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Bakkerbaard

Ability Cards Are Crap

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tonko
3 hours ago, SuperJude™ said:

I can only imagine what they'll add in the future. The possibilities are endless. Why not a Faster than Lightning card that allows you superspeed for a limited time? Harder than Steel which makes you invulnerable? A card where whatever damage inflicted on you actually damages the person shooting?

Infinite Dead Eye card would be cool. Or infinite ammo card.

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Foxwolfe

A card that increases the lasso range, imagine lasso sniping.

 

Or maybe a card that lets me swing people around while lassoed and then throw them into another state.

 

That sounds like fun.

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ALifeOfMisery
1 hour ago, tonko said:

Infinite Dead Eye card would be cool. Or infinite ammo card.

I'd like an XP boost card. Has zero effect on combat, but T1 gives 10% boost, T2 25% & T3 50% on all player, NPC and animal kills.

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Bakkerbaard
On 3/20/2019 at 9:57 AM, ALifeOfMisery said:

I'd like an XP boost card. Has zero effect on combat, but T1 gives 10% boost, T2 25% & T3 50% on all player, NPC and animal kills.

That would be the awesomestest, but we'd better focus on things more likely, like extraterrestrial contact. Or maybe one of those Japanese sex ghosts that shows up in your sleep.

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SuperJude™

I must say things like the repetitive actions of looting and skinning and crafting and managing your cores can be draining but OK sure fine why not. 

 

But Ability Cards are a crap addition they aren't getting rid of that probably drive more players AWAY than they keep.

 

Not directly, but I'll explain.

 

Sooooo some kid was having a tough time. I had spawned in near my camp, but there was action close enough to hear over the mic. The gist was this kid thought there was rampant cheating going on. He was fighting two other guys and couldn't seem to kill him.

 

The tell was "I just shot you in the head and YOUR HAT FELL OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

I hopped on the mic to explain that you are lower level and have not unlocked the abilities they have. So you're trying to fight people that have an anti Headshot ability, an ability that makes you miss DIRECT SHOTS (and kills Auto Aim but since I free aim it's rather useless against me, but I digress)...an ability that makes them stronger the closer to death they get, etc.

 

Just COMPLETELY unfair to a low level player without full knowledge of Ability Cards.

 

Which really aren't explained very well.

 

So here we go, a company that comes out with some of the dumbest Anti Griefing measures ever, caving to a vocal minority but codes it RIGHT INTO THE GAME WITH ABILITY CARDS!

 

I mean what Dev was like "let's insure people with money and high level are near impossible to kill for a low level!!!!!!!"

 

Absolute crap.

 

Anyway, I now shoot for the neck and torso as often as not.

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1898

Maybe it's all actually a glimpse into the future where PvP will utilize voice commands, controllers and hand coordination will become a thing of the past.

 

 "OK, toss a fire bottle at the guy with the fancy vest. Now shoot the dude on the white arabian but aim for the neck, he's wearing a bullet-proof hat. Please deduct 2 dollars from my account for a dead-eye boost and keep things going while I go grab a sandwich" etc etc

 

 

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Rokushakubo

I think ability cards are part of a larger PvE picture and that they seem out of place because of the bare nature of the beta. I can see them being more at home in varied PvE missions and heists where they'd benefit taking on certain roles. 

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Chrismads
Posted (edited)
On 3/29/2019 at 8:57 PM, Rokushakubo said:

I think ability cards are part of a larger PvE picture and that they seem out of place because of the bare nature of the beta. I can see them being more at home in varied PvE missions and heists where they'd benefit taking on certain roles. 

R*'d have to learn how to make challenging missions first.

If anyone need cards to do the current missions...well, I just hope they'll stay away from my story missions.

As far as I remember there wasn't even one challenging mission in gtao.

And RDR2 as awesome as it was, I think most of us could play through the whole story without dying... edit. you know what I mean

Edited by Chrismads

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ferguson99

Lets campaign to Rockstar and get rid of them, RDR1 worked well without them. 

 

a completely level playing field. 

no spending half hour setting them up..... then you get into a match and realise its there not working, so you quit out and start again.

 

Comparison between the two

9FJ4RqA.jpg

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Bakkerbaard
1 hour ago, ferguson99 said:

Lets campaign to Rockstar and get rid of them, RDR1 worked well without them. 

 

a completely level playing field. 

no spending half hour setting them up..... then you get into a match and realise its there not working, so you quit out and start again.

 

Comparison between the two

9FJ4RqA.jpg

Aw, I miss the stand-offs.

The fist-fighting... Not so much.

 

As far as BGM goes, I like the eerie silence sometimes in free roam. Hoofbeas in the gritty sand, occasionally interrupted by a shot echoing against the mountains.

And it makes the musical cues more helpful.

 

Either way, I'd be more inclined to screw around with the Cards if they'd all be 50 pop each, but at 500 for a tier 3 experiment, it's just not in the cards for me.

 

Yup. I did the pun and I'm not sorry.

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tonko

Just played some showdowns. And i killed this guy after: 3 body shots and 2 headshots. That's 5 shots to take him down, i was using Bolt Rifle!

 

Can someone refresh my memory; GTA was the goofy one and RDR is grounded and more realistic franchise, right? I can hardly tell the difference between the two.

 

 

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Ronin Ogami
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Bakkerbaard said:

Aw, I miss the stand-offs.

The fist-fighting... Not so much.

 

As far as BGM goes, I like the eerie silence sometimes in free roam. Hoofbeas in the gritty sand, occasionally interrupted by a shot echoing against the mountains.

And it makes the musical cues more helpful.

 

Either way, I'd be more inclined to screw around with the Cards if they'd all be 50 pop each, but at 500 for a tier 3 experiment, it's just not in the cards for me.

 

Yup. I did the pun and I'm not sorry.

 Nine hundred to max out a card. $900 per maxed ability. Let that sink in. They need you to spend all your hard earned cash on these early, so you'll cave & buy gold to purchase everything else. It's also not worth maxing them all (imo), just the ones you know you'll like &/or use. I've done about eight, so I can have a few decent combos depend on my current needs, but I don't think I'll be getting any more, since alot of them don't seem to suit my playstyle. Also think of them as an investment. Once maxed, you never have to worry about it again, & can finance other things in game, like owning every single piece of clothing you like, or near bottomless pits of ammo.   😛 

Edited by Ronin Ogami

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BUT THE BENZ

sheeeeeeeit.....I've got 7 cards on tier 3, as in, 7 x 900 $....for a few dollars more eh!? 6300 $...holy moly that's absolutely enough spent on those cards, at least on my end!

 

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Bakkerbaard
19 hours ago, Ronin Ogami said:

It's also not worth maxing them all (imo), just the ones you know you'll like &/or use.

So, that's about none of them.

Best I can do for the fine people at Rockstar is nab a couple of of the beginner cards for 50 bucks and call it a day. And that's only if I'm not saving up for a new coat or an imaginary update concerning property management or wagon owning.

19 hours ago, Ronin Ogami said:

Also think of them as an investment. Once maxed, you never have to worry about it again, & can finance other things in game, like owning every single piece of clothing you like, or near bottomless pits of ammo.

Investments pay out, ideally. So that would make the bottomless pit of ammo the investment and the deer the my new best buddy Herman is carrying around the pay out. Clothing would be an investment if I could look badass enough to scare people into thinking twice about screwing with me so I can actually get to a butcher to sell that deer.

The only card I need

is the ace of spades.

 

That made no sense, but I couldn't resist.

 

19 hours ago, BUT THE BENZ said:

sheeeeeeeit.....I've got 7 cards on tier 3, as in, 7 x 900 $....for a few dollars more eh!? 6300 $...holy moly that's absolutely enough spent on those cards, at least on my end!

Think of all the fancy hats you could have bought. My god man! THE HATS!

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Ronin Ogami
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Bakkerbaard said:

So, that's about none of them.

Best I can do for the fine people at Rockstar is nab a couple of of the beginner cards for 50 bucks and call it a day. And that's only if I'm not saving up for a new coat or an imaginary update concerning property management or wagon owning.

Investments pay out, ideally. So that would make the bottomless pit of ammo the investment and the deer the my new best buddy Herman is carrying around the pay out. Clothing would be an investment if I could look badass enough to scare people into thinking twice about screwing with me so I can actually get to a butcher to sell that deer.

The only card I need

is the ace of spades.

 

That made no sense, but I couldn't resist.

 

Think of all the fancy hats you could have bought. My god man! THE HATS!

Once you get far enough into the game, you'll find there's not as much to spend it on as you'd like, unless you're someone who needs to have all the in game items. I'm not, but I did spend a LOT on hats, lol 

Edited by Ronin Ogami

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Bakkerbaard
2 minutes ago, Ronin Ogami said:

Once you get far enough into the game, you'll find there's not as much to spend it on as you'd like, unless you're someone who needs to have all the in game items. I'm not, but I did spend a LOT on hats, lol 

I just hit level 51 yesterday and I'm already quite aware that my leftover wishlist is terribly short.

But I've learned from GTA that's it's a good idea to keep some cash on hand. 

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tonko

Honestly, i can barely see the difference. It all comes down to who owns stronger cards. RDR1 was cards free and it was superb in terms of Player vs Player.

nyydlj.jpg

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Almostnasty

Only meta cards are worth getting or whatever comes down to personal preference. There’s also a belt buckle for maxing out all cards for those that fancy doing that. 

 

Ability cards don’t really have an in-depth breakdown for new players, but there’s plenty of online videos about the ins and outs of this game. Getting up to speed is a click away.

 

A lot of higher level players seem to utilize similar ability cards, as they should, it’s a mechanic that’s been placed into the game, ultimately making it a very viable option for anyone wishing to use them. Lower levels tend to complain the most about the cost or xp that goes into building a set, but that just seems to be because it’s easier to complain about something than to put in the time. Merely playing and leveling a character up naturally by any means will yield the required xp and money.

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Assblaster

The more I think about it the more I think I was initially right in thinking that ability cards will be the death of this game (if lack of content isn't). New players will be demolished by older players and just quit. Too big of an advantage that takes too long to get. They're a stupid, unrealistic and off-putting game mechanic. They're no fun to anybody except maybe for those who like having unfair advantage. They might fit into a fantasy game but not a game set in or around the Wild West; yet even then they're a really bad idea. Game-breaking discouragement, plain and simple. 

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Bakkerbaard
4 hours ago, Almostnasty said:

 Lower levels tend to complain the most about the cost or xp that goes into building a set, but that just seems to be because it’s easier to complain about something than to put in the time. Merely playing and leveling a character up naturally by any means will yield the required xp and money.

Seeing as I initially started this topic I feel I should respond.

I was probably somewhere in the thirties when I posted, but I'm 53 now and I still feel the ability cards are an unneeded mechanism that strongly gives the impression it is there to get money flowing. While it is true that naturally playing yields the money and XP needed to level the cards, but you can't convince me it is a reasonable price.

Even if you settle on just four cards right from the get-go, the price is wholly unrealistic. The minimum for a deck would be $3,550 (excludes the first free card, making it three tier 1 cards, four tier 2 and four tier 3). Assuming you're some kind of wizard and you have the exact right cards at the first go, this means you've just paid three and half thousand dollars to have zero advantage over all the other people that figured out the right card combo. In fact, in that situation, I'd go as far as to say you've paid $3,550 to play a really sh*tty showdown.

 

To counter my own arguement: The game gives you a way to get an edge over other people and you'd be an idiot not to use it, so I guess that cancels out all my bitching and moaning, but I can simply not handle any game that does not consider headshots fatal, whatever the bullsh*t mechanic behind it. That, and at 3500 bucks I can be a very well dressed cowpoke on a couple of very stately horses. It's mostly a priority issue.

An occasional hatshot happens and would be sorely missed if it wasn't in a cowboy game, but all hatshots all the time just grinds my goddamn gears to a pulp.

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SuperJude™

At this point I can tell rather quickly whether battle is worth it or not.

 

With the Headshot/Hat card there, all someone needs is a bunch of different hats in their inventory so they can constantly put a new hat on making them nigh invulnerable to headshots #Realism

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4eyedcoupe
6 hours ago, Almostnasty said:

Lower levels tend to complain the most about the cost or xp that goes into building a set, but that just seems to be because it’s easier to complain about something than to put in the time. Merely playing and leveling a character up naturally by any means will yield the required xp and money.

I disagree with that statement entirely.  The biggest complaint I see about ability cards is that they are silly and unrealistic.  The cost is a complaint more so because it is a silly concept that we have to spend money on but don't want to.  I personally think they should be removed, but we all know that won't happen. 

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•—•
Posted (edited)

It's either auto aim one shot headshots.

 

Or auto aim headshots tanking sponging with ability cards.

 

Or free aim one shot headshots.

 

They should've done the 3rd option. But then we have single shot weapons that is harder to free aim with than semi auto or automatic weapons that we're used to in other games.

 

Or others games with free aim automatic guns, the enemies and players still are tanky and spongey... take so many bullets to head.

 

PvP would be f*cked if it was option 1, auto aim one shot kill. So cheap.

Edited by •—•

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The Blast

I support two basic game options for the completed RDRO:

1. Free-aim, no ability cards.
2. Auto-aim, ability cards.

I'd be with option #1 all day.

You could argue for more modes, and I wouldn't exactly oppose them, but that simple two-option divide would solve so much, and give people a truly competitive option with #1.
Option #2, which is obviously things as they currently are, is much less competitive than it is exploitative, and has left an abysmal void for everyone with free-aim skill and a reluctance to be cheap and abusive.

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Foxwolfe

The more time that goes on the more irritated I am at the fact they left different lobby types out. Auto aim vs other players gets dull fast for me but I'm also not up for dealing with the headache that is free aiming against auto aimers so I will continue to auto aim myself as well.

 

Kinda makes me avoid freeroam pvp to be honest.

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BobDyl
Posted (edited)

Combat in RDR2 is terrible. When you face off, R* might as well just line up your ability cards and declare a winner, why waste the time to fight at all? Deck is stacked. They got it so right in RDR and so wrong in RDR2 - I think the whole ability card thing is just an excuse to create an economy but is not realistic, fun, or engaging. 

Edited by BobDyl

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wehweh01
34 minutes ago, BobDyl said:

Combat in RDR2 is terrible. When you face off, R* might as well just line up your ability cards and declare a winner, why waste the time to fight at all? Deck is stacked. They got it so right in RDR and so wrong in RDR2 - I think the whole ability card thing is just an excuse to create an economy but is not realistic, fun, or engaging. 

Naw the worst part is the autoaim to me. It doesn't belong in anything PVP.

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GenericGTAO

PIB with dynamite arrows....the ultimate trump card to slippery bastard....you can almost see the ? replace their gamertag after the first one lands.  They gladly gallup into 10 more. 

 

I love the ability cards.  They add depth and a need to actually study and test the game.

 

Separate lobbies would be way better than the damn near passive mode thats incoming.   Dividing the already small player base is dumb from a business perspective, but watering the game down to appease both, auto aim pvpers and free aim pvers, is even worse.

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tonko
17 hours ago, Assblaster said:

The more I think about it the more I think I was initially right in thinking that ability cards will be the death of this game (if lack of content isn't). New players will be demolished by older players and just quit. Too big of an advantage that takes too long to get. They're a stupid, unrealistic and off-putting game mechanic. They're no fun to anybody except maybe for those who like having unfair advantage. They might fit into a fantasy game but not a game set in or around the Wild West; yet even then they're a really bad idea. Game-breaking discouragement, plain and simple. 

I don't like them but i have to use them sadly. I've been demolishing lower level players lately and it feels cheap and dirty. The unfair advantage isn't my thing but i guess some may like it.

And yeah, this is a western not fantasy genre so they just don't fit at all.

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The FoolYT

Nobody:

Rockstar: Lets add ability cardssss!!!

 

In all seriousness, i don't think this matches the game nor does it fit. Perk like systems are only good when the main gamemodes are meant to be combat orientated or close quarters or the game is built around that

For example, Max Payne 3 is close quarters combat with a set level and the perks are desinged around that. COD has small set levels with perks that are designed around that. 

Red Dead main gamemode is freemode let's be honest. Same with GTA, main gamemode is freemode. Ability cards/perks simply don't fit with this and tbh, it just seems like a lazy attempt of extra monetisation.

 

You may say that you don't need gold bars to upgrade the cards but you'll have  to use cash. Using that cash means you probably won't have as much for weapons or maybe clothing if you're into that which makes it seem more enticing. 

 

The other main thing is since Auto aim is strong enough to the point that majority of encounters will end with one shot, certain perks have way way more value than others (The perk that lets you tank a headshot with hat on or the other one which disables AA when in use). At the very least, perks are meant to encourage different playstyles. (Max payne 3 had a few long range people, some people went full defensive juggernaut armor, others were run and gun with dual sawned, etc....) As it stand, the best playstyle is either headshot with a fast rifle or shotgun spam up close from what I've seen.

 

In conclusion, Ability cards were unnecessary IMO (However, if there was free aim, maybe i could view these cards as interesting). Like what's the point of higher damage per shot or waiting increases your damage or you heal when doing damage when all it takes is a single headshot to kill you anyway???? 

 

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