Red Dead Online is making a hell of a lot less money than GTA Online

[Tez2]

39 minutes ago, Pressure Drop said:

Why they need a deal with Take Two I will never know.

Take-Two importance to Rockstar is that they can handle all the legal documents, complaints and business reports. At least that's what Take Two is for Rockstar.

In fact, Take-Two do suggest ideas as if they were as important as the development process but R* ignore them most of the time.

[Rammer2k]

Not really shocked. Online has been in Beta for over 3 months now.  Bugs, Glitches, and lack of content right off the bat.  You can't setup, and host your own races, story missions; so the whole co-op playing with your friends is taken out.  Economy isn't the greatest either.  Most of the decent stuff, you have to grind to over Rank 30 to unlock, and even then it's expensive as hell.  I guess we can all hold out hope that the Official Release post Beta will be a step in the right direction.

[DentureDynamite]

IMHO, as fun as RDO could be with the right TLC, it just doesn't have the long-term (or arguably even short-term) connection with interesting, and potentially long-term content that has served as financial payback in GTA Online.

 

It also has a very different pace and appeal, so there's a very different audience; yet Rockstar is treating its RDO players as if they were just another GTA Online.

 

There's no reason to believe that Rockstar will be successful with any new Online game, given their philosophy of monetization over game play.

 

I believe even newer, younger players are slowly becoming aware of what keeps them coming back to play, and what does not.

 

Clearly, RDO does not.

 

On 3/1/2019 at 7:32 AM, Fun 2 said:

Take-Two importance to Rockstar is that they can handle all the legal documents, complaints and business reports. At least that's what Take Two is for Rockstar.

In fact, Take-Two do suggest ideas as if they were as important as the development process but R* ignore them most of the time.

But until Rockstar changes their philosophy to what (I believe) Leslie Benzies had, namely, "game play first, and money comes in naturally", they will do nothing more than milk GTA Online for all it's worth.

 

Which causes me to have serious misgivings about their ability to ever create a successful, long-term online game again until that philosophy change actually happens.

 

They will also need to be wiling to invest as heavily in their online games as they do for their once-in-five/eight-year Story Mode games...good implementations of online pays back exponentially more.

Edited March 4, 2019 by DentureDynamite

[DarksunDaFirst]

On 2/28/2019 at 5:47 AM, fryday said:

exactly this. gta5 was a 10 hour per day game, rdo gets boring after 1 hour 

Maybe when new stuff came out, but repeating the same thing over and over again...ugh, boring AF grind.

[Jason]

It was never going to make as much as GTAO in fairness, but it's hard to argue that it's not underperforming.

 

Question is are they willing to put the work into the game that it needs so it can be as good as it can be, or are they just gonna put it on the backburner and move onto GTA VI and GTAO2.

[coach_wargo]

[Need drugs]

At the end of the day it just doesn't have the same mainstream appeal as gta. The setting doesnt lend itself to explosion-happy gameplay to draw in the kids. Nor does the rdr brand have as much appeal as the gta brand.(although rdr still has the R* brand). Also while it did get quite a bit of press coverage and advertising, it still didnt get as much as gta does. 

[Rafae S]

11 hours ago, Fun 2 said:

Take-Two do suggest ideas as if they were as important as the development process but R* ignore them most of the time.

 

I find that very hard to believe lmao

[Pocket Fox]

4 hours ago, Need drugs said:

At the end of the day it just doesn't have the same mainstream appeal as gta. The setting doesnt lend itself to explosion-happy gameplay to draw in the kids. Nor does the rdr brand have as much appeal as the gta brand.(although rdr still has the R* brand). Also while it did get quite a bit of press coverage and advertising, it still didnt get as much as gta does. 

RDR2 is the greatest selling piece of media of all time.

 

So clearly it is something people want and something that is profitable. But that's looking at a Single Player experience. So... why not take what made SP amazing and infuse that into RDRO?

 

Nope! Another generic live service game with no content, just grind for the sake of grind, emotes cost cash, PvP-centric, player freedom and control removed so the devs can channel your experience into how they want you to play the game.

 

It's like giving an artist a colouring book and pencils, then taking all but 2 coloured pencils away and having them only draw circles.

 

RDRO was designed from the ground up to be a monetised live service grind, it seems at no point was player freedom/control or fun/engaging gameplay ever considered.

 

And they're...surprised when this is a failure? 

 

Let's be totally honest, RDRO was only shoved into RDR2 so TT/R* could get themselves some Christmas money from gold bar purchases.

[Jason]

You know what RDO feels like? It feels like a multiplayer mode that was begrudgingly made by a team who just wanted to make a great single player game. GTAO for all it's problems, at launch, felt like it was made with a bit of spark, it felt like something Rockstar were excited about, but RDO has none of that. It's devoid of creativity, ambition, or anything that suggests that this is something they were really inspired to make.

 

Perhaps RDO is a victim of GTAO's success, like they felt the need to make a GTAO in the wild west, but if they went back to basics, maybe keep character creation, unlocking clothes, customising guns and that type of stuff and just stripped out the "grind" stuff, earning money and the like, and just built up a set of PvE and PvP modes and kept it all fairly simple then RDO would be a much better experience for it.

 

Like, they can't make a GTAO-scale experience for every open world game they do and there's no need to. What are they gonna do if they do a Bully 2? Agent if that ever sees the light of day, or another open world game? Try and create a big, bold multiplayer experience for all those too? It makes no sense when you really think about it. Perhaps then they'd be better suited leaving GTAO as their only big, bold multiplayer experience and when it comes to their other games they should keep the multiplayer portion simple.

[Furi0sa]

5 hours ago, Need drugs said:

At the end of the day it just doesn't have the same mainstream appeal as gta. The setting doesnt lend itself to explosion-happy gameplay to draw in the kids. Nor does the rdr brand have as much appeal as the gta brand.(although rdr still has the R* brand). Also while it did get quite a bit of press coverage and advertising, it still didnt get as much as gta does. 

Sounds like a trash excuse as rdr 2 made a fortune and obviously appeals to a huge amount of people. This online mode has no content and no effort, its not about a niche market.

[Halal Cyborg]

I just don’t understand why they’re attempting to replicate GTA Online experience in a setting that doesn’t suit it.

 

you could make a far more subtle less kid oriented experience that befits the late 1800s...why on earth does it have all the same crap that ruined gta online?

 

its obviously not going to work...their audience they are trying to reach would rather play gta and have no interest in the nuances of the Wild West...so why cater to them????

 

its really a case already before they’ve even began to add any meat into the equation of square pegs in round holes.

[~INDIO~]

I wish they'd split from Take Two aswell. There was once a time when I liked them, but lately they've been the most greedy bastards.

They're making people hate Rockstar.

 

I think it's been said before that the Housers aren't really into online and that they prefer single player, so maybe they wanted to do DLC for GTAV but were told not to. 

And maybe we won't get any DLC for RDR2 because of Take Two's disgusting corporate greed and Strauss' cluelessness about the products he's selling. 

I mean, it's like a f*cking baker not knowing anything about bread.

 

It just seems that Take Two don't have a clue what they're doing, and Rockstar have become so arrogant they won't even listen to their customers. Shame because they used to be the coolest company in gaming.

 

I also wish they'd leave online to GTA and free up time for other projects that would make fans happy.

Edited March 2, 2019 by ~INDIO~
Herbert mooon

[BUT THE BENZ]

the day the housers decided to "kill" the benz, they practically harakiri'd R* games. they're bleeding out right now. they've already lost their hearing, why else would they not add what people asked for or fix what people reported to be bugged, and fix the f*cking STUBBLE for example!?

Edited March 2, 2019 by BUT THE BENZ

[elfoam]

It's quite clear to me the soul of these games lived in Benzies. Completely everything went to sh*t after he left.

[U Carmine]

4 hours ago, ~INDIO~ said:

It just seems that Take Two don't have a clue what they're doing, and Rockstar have become so arrogant they won't even listen to their customers.

Then why does player feedback exist?

[~INDIO~]

1 hour ago, Ektope said:

Then why does player feedback exist?

I don't know why it exists, at least in their case

[Ghoffman9]

The word is spreading about this much hated change, and I am loving it.

 

[Ryan5252]

They're obviously getting a bit desperate, I just seen this Ad while waiting on a YouTube video but apparently it was released same day as the update. 

 

Gotta admit, they should give their advertising team a pat on the back, I wouldn't mind playing the game in the trailer....

 

 

[LorshZontek]

5 minutes ago, Ryan5252 said:

They're obviously getting a bit desperate, I just seen this Ad while waiting on a YouTube video but apparently it was released same day as the update. 

 

Gotta admit, they should give their advertising team a pat on the back, I wouldn't mind playing the game in the trailer....

 

 

yeah if only the content in the trailer was in the game and not dripfed and it wasnt overpriced garbage 

Edited March 3, 2019 by LorshZontek
added the dripfed part because i forgot about that

[BUT THE BENZ]

^ tbh the best clothing item in this "update" is the marshall coat, and it's available. the rest of clothing doesn't look good anyways...

[Rafae S]

2 minutes ago, BUT THE BENZ said:

^ tbh the best clothing item in this "update" is the marshall coat, and it's available. the rest of clothing doesn't look good anyways...

 

Agreed. The black is so f*cking sleek.

[Ghoffman9]

When prices get out of control, and people realize all of this is a bubble on the verge of bursting, mark my words, Rockstar/Take Two, Ea, Activision and so on are gonna get one hell of a wake up call. For some its already started with stocks on a continual decline. Even Rockstar has been feeling a decline that has persisted over the past few months. This is of no surprise, in their greed they created a business model that just wasn't sustainable. Trying to charge people for additional things they never charged you for before (Like Rockstar and their emotes), and for increasingly ridiculous prices, whilst consumer outrage continues to grow and fester. Investors are taking note of all of this and beginning to bail, we're seeing the early signs of it now.

 

It was never a question on if this bubble is going to burst, but when. When you keep trying to charge consumers more and more for less and less in exchange, this will always be the end result. The gaming industry got away with sh*t no other industry could ever dream of, its about time those bastards start playing by the same rule book as everyone else. Some tried to blame it on capitalism itself, but how I see it the problem was the industry itself in how it got its own set of rules that had fewer restrictions and rules to which they must abide.

[LorshZontek]

24 minutes ago, Ghoffman9 said:

When prices get out of control, and people realize all of this is a bubble on the verge of bursting, mark my words, Rockstar/Take Two, Ea, Activision and so on are gonna get one hell of a wake up call. For some its already started with stocks on a continual decline. Even Rockstar has been feeling a decline that has persisted over the past few months. This is of no surprise, in their greed they created a business model that just wasn't sustainable. Trying to charge people for additional things they never charged you for before (Like Rockstar and their emotes), and for increasingly ridiculous prices, whilst consumer outrage continues to grow and fester. Investors are taking note of all of this and beginning to bail, we're seeing the early signs of it now.

 

It was never a question on if this bubble is going to burst, but when. When you keep trying to charge consumers more and more for less and less in exchange, this will always be the end result. The gaming industry got away with sh*t no other industry could ever dream of, its about time those bastards start playing by the same rule book as everyone else. Some tried to blame it on capitalism itself, but how I see it the problem was the industry itself in how it got its own set of rules that had fewer restrictions and rules to which they must abide.

people are fed up with red dead online already the bubble will burst sooner or later 

[Van_Hellsing]

1 hour ago, LorshZontek said:

people are fed up with red dead online already the bubble will burst sooner or later 

Stock prices of all gaming companies were on the decline, because of the loot box controversy. Countries banning predatory gambling practices. 

 

The update fiasco is not helpful, sure. Rockstar being Rockstar, R* gets away with gtao for five years. RDR2 will not be different they argue. 

Edited March 4, 2019 by Van_Hellsing

[Ghoffman9]

1 hour ago, Van_Hellsing said:

Stock prices of all gaming companies were on the decline, because of the loot box controversy. Countries banning predatory gambling practices. 

 

The update fiasco is not helpful, sure. Rockstar being Rockstar, R* gets away with gtao for five years. RDR2 will not be different they argue. 

Well the thing is that Rockstar hasn't really dabbled in lootboxes, they focus more in price gouging the sh*t out of you for mediocre crap through micro-transactions, and they been on the decline as well. I believe its in large part to Red Dead Online's ever decreasing player engagement and consumers expressing their overwhelming dissatisfaction with what they been doing. Investors know Gta Online is on its way out, and they want something that will make a viable replacement, and Red Dead Online is failing on that front greatly.

 

When will companies learn. Investors only invest based on how much consumers are spending on your products. What do you think happens if you piss off those consumers and they stop spending? All investors run for the hills. 

This is basic fundamental stuff that you don't need to be a CEO or executive to understand, and yet so many of them cannot even grasp that. You don't pander to investors, they will come and go. They're just there to buy your stock when its low and sell it when its high, nothing more. They give two sh*ts if your company goes under. The ones who stick by your side through thick and thin is the fans, if you screw them over to appease investors that are impossible to appease, you will only end up with nothing in the end.

[Jason]

Stock prices for Take-Two were falling before RDR2 released and continued to fall despite RDR2's record breaking launch. It was happening before RDO. Strauss Zelnick was actually interviewed about it and he was kinda puzzled, but it's not something unique to Take-Two as EA and Acti Blizzard both have declining stocks. The AAA industry just seems kinda flat at the moment for some reason. It's likely a variety of reasons but it might be that one of those reasons is that the industry has been growing nonstop for basically decades and has been skyrocketing over the last few years due to the insane microtransaction profits, so it might just be a case of the stock prices normalising after the hype has died down.

 

I'm not really sure it's anything to do with lootboxes either, or an impending bubble burst or anything. Many of these publishers games are posting record numbers.

[Van_Hellsing]

8 hours ago, Ghoffman9 said:

Well the thing is that Rockstar hasn't really dabbled in lootboxes, they focus more in price gouging the sh*t out of you for mediocre crap through microtransactions. 

EA dragged the whole gaming industry in the abyss. Where there is smoke, there is fire. So investors walked out on the whole sector. 

 

Whether or not T2 engaged in lootboxes didn't matter.