Online BETA

[Jason]

Just now, Hetraet said:

Still...they made billions from the sales of the game, why can't they just pay off for a continued support of that game then? 

Publicly traded company. In an ideal world your scenario would play out but it is what it is.

 

Just now, Hetraet said:

he even thinks they are under monetizing us like wtf.

Define "us". His comments were about Take-Two's other games, not what Rockstar were doing.

 

1 minute ago, Hetraet said:

You pretty much sound like Strauss Zeldick...

Never said Rockstar or Take-Two are absolutely in the right, I'm looking at it from all angles and not just the "f*ck Rockstar!" angle. Dunno about you but if I enjoy a game a lot then I'm happy to support the devs so they can continue to make more content for that game. There's a reason I've spent maybe 20 quid total on Rockstar's microtransactions over 5+ years.

[Ghoffman9]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Point me to GTA IV's online content updates such as new vehicles, clothes, modes, businesses etc years after release.

 

Comparing online gaming from last gen to this gen is completely useless as it's changed a lot. Developers would support their online modes for a few months then dump it and move onto their next game but these days they support their games for years. That content can't be made without on-going support from players. This isn't something developers accounted for by the way, players sticking with games for years was something players naturally began to do and developers adapted to it, which is why we saw some studios scramble to get their versions of these on-going games out there.

 

So while you, like my self, may have been around last gen for online games like IV, it looks like you've not been around for online gaming at all this gen. Welcome to 2019 my dood.

Simple you release DLC packs that add additional content. You pay the fee, you get access to the DLC.

There are two reasons why they don't do this anymore.

1. They cannot charge ridiculous prices for the content like they been doing with their micro-transaction schemes. Companies want to make all of the money, and they could not do that with DLC packs/expansions.

If you think ten dollars for example is worth 25 gold bars when many items cost half that or even most of it, then you're an idiot. Customizing a single gun can go up to 20+ gold for some colors.

2. They actually gotta put the work in and make good content. They cannot half-ass it or otherwise no one will make the purchase.

 

Lets look at the content Rockstar for example been making for the most part these past 5 years. Most of it is vehicles, adversary modes, and re-skinned free roam business. All of which is cheap and quick to produce. For all the billions they made from Gta Online, all we ever gotten was low effort garbage. They put in the bare minimum effort and expect maximum profit. We only ever got two try and true updates with actual content for you to do, Heists, and Doomsday Heists. That was it. That would equate to about two DLC packs using the old method. That sure looks like lots of support they gave the game over the years. They kept adding things for you to buy but barely anything to do. I cannot emphasize this enough.

Through the old system of Expansion Packs/DLC this would have never worked, cause people want more things to do. Meaning they would not lay down any money for this.

It works with this new system thanks to whales who got more money than common sense and lack any sense of control. Companies monetization schemes target these whales and to the detriment of everyone else, as long as the whales kept giving them money then they could give two sh*ts what everyone thought because they're getting their money from the whales.

 

Lastly these micro-transaction schemes keep the game from reaching its full potential. To make their micro-transactions a more preferable choice, they actively sabotage their own game by providing nothing but boring, menial tasks to which you must repeat and grind over and over and over to make any substantial progress. Through the old system with DLC Expansions/Packs they have to provide you with good content that is very entertaining to play for as long as possible. If its sh*tty, boring, repetitive content then people would pass up on it, meaning the corporation gets no money.

[Jason]

12 minutes ago, Ghoffman9 said:

Simple you release DLC packs that add additional content. You pay the fee, you get access to the DLC.

The reason that a lot of developers moved away from this is because it carves up the playerbase. You can create a huge mess with that form of DLC like say: If player doesn't own content pack 1 they can't play with people who do. If player owns content pack 2 they can't play with people who own pack 1. If player owns content pack 2 and 3 they can't play with someone who owns content pack 1 and 2, etc etc. This is 100% the reason developers started to switch to free content with microtransactions.

 

12 minutes ago, Ghoffman9 said:

Lets look at the content Rockstar for example been making for the most part these past 5 years. Most of it is vehicles, adversary modes, and re-skinned free roam business. All of which is cheap and quick to produce. For all the billions they made from Gta Online, all we ever gotten was low effort garbage. They put in the bare minimum effort and expect maximum profit. We only ever got two try and true updates with actual content for you to do, Heists, and Doomsday Heists. That was it. That would equate to about two DLC packs using the old method. That sure looks like lots of support they gave the game over the years. They kept adding things for you to buy but barely anything to do. I cannot emphasize this enough.

Through the old system of Expansion Packs/DLC this would have never worked, cause people want more things to do. Meaning they would not lay down any money for this.

It works with this new system thanks to whales who got more money than common sense and lack any sense of control. Companies monetization schemes target these whales and to the detriment of everyone else, as long as the whales kept giving them money then they could give two sh*ts what everyone thought because they're getting their money from the whales.

 

Lastly these micro-transaction schemes keep the game from reaching its full potential. To make their micro-transactions a more preferable choice, they actively sabotage their own game by providing nothing but boring, menial tasks to which you must repeat and grind over and over and over to make any substantial progress. Through the old system with DLC Expansions/Packs they have to provide you with good content that is very entertaining to play for as long as possible. If its sh*tty, boring, repetitive content then people would pass up on it, meaning the corporation gets no money.

I completely and wholeheartedly agree with you on all of this. Originally the idea was that we'd get good, free quality content and we'd support the devs by buying good cosmetic DLC. Unfortunately we were all a bit naive or stupid or something because what's actually happened is we got bombarded with skins and cosmetics while we get thrown sh*tty pieces of hastily made, low budget content every few months. Then as an extra layer of sh*te on top we also got lootboxes which developers decided to replace the entire progression model with. Gone are the days of leveling up giving you cool stuff, now you get a sh*tty lootbox.

 

RedDagger did a great write up about this whole problem over in this thread a while back now. Lotta good discussion about the topic in there.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Jason

[Ghoffman9]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

The reason that a lot of developers moved away from this is because it carves up the playerbase. You can create a huge mess with that form of DLC like say: If player doesn't own content pack 1 they can't play with people who do. If player owns content pack 2 they can't play with people who own pack 1. If player owns content pack 2 and 3 they can't play with someone who owns content pack 1 and 2, etc etc. This is 100% the reason developers started to switch to free content with microtransactions.

 

I completely and wholeheartedly agree with you on all of this. Originally the idea was that we'd get good, free quality content and we'd support the devs by buying good cosmetic DLC. Unfortunately we were all a bit naive or stupid or something because what's actually happened is we got bombarded with skins and cosmetics while we get thrown sh*tty pieces of hastily made, low budget content every few months. Then as an extra layer of sh*te on top we also got lootboxes which developers decided to replace the entire progression model with. Gone are the days of leveling up giving you cool stuff, now you get a sh*tty lootbox.

Well if people were willing to shell out billions for garbage content via shark cards, I think they will have no problem paying for a DLC Pack/Expansion that gives you actual good content that is fun to play for more than a few hours. Companies hated them because they take more time, more effort, and more money. It being more expensive is what they hate the most. Why do you think Rockstar dropped single player support for Gta 5 despite their promises?

They cannot give you entertaining content, because if you are progressing through the game, and having fun doing it, that means you would be less inclined to spend money on micro-transactions. This is a clear conflict of interest. A paradox. They have everything to gain by giving sh*tty content. Its cheaper, quicker, and you are more inclined to buy micro-transactions because the content is so boring that you want to skip it.

[Hetraet]

In conclusion all this could be put into 2 single words : f*ck Rockstar

[Jason]

5 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

In conclusion all this could be put into 2 single words : f*ck Rockstar

f*ck modern online game is what I'd say tbh. It's just a sh*tshow no matter what developer you're talking about.

[MVP]

Well microtransactions as a whole could hopefully be stopping altogether.

 

https://kotaku.com/u-s-senator-introduces-bill-to-ban-loot-boxes-and-pay-1834612226/

 

[Amy Vinewood]

20 hours ago, éX-Driver said:

Nobody bought the bloody thing, what did you expect? Pretty much every PSVita game got a PS3/4 remaster, and they’ve basically swept its existence under the rug. I don’t even think they’re making them anymore. I’ve not seen a console flop as hard as the Vita since the Saturn.

The Vita Sold around 10 - 15 million units, sure - that's not a lot comparing it to other popular consoles. But it was and still is quite popular in Japan.
And no, they don't make it anymore, production ceased in march of this year. What the Vita needed was more games, and for Sony not to give up on it.
In comparison, it's first generation sister, the PsP - sold quite a few more.. 76.4 million to be exact.

[Jason]

9 hours ago, MostWantedMVP said:

Well microtransactions as a whole could hopefully be stopping altogether.

 

https://kotaku.com/u-s-senator-introduces-bill-to-ban-loot-boxes-and-pay-1834612226/

Not as a whole. Lootboxes (gambling) and P2W are what that bill is trying to stop and while lootboxes are straightforward to ban P2W can be very tricky to define because P2W comes in many forms. Cosmetic mtx will be fine.

 

The bill is still a big if though, but if it did pass holy sh*t would it have consequences. EA and Fifa would be mega f*cked.

[Happy Hunter]

34 minutes ago, Jason said:

Not as a whole. Lootboxes (gambling) and P2W are what that bill is trying to stop and while lootboxes are straightforward to ban P2W can be very tricky to define because P2W comes in many forms. Cosmetic mtx will be fine.

 

The bill is still a big if though, but if it did pass holy sh*t would it have consequences. EA and Fifa would be mega f*cked.

I wouldn't mind if they got Rockstar to get rid of the orbital cannon in GTA.

[ALifeOfMisery]

4 hours ago, Jason said:

P2W can be very tricky to define because P2W comes in many forms.

This is why I don't believe that such a bill would have much of an impact, if any, on GTAO and RDO.

 

If this bill, or a version of it, passed, I'm almost certain R* could and would argue that although microtransactions can lead to players having a situational advantage  (new GTAO player buys a Shark Card and uses the GTA$ to buy a Lazer, for example), R* would ultimately argue that there is no way to "win" in GTAO, that there is no clearly defined end game that you could pay to get towards.

 

RDO would be even more difficult to argue against. R* could argue that even though players can buy Gold, items are level locked, and although some level locks can be bypassed by paying more gold, some items, such as horses, have hard level locks that can't be bypassed, and really powerful items such as Ability Cards can't be bought with gold.

 

I'm not excusing the practices of R*, I've let my distain for the effect of microtransactions, on GTAO especially, be known on many occasions. But, I'm not confident that a solid case for Shark Cards and Gold Bars being pay to win could be argued.

 

4 hours ago, Jason said:

EA and Fifa would be mega f*cked.

I agree, *in my best cockney accent* proper f*cked. Along with 2K sporting titles such as the NBA 2K titles. Good. FUT is cancerous, especially with FIFA being an annual title. The way FUT works should never have been allowed in the first place.

Edited May 9, 2019 by ALifeOfMisery

[Hetraet]

The paywall locked dlc could work exactly like it did with rdr multiplayer, if you haven't bought the expansion with tomahawk it was your bad, you could still play with people who bought it though. There was even a mention of this by R* in the loading screen. Something along the lines of show those who don't have it who's the boss. That could encourage people to buy the expansion pack. The only reason why this business practice is not run by R* anymore is just because they are greedy bastards who get away with those prices for almost no content at all. People are dumb enough to support their sh*tty content which they spent a minimum time on. This is ultra disappointing because R* had a reputation like no other studio and it's now getting ruined by their hunger for our wallets. Just in the span of like 4 years their reputation is on the same level as EA if not worse. I'd actually even say that ubisoft are way better than R* in many ways by now. R* is just f*cking gone, they got destroyed by greed. 

[Hetraet]

I also modded all my money on gta online and very soon realized that everything was just not worth it, ofc you had the expensive condo, all the businesses and sh*t but what was it for really when I can't have any fun at all with it? Like I've got literally everything, spent like a billion bucks on that and I just can't enjoy it. Not everything they put out was bad... But was it worth of like 5000 dollars or more that I would have to pay by shark cards? Heck no. I don't even feel a bit of guilt for modding the money. R* can suck my d I ain't supporting this BS. It's just so bad that they are charging such a horrible price for so little content. 

[Jason]

42 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

The paywall locked dlc could work exactly like it did with rdr multiplayer, if you haven't bought the expansion with tomahawk it was your bad, you could still play with people who bought it though.

That works if it's a weapon, but what if it's missions or some other form of playable content? If only people with the DLC can play it suddenly the pool of possible players is a lot smaller than it was before. There are some possible solutions to it, I think it was the Payday games that made it so only the host needed the DLC to play but people who didn't own the DLC didn't get the DLC rewards or something along those lines. So it's possible, with limitations.

 

It's the same reason FPS games dropped the season pass model and map packs, servers or playlists that have the DLC maps become empty because the bulk of the players are playing playing non-DLC maps.

 

You absolutely can do microtransactions in a good way and still release good free content, microtransactions aint an excuse for releasing sh*tty content.

[Dr.Rosenthal]

28 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

I also modded all my money on gta online and very soon realized that everything was just not worth it, ofc you had the expensive condo, all the businesses and sh*t but what was it for really when I can't have any fun at all with it? Like I've got literally everything, spent like a billion bucks on that and I just can't enjoy it. 

 

So you enjoy the game just as much, owning everything, as you would if you owned nothing? I don’t buy that. I enjoy it a whole lot more with all the expensive toys I’ve bought. Sure, a new plane or a new helicopter doesn’t provide new ”content” in the terms of a new playable mission - but they provide new gameplay which is worth plenty in my opinion.

 

To some people the only content worth paying for is Heists and Missions, stuff with cutscenes and the like. But to me, I rarely play the Heists, I’ve greatly enjoyed the free roam businesses, the thrill of stealing I/E cars in busy sessions etc. Those were great additions to the game, in my opinion. Grindy, yes, but they also provided so much more enjoyment for me than a Heist does - that, when I’ve finished it, I usually put on the shelf and don’t look back at.

 

39 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

The paywall locked dlc could work exactly like it did with rdr multiplayer, if you haven't bought the expansion with tomahawk it was your bad, you could still play with people who bought it though. There was even a mention of this by R* in the loading screen. Something along the lines of show those who don't have it who's the boss. That could encourage people to buy the expansion pack.

 

I don’t understand how you fail to see that such a practice would be way worse than what we currently have? That would literally force people to pay for more powerful items. Not a good solution at all imo. Plus, in some cases it’s troublesome for gameplay if one player owns a DLC and another doesn’t. What if it changes the maps infrastructure for example? Having, say, 10 different DLC’s released all owned in different numbers by players would be a developmental nightmare.

 

I’m really not a proponent to R*’s practices, in many cases I think they’ve crippled the game(s) with their focus on MTX. At the minute, I’m mostly disgusted by the fact that they’ve kept the Gold store open since, what, day 30 of the Online Beta, and that it’s still in Beta after 6 months - Gold store still being open though the game is at times literally unplayable and despite all this we don’t receive regular updates to improve the gameplay! Not even that, we don’t receive anything but mums the word and $100.

 

And also, I’ll never understand how R* could implement the MC instaspawn Oppressor with unbeatable missile-tracking overnight without seemingly once questioning that decision from a balancing & gameplay perspective. It broke pretty much every other vehicle in the game. But that’s another story.

[CMCSAVAGE]

34 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

I also modded all my money on gta online and very soon realized that everything was just not worth it, ofc you had the expensive condo, all the businesses and sh*t but what was it for really when I can't have any fun at all with it? Like I've got literally everything, spent like a billion bucks on that and I just can't enjoy it. Not everything they put out was bad... But was it worth of like 5000 dollars or more that I would have to pay by shark cards? Heck no. I don't even feel a bit of guilt for modding the money. R* can suck my d I ain't supporting this BS. It's just so bad that they are charging such a horrible price for so little content. 

 

You're something else lol. So all the sh*t that you bought with illegitimate money isn't fun and you can't enjoy it? Why the fk should it be when you don't need or ever needed it for it's intended purpose, to make money. I read some stupid sh*t on these forums, but this takes the cake.

[Hetraet]

5 minutes ago, CMCSAVAGE said:

 

You're something else lol. So all the sh*t that you bought with illegitimate money isn't fun and you can't enjoy it? Why the fk should it be when you don't need or ever needed it for it's intended purpose, to make money. I read some stupid sh*t on these forums, but this takes the cake.

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying, ofc there are some good purchases but it isn't really worth that much. I don't enjoy the money ''making'' dlc's in gta cuz it's just grindy and hard to even stay in profit. And you can have just as much fun with for example Bati 811 (best purchases ever) and that neony bike that costs like 3 mil. And I do not enjoy pvp in gta that's why almost all of the expensive stuff is worthless for me. You're probably just triggered so much because you bought sh*t load of shark cards and are starting to regret it. And the only argument you've got is that we're supposed to make money and that's the whole point of gta. You're not right, we can do whatever we want and buy whatever we want but the game just forces us to pay more and more to be the "wealthiest" and "indestructible" gaylord. I'm not into that. You might be but I don't see making the money fun when the process of making money is just a chore and not fun in this game. 

[Dr.Rosenthal]

@Hetraet out of curiosity, how would you prefer the ladder of progression to be like?

[CMCSAVAGE]

19 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying, You're probably just triggered so much because you bought sh*t load of shark cards and are starting to regret it. And the only argument you've got is that we're supposed to make money and that's the whole point of gta. You're not right, we can do whatever we want and buy whatever we want 

 

You've only proven my point. Of course you're not going to enjoy anything you bought if you don't use it, and apparently you never needed to use it. And I'm not triggered at all and have never bought a shark card. 

 

I didn't say making money was the point of GTAO, I said it was the purpose of the businesses. Sure you can do and buy whatever you want, I didn't say anything to the contrary.

 

 

 

 

[Hetraet]

2 minutes ago, CMCSAVAGE said:

 

You've only proven my point. Of course you're not going to enjoy anything you bought if you don't use it, and apparently you never needed to use it. And I'm not triggered at all and have never bought a shark card. 

 

I didn't say making money was the point of GTAO, I said it was the purpose of the businesses. Sure you can do and buy whatever you want, I didn't say anything to the contrary.

 

 

 

 

You're wrong... I actually used all of the businesses I bought, stole all my supplies (missions) and played all of the bonus missions they provide, the problem is that by my subjective opinion they are just not as fun. Good for you if you enjoy this capitalistic chore to make money simulator, but for me...idk I'm kinda that cunt that just stunts on bmx and takes it as the most fun thing to do, it's all subjective. The problem is, when I get home and want to play a game I don't want to continue doing chores, I wanna do something fun. Chores don't equal fun to me and that's basically everything these businesses are. Pvp sux and I just don't get as much satisfaction from blowing someone up by some overpowered monstrosity as I get when I show them some real skill by popping their head with SNS pistol. The Pvp these days is sadly all lock on missiles on flying broomsticks and I'm not into that at all

[Hetraet]

25 minutes ago, Dr.Rosenthal said:

@Hetraet out of curiosity, how would you prefer the ladder of progression to be like?

Something like it was in rdr multiplayer - higher lvl = more items to use and have and more missions to unlock. For example I really liked how you didn't have to buy anything in rdr multiplayer, it all came with your experience in the game. When someone wanted an explosive rifle it wasn't like today that you just buy it for cash you can buy. You needed to shoot through a hideout first. You unlocked more visual items by your progress and your actions, then there were expansion packs only obtainable by money which I was perfectly fine with. 

Edited May 9, 2019 by Hetraet

[CMCSAVAGE]

7 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

You're wrong... I actually used all of the businesses I bought, stole all my supplies (missions) and played all of the bonus missions they provide, the problem is that by my subjective opinion they are just not as fun. Good for you if you enjoy this capitalistic chore to make money simulator

 

I stand corrected then. You kinda made it sound like you just bought a bunch of crap you didn't use. And no I don't enjoy it either. I have all the businesses and don't use any of them except when it's 2x bunker sales. Spending 75k for 345k in profit is too easy to pass up. The only useful thing they're good for is the passive Nightclub income.

[CMCSAVAGE]

10 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

Something like it was in rdr multiplayer - higher lvl = more items to use and have and more missions to unlock. For example I really liked how you didn't have to buy anything in rdr multiplayer, it all came with your experience in the game. When someone wanted an explosive rifle it wasn't like today that you just buy it for cash

 

We sorta have that now, although it's structured differently. You have to be in the 90's to unlock the pamphlets for explosive ammo and dynamite arrows. Oh, except for when R* lowered the unlock for them down to rank 60 that week. What a bonehead move that was.

[TyrionV]

If they were just copying everything over from GTAO they would have done so already if it’s thats simple. 

 

My take on it is that they are doing things differently which means they’ve got to build it from scratch which takes longer. 

 

Not great that that it’s taking so long but I’ll bet it will be worth it. 

[Hetraet]

1 minute ago, TyrionV said:

If they were just copying everything over from GTAO they would have done so already if it’s thats simple. 

 

My take on it is that they are doing things differently which means they’ve got to build it from scratch which takes longer. 

 

Not great that that it’s taking so long but I’ll bet it will be worth it. 

they were doing things from scratch too when GTAO released but atleast the foundation was already pretty solid. RDO is just a broken, empty mess from the start and if they don't dramatically change the way of this game, it'll only get worse. For start they should implement the most requested features that they've been ignoring so far, get rid off those stupid magic cards and fix the economy (grinding for a hat...really?) Also GTAO had much more content and stuff to do on the launch...RDO 6 months after release and the only real thing added is the gold store...pathetic

[wehweh01]

6 minutes ago, Hetraet said:

they were doing things from scratch too when GTAO released but atleast the foundation was already pretty solid. RDO is just a broken, empty mess from the start and if they don't dramatically change the way of this game, it'll only get worse. For start they should implement the most requested features that they've been ignoring so far, get rid off those stupid magic cards and fix the economy (grinding for a hat...really?) Also GTAO had much more content and stuff to do on the launch...RDO 6 months after release and the only real thing added is the gold store...pathetic

The sad thing is pretty much everything you described is never going away. The time based mission system is what kills a lot of the joy from playing the game to me. Sure there's numerous bugs but it seems to further Rockstar's monetization. They hold you back from putting in serious effort to get missions done fast. This whole time based crap thing came from GTA Online to begin with. I remember when people would upload the fastest ways to complete each mission when the payouts were the same even if you finished in 1-2 minutes. Now all that info is irrelevant since now you need to run a mission at the very least up to 10 to 15 minutes to expect a decent payout. 

 

Robberies and other ways to make  a quick buck will be ideal for decent cash but I'm willing to bet it'll be just like GTA Online where you'll be forced to go a certain path that'll definitely take you 20-30 minutes to complete. If your Robbery members die. Mission failed. If you think outside the box. Mission fail. Piss your pants? Mission fail. Super tired of this weak game design yet there's certain aspects of Red Dead Online that keep me coming back. I hope I'm wrong about all this. I'd like to think Rockstar is ready to change.

[Ghoffman9]

13 hours ago, Jason said:

That works if it's a weapon, but what if it's missions or some other form of playable content? If only people with the DLC can play it suddenly the pool of possible players is a lot smaller than it was before. There are some possible solutions to it, I think it was the Payday games that made it so only the host needed the DLC to play but people who didn't own the DLC didn't get the DLC rewards or something along those lines. So it's possible, with limitations.

 

It's the same reason FPS games dropped the season pass model and map packs, servers or playlists that have the DLC maps become empty because the bulk of the players are playing playing non-DLC maps.

 

You absolutely can do microtransactions in a good way and still release good free content, microtransactions aint an excuse for releasing sh*tty content.

Its impossible to split the GTAO/RDO community because they're not like FPS games like Call of Duty or Battlefield. Their DLC consists primarily of new maps. GTAO/RDO however has one map and will only ever have one map. While some missions may be locked off, you still got the same playground you all play on during free roam and not on mission. Those missions of which can only be done with a maximum of four players at a time. Such Expansions/Packs should be affordable, between 10 - 20 dollars is my guess they would place it at. This harkens back to the point I made in a previous post, they would be making a hell of a lot less charging 15 - 20 dollars per person because they can no longer make the kind of money they could through their micro-transaction system.

 

No more would they be able to charge obscene amounts of money through the use of value obfuscation (the reason why they use premium currency among other methods) to try and trick consumers into paying for content WAY beyond what its actually worth. Something that whales always do in their pursuit of instant gratification. Cannot lie but I harbor a bit of a hatred for them most of the time, they're a large reason this is happening as well. I read stories about whales spending as much as thousands of dollars on them, and it sickens me to the core. Course I do not put the blame entirely on them, but primarily on the corporations as well who are using psychologically manipulative tactics against these people who struggle to control their impulses.

 

The micro-transaction system is the direct cause behind these companies trying to maintain growth that in fact is unsustainable. The micro-transaction system has caused untold damage to the gaming industry. It indulges gluttonous corporations who don't know when to quits and keep trying to take more and more from consumers. The only thing that would stop it is either the industry suffering its second crash in history, or government steps in and forces them to stop. Cause these companies sure as sh*t won't stop on their own. EA even tried to fight the Belgian government from banning lootboxes. That is how unwilling they are to change.

 

I prefer the governments stepping in over a video game crash. Cause if there was a second industry crash, then those at the bottom, the white collar developers and so on would be hurt the most by this. While the pieces of sh*t that are truly behind this will be well off financially and just casually stroll off whistling a tune. Those garbage humans would get away without suffering one bit.

Edited May 10, 2019 by Ghoffman9

[Jason]

2 hours ago, Ghoffman9 said:

Its impossible to split the GTAO/RDO community because they're not like FPS games like Call of Duty or Battlefield. Their DLC consists primarily of new maps. GTAO/RDO however has one map and will only ever have one map.

In regards to the rest of your post I agree, but on this point in particular you're really not seeing the full picture.

 

Basically, imagine contact missions in GTAO, or heists, or story missions in RDO, or maybe PvP modes, imagine they're all premium DLC right? The matchmaking pool for that content would (potentially) be carved up by premium add-ons.

 

Even in free roam there's potential issues, like say what do you do if you're in the same session as somebody with the DLC? First of all you'd need to make every player download the DLC regardless of if they own it or not, which isn't an ideal scenario as you're filling up harddrive space for content they don't own, but there are games that do it and some even do things like offering 1 free bit of DLC if you download it. But say the Biker DLC in GTAO, assume that's premium content, what happens when someone is doing that content in the same session as you? Can they still interact with the DLC owner? Can the person who owns the DLC invite them to help their crew?

 

There's ways they can make it work, other games have done it, so I'm not saying they couldn't do it but it's not as simple as you might think. The situation is far more complicated than it would be in a Call of Duty or Battlefield to be honest.

[Ghoffman9]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

In regards to the rest of your post I agree, but on this point in particular you're really not seeing the full picture.

 

Basically, imagine contact missions in GTAO, or heists, or story missions in RDO, or maybe PvP modes, imagine they're all premium DLC right? The matchmaking pool for that content would (potentially) be carved up by premium add-ons.

 

Even in free roam there's potential issues, like say what do you do if you're in the same session as somebody with the DLC? First of all you'd need to make every player download the DLC regardless of if they own it or not, which isn't an ideal scenario as you're filling up harddrive space for content they don't own, but there are games that do it and some even do things like offering 1 free bit of DLC if you download it. But say the Biker DLC in GTAO, assume that's premium content, what happens when someone is doing that content in the same session as you? Can they still interact with the DLC owner? Can the person who owns the DLC invite them to help their crew?

 

There's ways they can make it work, other games have done it, so I'm not saying they couldn't do it but it's not as simple as you might think. The situation is far more complicated than it would be in a Call of Duty or Battlefield to be honest.

Well we are already in that situation. A fresh new rank 1 can enter and have none of the businesses, but he still had to have the data for those updates downloaded anyway, and they still encounter players who have the associated content. Despite being new they encounter players who own all the content as well anyway. A nice series to watch is one by the Youtuber Sonny Evans who is currently making such an experience showing what its like for a fresh new player entering GTAO in 2019.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iXE259RpJM

 

They can be employed by those who own a certain business but don't own it themselves. They can also attempt to disrupt resupplies and sales just the same, like how a rank 1 character could try already and still be rewarded despite not having the associated business. Like if you're doing a Gunrunning sale right now, a fresh rank 1 does have the option to try and disrupt it. I am sure all of us been attacked by lowbies before who did not have the associated business.

What you speak of is already possible and always happening under the current system right now.

 

You may not have bought the Gunrunning DLC for example but you can enjoy the content and receive money if you're working for a CEO/President. You just cannot become a CEO/President yourself.

Contact missions is base level content you receive upon playing, it comes with the game and everyone has it. Lowriders, Heists, and Doomsday Heists were about all the PvE content we received. They'd be the only exception.

[Jason]

8 hours ago, Ghoffman9 said:

Well we are already in that situation. A fresh new rank 1 can enter and have none of the businesses, but he still had to have the data for those updates downloaded anyway, and they still encounter players who have the associated content.

We're not already in that situation because the content is free in GTAO. If it wasn't free then that changes.

 

Like I said there are things they could do to avoid splitting the playerbase, some of your suggestions would work fine, but GTAO in it's current state isn't a clear cut example of how it could be done. It's not as simple as flicking on a switch, missions like heists, lowriders and things like the new contact missions would all be hit pretty hard.