious businessman to have to lose profit because some kids somewhere like splody time.

 

Part of me has a moral objection to that as a gamer. Here's me interacting with the game and all it's features, progressing and getting to the big dog table, and my relationship with the game has to get worse because over there, some INCEL kids who have no interest in the game or exploring it's many charms, are blowing up other people's stuff.

 

Business lobbies with anything other than what's in your weapon loadout, disabled have always been the only answer to this problem. If they can block vehicles in missions then they can implement it tomorrow if they wished. It's only Rockstar who don't think there is room for GTA COD Sandbox and the authentic proper rags to riches Grand Theft Auto. The players have wanted both for years.

 

With hindsight, the "worst of Rockstar logic" thread would have been more accurately named "the decline of Rockstar" thread. I've given up trying to figure them out, I don't think many of the people who made this franchise so cool can be left there and their replacements just don't seem to "get" it. It will become what it will become based on their blandness. I dont think this current lot could even think about Trevor without having to lie down and hug an avacado. GTA is becoming Glastonbury. Product placement wearing a plastic cape with "authentic" printed on it.

 

There seem to be too many there who've forgotten or never knew that very authenticity was bestowed on the game by the players. GTA became what it is because we liked what they did and took it and insipred them to keep going and adding. Almost like a back and forth with the players. Now its seems the future is "here's your dinner, eat it or don't". Fine as a business model to an accountant, but to a human, that just says "if you stop being cool and we stop liking you, you become MySpace overnight".

 

Time will tell. Sorry for the essay, but we all know gaming has been at a crossroads for a while with various companies pushing bounderies to find new revenue streams to replace fully milked ones. See GTA+ as the attempt at mitigating spunked-out Shark revenue. I'm not sure too many old timers like where we see this going. That said, if they make the game subscription then I will be front row center, I hate that I have to pay Microsoft anything when I only want to play GTA.

[Mexicola9302]

44 minutes ago, Shiloh Comes said:

 

I'm not so sure Rockstar would be that keen on reducing the enjoyability of what, let's be honest, is the main reason most people below the age of 18 play this game. That bike is pretty much GTA Online and has been since it came out. If they make it less than it is, that is going to send away an awful lot of players at a time when they are having a commercial nightmare as it is in terms of the wider economy. Kids are idiots. They go where the fun is, it's hardwired. Are they going to drive them away?

 

Of course I get why, if you play with strangers in public lobbies you will not like this bike. I don't do that, so any boost to that enjoyment comes at the expense of people like me who want it buffed, not nerfed. I want it made much faster. It's too slow. I use it to make money and it's made me money faster than any other thing in the game. I'll have to accept it if it does get nerfed, but it will be a shame for a serious businessman to have to lose profit because some kids somewhere like splody time.

 

Part of me has a moral objection to that as a gamer. Here's me interacting with the game and all it's features, progressing and getting to the big dog table, and my relationship with the game has to get worse because over there, some INCEL kids who have no interest in the game or exploring it's many charms, are blowing up other people's stuff.

 

Business lobbies with anything other than what's in your weapon loadout, disabled have always been the only answer to this problem. If they can block vehicles in missions then they can implement it tomorrow if they wished. It's only Rockstar who don't think there is room for GTA COD Sandbox and the authentic proper rags to riches Grand Theft Auto. The players have wanted both for years.

 

With hindsight, the "worst of Rockstar logic" thread would have been more accurately named "the decline of Rockstar" thread. I've given up trying to figure them out, I don't think many of the people who made this franchise so cool can be left there and their replacements just don't seem to "get" it. It will become what it will become based on their blandness. I dont think this current lot could even think about Trevor without having to lie down and hug an avacado. GTA is becoming Glastonbury. Product placement wearing a plastic cape with "authentic" printed on it.

 

There seem to be too many there who've forgotten or never knew that very authenticity was bestowed on the game by the players. GTA became what it is because we liked what they did and took it and insipred them to keep going and adding. Almost like a back and forth with the players. Now its seems the future is "here's your dinner, eat it or don't". Fine as a business model to an accountant, but to a human, that just says "if you stop being cool and we stop liking you, you become MySpace overnight".

 

Time will tell. Sorry for the essay, but we all know gaming has been at a crossroads for a while with various companies pushing bounderies to find new revenue streams to replace fully milked ones. See GTA+ as the attempt at mitigating spunked-out Shark revenue. I'm not sure too many old timers like where we see this going. That said, if they make the game subscription then I will be front row center, I hate that I have to pay Microsoft anything when I only want to play GTA.

They could just remove the Oppressor MK2 and refund the full price, i wouldn't miss it a second. I hope they nerf it so hard that it's almost useless.

[drizztle]

3 hours ago, Shiloh Comes said:

 

I'm not so sure Rockstar would be that keen on reducing the enjoyability of what, let's be honest, is the main reason most people below the age of 18 play this game. That bike is pretty much GTA Online and has been since it came out. If they make it less than it is, that is going to send away an awful lot of players at a time when they are having a commercial nightmare as it is in terms of the wider economy. Kids are idiots. They go where the fun is, it's hardwired. Are they going to drive them away?

 

Of course I get why, if you play with strangers in public lobbies you will not like this bike. I don't do that, so any boost to that enjoyment comes at the expense of people like me who want it buffed, not nerfed. I want it made much faster. It's too slow. I use it to make money and it's made me money faster than any other thing in the game. I'll have to accept it if it does get nerfed, but it will be a shame for a serious businessman to have to lose profit because some kids somewhere like splody time.

 

Part of me has a moral objection to that as a gamer. Here's me interacting with the game and all it's features, progressing and getting to the big dog table, and my relationship with the game has to get worse because over there, some INCEL kids who have no interest in the game or exploring it's many charms, are blowing up other people's stuff.

 

Business lobbies with anything other than what's in your weapon loadout, disabled have always been the only answer to this problem. If they can block vehicles in missions then they can implement it tomorrow if they wished. It's only Rockstar who don't think there is room for GTA COD Sandbox and the authentic proper rags to riches Grand Theft Auto. The players have wanted both for years.

 

With hindsight, the "worst of Rockstar logic" thread would have been more accurately named "the decline of Rockstar" thread. I've given up trying to figure them out, I don't think many of the people who made this franchise so cool can be left there and their replacements just don't seem to "get" it. It will become what it will become based on their blandness. I dont think this current lot could even think about Trevor without having to lie down and hug an avacado. GTA is becoming Glastonbury. Product placement wearing a plastic cape with "authentic" printed on it.

 

There seem to be too many there who've forgotten or never knew that very authenticity was bestowed on the game by the players. GTA became what it is because we liked what they did and took it and insipred them to keep going and adding. Almost like a back and forth with the players. Now its seems the future is "here's your dinner, eat it or don't". Fine as a business model to an accountant, but to a human, that just says "if you stop being cool and we stop liking you, you become MySpace overnight".

 

Time will tell. Sorry for the essay, but we all know gaming has been at a crossroads for a while with various companies pushing bounderies to find new revenue streams to replace fully milked ones. See GTA+ as the attempt at mitigating spunked-out Shark revenue. I'm not sure too many old timers like where we see this going. That said, if they make the game subscription then I will be front row center, I hate that I have to pay Microsoft anything when I only want to play GTA.

I dun know why formers always say op2 grifers are kids, they use parent's credit card .....Do we have data support?

 

I play fps game like ow, bf4,apex legend.  In my experience, toxix players are around 17~3x. Players around 13~16 usually lack of skill and experience but they talk sh*t like""I learn my move from streamer/champion,I am right, u are wrong, brbrbrbrbrbr """ . Players under 13 usually play like easiest AI.(or worst)

 

GTA is a FPS+driving+flying game, I feel most kids <13 have difficulties doing the complex control and prefer Dota more.

 

I am not defending those kids, I just want to say: I believe Grifers mainly naive teenager/adult with enough time and intelligence to grind a oppressor 2 rather than credit card kid.

 

Oppressor 2 is a double edged sword, it make Deliveryman crazy but it save them a lot of time in delivery mission as well...I dun like OP2 grifers but I dun agree erasing it. just make OP2 weaker against the mini gun(maybe weaker to homing missile as well) and the problem is solved

[Mexicola9302]

They should completly remove missiles from Oppressor Mk2 and Deluxo and make it go 180 mph even in the air, but make it possible to use normal weapons like pistol, smg, throwable explosives etc. then i would be totally okay with it.

[ACR]

1 minute ago, Mexicola9302 said:

They should completly remove missiles from Oppressor Mk2 and Deluxo and make it go 180 mph even in the air, but make it possible to use normal weapons like pistol, smg, throwable explosives etc. then i would be totally okay with it.

Which would render it completely useless for some crate sourcing missions and morons would continue to grief but with hydra, toreador and other replacements.

[Mexicola9302]

6 minutes ago, ACR said:

Which would render it completely useless for some crate sourcing missions and morons would continue to grief but with hydra, toreador and other replacements.

Come up with something better then. It's too OP we all know it.

 

If you could go 180 mph in the air you could fly right next to choppers and planes and even shoot the pilots...

 

180 MPH IN THE AIR with normal weapons!!!!!!!!

Edited July 2 by Mexicola9302

[theguy1998]

1 minute ago, Mexicola9302 said:

Come up with something better than. It's too OP we all know it.

Here's the "something better"! Remove every futuristic vehicle from GTAO, every. single. one. Then leave the classic ones like hydra, etc.

 

...not a good idea? well, there isn't a lot to do, the PvP is already ruined.

 

[ACR]

1 minute ago, Mexicola9302 said:

Come up with something better than. It's too OP we all know it.

 

If you could go 180 mph in the air you could fly right next to choppers and planes and even shoot the pilots...

Uh yea, that could happen if they remove OP aimbot npcs that can instant kill with uzi or lmg as chopper gunners. I would be ok if they remove missiles but buff rate of fire of explosive mgs so it could be used as weaponized vehicles still but without lock on, but then some people would still be bitching.

[Mexicola9302]

Every lobby would be more chilled without the f*cking MK2...

[ACR]

Just now, Mexicola9302 said:

Every lobby would be more chilled without the f*cking MK2...

No because griefing would continue with other vehicles, you remove firearms and psychos would just go with knife attacks or moving down crowd with trucks. You can't stop griefing, the only way would be to separate lobbies by making them aither PVE or PVP but then casuals wouldn't be frustrated that they can't sell their businesses and go with shark cards so less money in R* pockets.

[motomami]

People who don't want MKII to be nerfed or removed because they use it for grinding, what even is the fun in grinding after you've made your millions to billions of dollars? I'm genuinely curious. I never understood grinding mentality. If you're grinding just to grind and not for money, unlocks or achievements, wouldn't grinding with a less OP vehicle make the experience more fun and challenging?

[Mexicola9302]

7 minutes ago, motomami said:

People who don't want MKII to be nerfed or removed because they use it for grinding, what even is the fun in grinding after you've made your millions to billions of dollars? I'm genuinely curious. I never understood grinding mentality. If you're grinding just to grind and not for money, unlocks or achievements, wouldn't grinding with a less OP vehicle make the experience more fun and challenging?

Yeah imagine forcing ppl to grind without MK2 while already having 500 million, it's such a shame.  

 

The rich ppl need to earn more money, let's all shed a tear and keep MK2 untouched...

Edited July 2 by Mexicola9302

[REVENGE777]

3 minutes ago, motomami said:

People who don't want MKII to be nerfed or removed because they use it for grinding, what even is the fun in grinding after you've made your millions to billions of dollars? I'm genuinely curious. I never understood grinding mentality. If you're grinding just to grind and not for money, unlocks or achievements, wouldn't grinding with a less OP vehicle make the experience more fun and challenging?

I’m not a hardcore grinder, but i go out n grinding binges for a few days, stack up about 10+ million and then blow it all in one day lol. If the mkll was less viable as a pvp vehicle, I’d buy one just to use for cayo setups.

[Mexicola9302]

Oppressor MK2 and Deluxo should lose missiles and only be used as transport. Make them both go 180 mph while flying, only give them normal drive by weapons.

 

I would love this change, if they are really that fast.

 

The new consoles and PC both can do this sort of thing.

 

Imagine flying 180 mph how awesome that would be.

 

You could do many more missions in much less time.

 

If you need weapons you call pegasus or you get a personal aircraft, and fly there with 180 mph.

 

MK2 and Deluxo users, wouldn't be marked as sort of griefers on the map by others anymore, the users could fly freely without any danger. Well or much much less danger, going 180 mph.

 

f*ck even i would use Deluxo or MK2 on a regular basis then.

 

Only countermeasures and speed, and normal weapons, like ap-pistol, micro-smg etc.

Edited July 2 by Mexicola9302

[ACR]

2 minutes ago, Mexicola9302 said:

MK2 and Deluxo users, wouldn't be marked as sort of griefers on the map by others anymore, the users could fly freely without any danger. Well or much much less danger, going 180 mph.

 

f*ck even i would use Deluxo or MK2 on a regular basis then.

 

Only countermeasures and speed, and normal weapons, like ap-pistol, smg etc.

Getting decimated with barely any chance to defend against temrinator aimbot npcs...

[Black-Dragon96]

56 minutes ago, ACR said:

Which would render it completely useless for some crate sourcing missions and morons would continue to grief but with hydra, toreador and other replacements.

Hydra is more than easily countered with an explosive sniper or basicly just setting up shop below a bridge and waiting until the griefer crashes.

Torreador gets countered with basicly any gun and just shooting the driver out.

Same goes for the likes of the nightshark. Get up on a ledge he cant get up on and minigun his a$$ through the viewports in the armor. Not to mention that he cant do sh*t the second you get airborn.

 

And I dont really get how taking the mk2s missiles would make it useless for grinding. And even if, the buzzard still exists.

[Mexicola9302]

I also got no problems with terminator npc's just driving a regular car. So hmm yeah just living with it. Maybe im just a good driver, or it's something else.

 

Thermal scope has to be removed completly, so there are no more Hydra Griefers and through wall shooters.

 

Ppl should see an eye doctor if they can't hit sh*t anymore after removing it...

Edited July 2 by Mexicola9302

[ACR]

1 minute ago, Black-Dragon96 said:

Hydra is more than easily countered with an explosive sniper or basicly just setting up shop below a bridge and waiting until the griefer crashes.

Torreador gets countered with basicly any gun and just shooting the driver out.

Same goes for the likes of the nightshark. Get up on a ledge he cant get up on and minigun his a$$ through the viewports in the armor. Not to mention that he cant do sh*t the second you get airborn.

 

And I dont really get how taking the mk2s missiles would make it useless for grinding. And even if, the buzzard still exists.

Can you land anywhere with buzzard and how much time you need for that? Aimbot npcs draining health with rapid fire smg and rifles just to frustrate players due to R* artificially made them that way and some are advocating to nerf grinding tools so it should frustrate players even more... Of course R* won't ever nerf terminator npcs, but so they most likely won't do the same to MK2 so it's a status quo that's acceptable to me. I was just giving an example of griefing mindset, it won't stop, but then again i don't engage in a cesspool of public lobby (few friendly players  are exception) and pvp. Nerfing mk2 is against mine interest as a grinder unless they seriously do the same to PVE enemy npcs, if they rebalance that aspect of shooting system then i would change my opinion.

[Mexicola9302]

Why land right next to NPC's?

 

You can land further away and use a Kuruma or something.

Or snipe them.

Or whatever, you always got a choice.

Edited July 2 by Mexicola9302

[ACR]

10 minutes ago, Mexicola9302 said:

Why land right next to NPC's?

 

You can land further away and use a Kuruma or something.

Or snipe them.

Or whatever, you always got a choice.

Because i'm loosing time  landing ffs, it's not about proximity of NPCS, fly buzzard, land, call kuruma or just blast them with missiles and save yourself some time. I don't even play that way anymore, i'm doing shootouts with regular firearms against them in every scenario, (rarely if i even play headhunter anymore i'm using sparrow),  then some NPC kill me from full health while blindfiring, that's somehow aight but we must nerf mk2. Don't touch mk2 unless you seriously nerf NPCS precision and minigun rate of fire on assault rifles and smgs, in such cases mk2 is the most useful counter to not waste time.

[Zak Ras]

I am NOT operating under the idea that the OpMk2 is being nerfed, or buffed. R* have only used vague terminology to describe what changes will be occuring, so any across the board level changes for the benefit of anyone who isn't a PvP-chronically-frenzied-masturbating-over-K/D-wannabe-John Wick-skill-levelled-solo-paramilitary-juggalo (try saying that when you're drunk), rather than just a few already useless weaponized vehicles being made even more useless, will be a miracle - look at how long it took for Passive Mode to be made unavailable to anyone in a weaponized vehicle.

 

So yeah, it'd be nice - but don't kid yourself into thinking it and many other would-be-incredible changes have already been confirmed. Stay the grey man until we know what changes are occuring.

[Nutduster]

Nerf it unto death.

 

They won't, of course. It makes them too much money. But it's too easy a tool to use for both griefers AND grinders. Nerf it without mercy, give refunds to anyone who complains.

[ACR]

3 minutes ago, Nutduster said:

Nerf it unto death.

 

They won't, of course. It makes them too much money. But it's too easy a tool to use for both griefers AND grinders. Nerf it without mercy, give refunds to anyone who complains.

Or you just play in solo public or invite only, no more pasky mk2 to bother you. They are never going to remove it, so it should be some kind of compromise that would benefit majority of players, which won't happen because R* is lazy or just don't have time to rebalance it the right way. The way things are status quo is much better then completely removing it or nerfing it to oblivion.

[krotex]

1 hour ago, Mexicola9302 said:

Come up with something better then.

Two types of sessions solve all issues.
One session is active, where players can deal damage to each other.
Another session is passive, where players cannot damage each other. Exactly as it is implemented for partners of one organization.
If you want to fight - go to an active session. If you want to relax on a rare car near the sea with your friends, join the passive session.

[HopalongCasidy]

2 hours ago, Mexicola9302 said:

They should completly remove missiles from Oppressor Mk2 and Deluxo and make it go 180 mph even in the air, but make it possible to use normal weapons like pistol, smg, throwable explosives etc. then i would be totally okay with it.

Pretty positive the answer is not make it go faster.  Delete skill bike.  The fact that it’s cheaper than the mki is laughable.

[Nutduster]

40 minutes ago, ACR said:

Or you just play in solo public or invite only, no more pasky mk2 to bother you.

 

This remains as dumb a response as it was the previous 1,000 times someone said it to me. A huge chunk of game content is locked to public sessions only (yeah yeah, solo public blah blah blah--not everyone can do that, or knows how, or wants to acquire the technical know-how to do that on a regular basis). And... this is a multiplayer game. Emergent game experiences WITH OTHER PLAYERS is the whole point, more or less. That we can't have those experiences without a Mk II pooping on us is all down to many bad decisions by Rockstar.

 

As far as "they will never actually do anything really," on that we agree. Which is why I lobby for them to do what little they might actually do, including nerf the stupid thing a tiny bit just to make it more bearable. If some grinders suffer for it... well, boo hoo. I grind too and it's fine. It's not really much of an inconvenience, and honestly, for a lot of things the game SHOULD be harder.

[ACR]

5 minutes ago, Nutduster said:

 

This remains as dumb a response as it was the previous 1,000 times someone said it to me. A huge chunk of game content is locked to public sessions only (yeah yeah, solo public blah blah blah--not everyone can do that, or knows how, or wants to acquire the technical know-how to do that on a regular basis). And... this is a multiplayer game. Emergent game experiences WITH OTHER PLAYERS is the whole point, more or less. That we can't have those experiences without a Mk II pooping on us is all down to many bad decisions by Rockstar.

 

As far as "they will never actually do anything really," on that we agree. Which is why I lobby for them to do what little they might actually do, including nerf the stupid thing a tiny bit just to make it more bearable. If some grinders suffer for it... well, boo hoo. I grind too and it's fine. It's not really much of an inconvenience, and honestly, for a lot of things the game SHOULD be harder.

Boo hoo just go solo public, you just wanna nerf it because you don't like it and don't give a f*ck about downside for other portion of players and you mentioning how easy it is for grinders, so what you just want it to become even more frustrating to grind? So you can moan about it, boo hoo go passive or invite only.

[Nutduster]

44 minutes ago, krotex said:

Two types of sessions solve all issues.
One session is active, where players can deal damage to each other.
Another session is passive, where players cannot damage each other. Exactly as it is implemented for partners of one organization.
If you want to fight - go to an active session. If you want to relax on a rare car near the sea with your friends, join the passive session.

 

A great and tremendously simple idea (though it has a lot of downstream ramifications--jobs and events that need updating to work in the new session type). But, nine years on, it's just not happening. A little bit heartbreaking, really.

[Spider-Vice]

I moved this knowing it would start arguments (it's like 2016 up in here again) and pollute the DLC topic, but I would advise bringing bickering elsewhere and tone down the aggression.