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Weird tessellation (probably) glitches with Vulkan


Wirapuru

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Since day one I've been watching some very weird tessellation - probably, in my humble observations - glitches. Day one was on the snow. Last days I've been able to play so little time, I maybe am only going from A to B and  a  daily to keep the streak.  But then today I was going through the swamp areas and it was so abysmal I couldn't ignore it anymore:
 

Spoiler

3DQPcHH.jpg
agn5fNL.jpg

nr2H65c.jpg

(warning: trypophobia triggering)

On trying to identify the issue, it only *apparently* (sadly I can't test it extensively) fixed when I changed from  Vulkan to DX12. And, also unfortunately, this  isn't  much an option right now because something about it is making my GPU to "blackout" for a second after X random minutes with DX12,  which  forces me  to  reboot.  (yeah well, not a very happy experience so far)

My  guesses go from the GPU itself, from  being a  bit too new (AMD 5700 XT), its drivers, or  Vulkan  API -  and of course the game. Or any combination between those.

Anyone has seen that? Any ideas?

Edited by Wirapuru
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Vulkan is trash. DX12 has actually superior visuals, better draw distance but more prone to crashing. Many people have done testing and DX12 is better if you want the best visuals possible.

Edited by scorpgul
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3 minutes ago, scorpgul said:

Vulkan is trash. DX12 has actually superior visuals, better draw distance but more prone to crashing. Many people have done testing and DX12 is better.

But Vulkan performs a lot better. 

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3 minutes ago, Ron Damon said:

But Vulkan performs a lot better. 

I think this is subjective. I have 2080 Ti, i7 7700k, 16GB RAM and DX12 performance is vastly superior to Vulkan. The only problem is I get a few crashes with DX12. Vulkan is 0 crashing.

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13 minutes ago, scorpgul said:

I think this is subjective. I have 2080 Ti, i7 7700k, 16GB RAM and DX12 performance is vastly superior to Vulkan. The only problem is I get a few crashes with DX12. Vulkan is 0 crashing.

i7 4790k, GTX 1080, 16GB RAM. I get around 10 more fps on average with Vulkan.

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1 hour ago, scorpgul said:

Vulkan is trash. DX12 has actually superior visuals, better draw distance but more prone to crashing. Many people have done testing and DX12 is better if you want the best visuals possible.

Can I get a source on the better visuals part? First time i'm hearing this.

Edited by Russi4nW4rrior
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Yes it does, on snow is a bit less frequent and less weirder in here but still happens sometimes.

Another strange aspect is that not always it happens, somewhat seems to be related to the game session (as in the whole game, restarting => new game session, not online session). If it happens it'll happen A LOT (like in the first  post images), else none.
 

And another one  I just remembered now, when it happens on snow some other physics-related glitches happen (like I've seen like a stream of snow falling on top of enemies  and such), if it happens again I'll try to capture it - but those are very uncommon.

Well damn, my journey with this game - although fantastic in gameplay - has been rough an odyssey on  fixing issues.. no idea what to do with this now.

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9 hours ago, scorpgul said:

Vulkan is trash. DX12 has actually superior visuals, better draw distance but more prone to crashing. Many people have done testing and DX12 is better if you want the best visuals possible.

umm... actually there is no visual difference between dx12 & vulkan, the only difference is in the performance & crashing frequency

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1 hour ago, RuskiChleb said:

umm... actually there is no visual difference between dx12 & vulkan, the only difference is in the performance & crashing frequency

True, shouldn't be any visual difference at all, only if there's a glitch/bug like in this case.

1 hour ago, Doodling Hitman said:

This gives me the fricking itches! I don't like that pattern at all.. Kinda makes my trypophobia act up..

Sorry, eh, I forget there are such things. I'll put a warning 👍

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1 hour ago, Wirapuru said:

True, shouldn't be any visual difference at all, only if there's a glitch/bug like in this case.

Sorry, eh, I forget there are such things. I'll put a warning 👍

Oh I am fine with that, lol. Just saying it gave me the itchies, lol. Nothing serious.

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I don't get this with my RX 5700 with Tessellation and POM on Ultra. Weird. Using Vulkan.

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On 12/7/2019 at 11:32 AM, Spider-Vice said:

I don't get this with my RX 5700 with Tessellation and POM on Ultra. Weird. Using Vulkan.

POM? Do you mind sharing with me this screen from Radeon Settings? I'm curious to see which versions  you have for each of  those:
w3Ujtzi.png

 

 

On 12/7/2019 at 4:53 PM, UpTheDowngrade said:

Is this egg carton tessellation glitch online-only?

I believe not, because the snow  glitches also happened on  Story, first time. But I didn't see it yet on Story  - but I'm almost not playing Story  last weeks  I really can't be sure about this. I'll  double check it later.

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I take that back, I have noticed the bug too in the Bayou. Both Tessellation and POM are on Ultra. Not sure on who to put the blame on this one, AMD or Rockstar. It doesn't seem to happen on other less deep mud surfaces or snow, so...

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1 hour ago, Spider-Vice said:

I take that back, I have noticed the bug too in the Bayou. Both Tessellation and POM are on Ultra. Not sure on who to put the blame on this one, AMD or Rockstar. It doesn't seem to happen on other less deep mud surfaces or snow, so...

Yeah exactly, the  worst  about this glitch/bug is that it isn't much consistent to when, where and how will happen. Some game sessions I'll have that nightmare like in the images, sometimes only here or there, and very mild, and other times nothing (but this  is very rare).

The only  "consistent" aspect so far is when changing to DX12, I've never seen it anywhere - but since my game is randomly going  to this weird black screen state (with no recovery at all, I only hear the game sounds and a black screen, forcing me to hard-reset) only with DX12, I  can't guarantee 100% it doesn't happen..

This one gonna be painful to find a way to be consistently  reproduced so we can start to find reasons and solutions.

Yours happen very  rarely then, I believe?

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@Spider-Vice Just an update about it. At Guru3D forums I could get some cues about what's happening - it seems a (at least a little bit) known issue from AMD and Vulkan. I won't be able to test that possible workarounds until later or even only tomorrow - but if you want to take a peek on it: https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/possible-amd-vulkan-or-rdr2-implementation-tessellation-issue.429840/#post-5739739

Either way, I'll try those later and report back ASAP.

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I responded in that thread ;) I'll be waiting for the new drivers to see if it's a driver issue.

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1 minute ago, Spider-Vice said:

I responded in that thread ;) I'll be waiting for the new drivers to see if it's a driver issue.

ROFL I'm so spaced out sometimes - that's your username right there - yeah. Ok, I'll update here and there anyways. /Pepega-out 😁

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Hey @Spider-Vice and anyone with this issue: although not yet 100% fixing it, I found out that an already-known "fix" for another issue (the one where wagon trails i.e. fade out too early/near) can somewhat make it less worse. It's by setting the `deepsurfaceQuality` on settings.xml to Ultra. please see https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/possible-amd-vulkan-or-rdr2-implementation-tessellation-issue.429840/#post-5739933 for extra details and how to do it if any doubts.

Any news on this I'll report them back here. (Also let me know if it made it better for you)

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1 hour ago, Wirapuru said:

Hey @Spider-Vice and anyone with this issue: although not yet 100% fixing it, I found out that an already-known "fix" for another issue (the one where wagon trails i.e. fade out too early/near) can somewhat make it less worse. It's by setting the `deepsurfaceQuality` on settings.xml to Ultra. please see https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/possible-amd-vulkan-or-rdr2-implementation-tessellation-issue.429840/#post-5739933 for extra details and how to do it if any doubts.

Any news on this I'll report them back here. (Also let me know if it made it better for you)

i have a little question about deepsurfacequality - what is the hit in the performance after seeting it to ultra? 

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8 minutes ago, RuskiChleb said:

i have a little question about deepsurfacequality - what is the hit in the performance after seeting it to ultra? 

I really couldn't see any, Idk if it's because it was as High initially and maybe High > Ultra is almost no difference perf-wise - but I'm even questing myself in this particular situation it actually lower the stutters I was having here. Sorry, so  many variables I can't say what's happening here. The overall experience for me was that actually I  have  less stutters and  almost  no more tesselation  glitches anymore. Maybe someone  with none of the before mentioned issues could measure the (genuine) performance impacts.

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Yeah, I suspected that option being the culprit. Thought mine was set to Ultra, but it's High! will try that later. I did notice wagon tracks in the mud in the towns were disappearing too close to the camera....

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On 12/5/2019 at 7:05 AM, scorpgul said:

Vulkan is trash. DX12 has actually superior visuals, better draw distance but more prone to crashing. Many people have done testing and DX12 is better if you want the best visuals possible.

What the f*ck? I dont have any glitches with Vulkan and I HIGHLY doubt there are visual differences.........

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Also, this only happens in specific mud surfaces so it probably is a Rockstar issue. There's other deep mud surfaces in other areas of the game where this doesn't happen:

https://i.imgur.com/AEWAbRV.png

https://i.imgur.com/6NPc2Kt.png

 

And then where it happens:

https://i.imgur.com/CbpUrS5.png

https://i.imgur.com/5cAaouM.png

https://i.imgur.com/mvyPiSE.png

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This seems to be specific to AMD cards and it might have to do with AMD's own default optimised Tessellation calculations that can be switched off in the Radeon Software control panel. I'll try to do that later. Don't think I've seen a game have issues with those, but someone on Guru3D suggested that could be it.

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