Rockstars failure gets media attention (Dec1,2020)

[Gray-Hand]

Don’t forget the Tron cycle (1982)

[CaliMeatWagon]

1 minute ago, Gray-Hand said:

Don’t forget the Tron cycle (1982)

You are right, I'll add it. And I'm sure there are others. 
Interesting enough the Shotaro is actually based off of a Lotus concept bike, they just added on Tron features:

[Gray-Hand]

And the Beast that you turn into in Hunt the Beast is based off Teenwolf (1985).  Not that they make money off that, but once again it shows who the game is really aimed at.

 

They also use Top Gun (1986) to market the Hydra by playing Highway to the Dangerzone the first time you get to fly it.

[Lonely-Martin]

3 hours ago, CaliMeatWagon said:

I 100% agree. 
Here are some more examples:

Oppressor MK I is from Streethawk (1985). MK II is a BMW RS1200 flying bike concept.
Rhapsody is the Mirthmobile from Wayne's World (1992)
Gang Burrito is the A-Team Van (1983)
Scramjet is the Mach 5 from SpeedRacer (1967)
Youga Classic is the Mystery Machine from Scooby Doo (1969)
Hermes is Stalone's car from Cobra (1986)
Stromberg is the Lotus from The Spy Who Loved Me (1977)
JB700 is from Goldfinger (1964)
Shotaro is the light bike from Tron (1982)
And I'm sure there is more. These are just the ones I can think of. 

The only vehicle I can see kids not knowing about off that list is Cobra's. Otherwise, the rest are super popular with modern kids or at least known by them even if they've not seen the shows/films.

 

Especially stuff like Disney's Tron which has a popular modern sequel, Scooby Doo's van that has more modern movies that saw a new audience even though that cartoon series is still running regularly on kids TV too, and The A-Team with the Liam Neeson flick as well. Bond the same, still relevant and the Goldfinger Aston was in Skyfall which was probably the best selling bond flick of all. Bond flicks always draw in the next generation, that's why they remain so popular.

 

Then there's Teen Wolf having a modern TV series remake, which can only grow interest in the original flicks, especially from those that caught Marty and Doc's adventures in BTTF and realised Michael J Fox was in the original Teen Wolf. Wayne's World being a cult classic and having the actor from Shrek and Austin Powers too, new fans catch those flicks all the time, although I'll give you that one as it is a lesser known vehicle and doesn't do any of the crazy crap other vehicles do.

 

All these cars do have modern young fans and they're made appeal to old and new fans alike much like the Delorean or Batmobile I mentioned yesterday. I think citing many of those vehicles as only to appeal to older gamers is a bit of a stretch to be fair, especially from those franchises that have proven to keep growing modern audiences with remakes, new TV series' or the classic cartoons still so popular they're on TV regularly or even Disney stuff.

 

Dad's get their kids to watch this old stuff too, and again, much of these vehicles cane long after the huge complaints of how many kids play GTA:O too.

 

Like I said about the tumbler, these remakes bring the old classics to new audiences. Batman is and always will be popular with new kids. That's the point to these remakes etc, to breathe new life into this stuff. They know it'll sell to original fans and newcomers alike.

 

3 hours ago, CaliMeatWagon said:

I like debates/arguments. A little too much. But they can be a waste of my time. Especially when the people involved aren't interested in learning, or changing their mindset. 
For instance, would you find it worth it to spend a couple of hours pouring through various studies in order to find the correct information, all for some jackass to go "nuh uh... you are wrong, because my feelings tell me so, you filthy redditor..."?

I tend to stay away because I find myself in these situations all too often. 

As I said yesterday, I get ya not wanting to, but I'm not looking to go 'nuh uh' at you but just learn/discuss is all. Sure, when it comes to speculation like with why certain vehicles are added I might as all that is is speculation and there's no real way to prove why these toys were added when you consider how well known this stuff is to modern kids/audiences. Blame Hollywood for rinsing and repeating franchises, lol. But cold facts and true numbers, can't argue them and I wouldn't.

 

But there are no cold facts here, as it stands, it can be interpreted that we are currently here with you saying 'nuh uh, you're wrong, I've got the numbers' but all you've cited is one US only link so far which doesn't help the discussion move on from speculation to fact.

 

You're expecting me/us to take you at your word but refuse to offer anything including understand/listen to the valid counter points I/others added including speculating about many vehicles that have in fact grown in modern audiences/movie culture. You said there's fact to this, not us, so there is a burden of proof or it can only be 'he said she said' and go nowhere.

 

And when you're backed by someone that doesn't even know that the modern tumbler is a part of their example, it further messes things up. A quick glance at the link I posted highlights my claim about that particular vehicle being a mash up of old and new. It highlights it's for both modern kids and those that were kids when Batman '89 arrived too. I mean, hell, Top Gun has a belated sequel due, the list goes on. That's my point. Along with my pointing out at how many of these other vehicles are as popular with today's youth as yesteryears, the game is for all as all contribute to R*/T2's profits.

3 hours ago, Gray-Hand said:

Don’t forget the Tron cycle (1982)

Yeah, err, citing a Disney flick that has a very popular modern sequel just ain't gonna cut it, lol. See above.

[Gray-Hand]

7 minutes ago, Lonely-Martin said:

The only vehicle I can see kids not knowing about off that list is Cobra's. Otherwise, the rest are super popular with modern kids or at least known by them even if they've not seen the shows/films.

 

Especially stuff like Disney's Tron which has a popular modern sequel, Scooby Doo's van that has more modern movies that saw a new audience even though that cartoon series is still running regularly on kids TV too, and The A-Team with the Liam Neeson flick as well. Bond the same, still relevant and the Goldfinger Aston was in Skyfall which was probably the best selling bond flick of all. Bond flicks always draw in the next generation, that's why they remain so popular.

 

Then there's Teen Wolf having a modern TV series remake, which can only grow interest in the original flicks, especially from those that caught Marty and Doc's adventures in BTTF and realised Michael J Fox was in the original Teen Wolf. Wayne's World being a cult classic and having the actor from Shrek and Austin Powers too, new fans catch those flicks all the time, although I'll give you that one as it is a lesser known vehicle and doesn't do any of the crazy crap other vehicles do.

 

All these cars do have modern young fans and they're made appeal to old and new fans alike much like the Delorean or Batmobile I mentioned yesterday. I think citing many of those vehicles as only to appeal to older gamers is a bit of a stretch to be fair, especially from those franchises that have proven to keep growing modern audiences with remakes, new TV series' or the classic cartoons still so popular they're on TV regularly or even Disney stuff.

 

Dad's get their kids to watch this old stuff too, and again, much of these vehicles cane long after the huge complaints of how many kids play GTA:O too.

 

Like I said about the tumbler, these remakes bring the old classics to new audiences. Batman is and always will be popular with new kids. That's the point to these remakes etc, to breathe new life into this stuff. They know it'll sell to original fans and newcomers alike.

 

As I said yesterday, I get ya not wanting to, but I'm not looking to go 'nuh uh' at you but just learn/discuss is all. Sure, when it comes to speculation like with why certain vehicles are added I might as all that is is speculation and there's no real way to prove why these toys were added when you consider how well known this stuff is to modern kids/audiences. Blame Hollywood for rinsing and repeating franchises, lol. But cold facts and true numbers, can't argue them and I wouldn't.

 

But there are no cold facts here, as it stands, it can be interpreted that we are currently here with you saying 'nuh uh, you're wrong, I've got the numbers' but all you've cited is one US only link so far which doesn't help the discussion move on from speculation to fact.

 

You're expecting me/us to take you at your word but refuse to offer anything including understand/listen to the valid counter points I/others added including speculating about many vehicles that have in fact grown in modern audiences/movie culture. You said there's fact to this, not us, so there is a burden of proof or it can only be 'he said she said' and go nowhere.

 

And when you're backed by someone that doesn't even know that the modern tumbler is a part of their example, it further messes things up. A quick glance at the link I posted highlights my claim about that particular vehicle being a mash up of old and new. It highlights it's for both modern kids and those that were kids when Batman '89 arrived too. I mean, hell, Top Gun has a belated sequel due, the list goes on. That's my point. Along with my pointing out at how many of these other vehicles are as popular with today's youth as yesteryears, the game is for all as all contribute to R*/T2's profits.

Yeah, err, citing a Disney flick that has a very popular modern sequel just ain't gonna cut it, lol. See above.

The arguments put forward here makes Trump’s legal challenges of the election results look persuasive.  Give it a rest.

 

Your counterpoints (if they can be called that) are ridiculously weak.  You keep talking about the vigilante which is the spitting image of the Burton batmobile and looks nothing whatsoever like the Tumbler.  No one is with you on that point.

 

The teen wolf tv show has nothing to do with the original movie and the Hunt the Beast design takes after the movie, not the show, which proves better than anything what demographic R* is targeting.  You have disproven your own argument.

 

The Top Gun sequel isn’t even out yet, so obviously R* wasn’t using it to sell the Hydra to teenagers 3 or 4 years ago.  That’s an absurd suggestion.

 

The original Tron movie is a genre defining classic.  The second one got made purely on the basis of nostalgia for the original and flopped.  The Tron sequel was forgotten about as soon as it was released.  It made only $400 million at the box office on a $200 million budget - for Hollywood movies to be profitable they need to make 3x their budget.

Younger audiences might be aware of these older relics of their parents time, but they don’t have anywhere near the same affection or direct connection with them that the people who grew up with them had.  Wayne’s World is a cultural phenomenon for late GenXers, but anyone born after 1990 would only be vaguely aware of it - same with Knightrider.

GTAV was a game created by middle aged men, about middle aged men, heavily influenced by material popular with middle aged men (Heat - 1995), designed to appeal to middle aged men.  
 

No other AAA game maker targets middle aged men like R*.  You would see it if you were a middle aged man - it sticks out like dogs balls.  There is definitely cross appeal to other demographics, but there are a f*cktonne of dog whistles to men over the age of 35 in GTA and Red Dead.

[Gettin up]

5 hours ago, CaliMeatWagon said:

I 100% agree. 
Here are some more examples:

Oppressor MK I is from Streethawk (1985). MK II is a BMW RS1200 flying bike concept.
Rhapsody is the Mirthmobile from Wayne's World (1992)
Gang Burrito is the A-Team Van (1983)
Scramjet is the Mach 5 from SpeedRacer (1967)
Youga Classic is the Mystery Machine from Scooby Doo (1969)
Hermes is Stalone's car from Cobra (1986)
Stromberg is the Lotus from The Spy Who Loved Me (1977)
JB700 is from Goldfinger (1964)
Shotaro is the light bike from Tron (1982)
And I'm sure there is more. These are just the ones I can think of. 

I like debates/arguments. A little too much. But they can be a waste of my time. Especially when the people involved aren't interested in learning, or changing their mindset. 
For instance, would you find it worth it to spend a couple of hours pouring through various studies in order to find the correct information, all for some jackass to go "nuh uh... you are wrong, because my feelings tell me so, you filthy redditor..."?

I tend to stay away because I find myself in these situations all too often. 

I'm impressed, lol.

[Lonely-Martin]

2 minutes ago, Gray-Hand said:

The arguments put forward here makes Trump’s legal challenges of the election results look persuasive.  Give it a rest.

 

Your counterpoints (if they can be called that) are ridiculously weak.  You keep talking about the vigilante which is the spitting image of the Burton batmobile and looks nothing whatsoever like the Tumbler.  No one is with you on that point.

 

The teen wolf tv show has nothing to do with the original movie and the Hunt the Beast design takes after the movie, not the show, which proves better than anything what demographic R* is targeting.  You have disproven your own argument.

 

The Top Gun sequel isn’t even out yet, so obviously R* wasn’t using it to sell the Hydra to teenagers 3 or 4 years ago.  That’s an absurd suggestion.

 

The original Tron movie is a genre defining classic.  The second one got made purely on the basis of nostalgia for the original and flopped.  The Tron sequel was forgotten about as soon as it was released.  It made only $400 million at the box office on a $200 million budget - for Hollywood movies to be profitable they need to make 3x their budget.

Younger audiences might be aware of these older relics of their parents time, but they don’t have anywhere near the same affection or direct connection with them that the people who grew up with them had.  Wayne’s World is a cultural phenomenon for late GenXers, but anyone born after 1990 would only be vaguely aware of it - same with Knightrider.

GTAV was a game created by middle aged men, about middle aged men, heavily influenced by material popular with middle aged men (Heat - 1995), designed to appeal to middle aged men.  
 

No other AAA game maker targets middle aged men like R*.  You would see it if you were a middle aged man - it sticks out like dogs balls.  There is definitely cross appeal to other demographics, but there are a f*cktonne of dog whistles to men over the age of 35 in GTA and Red Dead.

Firstly, I'm 39, with kids of my own so I do speak from 1st hand experience. I'd say I'm the age you talk about here, lol. Don't be so quick to judge.

 

But you're in denial if you can't see the tumbler in that Vigilante. The entire back end is from Nolan's flicks. And yes, many see it and are with me. That's fact. I cited the wiki, but just look at the thing on youtube if you've not driven one. Clear as day. sh*t, I'll bet even Cali would be reasonable enough to agree on that obvious point. It's undeniable.

 

Regarding Teen Wolf. Sure, the design is of the original, never suggested otherwise. Read what I said, the new remake series is the same franchise. It stands to reason anyone that becomes a new fan of the franchise could easily learn of that film too. 80's films in particular are often growing their fanbases and become loved by modern audiences. It'll come up with any quick google search too. That's what remakes do, they breath new life and grow new audiences in old properties. That's the point. Or are you denying that old films get new audiences when remakes pop up? I've disproven nothing, lol. Same for Scooby Doo, The A-team, and more.

 

Admittedly, I misspoke about Top Gun. You're right there. My mistake, though in my defence, it was more a throwaway comment. But you're right, a poor example.

 

Tron may have not hit the cinematic heights Disney hoped, but DVD sales need to be considered, the Disney channel on TV and streaming now too of course. It's a Disney flick that is very popular with young boys particularly. Stuff like that (and Scooby Doo for much the same reasons, a franchise that still regularly gets new DVD movies that clearly sell well to keep making them) are targeted at modern kids. You may have forgotten about the Tron sequel, but that's not a universal thing. 

 

Anyway, I've not said GTA doesn't appeal to modern aged men, lol. Just that it has huge appeal to modern children. Just go into a lobby and listen, kids everywhere. So R*/T2 target the lot. That's my entire point. That's business sense, to widen your appeal as much as possible to maximise revenue. As you said, kids might be aware of these cult/legendary vehicles, and it's clear they are.

 

And besides, you say this game appeals to middle aged men so much, and we haven't even touched on just how more and more popular gaming is becoming with younger women/girls, but I've made enough valid and fair points to not need to go into more. 

 

Lastly, I surely won't just 'give it a rest' lol. That's not how discussions work, you don't get to just say 'I'm right, you're wrong, now shut up' and try to shut me down. That's pretty childish to be fair (and you assumed I'm young, lol. C'mon man). I'm just offering other points, valid points, that I believe should be considered.

 

That said, when someone simply can't accept facts like the obvious inspiration of the batmobile I mentioned, it shows I'm talking to someone that clearly has no intention of even trying to discuss. So let's move on.

[CaliMeatWagon]

10 hours ago, Gettin up said:

I'm impressed, lol.

Thanks
I was listing off the cars in one of my garages... 

Edited December 5, 2020 by CaliMeatWagon

[CaliMeatWagon]

On 12/4/2020 at 12:36 AM, Gray-Hand said:

And the Beast that you turn into in Hunt the Beast is based off Teenwolf (1985).  Not that they make money off that, but once again it shows who the game is really aimed at.

 

They also use Top Gun (1986) to market the Hydra by playing Highway to the Dangerzone the first time you get to fly it.

Another good indication of who they are targeting is the Arcade. Look at all the cabinets. 
When I was growing up, Arcades were still popular, but all the games Rockstar included were already considered old and were the cheapest to play. 

[Waingro]

So is RDO not working like a low-key shout out to the plot of West World's self-destruction?