Introducing GTA+ - Reward-based Subscription for GTA Online

[Zak Ras]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

Honestly though, I do think the existence of GTA+ is in large part as an experiment for GTAO2.

 

I think perhaps the issue here isn't R* trying to monetise new players exclusively, but trying to explore new ways to monetise veterans players.

 

Mission failed; the answer is No.

[Jason]

Just now, Zak Ras said:

Mission failed; the answer is No.

 

If it is partly an experiment I imagine the answer is more like they've learned a lot already.

 

If I am correct, going forward I expect we'll see some variety in the monthly benefits to see what and how players respond to the various things, what benefits give an uptick in subs, what causes cancellations etc.

 

For me there's no way they created GTA+ simply to milk GTA V for one last hurrah, it may be part that for sure but there is definitely one eye on GTAO2 here IMO.

[Zak Ras]

Just now, Jason said:

I expect we'll see some variety in the monthly benefits to see what and how players respond to the various things, what benefits give an uptick in subs, what causes cancellations etc.

Like I said; No.

[dieseltech20]

2 hours ago, Rvfae said:

 

 

 

When I go back and play the PS4 version, the differences are immediately apparent.

Same, it's the reason I migrated my character and uninstalled the PS4 version.

 

Thought about starting fresh but I don't play much now, so I would never get anywhere, lol. Rather keep what I have because it isn't even finished, still need to complete that Casino Heist and set up the first run through CP.

 

 

[Jason]

10 minutes ago, Zak Ras said:

Like I said; No.

 

Yes, you said.

 

Doesn't change what I think in regards to what they're doing.

 

If you don't like what they're offering now or in future, vote with your wallet and all that.

[Commander S]

4 hours ago, WildBrick142 said:

with all due respect to broughy, and i really mean no offence, he has a rather hypocritical point.

 

his "final kick in the balls for all of this" (implying the biggest issue) is that gta+ get early access to new cars.... he literally puts early access to his own testing videos on patreon and for youtube members? how is that any different from what rockstar is doing? lmao

 

 

Not really - not unless Broughy's been a millionaire the whole time, charged full retail price to start watching his videos in the first place, and made a billion dollars from his videos over the last eight years...

 

And I'll give him credit for not doing the whole "I'll buy it, but only because I have to for video-making purposes" - dude's so pissed off at it, he had to borrow Gtamen's account in order to test out the HSW Deveste Eight...

[Shadowfennekin]

4 hours ago, WildBrick142 said:

with all due respect to broughy, and i really mean no offence, he has a rather hypocritical point.

 

his "final kick in the balls for all of this" (implying the biggest issue) is that gta+ get early access to new cars.... he literally puts early access to his own testing videos on patreon and for youtube members? how is that any different from what rockstar is doing? lmao

i get that early access to his videos is only $2, but that's all he offers for that tier. you want more from him, you have to sign up for the higher-priced tiers. and it's the same rockstar is doing, just without tiers - if early access to cars is all that r* offered for $6 then i'd agree it's not worth it, but they offer more than just that regardless of how much value anyone sees in those items.

 

i definitely agree with his later points about rockstar's questionable effort with e&e and dlc's, and their random nonsense decisions like the ardent still being non-raceable. but it's just a bit silly to see people complaining about something they essentially do themselves

That's not hypocrisy. Youtubers actually need the money(Well those without a gazillion subs) and most the time it's the only means they have of paying back their subscribers.

R* and Straus are just greedy cunts

[Jason]

Generally speaking self employed YouTuber's and streamers are often an unreliable source for opinions on things of this nature in the games industry. It's slightly better than it used to be as paid promotions have to be declared as such these days however there's still a lot of shady stuff going on these days as well as stuff like "don't bite the hand that feeds you" type of situations going on (inb4 GTAF staff etc etc kekw). This is something that is a problem especially when said Youtubers/streamers are focused so heavily on one game or developer, not wanting to burn bridges or ruining potential involvement in any sort of sponsored stuff - EA centered influencers are particularly bad for this as EA flies them out to events to try upcoming games early, so early impressions are always soft. There's also always a lot of going with the wind as I said earlier as it gets the views and nodders early on as it gets linked about.

 

Again I'm just generally speaking, but we've see it even here with a lot of silly takes and comments when ever drama like this happens from people just looking to farm reactions. YouTubers and streamers do the exact same sh*t cause it gets them money and that needs to be taken into account and not simply handwaived away as "well they need to make a living".

 

 

Again, generally speaking, not trying to slag Broughy off or dismiss what he's said or anything but too many people parrot stuff influencers say these days.

 

[GhillieMaster]

10 minutes ago, Jason said:

Generally speaking self employed YouTuber's and streamers are often an unreliable source for opinions on things of this nature in the games industry. It's slightly better than it used to be as paid promotions have to be declared as such these days however there's still a lot of shady stuff going on these days as well as stuff like "don't bite the hand that feeds you" type of situations going on (inb4 GTAF staff etc etc kekw). This is something that is a problem especially when said Youtubers/streamers are focused so heavily on one game or developer, not wanting to burn bridges or ruining potential involvement in any sort of sponsored stuff - EA centered influencers are particularly bad for this as EA flies them out to events to try upcoming games early, so early impressions are always soft. There's also always a lot of going with the wind as I said earlier as it gets the views and nodders early on as it gets linked about.

 

Again I'm just generally speaking, but we've see it even here with a lot of silly takes and comments when ever drama like this happens from people just looking to farm reactions. YouTubers and streamers do the exact same sh*t cause it gets them money and that needs to be taken into account and not simply handwaived away as "well they need to make a living".

 

 

Again, generally speaking, not trying to slag Broughy off or dismiss what he's said or anything but too many people parrot stuff influencers say these days.

 

Speaking as a GTA YouTuber, Rockstar has not contacted me once regarding anything. There is zero connection between GTA YouTubers and the company themselves, at least for ones around my size. You cant burn a bridge if there is no bridge to begin with. They don't talk to their community, let alone YouTubers in the community.

[ilRae]

1 hour ago, GhillieMaster said:

Speaking as a GTA YouTuber, Rockstar has not contacted me once regarding anything. There is zero connection between GTA YouTubers and the company themselves, at least for ones around my size. You cant burn a bridge if there is no bridge to begin with. They don't talk to their community, let alone YouTubers in the community.

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community. Most of them have built a following on outrage, instead of level minded takes. Going against those followers makes them delete their own tweets and change their tone.

R* tends to stick with established gaming journalists, and uses a pretty curated marketing strategy, almost Apple-esque. They are also very good at changing tone, and sparking a flood of interest with controlled info. It continues to work for them, as they know they can tease even the slightest info about GTA, and the narrative changes in their favor.

Further, they have a FAR better grasp on what the community says as a whole than many think, they use Sprinklr CXM and its platform AI. They see WAY more than the whiney-ass kids posting the same clown emojis and GTA6 replies on Reddit and Twitter everyday. That stuff gets filtered out pretty quickly as low level noise.

[Quinn_flower]

1 hour ago, GhillieMaster said:

Speaking as a GTA YouTuber, Rockstar has not contacted me once regarding anything. There is zero connection between GTA YouTubers and the company themselves, at least for ones around my size. You cant burn a bridge if there is no bridge to begin with. They don't talk to their community, let alone YouTubers in the community.

hey Ghillie, just want to say i saw your gta+ video and agreed with everything you said and posted it on my thread. its nice to see one of the famous gta yt's on here with the public and having a convo. 

Edited March 31, 2022 by Quinn_flower

[Jenkiiii]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

Again I'm just generally speaking, but we've see it even here with a lot of silly takes and comments when ever drama like this happens from people just looking to farm reactions. YouTubers and streamers do the exact same sh*t cause it gets them money and that needs to be taken into account and not simply handwaived away as "well they need to make a living".

The question is, how much did Broughy lay it on the line to farm reactions and generate income?

 

And how much was it him saying what he really thinks?

 

As a professional YouTuber I would say about 10% for paragraph one, but you know where I think the other 90% went.

[carnerd3000]

46 minutes ago, ilRae said:

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community. Most of them have built a following on outrage, instead of level minded takes. Going against those followers makes them delete their own tweets and change their tone.

R* tends to stick with established gaming journalists, and uses a pretty curated marketing strategy, almost Apple-esque. They are also very good at changing tone, and sparking a flood of interest with controlled info. It continues to work for them, as they know they can tease even the slightest info about GTA, and the narrative changes in their favor.

Further, they have a FAR better grasp on what the community says as a whole than many think, they use Sprinklr CXM and its platform AI. They see WAY more than the whiney-ass kids posting the same clown emojis and GTA6 replies on Reddit and Twitter everyday. That stuff gets filtered out pretty quickly as low level noise.

 

If R* really pays attention to the community feedback, then they sure as hell have a really funny way of showing it, since it tends to be kind of hit or miss. I think it's safe to say the content they add and the things they fix seem to be based off how they can overprice them in the hopes that they make money from Shark Cards, which is probably why many bugs and glitches have still been in the game for years. Even though they are apparently capable of doing it, R* really sucks ass at going back to previously released content and making fixes/changes that would probably benefit them more than they may realize.  And I'm not sure which Youtubers you are talking about that are an extension of the cancer in the community. If you're talking about guys like Broughy or Ghillie, they do just what most other people do; they voice their likes, but also their dislikes. They seem to be big fans of GTA Online, but they're also not going to bend over and praise R*'s nonsense too.

[needforsuv]

10 hours ago, Quinn_flower said:

so the billionare bounty never existed for you then?

I started on PC in 2015

Never had interest with a controller

but the mods were wild back in those days

[Ash_735]

3 hours ago, ilRae said:

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community.

Man you are just one of the worst kinds of toxic posters.

[R a f a e]

4 minutes ago, Ash_735 said:

Man you are just one of the worst kinds of toxic posters.

 

The irony

[Ash_735]

Just now, Rvfae said:

 

The irony

Oh, care to share you view?

[IzzyBlues]

5 minutes ago, Ash_735 said:

Man you are just one of the worst kinds of toxic posters.

 

Just now, Rvfae said:

 

The irony

 

Just now, Ash_735 said:

Oh, care to share you view?

Listen here you two... Kiss and make up now or you will both get a huge spanking on the bum.

[Ash_735]

I should expand on it though, yeah I can be viewed as "toxic" and "problematic", I've been labelled as such by certain staff members, but I'd rather be known for being in the camp that supports our rights and doesn't want to praise anything new Rockstar does. I've been calling this out since 2014 when I brought to peoples attention about how many people quit/resigned from Rockstar North after the Leslie Benzies incident, back then I was told I was crazy and that it means nothing, yet here we are years later, most key staff gone, GTA6 being rumoured to having internal troubles and being rebooted and then of course there's the recent actions over the years, which leads me on to this new breed of "toxic".

 

The "Righteous" kind, the ones who take glory and pride in Rockstar still selling well and having high numbers because it upsets the "haters", the ones who are happy for products like The Definitive Edition to sell well so they can laugh at people here, almost as if they want to see how much Rockstar/Take-Two can get away because they think it's funny that people are upset and let down but these people can feel smug about it. It's almost masochistic in a way, except you're doing it for a billion dollar company just so you can gloat at average people.

[R a f a e]

27 minutes ago, Ash_735 said:

Oh, care to share you view?

 

Don't need to lol

[El Cavilldo]

As said above, recent R* relationship with content creators is distant to say the least. 

 

Even more, their obsession with absolute control on their IP's feels completely antagonistic with creators, outside of the strict sense of promotion or advertising.
R*/T2 has become a company too big to be held accountable; most of their interviews are basically press releases. Is there any interview related to the massive backlash against their recent releases, or their monetization strategies? 

 

Sadly, if T2 reaches to an individual, it's to hand a Cease and Desist notification most of the times.

[ilRae]

2 hours ago, carnerd3000 said:

 

If R* really pays attention to the community feedback, then they sure as hell have a really funny way of showing it, since it tends to be kind of hit or miss. I think it's safe to say the content they add and the things they fix seem to be based off how they can overprice them in the hopes that they make money from Shark Cards, which is probably why many bugs and glitches have still been in the game for years. Even though they are apparently capable of doing it, R* really sucks ass at going back to previously released content and making fixes/changes that would probably benefit them more than they may realize.  And I'm not sure which Youtubers you are talking about that are an extension of the cancer in the community. If you're talking about guys like Broughy or Ghillie, they do just what most other people do; they voice their likes, but also their dislikes. They seem to be big fans of GTA Online, but they're also not going to bend over and praise R*'s nonsense too.

Hit and miss to whom? The deep rooted analytics, or to the loud, obnoxious minority that thinks that have more clout than they do? I say this to you as someone that has used that same unified-CXM before, it has some great ways to filter through posts and comments that are worded the same, or come from the same handful of accounts. In real time too.

I guarantee you things like the #savereddead nonsense never broke any sort of thresh-hold metric. Parroting the same wording as the post above you, or the same stupid meme doesn't do a lick of good when it comes to social marketing analytics. They are able to see trends with natural language and gather feedback from well-thought out critiques, even if they are single posts. Those are weighted FAR more than the outrage. FAR FAR more, because outrage tends to just fuel itself instead of actual feedback. You might be scared when you find out how much LinkedIn is weighted, where there are actual  professionals with money, tied to REAL NAMES, that post actual social feedback.

The biggest problem most influencers face is feedback parroting. They take a gauge of their followers and generally parrot the same in order to keep their growth going, never wanting to trend too much against their communities for fear of unfollow retribution, which usually does direct damage to their clout. Even if a YouTuber or influencer starts out with the most innocent of intentions, they are beholden to those clicks, and it eventually clouds judgement, especially if they are known to be tied to one game. 

Is R* infallible, of course not. No [brand] is. I saw right through their 'thank you' post this year, where they were trying to spin the news positive with the next GTA tease. I have a fair bit of critique I have sent via email, and posted on my IRL accounts. I've even participating in the outrage myself at times. The most recent was my instant feedback where I thought GTA+ was silly. A lot of users on here, Twitter, and Reddit would do themselves a lot of good if they would learn to provide actionable feedback via a conversation, and not just "oMg CoCkStAR iS c*nt. I guarantee the CXM AI burns that account and anything it has ever posted, lol.

[Black-Dragon96]

12 hours ago, WildBrick142 said:

with all due respect to broughy, and i really mean no offence, he has a rather hypocritical point.

 

his "final kick in the balls for all of this" (implying the biggest issue) is that gta+ get early access to new cars.... he literally puts early access to his own testing videos on patreon and for youtube members? how is that any different from what rockstar is doing? lmao

 Diffrences:

1. Broughy isnt a Million Dollar Corpo that charges this stuff for at this point 8 year old content and ways to wrangle even more cash out of the customers pocket (aka. special sharkcards).

2. Its only early access not exclusive Content like the special liverys and clothes with gta+ that take up space on my device but that I cant access.

3. There is no indication that Broughy will lock his future content behind a payed subscription system like it might be possible with future gta content or gta 6 content.

 

5 hours ago, ilRae said:

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community.

5 hours ago, ilRae said:

Further, they have a FAR better grasp on what the community says as a whole than many think,

 Their community interaction is mostly limited to sending out C&D letters when they shut down yet another modding project while cheaters run rampant on PC.

Expecting people not to get pissed at that is borderline naive.

 

I agree with your comparison with Apple tho. That company is just as much of a sh*tshow as are R* and TakeTwo.

[WanteD1]

Pls, Don't support GTA+ or... GTAO updates/DLCs contents will be exclusive to GTA+ subs and also you will ruin GTA6's online...

 

GTA+ should be about some skins/Liveries/offers/money nothing more!  

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

5 hours ago, ilRae said:

Why would they work with the current group? Many GTA YouTubers and 'influencers' have proven themselves an extension of the cancer that is the obnoxious portion of the GTA Community. Most of them have built a following on outrage, instead of level minded takes. Going against those followers makes them delete their own tweets and change their tone.

It's like if all that outrage has a reason to be in the first place or something like that.

 

I really doubt that YouTubers like Broughy, GhillieMaster or TheProfessional just complain for clicks, they do it because they care and because they would rather use their platforms for good instead of just for clickbait nonsense.

 

You don't see the likes of Bossman f*ck the World doing the same at all, in spite of him having way more viewers and influence.

[SHOKKERZ91]

So wanting the game to be functional and not the buggy mess it is right now, where half of the stuff glitches out during normal gameplay, is toxic by todays standarts. Got it.

[ilRae]

6 minutes ago, Black-Dragon96 said:

 Diffrences:

1. Broughy isnt a Million Dollar Corpo that charges this stuff for at this point 8 year old content and ways to wrangle even more cash out of the customers pocket (aka. special sharkcards)

 i agree with your comparison with Apple tho. That company is just as much of a sh*tshow as are R* and TakeTwo.

Advice, stop using the big vs small comparison, it's the first thing [brand] marketers ignore because shareholders/followers are exactly the same in many ways. Broughy being small does not make them immune from clouded judgment to keep followers, nor does R* being large excuse them from endlessly catering to their shareholders. The success of GTAO is a unique one in gaming, and just being mad at R* and T2 for monetizing that success for no other reason than 'money bad', is shortsighted at best. 

Pinning 'sh*tshow' on one of the largest companies in the world, and one of the most successful gaming companies really does slant your comment. This is the type of feedback that get filtered as noise, because the bias is so heavy and silly.

Have a great day, if your outrage will let you.

Just now, SHOKKERZ91 said:

So wanting the game to be functional and not the buggy mess it is right now, where half of the stuff glitches out during normal gameplay, is toxic by todays standarts. Got it.

Literally not what I said. The way the feedback is presented as simply outrage is the problem. If more would provide conversational, actionable feedback, it would less likely get filtered and ignored. The explicative laden, hatred should stop. If you actually want to see changes come that is. My guess is too many people enjoy being mad, and would rather just post to score points than actually get things changed.

[ilRae]

4 minutes ago, Yellow Dog with Cone said:

I really doubt that YouTubers like Broughy, GhillieMaster or TheProfessional just complain for clicks, they do it because they care and because they would rather use their platforms for good instead of just for clickbait nonsense.

I watched Broughy's livestream of the next-gen release. When R* had an issue with the previous PC transfers, he immediately raced to make a YouTube video for clicks, even tho it was sorted a little later. He's not immune to the outrage, whether he sees it or not he does it because that is what works in today's influencer realm.

[SHOKKERZ91]

3 minutes ago, ilRae said:

Literally not what I said. The way the feedback is presented as simply outrage is the problem. If more would provide conversational, actionable feedback, it would less likely get filtered and ignored. The explicative laden, hatred should stop. If you actually want to see changes come that is. My guess is too many people enjoy being mad, and would rather just post to score points than actually get things changed.

 

That´s what the feedback site is for. There i send my constructive feedback, like many more people i know did for years, and still, almost nothing changed. The weapon workbenches still glitch out since they released. My vehicles still regulary get glued into place. I still see the same godmode glitches for years. And don´t let me start on the cheating problem. What was the phrasing rockstar used in one of the newswire posts? "we target cheaters"? Sueing a cheat provider here and there didn´t do much.

[E•MO•TION]

Holy sh*t.

 

The cow can now be milked, indeed.