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Mr. Ando

The Gang's Code

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Mr. Ando

Throughout the game you hear the characters talking about Dutch's code, of how their different than other gangs and of course how Dutch rambles about how they are trying to reform society.

 

We learned later at the game this is bullsh*t, Dutch only cared about himself, but what do you think was the gang code? they were some kind of Robin Hood thieves? robbing the rich to give the poor I would like to think, but then you hear Hosea talking about robbing folks in saloons,. Strauss whole deal involved loaning money to people in need too.

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Ironside

I feel that Dutch has some quasi-socialistic dream where he of course is the benevolent despot. I will not try to mix my own political opinions in this text but what I can say is that every system is corrupt to a certain degree. And if said system is led by a sociopathic philosopher that dream of being an enlightened despot, well that is not going to end well.

 

So even if the “code” was some proto-socialism with Dutch as the leader, the code was corrupted just as any rule is when it is controlled by only one or at least very few people. 

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Mr. Ando
1 hour ago, Ironside said:

I feel that Dutch has some quasi-socialistic dream where he of course is the benevolent despot. I will not try to mix my own political opinions in this text but what I can say is that every system is corrupt to a certain degree. And if said system is led by a sociopathic philosopher that dream of being an enlightened despot, well that is not going to end well.

 

So even if the “code” was some proto-socialism with Dutch as the leader, the code was corrupted just as any rule is when it is controlled by only one or at least very few people. 

Maybe it's something more akin to anarchism. Dutch seems to detest government and wants to live free in the open country. He also says to Milton in the bank robbery in America you can always cut a deal, I feel that's more in line with philosophy of Evelyn Miller Dutch seems to love.

 

I just wonder what he said to the gang, rob to rich and live the poor folk alone or something like that. An interesting item is the newspaper scrap Arthur keeps about their first robbery, apparently they donated money to an orphanage or something like that.

 

 

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UpTheDowngrade

Early in the game, Dutch tells Arthur they're trying to reform society to be kinder and gentler -- How? By robbing and killing people?

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Mysterious hero

It's mentioned several times in the first and second game that the gang used to be more Robin Hood-esque, robbing from the rich and giving to the poor and wanting to change the system of power Dutch thought was corrupt and rotten. However, they eventually stopped doing that and instead focused on themselves for their own survival. 

According to Hosea, they also used to have a "no killing" rule as well, most likely to convince themselves that they're not "criminals", they're "outlaws". However, Dutch decided to break that rule, because, in his mind, "Change can only succeed if it was brutal and relentless".

Edited by Mysterious hero

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Caffeination
13 hours ago, Mr. Ando said:

but what do you think was the gang code?

As the achievement trophies imply; rob the rich, give to the poor. But they’ve always been a contradictory bunch since they tell stories of robbing common folk, or at least attempting to before having a change of heart like Tilly did with a poor old mother of a dead rebel, even a high-honor Arthur nonchalantly expresses he’d rob a her out of the money she needed for food.

 

Like, Dutch’s gang say they have a code and aren’t like the other gangs, but Kieran has a point about not seeing much difference between them and the O’Driscolls. 

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Mr. Ando
7 hours ago, Mysterious hero said:

It's mentioned several times in the first and second game that the gang used to be more Robin Hood-esque, robbing from the rich and giving to the poor and wanting to change the system of power Dutch thought was corrupt and rotten. However, they eventually stopped doing that and instead focused on themselves for their own survival. 

According to Hosea, they also used to have a "no killing" rule as well, most likely to convince themselves that they're not "criminals", they're "outlaws". However, Dutch decided to break that rule, because, in his mind, "Change can only succeed if it was brutal and relentless".

Do you think Arthur's character would kill the surviving guys in the train robbery or Jimmy Brooks? according to their "code" he won't kill people in cold blood, but they could be witnesses that rat out the gang, isn't better to cut all the loose ends?

Edited by Mr. Ando

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Mysterious hero
6 hours ago, Mr. Ando said:

Do you think Arthur's character would kill the surviving guys in the train robbery or Jimmy Brooks? according to their "code" he won't kill people in cold blood, but they could be witnesses that rat out the gang, isn't better to cut all the loose ends?

I suppose that that's the ambiguity of the situation. Will Arthur be pragmatic or will he follow his code? It's up to the player to decide.

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Jimbatron
20 hours ago, Ironside said:

I feel that Dutch has some quasi-socialistic dream where he of course is the benevolent despot. I will not try to mix my own political opinions in this text but what I can say is that every system is corrupt to a certain degree. And if said system is led by a sociopathic philosopher that dream of being an enlightened despot, well that is not going to end well.

 

So even if the “code” was some proto-socialism with Dutch as the leader, the code was corrupted just as any rule is when it is controlled by only one or at least very few people. 

Pretty good analysis of it.

 

The key point is Dutch uses his charisma and a stated vision to keep loyalty. But the truth is that his leadership comes first and is more important to him than the vision, whatever that might be.

 

That failure of leadership happens much in modern business settings. It’s not always an apparent problem until things start to go wrong then it is obvious when a leader starts to compromise values they supposedly held sacred as they deem necessary to stay in control.

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UpTheDowngrade
17 hours ago, Mysterious hero said:

It's mentioned several times in the first and second game that the gang used to be more Robin Hood-esque, robbing from the rich and giving to the poor and wanting to change the system of power Dutch thought was corrupt and rotten. However, they eventually stopped doing that and instead focused on themselves for their own survival. 

According to Hosea, they also used to have a "no killing" rule as well, most likely to convince themselves that they're not "criminals", they're "outlaws". However, Dutch decided to break that rule, because, in his mind, "Change can only succeed if it was brutal and relentless".

I didn't play RDR1, so this explains Hosea's "We've turned into a bunch of killers, I mean it".

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