Introducing GTA+ - Reward-based Subscription for GTA Online

[Cigars and chill]

31 minutes ago, carnerd3000 said:

 

Unfortunately, GTA Online is easily a case where the negatives can outweigh the positives, but I know that also depends on who you ask. This isn't just a game that has a few nitpicks. The first two things you mentioned can easily screw up your gameplay, and in extreme situations make the game unplayable altogether, which is why people want the third thing so they don't have to deal with the first two. And honestly, what is organic about having someone using player-created cheats to have an unfair advantage at the game?

That is not what I mean by organic. I mean whatever happens happens.  Rockstar will change and implement things based on money and shareholders input. Is it frustrating at times...of course it is.  But life goes on.

[Kirsty]

56 minutes ago, Yellow Dog with Cone said:

>toxic positivity

>"it is what it is", "nothing we can do about it" defeatist rhetoric

>"if you don't like it, go play something else" non argument

 

Is there truly any realistic alternative than acceptance at this point? Genuine question, as these days not saying anything is the equivalent to defending or endorsing a decision to some people, but the opposite achieves nothing either.

 

If the last few Rockstar "blunders" are anything to go by (like the modding situation, the Trilogy fiasco, the expectations of E&E, RDO basically being a missing person), then no actions the community have taken even collectively have made an immediate difference. Review bombing, protests, hashtags, even exceptionally well constructed videos or articles criticising them don't seem to have made them budge on core things community takes issue with, so what's left? A lot of people think social media and forum spaces etc is "everyone" talking when it isn't - Rockstar probably have so much data telling them otherwise, granted probably from casual players, but that's what they follow.

 

I think for something like GTA+ the only thing that can achieve any difference is simply not buying it, not making it successful, but long term I think even this is a hard task when people are in charge of their own choices and I've already seen a fair amount of people I follow on Twitter have bought it. If someone finds value in something, then what can be done? I watched Broughy's video and I think he put it well that it's on him to make an informed choice based on where he wants to take his own content.

 

I've said this elsewhere but I think the only thing that will make Rockstar "take a look at themselves" in the way many in the community expect is for a mainline game (i.e. GTA VI) to completely flop. I don't see that happening any time soon either.

 

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

11 minutes ago, Kirsty said:

Is there truly any realistic alternative than acceptance at this point?

I mean, that's the thing, acceptance is how we ended up to this point in the first place.

 

People were either complacent with the current state of the game (or games, if you take the Trilogy and E&E in mind) or just didn't care about it. Even worse, the people who did expressed their worries were met with accusations from the rest of the R* community of being whiners or trolls.

 

Hell, the few times people in the community actually tried to do something about it (like the RDO community) they were met with resistance, hostility and mockery from the rest of the community too.

 

Maybe you're right, maybe it's too little too late at this point, but what really annoys me greatly is how no one actually did anything when we could have done something about it.

 

Or maybe there wasn't such window of opportunity ever and we were just screaming at the void all this time.

 

Maybe we were wrong.

 

It's hard to be a fan of R* these days.

[Kirsty]

1 minute ago, Yellow Dog with Cone said:

I mean, that's the thing, acceptance is how we ended up to this point in the first place.

 

People were either complacent with the current state of the game (or games, if you take the Trilogy and E&E in mind) or just didn't care about it. Even worse, the people who did expressed their worries were met with accusations from the rest of the R* community of being whiners or trolls.

 

Hell, the few times people in the community actually tried to do something about it (like the RDO community) they were met with resistance, hostility and mockery from the rest of the community too.

 

Maybe you're right, maybe it's too little too late at this point, but what really annoys me greatly is how no one actually did anything when we could have done something about it.

 

Or maybe there wasn't such window of opportunity ever and we were just screaming at the void all this time.

 

Maybe we were wrong.

 

It's hard to be a fan of R* these days.

 

That's probably the crux of it yeah. It's difficult to be on either side, especially when people get overly toxic or overly positive, and we could all do with being a bit better at properly expressing ourselves when things get problematic in the community. We've probably equalled each other out over the years and now no one truly wins apart from those who choose to ignore everything 

[Commander S]

Can't help but think that folks with decent audiences who do event week roundups (Gtamen, Broughy, etc.) should keep at it, along with their usual recommendations as to what's worth getting, what are the best discounts, etc.

 

...and always make a point of recommending the best discount of all: "don't waste your money on GTA+, or else you're part of the problem!" 

 

That's the problem with folks getting demoralised and drifting away: it means the only people left are the folks shrugging and saying "well, it is what it is..." - and that mixture of fatigue and ennui is how this stuff gets normalised (grudging acceptance is still acceptance, an' all that).

[Ash_735]

Remember when the most controversial thing Rockstar did was sell EFLC for $40 instead of $30? Man those were the days.

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

14 minutes ago, Ash_735 said:

Remember when the most controversial thing Rockstar did was sell EFLC for $40 instead of $30? Man those were the days.

Remember when Rockstar did Story Mode DLC? Good times.

[GhillieMaster]

17 hours ago, ilRae said:

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community. Most of them have built a following on outrage, instead of level minded takes. Going against those followers makes them delete their own tweets and change their tone.

R* tends to stick with established gaming journalists, and uses a pretty curated marketing strategy, almost Apple-esque. They are also very good at changing tone, and sparking a flood of interest with controlled info. It continues to work for them, as they know they can tease even the slightest info about GTA, and the narrative changes in their favor.

Further, they have a FAR better grasp on what the community says as a whole than many think, they use Sprinklr CXM and its platform AI. They see WAY more than the whiney-ass kids posting the same clown emojis and GTA6 replies on Reddit and Twitter everyday. That stuff gets filtered out pretty quickly as low level noise.

Well I cant speak for everyone, but I know at least for myself, as someone who plays the game nearly daily, I would do as much as I could to improve the game for everyone and I want to see it in its best state possible. From playing the game so often I know just about everything there is to know about the current state of things and if I was able to provide that insight directly, I would 100%.  I don't like being negative about it but when certain things are the way they are, I have to be honest... Because the fact is, a lot of the 'cancer or toxicity' in game is a direct result of how Rockstar has treated it themselves. Busted and broken mechanics, OP vehicles that have gone untouched, bugs that have gone unfixed for years. These game journalists hardly play GTA Online to know even half of this stuff, which I guess is why they stick with them, because they know they won't bring forward the issues that plague the game.

[AUScowboy]

Do you get a free Deveste Eight or just access to it and the Hao upgrade?

[Commander S]

6 minutes ago, Yellow Dog with Cone said:

Remember when Rockstar did Story Mode DLC? Good times.

 

 

On the one hand, only a fraction of players went on to buy story DLC even back then.

 

On the other, glad to see that in this age of open-ended monetisation and live services, the new Saints Row game is doing the old 'two story expansions and some weapon/clothing/vehicle packs' routine, like it's still 2011...

 

...man, remember when Saints Row 3 had lots of cosmetic packs, and people at the time described that as excessive? Seems positively quaint by modern standards!

[Black-Dragon96]

46 minutes ago, Kirsty said:

Is there truly any realistic alternative than acceptance at this point?

Well not accepting it and not filling their pockets but thats about it.

Trying to change R* with feedback is like screaming into the void of space. The only thing that would make them change course is them "crashing and burning". Something that a few years back would have seemed impossible but now after the "Defective Edition" and "Not E&E" aswell as MIA Red Dead Redemption and GTA 6 allegedly being restarted internally feels more possible every day.

 

At the end of the day the only real think we can do is help people make an informed decision by offering them information from both sides of the coin.

Will that achieve something? Probably not much. But it feels better than just sitting here twiddeling my thumbs and watch one of my favourite videogames go down the crapper one step at a time.

[Cigars and chill]

18 minutes ago, AUScowboy said:

Do you get a free Deveste Eight or just access to it and the Hao upgrade?

It's free.

[Shadowfennekin]

44 minutes ago, AUScowboy said:

Do you get a free Deveste Eight or just access to it and the Hao upgrade?

Both are free though the car will be available to purchase with GTA $ this time next week so not worth it lol

[carnerd3000]

2 hours ago, Cigars and chill said:

That is not what I mean by organic. I mean whatever happens happens.  Rockstar will change and implement things based on money and shareholders input. Is it frustrating at times...of course it is.  But life goes on.

 

Fair enough. We definitely don't have any control over how the game is programed. I just wonder how many casuals there are out there, that are apparently the ones who actually buy Shark Cards.

[Cigars and chill]

8 minutes ago, carnerd3000 said:

 

Fair enough. We definitely don't have any control over how the game is programed. I just wonder how many casuals there are out there, that are apparently the ones who actually buy Shark Cards.

I am sure 10s of thousands.  And while the ones who bought GTA + like me...are much smaller but I suspect this is a jumping off point and given time better things will be offered and that will rise as well.

[Shadowfennekin]

25 minutes ago, Cigars and chill said:

I am sure 10s of thousands.  And while the ones who bought GTA + like me...are much smaller but I suspect this is a jumping off point and given time better things will be offered and that will rise as well.

Shark cards give one a choice on what to buy, I'm sure that some likely bought + to see what the 'bonus' was but I doubt they'll keep it going given how low of a bonus it actually is lmao

 

+ gives you a selection and most the whales likely already own the sh*t R* is giving away

[Spider-Vice]

Something I've noticed about the wording in the GTA+ website FAQ. Only clothing specifically says it will be deposited into your inventory, whereas vehicles and property say they will either be discounted or free during member events, it really doesn't sound like they're planning to lock any of those two things, except clothes, behind the subscription - just making them free or cheaper. So if they say clothing will just be given to you and properties/vehicles will be discounted or free, this might mean that everyone can get it, except for full price (or a weekly bonus discount), whereas GTA+ members can get a discount or just a free property, I suppose depending on what it is.

 

I feel like there would be an extra tidbit about exclusive access and redeeming instead of "discounts" and such if they planned to lock property and vehicles, and they're not even mentioning clothing discounts, they're just giving it to you.

 

It would certainly be optimal if they came out officially and said directly "no we are not planning to lock property or vehicles to GTA+" but still... I personally don't think they're locking anything but cosmetics like most other subs out there.

[R a f a e]

1 hour ago, AUScowboy said:

Do you get a free Deveste Eight or just access to it and the Hao upgrade?

 

Both 

[D9fred95]

I don't get why everyone is being like "Rockstar said they won't lock content behind GTA+ so it's fine!" None of us ever thought they would stoop to the point of creating a subscription service for an already bloated online mode either yet here we are. Give it time and you'll see things slowly be locked away.

 

Lest we forget how Bethesda said Fallout 76's Atomic Shop would "only have cosmetics" and now they have full blown lootboxes in there that give you random buffs.

[Lonely-Martin]

5 hours ago, Kirsty said:

 

Is there truly any realistic alternative than acceptance at this point? Genuine question, as these days not saying anything is the equivalent to defending or endorsing a decision to some people, but the opposite achieves nothing either.

 

If the last few Rockstar "blunders" are anything to go by (like the modding situation, the Trilogy fiasco, the expectations of E&E, RDO basically being a missing person), then no actions the community have taken even collectively have made an immediate difference. Review bombing, protests, hashtags, even exceptionally well constructed videos or articles criticising them don't seem to have made them budge on core things community takes issue with, so what's left? A lot of people think social media and forum spaces etc is "everyone" talking when it isn't - Rockstar probably have so much data telling them otherwise, granted probably from casual players, but that's what they follow.

 

I think for something like GTA+ the only thing that can achieve any difference is simply not buying it, not making it successful, but long term I think even this is a hard task when people are in charge of their own choices and I've already seen a fair amount of people I follow on Twitter have bought it. If someone finds value in something, then what can be done? I watched Broughy's video and I think he put it well that it's on him to make an informed choice based on where he wants to take his own content.

 

I've said this elsewhere but I think the only thing that will make Rockstar "take a look at themselves" in the way many in the community expect is for a mainline game (i.e. GTA VI) to completely flop. I don't see that happening any time soon either.

 

 

It's where I'm at now, acceptance that is. I've just not got it in me to fight it/get angry/miffed etc (and I'm definitely not signing up to other social media to voice any concerns, lol). Just hope for the best and get what I can out the game while I can, RDRO too, though I play that far less than GTA, rare I visit The West these days, but it's a nice game to relax and hunt/fish/collect in at times.

 

We've seen all sorts from the players and long term fans and it just hasn't truly yielded enough of a response unfortunately. In my time here on GTAF we've seen some real feisty topics from the likes of public only content, griefing, petitions, and so on that I've had my say in often enough (too often for some, lol). It's just not working really. 

 

The way RDRO has gone this last year or so, that's just shocking though TBH. Really hope it has a future, but I also feel R* need to rethink that game a bit, bring some of what makes GTA:O thrive over, more freedom and choice, IMHO. Anyway, I digress.

 

I admire the effort some still put in over these controversial aspects we've seen of course, I really do. Though I do feel it can go too far, for example, there's such a divide between story only players and online players, and the whole PC vs console nonsense is tedious too, and now this where people are advocating griefing towards anyone that buys this GTA+. So I have been put off getting involved in some areas (or getting heavy here) as I love both online and story based GTA. The passion some have is just great to see though, just I've lost mine, lost that fight to want better, fixes, balance etc etc. I've not lost anything for R*'s story modes (though I'm cautious of what GTA next will be), and the online modes do offer me plenty of fun/escapism still (indeed, I praise R* for not forcing the likes of the casino and Cayo heists, the auto shop and Agency into public only - Really wish RDRO could add that freedom and flexibility to the game).

 

But R* shares the blame for the divides too. From cancelling previously announced story DLC, to not giving PC players the same content as console players recently. All helps cause ripples. 

 

Just I/we see too often that for every one person trying to bring attention to something or what it could mean later on and other legitimate criticism/concerns, there's always another just happy with how things are/going or maybe they just couldn't care less about the history of GTA/R* games as a whole like other fans so they just see it as 'just another game' and if it went away tomorrow, it'd mean nothing to them (which is fair enough I believe, you don't have to be a die hard fan to enjoy a game at that moment for what it is). I can understand that, as there's an awful lot of people that play GTA:O, 130m copies or more sold, it's impossible to get everyone on the same page, lol. Definitely don't expect R* to address every single complaint, but there's plenty I feel they really should address. Communication being top of the list IMHO.

 

And of course, though we have places like here or other social media to be vocal (for or against), there's millions that don't 'internet' with their game(s), so it's impossible to reach everyone and again, with how many copies sold, all the vocal players could probably quit tomorrow, GTA:O would still thrive I feel. I mean, look at RDRO, that section goes quieter and quieter, but R*/T2 are obviously happy enough (so they say anyway), so clearly there's plenty playing/buying regardless of how many times we here might see the game as dying out.

 

Personally, if this GTA+ stays as is (with this week's regular bonuses now known), I can live with it. As I said in the weekly event thread, I can understand those that collect clothing/livery unlocks since day one being annoyed though as they would have to pay to continue that, if indeed those items are fully exclusive, but a bit extra money, free properties, cars early, it really doesn't worry me. 

 

But I also understand and share people's concerns of where it could go in future, both here in GTA:O/RDRO, and the future titles. But if, big if, if this week's regular bonuses are a sign of things to come, it's not as bad as first feared. 

 

Anyway, sorry for the long post. Though some would say I'm back on form.

[Shadowfennekin]

22 minutes ago, D9fred95 said:

I don't get why everyone is being like "Rockstar said they won't lock content behind GTA+ so it's fine!" None of us ever thought they would stoop to the point of creating a subscription service for an already bloated online mode either yet here we are. Give it time and you'll see things slowly be locked away.

 

Lest we forget how Bethesda said Fallout 76's Atomic Shop would "only have cosmetics" and now they have full blown lootboxes in there that give you random buffs.

Lunchboxes are available in the game itself for free and via bullion(A currency you earn for free by participating in events)

All they do is provide a XP bonus for everyone within the radius(Stacks to four so you can open four, or four different individuals open simultaneously)

 

It's a lot like the Scrap and Repair kits they sell, everyone that plays knows those are useless so they don't care or complain. If people want to waste money on something stupid, they're free to do so. XP stops mattering fast in that game, faster than GTA Online I might add. Honestly they should have just made a Battlepass similar to the Outlaw pass with unique prizes and such, with the ability to pay to skip levels if you want. RP is easy enough to earn, heck I'd go crate farming again as that gives an INSANE amount of RP. Instead RP is just a big joke, it's worthless. Especially so once they removed the requirement/locks

[Quinn_flower]

lol shill vice haha 

[Jenkiiii]

This is going to get tricky...

 

When GTA+ was announced last week I felt shock, anger and disappointment, most of us did.

 

This week I feel a lot more relaxed about it and I'm glad to see the forum hysterics have calmed down. We can now discuss.

 

The bottom line is, Rockstar have been planning GTA+ for years and will carry on doing so whether we like it or not. We have to accept that it's here to stay and I am thankful it's not as heavy as it seemed at first.

 

Yes, having liveries and aesthetics locked behind GTA+ sucks on top of the dozens of threadbare subscriptions on offer from other companies - I don't need another one, nor the hassle of cancelling and resubscribing - so it's a no from me.

 

But I am thankful that GTA+ is optional and doesn't affect core gameplay. Other companies hide skins and visuals behind separate currencies or purchasable packs, so I am thankful that Rockstar still has its single currency that we can grind normally.

 

There will be hidden GTA+ items that will infuriate people because you now have to pay-subscribe to get them, which is a tricky subject. I like unlocking a new hoody at the LSCM, for example, and I don't want this to stop.

 

But I can live with aesthetics being locked behind GTA+ as a compromise between us and Rockstar as long as it doesn't affect core gameplay. Ninety percent of the Hao outfits and liveries are horrible anyway and we don't need them. That's maturity for you and being able to deal with your addictions and impulses.

 

And GTA+ being a cash and RP booster doesn't bother me that much either. When you play and dedicate as much time as we do, we get all of that anyway. I have more cash and RP than I know what to do with.

 

I don't like GTA+ and I'm not going to buy it - mostly because I don't need it - so leave it for those who do. Let's hope that Rockstar uses the extra cash to make future content better. They are now on probation and we are watching them intently. Our expectations are higher than ever and they need to deliver. They have put themselves under enormous public pressure and we want to see them deliver with their extra resources and cash.

[R a f a e]

3 minutes ago, Jenkiiii said:

Rockstar are now on probation and we are watching them intently. Our expectations are higher than ever and they need to deliver. They have put themselves under enormous public pressure and we want to see them deliver with their extra resources and cash.

 

[Badman_]

Social media backlash surely has an effect and it's foolish to think otherwise. Or does anyone believe Rockstar apologized for The Trilogy because they made a deep inner reflection and realized GSG did a poor job with the remasters? Of course not.

[QuackinAColdOne]

This is the result of allowing children with access to their parents' credit cards to play a game with microtransactions... only now those kids will be driving and paying a monthly fee for remote start in their Toyota.

Edited April 1, 2022 by QuackinAColdOne

[ilRae]

1 hour ago, QuackinAColdOne said:

This is the result of allowing children with access to their parents' credit cards to play a game with microtransactions... only now those kids will be driving and paying a monthly fee for remote start in their Toyota.

Funny, I used my own debit card for GTA+. I need to find me one of these 'parents' you speak of.

1 hour ago, Badman_ said:

Social media backlash surely has an effect and it's foolish to think otherwise. Or does anyone believe Rockstar apologized for The Trilogy because they made a deep inner reflection and realized GSG did a poor job with the remasters? Of course not.

Social media had nothing to do with that, they likely saw a spike in refunds which spurred a response. Money is the only thing that matters. Y'all put too much weight into social media outrage.

[RyuNova]

3 hours ago, Jenkiiii said:

But I am thankful that GTA+ is optional and doesn't affect core gameplay.

 

They won't lock actual content behind GTA+ for a while, it would be stupid, like basic level of stupid to do it so soon. You might get some liveries for new vehicles added in the update, but they will wait until GTAV has sold well, and the sh*t storm has cooled down.

[Jason]

20 hours ago, Shill-Vice said:

Something I've noticed about the wording in the GTA+ website FAQ. Only clothing specifically says it will be deposited into your inventory, whereas vehicles and property say they will either be discounted or free during member events, it really doesn't sound like they're planning to lock any of those two things, except clothes, behind the subscription - just making them free or cheaper. So if they say clothing will just be given to you and properties/vehicles will be discounted or free, this might mean that everyone can get it, except for full price (or a weekly bonus discount), whereas GTA+ members can get a discount or just a free property, I suppose depending on what it is.

 

Not automatically being given vehicles or homes/business is more likely due to the storage limitations those have where as clothing storage is infinite.

[davey1975]

On 3/25/2022 at 5:13 PM, awanderers1877 said:

It's reached a point where I'd happily pay twice that amount to get decent content on Red Dead Online.

 

Regarding this GTA+ Membership I do have a feeling it's part of their strategy to make the game easier for new members. I honestly wouldn't think any of you seasoned players are part of their target.

 

Because this game has been going on for long that the "grinding paywall" for newcomers might be perceived as a put off.

 

But this membership may be a fast track to catching-up high-level players by granting members with properties and upgrades from past DLCs.

 

Time is money, and it's basically offering players the content older players have grinded hundreds of hours for.

So as long as no new content is hidden behind this paywall I don't see the issue, it's just part of their now-widely-acknowledged strategy of keeping this game going for as long as possible 

100% agree with this