A question for those who will randomly shoot people.

[Hiply]

29 minutes ago, Leftover Pizza said:

If any one wants to claim some sort of realism in gameplay according the era, they are 20 years late, even.

^^This ^^

In fact, part of the intro and teasers specifically refer to this being the time when the outlaw life was coming to an end.  That's also referenced multiple times throughout story mode.  These are the end times for the "Wild West".

[dieseltech20]

We are playing as outlaws? That's f*cking hilarious.

 

My favorite stories from the wild west are the ones where Jesse James would go metal detecting with his crew in order to sell the local gipsy woman some rings and coins so they could finance a moonshine still in the mountains of west virginia.

 

The OK Corral was actually a battle over rabbit hides and salmon.

 

Billy the Kid was actually known for his exceptional bounty hunting abilities. He only robbed banks and trains so he could turn over his accomplices and return the money/goods in exchange for his $2 share.

[1898]

This has been complaint since day one but I'm randomly attacked about 1% of the time and 0% when I intentionally stay away from other players. I've never used Defensive mode, never had to. If I'm not in the mood I can outrun anybody. I'd like to see stats or a poll of how often we are actually attacked. Not questioning anyone else's honesty, it just seems this is always exaggerated or I'm just the luckiest player in the game.

Edited May 17, 2020 by 1898

[kcole4001]

14 minutes ago, 1898 said:

This has been complaint since day one but I'm randomly attacked about 1% of the time and 0% when I intentionally stay away from other players. I've never used Defensive mode, never had to. If I'm not in the mood I can outrun anybody. I'd like to see stats or a poll of how often we are actually attacked. Not questioning anyone else's honesty, it just seems this is always exaggerated or I'm just the luckiest player in the game.

Some are clearly more lucky than others.

I have had instances when I was shot for just being near someone else, but at most it happened once every 2-4 weeks, and I haven't seen those players around for a long while.

Yes, I do keep a list of them so I could switch sessions if they're there and I needed to do risky sales.

Those type of players don't seem to stick around the game very long, but are obviously replaced by new ones fairly regularly.

 

Honestly, cheaters are a bigger menace, and their motives are just as hard to figure out.

[Direwrath]

5 hours ago, Hiply said:

^^This ^^

In fact, part of the intro and teasers specifically refer to this being the time when the outlaw life was coming to an end.  That's also referenced multiple times throughout story mode.  These are the end times for the "Wild West".

 

6 hours ago, Leftover Pizza said:

 

People didn't even shoot everyone they encountered back in the day. If you browse through history, you'll never find an outlaw shooting up hundreds of people. What you do see is outlaws getting caught by the law, sentenced to hang until dead, dead, dead and never return. William H Bonney claimed to have killed 21 and was notorious. 

If any one wants to claim some sort of realism in gameplay according the era, they are 20 years late, even. The number of outlaws wasn't very high compared to a few previous decades. Check some names on the internet. The most notorious ones died at least a decade before this game takes place. Players who think they are playing the outlaw life in this game have watched too many movies.

I grew up on the Nebraska/Kansas border. In the county that I was from there was a family of what could be considered "outlaws" that were well known locally, we actually went to where the law caught them near a river. They also showed us the location of where they were hung and then to their graves at an old prairie cemetary. It was a mother and her two sons and their crimes consisted of petty robbery and theft of property. I believe they were hung sometime in the 1880's. But for being so notorious they didn't kill one soul, people back in those days didn't take kindly to being robbed of their possessions and well the law wasn't apt to give criminals any quarter either. Lol, even the guide who was showing us this part of our history said that he could embellish their capture and make them sound like Billy the Kid but actually the truth was they were not hard to catch, they were petty thieves, and that was about it. No huge gunfight, nobody going down in a blaze of glory, just criminals being caught and hung. I always love when people make that "we have the right to shoot players because the point of the game is the "Wild West".  Well the time period was actually pretty tame, unless you consider the threats of natural disasters and disease that came into play. Nebraska's most notorious spree killer from history was a man in the 1950's, Charles Starkweather. Not any western outlaw.

 

In this game the idea of the "outlaw" was coming to an end, people just want an excuse for their bad behavior.

[netnow66]

5 hours ago, 1898 said:

This has been complaint since day one but I'm randomly attacked about 1% of the time and 0% when I intentionally stay away from other players. I've never used Defensive mode, never had to. If I'm not in the mood I can outrun anybody. I'd like to see stats or a poll of how often we are actually attacked. Not questioning anyone else's honesty, it just seems this is always exaggerated or I'm just the luckiest player in the game.

Then my guess would have to be you're the luckiest player in the game. I've seen other posters with comments similar to yours though.

 

Even though I play in solo lobbies the majority of the time, I'm griefed at a minimum of one time each day when I'm collecting (I only do my collecting in normal lobbies).

 

I would also direct you to the When Justice Is Served thread on this board where some players even submit videos.

[1898]

14 minutes ago, netnow66 said:

Then my guess would have to be you're the luckiest player in the game. I've seen other posters with comments similar to yours though.

 

Even though I play in solo lobbies the majority of the time, I'm griefed at a minimum of one time each day when I'm collecting (I only do my collecting in normal lobbies).

 

I would also direct you to the When Justice Is Served thread on this board where some players even submit videos.

Then something is out of whack. The only thing I can think is that certain players are grouped together or it's your characters appearence, IDK. My guy is gray-haired in his 60s.

I'm familiar with WJIS, I've posted videos there twice. I'm not saying it never happens, it's just very rare and never once when collecting.

Edited May 17, 2020 by 1898

[netnow66]

2 hours ago, 1898 said:

Then something is out of whack. The only thing I can think is that certain players are grouped together or it's your characters appearence, IDK. My guy is gray-haired in his 60s.

I'm familiar with WJIS, I've posted videos there twice. I'm not saying it never happens, it's just very rare and never once when collecting.

I'm laughing to myself right now because though I'm over level 300, I still only wear the bib overalls that my character got in the beginning and that's it (I did buy a coat and hat for snow). One of my friends recently asked me why I dressed like a scrub/noob. Add to that I have a female character and maybe I come off to some as being vulnerable.

 

In any case, not only are some of the WJIS multiple posters (so it happens to them on occasion), there are various YT videos showing the same thing along with complaints from others about griefers. Griefing is the main reason given for glitching solo lobbies in the communities I use, so I'm comfortable saying that it remains a major issue for many of us gamers.

[Buddy Hightower]

On 5/16/2020 at 10:06 AM, Geekatoni said:

its a game about being an outlaw.

Outlaws - not idiots...

[Buddy Hightower]

20 hours ago, 1898 said:

This has been complaint since day one but I'm randomly attacked about 1% of the time and 0% when I intentionally stay away from other players. I've never used Defensive mode, never had to. If I'm not in the mood I can outrun anybody. I'd like to see stats or a poll of how often we are actually attacked. Not questioning anyone else's honesty, it just seems this is always exaggerated or I'm just the luckiest player in the game.

Get off your horse and walk slowly through Valentine on a maxed server session. 

[Buddy Hightower]

On 5/16/2020 at 12:00 AM, STNeish said:

So, I was making my way back to camp on my Hunting Wagon.  I'd been up at Brandywine Drop, so it was a LONG ride by wagon.  I even fought off a cougar attack.

 

I'm making my way toward my camp just on the other side of Citadel Rock.  There's a player sitting on his (her?) horse at a crossroads.  As I go by, they suddenly and randomly shoot me with a pump action shotgun.

 

My question for people who do this is... Why?  I mean, what are you getting out of it?  There's no xp, there's no loot, and there's certainly no challenge, so what's the point?  I get griefing, but there's not even much of that, it's little more than a minor inconvenience, so why do people do this kind of thing?

 

I should say, this is not necessarily a condemnation, I just want to understand the thinking behind it.

I agree there should be invite only session so people can play however the hell they want.

However there is an example given in story mode that does justify shooting other players on sight if you can get away with it. That is to say the police don't see you.

The example is: every time you (Arthur/John) encounter the O'driscolls (or any other outlaw gang) you gun them down or they attack you. The reason behind it is a ridiculous life time feud between the leaders. 

 

Edited May 18, 2020 by Buddy Hightower

[Hiply]

56 minutes ago, Buddy Hightower said:

However there is an example given in story mode that does justify shooting other players on sight if you can get away with it. That is to say the police don't see you.

The example is: every time you (Arthur/John) encounter the O'driscolls (or any other outlaw gang) you gun them down or they attack you. The reason behind it is a ridiculous life time feud between the leaders.

And that O'Driscolls/van der Linde feud illustrates the difference between thoroughly explained and justified "shoot on sight" and random "Hur hur...I'mma light these noobs up" moments perfectly.  One is a long-standing blood feud with a well explained backstory and the other is...well...what it is.  

The correct analogy between the story mode feud and online gameplay would be two perma-posses or crews declaring a feud between each other and going at it in online sessions, which - frankly - would be a pretty cool scenario.  It would take both leaders agreeing to it, but it could be a fun mechanic to add to the game.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Hiply

[1898]

4 hours ago, Hiply said:

The correct analogy between the story mode feud and online gameplay would be two perma-posses or crews declaring a feud between each other and going at it in online sessions, which - frankly - would be a pretty cool scenario.  It would take both leaders agreeing to it, but it could be a fun mechanic to add to the game.

I like that idea. Made me think of something else that might work to keep the trigger happy players away from the rest. It would be the opposite of Passive Mode. Something like I'm Looking For a Fight Mode with a green blip to alert all others your're open for a shootout.

Edited May 18, 2020 by 1898

[netnow66]

2 hours ago, 1898 said:

I like that idea. Made me think of something else that might work to keep the trigger happy players away from the rest. It would be the opposite of Passive Mode. Something like I'm Looking For a Fight Mode with a green blip to alert all others your're open for a shootout.

I thought that's what Offensive mode was.

 

If you're riding around with Offensive mode, doesn't that mean you're spoiling for a fight?

[ZombieBatman]

Came across way too many trigger finger clowns today, usually low level players trying to chase after me

[Direwrath]

5 hours ago, Hiply said:

The correct analogy between the story mode feud and online gameplay would be two perma-posses or crews declaring a feud between each other and going at it in online sessions, which - frankly - would be a pretty cool scenario.  It would take both leaders agreeing to it, but it could be a fun mechanic to add to the game.

Now that would be fun! Could you imagine being a member of a large posse and after having been sent out with a few other members by the leader to take care of some business you come into contact with members of your "enemy" posse? They could hold you ransom, threaten to hang you, etc. And if they choose to keep you alive they can send word of your capture so your posse can come and rescue you by either negotiation, or war. R* needs to hear about this idea! The posse system needs more added to it already and this would definitely bring more promising interactions between online players that won't always end up with sour intentions like random shooting sprees. That's such an exciting idea!

 

2 hours ago, 1898 said:

I like that idea. Made me think of something else that might work to keep the trigger happy players away from the rest. It would be the opposite of Passive Mode. Something like I'm Looking For a Fight Mode with a green blip to alert all others your're open for a shootout.

Something better than the red blip, because those can be mistaking a player defending themselves as an aggressive player. Griefers would probably stay away from those players, because they aren't really looking for a player willing to fight, but for in game pvp players that would be a decent option.

 

33 minutes ago, netnow66 said:

I thought that's what Offensive mode was.

 

If you're riding around with Offensive mode, doesn't that mean you're spoiling for a fight?

Not for everyone, but yes technically Offensive mode is meant to be the signal that you are wiling for an interaction if someone is game. The problem with Defensive mode is that it makes it harder for the player to counter attack the aggressive player, so most players will pass on it because if they get attacked they want the ability to fight back. R* has a strange way of trying to counteract griefing behavior that's for sure.

 

@ZombieBatman with RDR2 being included in that game pass the servers have been over run with lower level players just messing around like children.  Lol, so many of them have those little palomino morgan horses and they shoot at us thinking they can keep up with the higher level players. I have stopped paying the trigger happy ones any mind, and a few I have actually let join me so they could play the roles a little because they were interested in how they work. 

Edited May 18, 2020 by Direwrath

[netnow66]

34 minutes ago, Direwrath said:

Not for everyone, but yes technically Offensive mode is meant to be the signal that you are wiling for an interaction if someone is game. The problem with Defensive mode is that it makes it harder for the player to counter attack the aggressive player, so most players will pass on it because if they get attacked they want the ability to fight back. R* has a strange way of trying to counteract griefing behavior that's for sure.

I keep Defensive on at all times (unless I forget to switch back after a mission). Hell, I even keep my geiger counter in hand when I'm NOT collecting sometimes to show I'm no threat. 

 

Defensive usually gives me a fighting chance on those occasions I decide I'm not ready to leave the server yet (sometime I just switch servers during an encounter). I can sometimes see the player trying to lock on to me and his aim keeps "slipping" it seems. That usually gives me time to pull my sawed offs and deal enough splash damage (incendiary and explosive rounds) to win the day. Win or lose, I block them on PSN and report them to Rockstar (when I can) and switch servers.

[Direwrath]

21 minutes ago, netnow66 said:

I keep Defensive on at all times (unless I forget to switch back after a mission). Hell, I even keep my geiger counter in hand when I'm NOT collecting sometimes to show I'm no threat. 

 

Defensive usually gives me a fighting chance on those occasions I decide I'm not ready to leave the server yet (sometime I just switch servers during an encounter). I can sometimes see the player trying to lock on to me and his aim keeps "slipping" it seems. That usually gives me time to pull my sawed offs and deal enough splash damage (incendiary and explosive rounds) to win the day. Win or lose, I block them on PSN and report them to Rockstar (when I can) and switch servers.

I turn mine off when I feel ready for a fight, but I'm usually in defensive as well. Most players respect defensive, and I can even wander through a gunfight without having players mess with me while it's on. But some seem to take offense to it, or they think me an easy target because I have it on. Sometimes it's fun to turn their game back at them.

[1898]

2 hours ago, netnow66 said:

I thought that's what Offensive mode was.

 

If you're riding around with Offensive mode, doesn't that mean you're spoiling for a fight?

Then I guess they could just keep it simple by making Defensive Mode 100% defensive. I don't know why they had leave a window open so that a defensive player can still be attacked. Sometimes they just can't help themselves.

Edited May 18, 2020 by 1898

[kcole4001]

I have actually ridden through (and sometimes around certain sections of) Valentine during an ongoing shootout between players and wasn't bothered.

It was during days that required things like 'visit a shop in Valentine', 'sell herbs', 'change your character's facial appearance' etc.

I had nothing on my horse, specifically no carcasses that could be ruined, so if I had been shot I lose nothing but a little time, but surprisingly no one bothered with me.

Usually if the shooters are entertained blasting each other, they won't think too much of a stranger at the far end of the street minding their own business.

Usually...

 

===========================================================================================================================

 

54 minutes ago, Direwrath said:

I turn mine off when I feel ready for a fight, but I'm usually in defensive as well. Most players respect defensive, and I can even wander through a gunfight without having players mess with me while it's on. But some seem to take offense to it, or they think me an easy target because I have it on. Sometimes it's fun to turn their game back at them.

Maybe some of them think we're wusses for using defensive, that soon changes when the explosives start raining down on them.

I've seen it happen on livestreams a lot, especially after a round of showdowns.

I don't know if the trigger happy ones think that they're badasses, and they owned someone, so they can just continue plinking away, but they always find out attacking a full posse of 7 is a really stupid idea.

Generally the happy shooter gets a couple of quick 'WTF' kills, then gets relentlessly hammered until they parlay and leave.

Lessons need to be learned.

Edited May 18, 2020 by kcole4001

[1898]

10 hours ago, Buddy Hightower said:

Get off your horse and walk slowly through Valentine on a maxed server session. 

Well I took your recommendation, did just that and was attacked!

Not sure what to say but this guy was an idiot.

 

 

Edited May 18, 2020 by 1898

[Direwrath]

3 hours ago, kcole4001 said:

Maybe some of them think we're wusses for using defensive, that soon changes when the explosives start raining down on them.

I've seen it happen on livestreams a lot, especially after a round of showdowns.

I don't know if the trigger happy ones think that they're badasses, and they owned someone, so they can just continue plinking away, but they always find out attacking a full posse of 7 is a really stupid idea.

Generally the happy shooter gets a couple of quick 'WTF' kills, then gets relentlessly hammered until they parlay and leave.

Lessons need to be learned.

Lol, sometimes the player is in defensive for the protection of the "trigger happy" fools, not for their own safety.  It's funny watching videos of these types of players learning that lesson the hard way.

 

2 hours ago, 1898 said:

Well I took your recommendation, did just that and was attacked!

Not sure what to say but this guy was an idiot.

 

 

Your typical tough guy/gal player, now that there, that was a good looking execution! 

[Gunbladelad]

Some players are just out to grief others - just yesterday I was heading from Valentine to meet up with a friend - and a gang of 4 guys decided to kill me (and my horse) - for no reason other than I was going along a track they happened to be close to.

Normally I avoid Valentine because there is ALWAYS some group of idiots who's wanting to go to war with every single player and NPC within 3 miles of the place - but in this instance the game just happened to spawn me in the outskirts of the town.

[YNNEL]

I don’t mind people trying to kill me in a game about outlaws. I expect it and accept it. It’s when people shoot me from behind or when I’m in a position where I’m unable to defend myself. That is a cowardly move. But then again it’s only a mild inconvenience and I’ll simply parlay if I can’t be bothered fighting. People just do it cos they like killing other players. That’s fine and I accept it. Just don’t be a cowardly bitch about it.

[AmyStone]

On 5/16/2020 at 6:00 AM, STNeish said:

My question for people who do this is... Why?  I mean, what are you getting out of it?  There's no xp, there's no loot, and there's certainly no challenge, so what's the point?  I get griefing, but there's not even much of that, it's little more than a minor inconvenience, so why do people do this kind of thing?

 

I should say, this is not necessarily a condemnation, I just want to understand the thinking behind it.

There will always be people who shoot for what seems to be no reason. There are certain reason I have for shooting people. If there is a posse of red or pink players then they have obviously been hostile towards others and are clearly up for a bit of a fight. If a mission pops up and it's a game feature to attack something and I have nothing better to do then I'll have a play with them. For most of the time I'm minding my own business collecting but sometimes you just seem to end up in a really toxic session where every random player is shooting at you. If this happens to me a few times then I get sick of it and then trust nobody for an hour or so which means anyone that rides towards me gets a bullet.

[ShadowlessDevil]

If someone shoots me for no reason, I hunt them down, and shoot them myself. One time a player didn't learn and kept trying back to kill me, After killing him 5 times, player left lol

 

[DentureDynamite]

^^ I did that about a week ago in Blue Water Marsh; was minding my own business as usual, and got sniped by a red dot moron. I hunted him down and returned the favor with my Rolling Block and an explosive round.

Edited May 19, 2020 by DentureDynamite

[GrungeNinja]

Lets hold our horses shall we?  We don’t need to take serious whats exactly happened back in the period, if ppl went mad shooting everyone or not, its a game, its meant for fun so, lets have fun the way we want and if one is ruining it for you just use the tools provided to solve it.

Edited May 19, 2020 by GrungeNinja

[Hiply]

39 minutes ago, GrungeNinja said:

Lets hold our horses shall we?  We don’t need to take serious whats exactly happened back in the period, if ppl went mad shooting everyone or not, its a game, its meant for fun so, lets have fun the way we want and if one is ruining it for you just use the tools provided to solve it.

Then let's immediately toss all of the "Hey, we're supposed to be outlaws in the Wild Wild West!" arguments out the window as well, shall we? 

 

It seems like you're saying "This should just be a free for all shoot 'em up" since the "tools provided" boil down to flipping sessions if you are unable to - or unwilling to - successfully engage with someone (or some posse) who is hell bent on ruining your gameplay for the sake of ruining your gameplay.

I'm not opposed to someone taking a shot at me, and in fact had a short dust-up with someone yesterday who was sniping NPCs from the lighthouse in Van Horn and decided I was a reasonable target as well (I was in Def mode).  He missed from the range we were at but it was damned close, so I worked my way up to the top floor where he was hiding with a pile of dead lawmen on the floor below, got an angle on him and put a slug from my shotgun into him just as he was about to drop a stick of dynamite on my head.  He respawned, came at me again and ate another slug.  On his next respawn he killed me.  After that we both went our separate ways, fun was had, neither of us spawn-camped the other. 

Now that's fair play in a game that allows PvP.  But that's not what's being talked about here.  

Edited May 19, 2020 by Hiply

[GrungeNinja]

16 minutes ago, Hiply said:

Then let's immediately toss all of the "Hey, we're supposed to be outlaws in the Wild Wild West!" arguments out the window as well, shall we? 

 

It seems like you're saying "This should just be a free for all shoot 'em up" since the "tools provided" boil down to flipping sessions if you are unable to - or unwilling to - successfully engage with someone (or some posse) who is hell bent on ruining your gameplay for the sake of ruining your gameplay.

I'm not opposed to someone taking a shot at me, and in fact had a short dust-up with someone yesterday who was sniping NPCs from the lighthouse in Van Horn and decided I was a reasonable target as well (I was in Def mode).  I worked my way up to the top floor where he was hiding with a pile of dead lawmen on the floor below, got an angle on him and put a slug from my shotgun into him just as he was about to drop a stick of dynamite on my head.  He respawned, came at me again and ate another slug.  On his next respawn he killed me.  After that we both went our separate ways, fun was had, neither of us spawn-camped the other. 

Now that's fair play in a game that allows PvP.  But that's not what's being talked about here.  

Hummmmmm.... so what's your point?    Because everything I read in your reply is the same as I said and what ppl complained said aswell. You interpreted what I said "this should be a free for all shoot up" when this is exactly what the game is, if you're not a dick that goes around shooting everyone, good for you, you're part of the good guys, as I am, so whats the problem having dicks on the game that is the opposite?  what will happen is exactly what you experiencied in Van Horn, if one can't deal with someone or a posse, theres 3 options, parley, move session or run, i don't see why ppl get so serious about a game when you have options to avoid dicks, play games like Conan Exiles and there you will see what nightmare is.

Edited May 19, 2020 by GrungeNinja