Should Paint it Black (PIB) Be Nerfed?

[Rockstarsucks33]

Sorry but if you can't kill people with the regular auto aim and have to use PIB you are just awful and are upset people call you out for using an OP auto kill card....PIB should only be pve or story mode...They would have been better off leaving out combat cards and just giving us ones with unique skills or perks that are more helpful QOL things, not things that give you an advantage against other players.

[AmyStone]

5 hours ago, Rockstarsucks33 said:

Sorry but if you can't kill people with the regular auto aim and have to use PIB you are just awful and are upset people call you out for using an OP auto kill card....PIB should only be pve or story mode...They would have been better off leaving out combat cards and just giving us ones with unique skills or perks that are more helpful QOL things, not things that give you an advantage against other players.

 

How does it give you an advantage over other players when anyone can use it? Sorry, if you can't figure out a counter for PiB then you are just awful at pvp.

[CosmicBuffalo]

23 hours ago, Nerfgoth said:

Seriously that makes the game lag too!?

Ahh the good old days, when slippery was actually free aim and there was no fool me once.  I actually was able to kill that guy but because of lag it said he killed me and when I respawned it said death from beyong.  You simply turned it off on PIBers and killed them.  I have noticed that with a bit of an upgrade on my console end I have less lag.  However, people that use PIB still seem to have a lot of lag.  Its because they are going in an out of dead eye nonstop and 9 times out 10 they flopping around like a fish that you lost a grip on in your boat.  Oh man the flopping, that should be nerfed as well along with PIB, if you belly flop, you should lose all your stamina and have to lay on the ground for like 5 secs not instantly pop up.  

[Rockstarsucks33]

5 hours ago, AmyStone said:

How does it give you an advantage over other players when anyone can use it? Sorry, if you can't figure out a counter for PiB then you are just awful at pvp.

You use slippery card...that's why that card exists...Putting xs on people for instant kills with no bloom doesn't take skill plus it's so easy it's boring. But to each their own.

[AmyStone]

3 hours ago, Rockstarsucks33 said:

You use slippery card...that's why that card exists...Putting xs on people for instant kills with no bloom doesn't take skill plus it's so easy it's boring. But to each their own.

 

You still haven't said how it gives you an advantage when anyone can use the card? And if you think it takes no skill then how do you explain how some people are good with the card and some people are rubbish?

[Lonely-Martin]

In such an immersive game, it simply breaks immersion for some. Of course, these cards aren't the only aspect guilty of breaking immersion, but they are the topic for now. 

 

People can dislike things but understand just how they work just fine. Hell, plenty of these cards can be just as useful in PvE, lol. So let's not turn this thread into another mess.

 

Those that like them will defend them, those that understand them but dislike them will oppose, no need to go back and forth telling those that dislike them 'oh, you must be bad at the game' when that's not necessarily the issue.

[Nerfgoth]

47 minutes ago, Lonely-Martin said:

In such an immersive game, it simply breaks immersion for some. Of course, these cards aren't the only aspect guilty of breaking immersion, but they are the topic for now. 

 

People can dislike things but understand just how they work just fine. Hell, plenty of these cards can be just as useful in PvE, lol. So let's not turn this thread into another mess.

 

Those that like them will defend them, those that understand them but dislike them will oppose, no need to go back and forth telling those that dislike them 'oh, you must be bad at the game' when that's not necessarily the issue.

 

Best use of the card in PvP are days with bow headshoots as daily. And those pesky deers!

[AmyStone]

My comment about them being bad at the game was in defence of them saying that they take no skill when there is obviously going to be some skill. The card isn't just about being able to get kills more easily than without them. How you play the game with the different cards is as import (maybe more) than the card itself. There is obviously skill involved in using all of the offensive cards and anyone who says otherwise is probably not very good with them so uses the 'no skill' thing as an excuse. I used to think slippery took no skill but there's a lot more to it than putting on the card and expecting to be invincible. I didn't particularly like the cards to begin with but had to get used to using them because it was part of the game. If you're not into pvp then you're never going to really understand about the cards.

 

I'm not sure how anyone can say it breaks immersion. We are playing fantasy characters - people who live in the wild west and who are skilled at using weapons. Do those people who think it should all be free aim also think that we should 'free ride' our horses and control the balance of your character as you're riding with a high chance you'll be falling off a lot? No because that would be silly.

 

 

[4eyedcoupe]

7 minutes ago, AmyStone said:

 I didn't particularly like the cards to begin with but had to get used to using them because it was part of the game.

 

 

This^^.  I don't like them, but they aren't going anywhere so I use cards that suit my playing style.  Sometimes you have the make the best with what you are given, like it or not...tis life.

[Lonely-Martin]

7 minutes ago, AmyStone said:

My comment about them being bad at the game was in defence of them saying that they take no skill when there is obviously going to be some skill. The card isn't just about being able to get kills more easily than without them. How you play the game with the different cards is as import (maybe more) than the card itself. There is obviously skill involved in using all of the offensive cards and anyone who says otherwise is probably not very good with them so uses the 'no skill' thing as an excuse. I used to think slippery took no skill but there's a lot more to it than putting on the card and expecting to be invincible. I didn't particularly like the cards to begin with but had to get used to using them because it was part of the game. If you're not into pvp then you're never going to really understand about the cards.

 

I can enjoy PvP, just not in this game. I've tried it more than enough so please don't assume, I can hold my own even without these buffs. I mean the game is designed to force PvP onto players if one so wants.

 

I understand the cards but dislike them so I'm critical. Luckily they currently have zero impact on my game, but they have before. That said, these cards quite literally do make getting kills easier, it's written in the descriptions, lol. You are literally buying an ability to get a buff at something, making it easier, or more concentrated on that aspect, that's why it's easy to say they take less/no skill, because you are buying one. But it's just a broad way to knock something I feel add nothing to the game and that effort could be better spent elsewhere, at least in my view. I accept it's not yours/others though.

 

Point being, the other chap made a general comment while you looked to take a cheap shot is all and that's likely to see the thread get heat from the mods. It's better to keep things general and not personal I feel.

 

23 minutes ago, AmyStone said:

I'm not sure how anyone can say it breaks immersion. We are playing fantasy characters

 

This makes little sense though. Of course we're playing fantasy characters, fantasy characters in a role playing game too. Immersing means to invest in one's fantasy by role playing.

 

Anything can break that immersion, from another player disrupting it, certain game mechanics/additions, to the doorbell or phone ringing. Some things like the doorbell obviously aren't R*'s issue, but others are, especially when these players are forced to share with other playstyles, or completely opposing playstyles. A clash is inevitible and immersion gets sapped away.

 

Sure, we all immerse in our own ways, and for me being attacked by a player that can survive headshots because of their cloth hat breaks mine, among other things. Others like you embrace the cards in their fantasy/roleplay and that's fine too, or don't immerse at all which again is fine. Doesn't mean you're sh*t at the game or don't understand what it is for others, just that you dislike an aspect. Fair enough.

 

Simply put, your fantasy isn't mine, mine isn't yours. No problems there, until one imposes on another's.

 

46 minutes ago, AmyStone said:

people who live in the wild west and who are skilled at using weapons.

 

See, that's your fantasy. Guns are a means to an end for me. I'm more the explorer type that prefers to immerse into the atmosphere hunting treasures and robbing houses or helping strangers get home etc.

[Lonely-Martin]

1 hour ago, Nerfgoth said:

Best use of the card in PvP are days with bow headshoots as daily. And those pesky deers!

 

To be fair, combat dailies are one's I leave be. It's not my preferred area and I've a healthy stash of gold so it's easier to be selective. But I'm sure they'd come in handy for hunting too, especially if you find a quick fox in a harsh area full of trees, gators and rivers/falls etc.

[Rockstarsucks33]

4 hours ago, Lonely-Martin said:

I understand the cards but dislike them so I'm critical. Luckily they currently have zero impact on my game, but they have before. That said, these cards quite literally do make getting kills easier, it's written in the descriptions, lol. You are literally buying an ability to get a buff at something, making it easier, or more concentrated on that aspect, that's why it's easy to say they take less/no skill, because you are buying one.

This^ The cards should've been left out or just have cards like the QOL "skill pages" from the roles like the skill being able to stay in eagle eye while sprinting on my horse when hunting, or cards giving boosts like gus's trinkets. 

[GrungeNinja]

I dont wanna flame ppl who use PiB, but to discuss skill, its very easy to see why PiB is OP, PiB user to shoot a bird or a squirrel, just pass the aim dot once by the target to paint it and done. The one not using PiB…. yeah you know.

 

Again, I dont wanna get into a fight here on PiB vs Non PiB,  but in a western game where aiming with guns is the very SOUL of it, such a feature should only be present in Story mode, in a multiplayer makes no sense at all exactly because of taking away the skill of aiming.

Edited May 7, 2021 by GrungeNinja

[Krommer]

I was pretty bad with PIB; this is probably because I'm on the XBOX, so even with the sliders

all the way up I just can't seem to move the thing fast enough for free aiming/painting it black success.

 

I'M WAY better after I switched to Slow and Steady, for PVP/Legendary animals/"Hunt the animal" etc.

No idea why I had PIB for so long, what a waste.

Edited May 8, 2021 by Krommer

[Nerfgoth]

8 hours ago, Krommer said:

I was pretty bad with PIB; this is probably because I'm on the XBOX, so even with the sliders

all the way up I just can't seem to move the thing fast enough for free aiming/painting it black success.

 

I'M WAY better after I switched to Slow and Steady, for PVP/Legendary animals/"Hunt the animal" etc.

No idea why I had PIB for so long, what a waste.

 

Maybe it was because everyone else had it? I´m running around with the Springfield in PvP when the Bolt Action Rifle is the rifle to use!

[Direwrath]

14 hours ago, Krommer said:

I was pretty bad with PIB; this is probably because I'm on the XBOX, so even with the sliders

all the way up I just can't seem to move the thing fast enough for free aiming/painting it black success.

I have the same issue, it's why I hardly use Dead Eye in the first place. 

[RyuNova]

On 5/7/2021 at 9:34 AM, AmyStone said:

You still haven't said how it gives you an advantage when anyone can use the card? And if you think it takes no skill then how do you explain how some people are good with the card and some people are rubbish?

 

Because its OP, one Dead Eye Card outclasses them all and needing to have another one constantly on your deck (Slippery Bastard) just in case just reinforces this point. A game that already has Auto-Aim did not need "Super Auto-Aim" on top, PiB works with all weapons (except scoped) meaning that unless you are constantly looking over your shoulder anyone with basic PiB and a basic rifle will kill you every time. Its basically an "I win" button unless you are constantly jacked up on tonics.

 

PiB should have only worked with Handguns as a kind of "Quick Draw" feature.

Edited May 10, 2021 by RyuNova

[From dimension 1207]

. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by From dimension 1207

[AltiMetro]

I'm OK with PiB as it is now. I'm a Slow & Steady user, and do well enough against PiB users. 
If they nerf it, I'd welcome changes to the entire Ability Card system. 
Do a complete overhaul. 
I've had to adjust to all the changes they made to combat, I'll adjust to the next changes too. 

The only thing I don't want: any PiB changes that affect hunting. When they nerfed the Varmint rifle, it also affected hunting birds. Don't need more of that

[AmyStone]

3 hours ago, From dimension 1207 said:

95% of players use pib, proves rockstar failed balancing their own ability cards. But its not pib that is op, its everything else that got nerfed. 

 

No. It proves that's the way people prefer to play.

 

What I think is really strange is how you think the Rolling Block is underpowered. In fact it's something nobody seems to talk about with things that need nerfing. The game allows you to dance around randomly and free aim headshots from 50 metres with a scope more easily than free aiming with a shotgun from 5 metres away. If you were trying to dancing and scope in real life you'd be lucky to be able to hit a building from 20 metres away. So being able to paint targets with PiB is perfectly balanced with how unimaginably accurate someone can be with a scope.

 

And people saying PiB takes no skill are also clearly wrong. It has taken me a long time to be able to get consistent headshot with it. It's not just a case of 'auto aim and flick' and you get the perfect headshot every time. You have to take into account things like how someone is moving and how far away they are. And if PiB was so easy then you would never have winners or losers in fights and everyone would get the same number of kills with it. You could just as easily say 'SB takes no skill because you just get close with a shotgun and blast them' or 'SaS takes no skill because you can just stand there and shoot while taking loads of damage'. It takes skill to use all the cards and be able to judge which ones to use against your opponents in the situation you are in. PiB is utterly useless in a long distance fight where scopes are involved which means you'll either need to get close somehow by using the terrain or switch to a different card.

 

Anyone thinking PiB is overpowered or takes no skill are either miffed that they can't use it and get killed a lot by people who can, or generally don't get involved in PvP and don't understand the cards.

[1898]

 

Please open up Mexico, have the Ruales seize all cards at the border and give us one area where we don't have to think about this crap.

[4eyedcoupe]

2 hours ago, 1898 said:

 

Please open up Mexico, have the Ruales seize all cards at the border and give us one area where we don't have to think about this crap.

I like that idea

 

[travilanche]

There shouldn’t be tonics and there shouldn’t be ability cards in this game at all. I remember the good old days of RDR when if you shot someone...they died. I can’t believe how many YouTube videos there are talking about the best tank builds in a western game. What a mess they made this time around. 

[AmyStone]

1 hour ago, travilanche said:

There shouldn’t be tonics and there shouldn’t be ability cards in this game at all. I remember the good old days of RDR when if you shot someone...they died. I can’t believe how many YouTube videos there are talking about the best tank builds in a western game. What a mess they made this time around. 

 

Good idea. And while they are at it they should remove the different kinds of weapons and just have one type and call it 'gun'. And they should remove the different ammo types too so everyone is using the same bullets. They should also remove the ability to duck on your horse or dive when in combat. In fact just to remove all strategy and choice from the game and make combat as dull as possible it should all be fist fighting where you just stand close and spam x.

[From dimension 1207]

On 5/12/2021 at 10:12 AM, AmyStone said:

 

Edited May 14, 2021 by From dimension 1207

[AmyStone]

12 minutes ago, From dimension 1207 said:

But then again, since you brought it up, pib actually shoots for you. Saying pib requires skills, is like telling me, you are a very skilled soccer player, but every time you shoot the ball, there is a robot next to the net, who make sure you score.

 

Then you don't know how PiB works. Like I said, if it did everything for you then you could be in a fight with absolutely anyone and be even on kills. That's rarely the case which means some people are better with it than others. If you don't want to call it skill then just call it luck then.

[4eyedcoupe]

22 minutes ago, From dimension 1207 said:

 

soccer player

I gave you a thumbs up just for those two words

[Direwrath]

2 hours ago, From dimension 1207 said:

But then again, since you brought it up, pib actually shoots for you. Saying pib requires skills, is like telling me, you are a very skilled soccer player, but every time you shoot the ball, there is a robot next to the net, who make sure you score.

 

So, since it took you a long time. I would like to see how you manage to 1 headshot kill another running player with a bow or tomahawk, or even a repeater, without using "pib". 

I honestly can do that with a bow without PIB but I am a lousy shot when I try to use it. Why? I have no idea, but I just cannot get the hang of painting the targets and for some reason it seems awkward on the Xbox controller to do so. Kind of like how auto aim throws me off a bit too, I like a smooth aim to fire ratio and when something slows me down like dead eye or targets another enemy instead of the one in my sights, it screws me up.

 

Lol, I know so many who just live by PIB but I'm one of the weirdos who cannot use it.

[ThaBirdCoot]

On 5/12/2021 at 5:41 PM, travilanche said:

I remember the good old days of RDR when if you shot someone...they died.

i remember your gt, you was with DWB back then... circleD trinity and them guys. good shootouts in hardcore gang matches no card and magic potion trash just overall good competition.

[travilanche]

On 5/13/2021 at 3:34 PM, ThaBirdCoot said:

i remember your gt, you was with DWB back then... circleD trinity and them guys. good shootouts in hardcore gang matches no card and magic potion trash just overall good competition.

Indeed I was. And those were really great times. I remember our blood feud with KSA...god we hated those guys. I miss my old clan mates. I still play with a couple of them Sometimes. But pretty much all of them hated rdr2 multiplayer from the very beginning and for good reason. They threw away everything that made the first game so great and replaced it with a bunch of fantasy RPG nonsense that doesn’t make any sense.