🏏 TO GRIEF OR NOT TO GRIEF, what exactly is it?

[Nyamber]

1 minute ago, Big Molio said:

Makes one wonder why people play “Grief Theft Auto Online” then.

Because solo sessions exist.

 

If they didn't, I'd have dropped this game the day Finance and Felony released.

[Lonely-Martin]

1 hour ago, Smokewood said:

Agreed - that's why I have an issue with the word griefing.

Griefing carries a negative stigma with it.....

 

So, I chose to focus on what is quantifiable. Cheating, glitching, exploits... these are the words that actually have a meaning. These are the subjects we should care about - not being butthurt because someone killed me in a pvp related game.

Of course griefing should be seen negatively, lol. The meaning of the word is to cause someone grief, wherever in life that comes from.

 

Regardless of what's considered grief is open for interpretation, but to knowingly cause someone some is nothing but negative. By your definition, you think cheating is griefing. So if someone cheats to cause you grief, how is that a positive?

31 minutes ago, Smokewood said:

Like i said, not possible in GTAO

Thanks, glad you finally realized it.

It's possible in any game. And as you said yourself above, cheating, glitching or exploits used are your definition of grief. The game is full of that sh*t. By your own standards, grief is rife!

 

Plus abusive messages are a form of grief. Any gane suffers that too, chat also of course. Many ways to grief in all games.

 

(And there really is no need to be so frosty dude. It's all just discussion and not all will see it your way, no matter how you tell us we do. Be fair).

[Big Molio]

2 minutes ago, Natsuki said:

Because solo sessions exist.

 

If they didn't, I'd have dropped this game the day Finance and Felony released.

Good for you.

 

The game’s designers differentiate between what they class as griefing and penalise players with Bad Sport points and other restrictions / sanctions, and what they consider legitimate play with rewards.

[Lonely-Martin]

2 minutes ago, Big Molio said:

Good for you.

 

The game’s designers differentiate between what they class as griefing and penalise players with Bad Sport points and other restrictions / sanctions, and what they consider legitimate play with rewards.

Yeah...

 

What a griefer we are saving our stocks, lol.

 

Had to, sorry. ✌

[Nyamber]

2 minutes ago, Lonely-Martin said:

The game’s designers differentiate between what they class as griefing

Good thing they aren't the ones who define what griefing is then.

 

Griefing is griefing. Just because they refuse to enforce against it, and even foster it doesn't change the fact that it is still g r i e f i n g.

 

Edit: No idea why this thinks I was quoting Martin, but this is aimed at Molio.

Edited June 17, 2019 by Natsuki

[Big Molio]

7 minutes ago, Lonely-Martin said:

Yeah...

 

What a griefer we are saving our stocks, lol.

 

Had to, sorry. ✌

That’s the only anomaly in my opinion.

 

You should be able to blow all armoured vehicles up with impunity.

 

In all reality though, you won’t get sent to bad sport for defending your stock at the frequency required to trigger the dodgy player / bad sport sequence. I suspect they have factored that in and consider it a fair trade off.

 

5 minutes ago, Natsuki said:

Good thing they aren't the ones who define what griefing is then.

Which is the definitive definition of griefing then, because there are many, and all likely derived from the opinion of players who feel they are on the sh*tty end of the stick, but that doesn’t make it an absolute.

Edited June 17, 2019 by Big Molio

[Talisman_83]

I was in a public solo lobby recently - or so I thought.

4 MC bikes, was on the way to get the last one when a 3 man heist crew landed in the city and promptly decided to blow up my last bike.

They then began a CEO crate sale.

So, I retrieved my Lazer, spawn killed them all and blew it up.

I then left them alone and went about my business. 

They started a 3 car I/E sale. I returned, blew them all up and continued spawn killing them. 2 of them pleaded for me to stop. Sorry, I'm beyond any peace offering at this point.

 

If you go after me, you'll rue the day.

I used to be a fully fledged cargo griefer / spawn trapper until.. I dunno, grew tired and decided to help defend low levels against the former me?

I still have my moments though.

 

Now, if what I produced is considered the act of a griefer, then I'm proud to be one.

Maybe I just like to fight back.

I do employ tryhard tactics though, but thats another story.

 

 

Edited June 17, 2019 by Talisman_83

[Big Molio]

Anybody who embarks on a supply or sale run in a public lobby knows the risks. The alerts are going to go out and the MC or Organisation are visible on the map. There are rewards for players who decide to act as the adversarial element to those crews.

 

If that doesn’t sit well with you as a game model, then you can either frig your machine and contrive a solo session or go and find something else to play. Some players seem to balk at those stark choices but that’s what they are.

[Lonely-Martin]

56 minutes ago, Big Molio said:

That’s the only anomaly in my opinion.

 

You should be able to blow all armoured vehicles up with impunity.

 

In all reality though, you won’t get sent to bad sport for defending your stock at the frequency required to trigger the dodgy player / bad sport sequence. I suspect they have factored that in and consider it a fair trade off.

I believe there's much to it, balance and planning is just a huge mess, lol. But alas, choice has always been my solution.

 

I was just being cheeky though to try and keep it lighter. The game is so flawed. Luckily I can do my thing still with the way they're pushing PvE and PvP together more and more.

 

f*ckers are killing the franchises for me though, can't get off the ground over the other side.

Edited June 17, 2019 by Lonely-Martin

[AdriiRozayXOXO]

43 minutes ago, Big Molio said:

Anybody who embarks on a supply or sale run in a public lobby knows the risks. The alerts are going to go out and the MC or Organisation are visible on the map. There are rewards for players who decide to act as the adversarial element to those crews.

 

If that doesn’t sit well with you as a game model, then you can either frig your machine and contrive a solo session or go and find something else to play. Some players seem to balk at those stark choices but that’s what they are.

That's why I don't consider repeatedly blowing up sales as 'griefing', but rather pvp. They wouldn't alert us unless they wanted us to blow it up or intercept the sell.

[Jenkiiii]

I think the best way to define griefing is to go to a worldwide and recognised source such as: https://www.merriam-webster.com/ and take it from there. There's little point using Wikipedia or other types of wikis because these are not standardised, but edited on a regular basis by multiple people. The wikis are guidelines, not standards.

 

Here goes then:

“griefing”

(The word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the search bar above.) !!!

 

This pretty much sums it up! If one of the world's best dictionaries can't define it, how can we? How we personally define "griefing" is nothing more than the opinion of our in-built dictionaries inside our heads.

 

However, the broader definition of griefing is:

 

 

bad behaviour
 

 

...and we're all guilty of that.

Edited June 17, 2019 by Jenkiiii

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

18 minutes ago, MissMurkina said:

That's why I don't consider repeatedly blowing up sales as 'griefing', but rather pvp. They wouldn't alert us unless they wanted us to blow it up or intercept the sell.

Have you ever wondered why they want you to blow up cargo in the first place?

 

It can't be just for "PvP" seeing how most encounters involving cargo are mostly curb stomps against sitting ducks instead of, you know, an actual, proper fight.

 

I mean, it's not like there's a ulterior motive for enabling such imbalance of power between players or anything, no sir.

 

/s

[KazzMajol]

i feel bad for LeslieFromTheShoIntimacy just trying to get a word in edgewise, not even really picking sides, and shamelessly getting spawn-killed out of the forum by the anti-griefing social justice crowd.   L M A O

[Jenkiiii]

27 minutes ago, KazzMajol said:

i feel bad for LeslieFromTheShoIntimacy just trying to get a word in edgewise, not even really picking sides, and shamelessly getting spawn-killed out of the forum by the anti-griefing social justice crowd.   L M A O

Here's an additional shout out to @LeslieFromTheShoIntimacy. I read your post and agreed with parts of it, disagreed with other parts of it. The problem stems from posting on a forum for the first time (in a while) and expecting everyone to agree with your summary. You then made the ultimate mistake of taking the bait, getting very defensive and drawing attention to yourself by essentially going off topic.

[LeslieFromTheShoIntimacy]

36 minutes ago, Jenkiiii said:

Here's an additional shout out to @LeslieFromTheShoIntimacy. I read your post and agreed with parts of it, disagreed with other parts of it. The problem stems from posting on a forum for the first time (in a while) and expecting everyone to agree with your summary. You then made the ultimate mistake of taking the bait, getting very defensive and drawing attention to yourself by essentially going off topic.

At least you read it. I feel like most didn’t even acutally read my post lol, but rather skimmed, selected what they wanted, and judged from there. If people actually read my post they’d know I don’t encourage what I percieve as griefing it’s just that at the same time I’m not bothered by other people if they so choose to do it.

 

I really didn’t expect to change anyone’s mind; as most people have (obviously) formed a rock solid opinion on this matter. Just wanted to make a point.  

 

I did make the mistake of taking the bait and feeding the troll. Lol mah badd..  I was overly defensive and for that I apologize, but I still stand by my post.

[Agent 14]

On 4/24/2019 at 2:17 PM, RyuNova said:

Being a "very naughty boy" for the sake of being a "very naughty boy".

When what the person loses is possibly millions and all you get is a couple thousand then you are a "very naughty boy".

 

Edited by Crokey - Don't circumvent the swear filters or you'll get a slap next time

Naughty Naughty boy rawr.

[HamwithCheese]

4 hours ago, MissMurkina said:

That's why I don't consider repeatedly blowing up sales as 'griefing', but rather pvp. They wouldn't alert us unless they wanted us to blow it up or intercept the sell.

For f*cks sake. The only reason they alert you in the first place is to give sales "difficulty" and increase the sales of shark cards. So even though the game "tells you to" it isnt even for the good of the game. "Hey you can be an asshole and help line our pockets." Does that not matter to anyone?

[kenmy13999]

5 hours ago, Jenkiiii said:

I think the best way to define griefing is to go to a worldwide and recognised source such as: https://www.merriam-webster.com/ and take it from there. There's little point using Wikipedia or other types of wikis because these are not standardised, but edited on a regular basis by multiple people. The wikis are guidelines, not standards.

 

Here goes then:

“griefing”

(The word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the search bar above.) !!!

 

This pretty much sums it up! If one of the world's best dictionaries can't define it, how can we? How we personally define "griefing" is nothing more than the opinion of our in-built dictionaries inside our heads.

 

However, the broader definition of griefing is:

  Hide contents

 

bad behaviour
 

 

...and we're all guilty of that.

So there's no need for this thread anymore? Btw, never heard of that page

[Big Molio]

1 hour ago, HamwithCheese said:

For f*cks sake. The only reason they alert you in the first place is to give sales "difficulty" and increase the sales of shark cards. So even though the game "tells you to" it isnt even for the good of the game. "Hey you can be an asshole and help line our pockets." Does that not matter to anyone?

There may be some truth in that, but I don’t give it as much weight as some do on here. I have never read a post on this forum from a player who admitted that he was so f*cked off with getting his stuff destroyed that he relented and bought a shark card instead. In fact, the opposite is true and most of you like to proudly declare how you have never bought one (....and never will!)

 

There are lots of ways to make money in this game, but the destruction of supplies / sales seems to be the activity that causes the most angst. This is because, in my opinion, there is a sense of entitlement surrounding the time it has taken to farm what is required to chase those larger payouts. Instead of mixing the game up a bit and doing a bit of everything, letting the money accrue that way, players are reading guides about how to make the quickest bucks, then becoming upset when that is impeded, aghast at the idea that this is part of the game ethos.

[RyuNova]

On 4/24/2019 at 7:17 PM, RyuNova said:

Being a "very naughty boy" for the sake of being a "very naughty boy".

When what the person loses is possibly millions and all you get is a couple thousand then you are a "very naughty boy".

 

Edited by Crokey - Don't circumvent the swear filters or you'll get a slap next time

Edited April 25 by Crokey
Don't circumvent the swear filters or you'll get a slap next time

 

Excuse me? I didn't circumvent the swear filter. I starred out the majority of the word exactly how the auto-filter does. If this can for this many pages without another Mod taking offence I can assume what I did was correct. My post was on the first page and unlike other places the Mods are very active here and multiple of them have seen it and not had an issue.

[HamwithCheese]

3 hours ago, Big Molio said:

I have never read a post on this forum from a player who admitted that he was so f*cked off with getting his stuff destroyed that he relented and bought a shark card instead. In fact, the opposite is true and most of you like to proudly declare how you have never bought one

This forum represents a small amout of people, and we're seen as the hardcore players too. Lots of people out there probably get discouraged and quit or give into the cards.

 

What, you think R* makes us jump through all hoop, redundant facilities, and slow ass grinding to make things "difficult"?

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

4 hours ago, Big Molio said:

There may be some truth in that, but I don’t give it as much weight as some do on here. I have never read a post on this forum from a player who admitted that he was so f*cked off with getting his stuff destroyed that he relented and bought a shark card instead. In fact, the opposite is true and most of you like to proudly declare how you have never bought one (....and never will!)

It doesn't work like that, no one says "sh*t, I had my sale destroyed, time to buy a Shark Card", it's way more subtle than that.

 

Most players who buy Shark Cards are those who don't have enough funds to buy some of the new content when an update drops, now why they don't have enough money? Because when they try to make some, R* snitches on them and the playerbase is more than willing to comply and stop them for a measly $2k, a pat in the back and a power trip.

 

4 hours ago, Big Molio said:

There are lots of ways to make money in this game, but the destruction of supplies / sales seems to be the activity that causes the most angst. This is because, in my opinion, there is a sense of entitlement surrounding the time it has taken to farm what is required to chase those larger payouts. Instead of mixing the game up a bit and doing a bit of everything, letting the money accrue that way, players are reading guides about how to make the quickest bucks, then becoming upset when that is impeded, aghast at the idea that this is part of the game ethos.

People wouldn't take having their cargo destroyed so personal if it didn't take a long time to acrue the goods, if it wasn't so easy for another player to erase hours of work for almost nothing and if the ingame prices were more fair. There's no such thing as "entitlement" (which is an overused word nowadays) to want to see your effort spent on something bear fruits instead of seeing it dissapear because of someone who just can't mind his own business.

[Big Molio]

1 hour ago, Voodoo-Hendrix said:

here's no such thing as "entitlement" (which is an overused word nowadays) to want to see your effort spent on something bear fruits instead of seeing it dissapear because of someone who just can't mind his own business.

This is the wrong game in which to expect other players to mind their own business.

 

2 hours ago, HamwithCheese said:

This forum represents a small amout of people, and we're seen as the hardcore players too. Lots of people out there probably get discouraged and quit or give into the cards.

 

What, you think R* makes us jump through all hoop, redundant facilities, and slow ass grinding to make things "difficult"?

Partly, but I also think that alongside the shark card thing, there is a need to try and maintain some longevity to the game as a persistent open world multiplayer game which, by nature, doesn't have an "end"

If everything was affordable and really easy to get, everybody would have everything, so then there would be little else to play for. The game revolves around the acquisition of money, and "stuff", and if that acquisition element becomes too easy, you just end up with bored players with no real goals. We have seen how fed up players are with the fact that there has been nothing new DLC wise for some time.

Edited June 18, 2019 by Big Molio

[AdriiRozayXOXO]

6 hours ago, HamwithCheese said:

For f*cks sake. The only reason they alert you in the first place is to give sales "difficulty" and increase the sales of shark cards. So even though the game "tells you to" it isnt even for the good of the game. "Hey you can be an asshole and help line our pockets." Does that not matter to anyone?

That doesn't matter, it doesn't need to be 'for the good' of the game. People will still play it regardless and it must not be that big of a deal if the same people getting their cargo destroyed keep playing the game. At the end of the day it's still a part of Online and that's what they intended for players to do, why else would they give money and ammo for destroying cargo if it wasn't intended to be destroyed in the first place??

 

And it's actually better to give sales 'difficulty' because there's a better sense of 'reward' for surviving a delivery in a public session. If there was no 'challenge' the missions would be boring.

[Smokewood]

10 hours ago, HamwithCheese said:

For f*cks sake. The only reason they alert you in the first place is to give sales "difficulty" and increase the sales of shark cards. 

Nonsense - no one losses a shipment and then go buys a shark card because of it....i have lost countless shipments and have only bought 2 shark cards total. I bought them to support the game more than anything.

[Agent 14]

6 hours ago, RyuNova said:

 

Excuse me? I didn't circumvent the swear filter. I starred out the majority of the word exactly how the auto-filter does. If this can for this many pages without another Mod taking offence I can assume what I did was correct. My post was on the first page and unlike other places the Mods are very active here and multiple of them have seen it and not had an issue.

And he say you will get slapped as well. Uh oh 

 

 

Also he only marked you.. every other swear words from every other post stayed the same.. lol what you do to piss him off.

Edited June 18, 2019 by Agent 14

[Big Molio]

1 hour ago, Smokewood said:

Nonsense - no one losses a shipment and then go buys a shark card because of it....i have lost countless shipments and have only bought 2 shark cards total. I bought them to support the game more than anything.

I've bought quite a few, but that's because I'm a lazy f*cker who can't be bothered running any of the businesses.

 

 

[HamwithCheese]

5 hours ago, MissMurkina said:

And it's actually better to give sales 'difficulty' because there's a better sense of 'reward' for surviving a delivery in a public session. If there was no 'challenge' the missions would be boring.

And thats totally up to you to decide? Who in their right mind plays GTA for a challenge? Nothing about this game presents a challenge, its a casuals paradise. What you're really saying is that r* doesnt know how to make a truly fun game.

2 hours ago, Smokewood said:

Nonsense - no one losses a shipment and then go buys a shark card because of it....i have lost countless shipments and have only bought 2 shark cards total. I bought them to support the game more than anything.

And everyone is you correct? Am I you? Nonsense, it's a slow grind, made slower by you. Why else has this game made hundreds of millions, possibly billions off of sharkcards (supposedly they've made 500 million last year), when we have all these money making techniques? 

6 hours ago, Big Molio said:

If everything was affordable and really easy to get, everybody would have everything, so then there would be little else to play for

Um, if the game were fun, that would be a reason to play. If the only reason to play is chase invisible money rather than having a good time, then there is something wrong with your game.

[Skullpanda3968]

While I understand the argument of "it's just a game, it's not that serious", earning money is already hard enough, but when you have people killing you repeatedly just for the sake of killing them (and no, just because you can, doesn't mean you should) Especially lower levels or new players.  Not that people would care, but I do feel that it is just another way for R* to have an influx of shark cards.  If R* actually cared about its player base, they'd try and do something about it.  Sure, players have the choice to join solo sessions or go to a trusted session w/friends, but what happens when a new player is continuously killed while trying to get cargo? If they have the funds, of course they'll go and buy a shark card since it's the easiest way to get money and retaliate against griefers.  Basically: 

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by Jacebuts24

[Smokewood]

37 minutes ago, HamwithCheese said:

And thats totally up to you to decide? Who in their right mind plays GTA for a challenge? Nothing about this game presents a challenge, its a casuals paradise. What you're really saying is that r* doesnt know how to make a truly fun game.

And everyone is you correct? Am I you? Nonsense, it's a slow grind, made slower by you. Why else has this game made hundreds of millions, possibly billions off of sharkcards (supposedly they've made 500 million last year), when we have all these money making techniques? 

Um, if the game were fun, that would be a reason to play. If the only reason to play is chase invisible money rather than having a good time, then there is something wrong with your game.

Obviously you don't like GTAO and want to change it to meet your desires...