Tech General Chat

[X S]

These came in today. I really have to give it to EKWB. Everything from the product to packaging is really high quality. Now the task of organizing the rest of the parts begins. Thinking of going with UV pastel green for the coolant.

 

[B7R]

Probably for the Random Chat topic but geeze it feels good to have the Internet still working when it rains. My old ADSL (DSL) would drop sync or connection when it rained and the duct our Copper cable phone line runs through is half full of dirty muddy water and the copper cable is at the bottom of it. No one has ever bothered to drain the water out of it.

 

Fibre cable is probably at the bottom too but at least the Fibre cable doesn't degrade in the water or have issues when it rains. I have had the Fibre Modem up since Thursday (Which is when we switched to fibre) and it's stats have reported 0 restarts / 0 drop outs vs Copper that would drop out or lose sync as I said if it rained.

 

Anyway I think some of you want a Before and After of my connection (Copper ADSL - NBN Fibre) So here are the tests.

 

Before (ADSL)

 

After (NBN Fibre)

[Sombra]

so whats a good monitor these days? looking for something cheap (roughly around £120 maybe?) to replace this dell e207wfp. was looking at maybe an AOC e2460Sh - £104, ports i need, 1ms response, good size etc i just have no clue about monitors and all this ips lcd tn sh*te

[sivispacem]

Newer version of mine:

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00UNBAPZ6/

 

Unless you're an ADHD twitch FPS gamer I'd always go for an IPS with a 5ms response time over a TN with a 1ms. Much better colour representation, better viewing angles. Since buying an IPS I physically can't go back to a TN panel, my very expensive Dell TNs at work make me want to cry every time i look at them.

 

Pretty sure that AOC is a TN.

 

You can get both IPS and super fast response times, but you pay a huge premium.

[Sombra]

you got any photos of it in your setup? those stock photos never do them justice. just found one on sale on kustom for £94, hope it's still there when I get paid on the 26th.

 

http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_60109.html?gclid=CIzepujJ4c0CFdTnGwodksoDPw

[sivispacem]

I'll take one when I'm home from work.

 

E-

 

Ignore the camera/refresh rate artifacts, decent representation of the colour gamut and accuracy:

 

[DEALUX]

Speaking of displays, I got a reply back from an LG representative and apparently none of their 4K TVs support full RGB (4 4 4) which is a dealbreaker for me unfortunately as text in 4 4 2 mode looks horrible and it affects the overall quality of the image. They also said none of the TVs on the market support it which is weird because there are Samsung panels out there that do support it. I should look into Samsung TVs instead. Barnacules has one that supports 4 4 4 at 60 Hz in 4K but it's not available here in the EU and it's pricey as f*ck (but then again, I only want a 40-ish inch panel, not 50" or 55").

 

 

Edit: f*ck it. I found a 40" 4K VA PC monitor. Yes, a monitor in that size. Who else is doing that besides Philips? It seems like a decent monitor and I might be able to get one from a local retailer in the future. It's also in my $800-ish range.

 

 

Edited July 7, 2016 by Kristian.

[Ai®a©ob®a]

Is it possible to re-map the F1-F12 keys on laptop?

 

I play some games on my laptop and some of them require me to press on the F keys but because it's a laptop and the keys are assigned to do certain things like F1 brings up a Windows Help guide which interupts the game and i've tried pressing the Fn + F1 but it doesn't work so wondering if i can remap them completely

[X S]

Geforce GTX 1060 announced with an MSRP of $249.

 

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-gtx-1060

 

Apparently it's on par with a 980. Wow, this definitely puts pressure on AMD and their new 480.

[SilverRST]

Geforce GTX 1060 announced with an MSRP of $249.

 

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/10series/geforce-gtx-1060

 

Apparently it's on par with a 980. Wow, this definitely puts pressure on AMD and their new 480.

If only the 1060 would be priced as the 480, then that would be really good.

[yoječ]

Is it possible to re-map the F1-F12 keys on laptop?

 

I play some games on my laptop and some of them require me to press on the F keys but because it's a laptop and the keys are assigned to do certain things like F1 brings up a Windows Help guide which interupts the game and i've tried pressing the Fn + F1 but it doesn't work so wondering if i can remap them completely

There could be a setting in BIOS to make the F keys function normally, I'd check it.

[sivispacem]

It's $30 more, for a decent chunk more performance.

[Creed Bratton]

It's $30 more, for a decent chunk more performance.

We don't know exactly how much more performance that is. But here's the thing. Aftermarket 480's are rumored to be very good overclockers: http://wccftech.com/amd-rx-480-overclocked-air-water/

And AMD has an edge in Dx12 already. Pascal doesn't overclock as well as the 900 series. You have to push it more for very mediocre results. And it seems that Nvidia has a problem with delivering enough cards to the market. Higher demand that will result in higher prices. And who knows how much more expensive they'll be in Europe. Then there's no SLI support on 1060, probably because two of those would outperform a single 1080. You can do wonders with 2x480's in Crossfire, making it a better choice than a single 1070. And people on a tighter budget will simply get one 480 now and another one later on for a significant performance increase. An option that isn't available if you opt for 1060.

Edited July 8, 2016 by The Yokel

[sivispacem]

Pascal overclocks fine, partner cards with custom VRMs and coolers are hitting well over 2.2GHz. It's just a bit more intensive to set up than previous generations.

 

AMD doesn't actually have an edge in DX12. It's got an edge in certain DX12 applications but the Ashes of Singularity benchmarks replicated by various outfits done on production drivers show that, despite AMDs initial claims, two in crossfire is not actually faster than a 1080:

 

 

Let's not forget that SLI and Crossfire only bring benefit in a small number of games, and in others actually result in lower performance. In fact, in most games, two RX480s are significantly outperformed by one 1070

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/RX_480_CrossFire/21.html

[Creed Bratton]

Pascal overclocks fine, partner cards with custom VRMs and coolers are hitting well over 2.2GHz. It's just a bit more intensive to set up than previous generations.

 

AMD doesn't actually have an edge in DX12. It's got an edge in certain DX12 applications but the Ashes of Singularity benchmarks replicated by various outfits done on production drivers show that, despite AMDs initial claims, two in crossfire is not actually faster than a 1080:

 

Let's not forget that SLI and Crossfire only bring benefit in a small number of games, and in others actually result in lower performance. In fact, in most games, two RX480s are significantly outperformed by one 1070

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/RX_480_CrossFire/21.html

Pascal can reach very high core clock, that's true. But it seems that gains from actual overclocking aren't as big as they should be compared to gains from overclocking the 900 series. There was an article back when 1080 and 1070 were released. I'll try to find it. The gist of it is that you're not getting the performance that you'd expect from overclocking despite the very high core clock.

 

I'm not surprised that 2x480's can't reach 1080 and 1070 level of performance. At least not with current drivers. That was just a pipe dream. People expected way too much out of a $200 GPU. I'm kind of counting on CF and SLI support being better with Dx12 and the fact that with lower power consumption and lower prices it's easier and more justifiable to go with a multi-GPU setup later on than ever before. I wouldn't go for it immediately. That's just stupid. But I like having that option when prices go down.

And I don't care about Dx11 benchmarks at all. All of these cards on both sides perform really well in Dx11.

 

Oh yeah, I knew I forgot something. A big draw for me when it comes to AMD is free-sync. I'm not very inclined to pay additional $100 for a G-sync monitor when there's an open source standard available.

Edited July 8, 2016 by The Yokel

[sivispacem]

The big impact in Pascal seems to be memory overclocking. The 1080 I've ordered has an 800MHz memory overclock and runs 5-6% faster than stuff like the Strix despite having a lower clock speed. It seems that some of the Pascal performance limitation comes from the performance of the memory bus, which if course can be addressed by overclocking the memory.

 

As for the G-Sync versus Freesync thing, the extra cost of the former is kind of a drop in the ocean compared to the cost of a system able to take proper advantage of it at resolutions 2K and above. There's also a tangible performance benefit in G-Sync over Freesync. I'd argue most people would be better off spending the $1-200 difference in the cost between a standard monitor and an *Sync one on a more powerful GPU capable of producing consistently higher frame rates.

[SilverRST]

Pascal overclocks fine, partner cards with custom VRMs and coolers are hitting well over 2.2GHz. It's just a bit more intensive to set up than previous generations.

 

AMD doesn't actually have an edge in DX12. It's got an edge in certain DX12 applications but the Ashes of Singularity benchmarks replicated by various outfits done on production drivers show that, despite AMDs initial claims, two in crossfire is not actually faster than a 1080:

 

 

Let's not forget that SLI and Crossfire only bring benefit in a small number of games, and in others actually result in lower performance. In fact, in most games, two RX480s are significantly outperformed by one 1070

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/RX_480_CrossFire/21.html

Daaaayuum! GTX1000 series were just released shortly and they already start gimping the GTX1080 with the latest driver.

Does this mean there will be a GTX2080Ti at the end of this year????????

 

j/k and /s

[DEALUX]

I wish everyone would just shut the hell up about DX12. Most of the people praising AMD for their alleged superior performance seem to know nothing about how their GPUs are optimized for DX12. Everyone is just repeating the same stuff over and over again with no ability to explain it further. I've seen a bunch of benchmarks where AMD cards perform worse in DX12, which is normal given that it is a relatively new and unexplored API. Most games don't even support it and if you seriously think it's an important aspect when considering a new GPU purchase you don't know what you are talking about. Yeah, I am going to purchase a GPU for DX12 to play like a handful of games that may or may not perform (marginally) better compared to DX11.

 

SLI\Crossfire configs don't make a lot of sense either. Not all games scale the same, some don't even support multiple GPUs at all, so it's still better to just get the best single GPU you can afford. Also, some games don't run that well on multiple GPUs even if they support the feature. You may encounter some graphics bugs or performance issues (input lag or micro stutter).

Edited July 8, 2016 by Kristian.

[SilverRST]

I wish everyone would just shut the hell up about DX12. Most of the people praising AMD for their alleged superior performance seem to know nothing about how their GPUs are optimized for DX12. Everyone is just repeating the same stuff over and over again with no ability to explain it further. I've seen a bunch of benchmarks where AMD cards perform worse in DX12, which is normal given that it is a relatively new and unexplored API. Most games don't even support it and if you seriously think it's an important aspect when considering a new GPU purchase you don't know what you are talking about. Yeah, I am going to purchase a GPU for DX12 to play like a handful of games that may or may not perform (marginally) better compared to DX11.

 

SLI\Crossfire configs don't make a lot of sense either. Not all games scale the same, some don't even support multiple GPUs at all, so it's still better to just get the best single GPU you can afford. Also, some games don't run that well on multiple GPUs even if they support the feature. You may encounter some graphics bugs or performance issues (input lag or micro stutter).

Finally someone with a brain. That's exactly I have pulling my hair out because of those idiots keeps praising AMD and how awesome DX12 is and AMD is much

better for DX12 than nVidia. I mean, for real? There is still no true DX12 game like a GTA game with DX12 support.

If someone wanna build a new PC, most will gonna advise them an AMD GPU because DX12. While we still doesn't know sh*t and most of the games uses DX11.

DX12 is relatively new and devs still have to broaden their knowledge for it. Remember DX10 or 11? It took years after DX9 became the very standard.

 

I'd rather get the GTX1080 or even the 1080Ti instead of dual-GPU and have to face non-support for SLI/CF and microstutter/input lag.

Edited July 8, 2016 by SilverRST

[DEALUX]

Well, to be fair, some new games seem to run pretty well on multiple GPUs but that's still not an ideal situation in my opinion. If you get one powerful GPU you won't have to face any of these (potential) problems and you will also get superior performance in games where there is no support for multiple GPUs.

 

SLI\Crossfire makes more sense for gaming enthusiasts who want to run games at max settings, high resolutions, and high frame rates, insofar as the games themselves have proper support for the feature.

[SilverRST]

Well, to be fair, some new games seem to run pretty well on multiple GPUs but that's still not an ideal situation in my opinion. If you get one powerful GPU you won't have to face any of these (potential) problems and you will also get superior performance in games where there is no support for multiple GPUs.

 

SLI\Crossfire makes more sense for gaming enthusiasts who want to run games at max settings, high resolutions, and high frame rates, insofar as the games themselves have proper support for the feature.

Gaming ethusiasts? There will be Titan P and 1080Ti

 

Even if games do have a proper support, I'll will not gonna do SLI/CF because:

1) more juice gets drained from the wall

2) more noise

3) more heat

[Creed Bratton]

I wish everyone would just shut the hell up about DX12. Most of the people praising AMD for their alleged superior performance seem to know nothing about how their GPUs are optimized for DX12. Everyone is just repeating the same stuff over and over again with no ability to explain it further. I've seen a bunch of benchmarks where AMD cards perform worse in DX12, which is normal given that it is a relatively new and unexplored API. Most games don't even support it and if you seriously think it's an important aspect when considering a new GPU purchase you don't know what you are talking about. Yeah, I am going to purchase a GPU for DX12 to play like a handful of games that may or may not perform (marginally) better compared to DX11.

The thing is that these new cards all perform pretty well in Dx11. There's nothing you can do with Dx11 anymore and any mid-range card from 2016 will do just fine. So the thing that you are left with is the potential performance in Dx12 applications.

 

And people aren't praising AMD for Dx12 performance because there's something inherently better about AMD cards. It's because AMD is partnering with a lot of devs for the upcoming Dx12 titles: http://wccftech.com/amds-robert-hallock-the-vast-majority-of-dx12-titles-in-20152016-are-partnering-with-amd/

And let's not forget that AMD hardware is in both major consoles, which could be relevant considering that new consoles are basically low-end gaming PC's.

Edited July 9, 2016 by The Yokel

[DEALUX]

We haven't even begun to see a trend in DX12 usage for developing games. Right now, if DX12 performance is something you are worried about when deciding on which GPU to purchase you are simply wasting your time. By the time DX12 becomes widely adopted current cards will be low-end cards or pretty much obsolete.

Edited July 9, 2016 by Kristian.

[Creed Bratton]

We don't really know how long these new cards will last. The significant leap in performance when they moved on from 28nm to 16nm and 14nm shifted a lot of expectations. And we don't know when to expect another jump that big. This year's mid-range cards perform as well as last year's high-end cards. Whatever 2016 card you get that's in your budget guarantees that your Dx11 games will perform great. Most games are still made with consoles in mind, so until those updated consoles are released there won't be any significant leaps in graphical fidelity or system requirements on the PC (unless it's a sh*tty port). So as far as Dx11 goes you're all set. On the other hand, games made specifically for the PC tend to adopt new API's pretty fast. My only hope is that instead of Dx12 we start seeing Vulkan support.

[X S]

Finally installed my new mobo/CPU and RAM. I was surprised at how easily the motherboard recognized my old RAID 0 volume that I used for boot on my previous board, and how easily Windows 10 adjusted its drivers to allow the OS to load. Back on Windows 7, you had to go through a few command prompt lines to install a new mobo. It was a pain in the ass. However, I was not expecting to lose my activated copy of Windows 10, so I called up MSFT support, and they were nice enough to generate me a brand new key.

 

Also, coming from an old legacy BIOS to UEFI is like going from a flip phone to a smart phone. Overclocking my old 920 was a bit of bitch on that BIOS. These new UEFI's make it so easy to independently overclock your RAM independent of the CPU and vice versa. I love it. Sorry, this stuff is just all new to me.

 

I went with a modest overclock of 4.5 MHz with the RAM set at the XMP profile of 3200 MHz for now. I ran a benchmark on GTA V with all settings on their highest, except for Grass Quality at 'Normal'. MSAA was a X4 and off for Reflections. I was holding an average framerate of about 95 FPS at 1080p. The most taxing parts of the benchmark went no lower than 75 FPS. Pretty damn stable.

 

Super happy with these results.

[Chewie]

I bought an SSD yesterday and I heard that you should turn Trim and AHCI on. I also heard that you should change the temp files to go to a hdd instead of a ssd. What else should I do?

[Creed Bratton]

I bought an SSD yesterday and I heard that you should turn Trim and AHCI on. I also heard that you should change the temp files to go to a hdd instead of a ssd. What else should I do?

Your internet browser cache and data folders should go to HDD as well. And you can put pagefile on HDD. I don't think that really matters that much since modern SSD's can handle a ridiculous amount of writes and pagefile writes are so minimal these days on modern systems. But on the other hand since it doesn't really matter if it's on SSD or HDD, so you may as well have it on HDD to save some space if nothing else.

[dice]

If you're not consistently writing several gigabytes per day then you dont really have anything to worry about and may have everything in your ssd. Failures generally relate to faulty controllers which are vendor specific.

 

Regarding TRIM your OS should've automatically turned it on already, if not check for guides on how to do it and download your vendors maintenance software (if you really want to)

 

AHCI should be enabled in bios else you'll have a slight bottleneck

Edited July 10, 2016 by  dice

[yoječ]

If the OS supports TRIM (XP was the last Windows not to support it), there's nothing else you have to do in that regard. I don't even think you can manually enable/disable TRIM, but I might be wrong on that one.

 

As for the temp files - that's dumb if you ask me. Yes, keeping the temp folder on the SSD will make it wear out slightly faster. But IMHO it makes way more sense to leave it as it is and take the full advantage of the SSD being faster. After all, isn't it why you bought the SSD in the first place? What's the point of moving the frequently accessed files to a much slower HDD? I can't wrap my head around that. If one's so worried about the SSD wearing out, then just stop using it entirely, take it out of the PC and put it on a display stand on your desk.

[sivispacem]

Not installing your OS to an SSD is pretty silly in general. You end up losing most of the performance advantage of having an SSD in the first place.