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IamCourtney

Judge me, my Peers

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Gray-Hand
1 hour ago, IamCourtney said:

Care to expand? I'm genuinely curious to hear other people's lines of reasoning for why they would act a certain way in this situation. :)

He went out of his way to warn you that he was approaching and to give you comfort that he had no bad intentions toward you.

If he had intended to kill you, he wouldn’t have drawn attention to himself - he would have picked you off from a distance, which would have been easy for him to do.

It was quite obvious that he meant what he said given that he had a horse full of pelts and carcasses which were probably worth more than any reward he would have got from destroying the cart. But you killed him anyway.

 

You had the opportunity to reward the good behaviour of another player and you blew it.  You have contributed to the sh*ttiness of the culture of RDonline.

 

 

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Assblaster
25 minutes ago, Gray-Hand said:

If he had intended to kill you, he wouldn’t have drawn attention to himself - he would have picked you off from a distance, which would have been easy for him to do.

On the other hand, I've encountered numerous players that pretended to be nice, only to shoot me in the back (or dynamite me and my horse) once my back was turned. This rotten tactic has the advantage of getting them closer for an easy kill without unnecessary risk. I was once the friendliest guy in this game, often waving and hoping for the best. No more of that. Done in one too many times, now I'm better safe than sorry. I'll try to avoid players if possible; but if they speed toward me anyway, I tend to kill.

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El Payaso
2 hours ago, IamCourtney said:

Care to expand? I'm genuinely curious to hear other people's lines of reasoning for why they would act a certain way in this situation. :)

Well, the other guy said he was just passing by. You also saw he had pelts on his horse. I doubt he was going to risk his hunting labor just to grief you. To top it off, you fired the first shot at him.

 

I feel really bad for him because he lost all his work for nothing. You didn't really have anything to lose and even if you did, you both had a verbal discourse. Just take his word and share the road.

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Ektope
30 minutes ago, Assblaster said:

On the other hand, I've encountered numerous players that pretended to be nice, only to shoot me in the back (or dynamite me and my horse) once my back was turned. This rotten tactic has the advantage of getting them closer for an easy kill without unnecessary risk. I was once the friendliest guy in this game, often waving and hoping for the best. No more of that. Done in one too many times, now I'm better safe than sorry. I'll try to avoid players if possible; but if they speed toward me anyway, I tend to kill.

I think I would've laughed if that happened to me. And it hasn't.

24 minutes ago, El Payaso said:

Just take his word and share the road.

If there was little space on the road, this is what would happen:

 

jousting-2020-olympics.gif

 

They could just crash their wagon right into the other guy's horse. Now that would be funny.

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Assblaster
2 minutes ago, Ektope said:

I think I would've laughed if that happened to me. And it hasn't.

Good for you bud, I'm happy for you. Happened to me on several occasions. It's not a huge deal, doesn't bother me really but if I have carcasses and skins I spent awhile working for, it doesn't benefit me much to be kind to players that go out of their way to chase me after I make a clear effort to avoid them. It's a small loss but in a bad session it can get costly after awhile. At least I don't "kill anybody on sight" as you say you do.

 

I should add that most of my sessions aren't bad at all. Plenty of friendly, mature players out there who won't f*ck you over. Depends on when you play for the most part. If the dots are a-flyin', I'm more cautious.

 

You've got a good attitude though, of course it's just a game.😉

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Ektope
2 minutes ago, Assblaster said:

At least I don't "kill anybody on sight" as you say you do.

 

Those are very rare moments. It's what I used to do when I was a level 30~ noob. I was grinding stranger missions at the time, with objectives. But now, I'm not the all out hellraiser as you might think.

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clinical oppression

I wouldn't feel bad about it . Much of this game when it comes to other players is rolling the dice and hoping for the best or taking definative action . I do my best to stay out of the way of rival posse mission wagons .....they generally have itchy trigger fingers . Hell I was along a mission wagons route and got shot picking herbs ffs. After that neither wagon made it to the destination . 

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Bare

yeah thats not cool imo id take his word for it and let him pass especially after seeing the pelts but to each his own.

i tend to let others attack me first in rdr2 since theres no kd so i dont feel like preemptively defending myself like on gta.

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GenericGTAO
5 hours ago, Assblaster said:

On the other hand, I've encountered numerous players that pretended to be nice, only to shoot me in the back (or dynamite me and my horse) once my back was turned. This rotten tactic has the advantage of getting them closer for an easy kill without unnecessary risk. I was once the friendliest guy in this game, often waving and hoping for the best. No more of that. Done in one too many times, now I'm better safe than sorry. I'll try to avoid players if possible; but if they speed toward me anyway, I tend to kill.

Yes, its too easy for the hunter guy to kill and drop a dynamite, go sell and then find a new session.  And its far more likely he was going to do just that.  And thats why he tried to feign "nice guy."   If he was that concerned about his stuff, he would have avoided another player.  

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1898

OP, maybe posting a pic of the map as well as 2 dots representing you and the dude in question would go a long way before the final verdict.

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*Lola
On 2/1/2019 at 9:34 AM, IamCourtney said:

Judge me, my Peers

 

 

I'd guess if his haul was so important to him he'd take another route to stay clear of another player.

Hunters don't like losing their time and money from other players in game.

He gambled his haul and lost. Make better choices in life, Mr. Hunter.

 

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Ghoffman9

For me personally, I fire if I see a gun drawn, if its holstered I don't shoot first but will the second I start to see you pull a gun out. Its allowed me to be friendly and not piss off everyone I see, whilst also not being a free kill either. I blame it entirely on the game and its one hit kill headshots, because of it you cannot afford to let the enemy shoot first cause chances are it will be a headshot and kill you right there on the spot. Auto aim and one hit headshots make for a horrible combination for a video game.

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Virus..

f*ck it...did what you have to do to survive... Uncle dutch would be proud.

Edited by Virus..

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IamCourtney
11 hours ago, Gray-Hand said:

He went out of his way to warn you that he was approaching and to give you comfort that he had no bad intentions toward you.

If he had intended to kill you, he wouldn’t have drawn attention to himself - he would have picked you off from a distance, which would have been easy for him to do.

It was quite obvious that he meant what he said given that he had a horse full of pelts and carcasses which were probably worth more than any reward he would have got from destroying the cart. But you killed him anyway.

 

11 hours ago, El Payaso said:

Well, the other guy said he was just passing by. You also saw he had pelts on his horse. I doubt he was going to risk his hunting labor just to grief you. To top it off, you fired the first shot at him.

 

I feel really bad for him because he lost all his work for nothing. You didn't really have anything to lose and even if you did, you both had a verbal discourse. Just take his word and share the road.

Why should I be bound to just take him at his word though? Couldn't he have looked up my Ability Card loadout, seen that the combo of Slow & Steady + Never Without One would make a quick long-range kill unlikely and come up with a ploy to get close to me for a short range attack, one more likely to succeed? I've gone after plenty of target-of-opportunity stranger missions while my own horse was loaded up with hunting goods, there was no reason to believe this fella might not do likewise. I had my mission to lose and had given fair warning I was going to shoot if he got close.

 

The verbal exchange does make this situation more interesting though, perhaps more 'personal'... I'm not usually on the public chat channel (I'm generally in posse chat or a PS4 party if I'm mic'd up) so it was a rare experience for me. I think I might get into the public chat more often now though, it can add a cool dynamic.

Edited by IamCourtney

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GenericGTAO

Was he any good in the fight?  If he was, its very likely he knows, that nice guy crap in online video games means nothing.  If he was a noob, maybe he isnt adjusted to online games.  Even so, his intent doesnt matter unless you lied in the post because outskirts of any town allows many ways to get to the butcher.  You basically told him, I will shoot if you come by me.  Which maybe that clear warning is all you need in the future.

Edited by GenericGTAO

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El Payaso
49 minutes ago, IamCourtney said:

 

Why should I be bound to just take him at his word though? Couldn't he have looked up my Ability Card loadout, seen that the combo of Slow & Steady + Never Without One would make a quick long-range kill unlikely and come up with a ploy to get close to me for a short range attack, one more likely to succeed? I've gone after plenty of target-of-opportunity stranger missions while my own horse was loaded up with hunting goods, there was no reason to believe this fella might not do likewise. I had my mission to lose and had given fair warning I was going to shoot if he got close.

 

The verbal exchange does make this situation more interesting though, perhaps more 'personal'... I'm not usually on the public chat channel (I'm generally in posse chat or a PS4 party if I'm mic'd up) so it was a rare experience for me. I think I might get into the public chat more often now though, it can add a cool dynamic.

You're not "bound" to take his word but it's good sport to take his word. What you did was just contributing to the toxic nature of these games when verbal words become meaningless and worthless. 

 

In your point of view, there was no reason to believe he wouldn't kill you because you do the same to others so you think it's normal or it's what everyone does. This is part of the reason why your previous posts are in support of player beacons showing up on the entire map.

 

Honestly, this whole thing is one of those "change my mind" situations. Which is why I said you won't see what you did wrong because you already have your own beliefs and opinions about it.

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ThaBirdCoot

I let pass by a couple of hunters earlier down in Tumbleweed. First guy goes trough straight to the butcher doesn't even mind me just hauls ass, the other however... I saw him loaded up on all sides so I figured he won't wanna engage me and since he is just a low level anyway. Let my guard down. Did not have the HS counter cards on because I was just doing a couple hideouts. Blam* varmint rifle round to the dome. Being nice or trustful doesn't pay. 

 

 

 

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GenericGTAO
17 minutes ago, ThaBirdCoot said:

I let pass by a couple of hunters earlier down in Tumbleweed. First guy goes trough straight to the butcher doesn't even mind me just hauls ass, the other however... I saw him loaded up on all sides so I figured he won't wanna engage me and since he is just a low level anyway. Let my guard down. Did not have the HS counter cards on because I was just doing a couple hideouts. Blam* varmint rifle round to the dome. Being nice or trustful doesn't pay. 

 

 

 

I went to butcher with 2 guys near it, sold my stuff.  As was leaving, 1 guy waved, so I thumbs up him.   As I do, shoots me, then he leaves. 

 

Another guy, killed me on spawning, I was afk..so i killed him repeatedly, he sent an apology, never seen that, so I rode on him with no weapon, he starts shooting me, he was a noob, and didnt get me, so I kill him until he left.  Guaranteed, had he killed me, he would have left.  There is a tat in LS, trust no one...applies in the wild west.

Edited by GenericGTAO

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Virus..
12 minutes ago, ThaBirdCoot said:

I let pass by a couple of hunters earlier down in Tumbleweed. First guy goes trough straight to the butcher doesn't even mind me just hauls ass, the other however... I saw him loaded up on all sides so I figured he won't wanna engage me and since he is just a low level anyway. Let my guard down. Did not have the HS counter cards on because I was just doing a couple hideouts. Blam* varmint rifle round to the dome. Being nice or trustful doesn't pay. 

 

 

 

Low levels get too excited when they believe they got the jump on someone only to notice they just triggered a fight with a +80 and regret it. Some dude pissed me off by killing me after i stopped taking pictures, proceeded to rain hell on him and left cuz i had somewhere to go IRL, surprised he didnt message me saying a "omg you left pussy" 

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ThaBirdCoot
7 minutes ago, Virus.. said:

Low levels get too excited when they believe they got the jump on someone only to notice they just triggered a fight with a +80 and regret it. Some dude pissed me off by killing me after i stopped taking pictures, proceeded to rain hell on him and left cuz i had somewhere to go IRL, surprised he didnt message me saying a "omg you left pussy" 

Yeah seems that way, in my situation I made sure he would not hunt & sell anything in that session afterwards for being cheap. He still went for the pronghorns and sh*t so I just rode up did not even aim for him incendary buckshot into his horse and carcasses. Managed to Lasso him from horseback a couple times too and drag him trough the dust for a while and then released and ride off, surely 5 mins later he had enough and left with his buddy. I had more fun than he did with that 1 shot to my skull for sure.

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IamCourtney
1 hour ago, El Payaso said:

You're not "bound" to take his word but it's good sport to take his word. What you did was just contributing to the toxic nature of these games when verbal words become meaningless and worthless. 

Wouldn't it have been good sport for him to heed my repeated warning to keep clear? His butcher load would have made it safely had he done so. Why verbally declare your intent at all if you aren't interested in the response? My warnings would have been meaningless and worthless if I hadn't backed them up with action when the line was crossed. I stated my boundaries and he chose to ignore and cross them, is this not also toxic behavior?

 

2 hours ago, El Payaso said:

In your point of view, there was no reason to believe he wouldn't kill you because you do the same to others so you think it's normal or it's what everyone does. This is part of the reason why your previous posts are in support of player beacons showing up on the entire map.

Weeellllllll, it's more that I believed that in the circumstances prevailing at the time, he had plausible cause to kill me. I wasn't sure he would, but plenty of people do and there's nothing abnormal about it. It just wasn't a risk I was willing to take. I'm really not an especially aggressive player tbh, but no matter. FWIW, I'm not sure exactly what beacon posts you're referring to, but if the choice was between All Blips Visible or No Blips Visible, I prefer the former, but I'm hoping the upcoming proximity based system is better than either option.

 

Anywho, I'm not really looking to prove myself indisputably right or change anybody's mind if they think I'm wrong, I just find the questions these situations bring out interesting. :)

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Ghoffman9
9 hours ago, IamCourtney said:

 

Why should I be bound to just take him at his word though? Couldn't he have looked up my Ability Card loadout, seen that the combo of Slow & Steady + Never Without One would make a quick long-range kill unlikely and come up with a ploy to get close to me for a short range attack, one more likely to succeed? I've gone after plenty of target-of-opportunity stranger missions while my own horse was loaded up with hunting goods, there was no reason to believe this fella might not do likewise. I had my mission to lose and had given fair warning I was going to shoot if he got close.

 

The verbal exchange does make this situation more interesting though, perhaps more 'personal'... I'm not usually on the public chat channel (I'm generally in posse chat or a PS4 party if I'm mic'd up) so it was a rare experience for me. I think I might get into the public chat more often now though, it can add a cool dynamic.

Lol, as toxic as this community is I don't trust a thing anybody says. If he was friendly he would have approached you with his gun holstered, but as you said he had a gun drawn. Could you tell what one it was by any chance and what one you used? If his was a repeater and yours was the bolt action for example, it should explain why you got to shoot first. Its his fault really, if you know you're dealing with a skittish player, especially one during a stranger mission, its stupid to approach them with a gun drawn.

 

My favorite strategy on judging the intent of a player is getting off my horse, hiding behind a tall rock/tree, and equip a shotgun. Then I wait to see what the player does. I move around the rock/tree as they get close so it remains between us, if they just pass me by and keep going, then I let them be. However if they got a gun drawn and trying to get to my side of the rock/tree, its clear they are trying to kill me, so they get a nice face full of buckshot. One time a player approached my side of the rock, but didn't fire immediately cause he didn't have a gun drawn at the time, so I aimed my gun at them but didn't fire yet. When he did the wave emote I put my gun down and spared him. Another time after sparing someone, I ran into them later in Valentine and they actually took a pike off their horse and put it onto mine. Said it was thanks for not being one of those who shoot on sight.

 

As a rule I never approach players in the middle of a stranger mission, they're often very skittish and shoot on sight. I do not wish to grief their mission, nor do I want to be shot at, so I just give them a wide berth.

Edited by Ghoffman9

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Obsi

I get the being distrustful of people..  Unfortunately you have to assume everyone is an asshole out to kill you. 

 

Unless he was carrying worthless 1 star pelts then he had way more to lose than you did.  So it would be foolish of him to engage you, since even if you died in a fight, you'd still have the potential opportunity to respawn and get back in the wagon and complete your mission, but a hunter being killed loses their loot.

 

As for who was right/wrong I guess both of you were in the wrong, but it really depends on where in Blackwater you were.  If you were Somewhere closer to the butcher side of town, I can see how the other player might have been wanting to get there in a hurry (before any carcasses decayed and before they got killed by someone else), and might have figured that since you were on a mission you'd be more interested in going your peaceful way and letting him go his.  But there should have been multiple ways he could get to the butcher without being too close to you, so he's then either an idiot for not going around you, or was out to get you.  Also surely by the time you had your back and forth discussion, he could have taken that time to go around if he wasn't after you, when you made it clear you weren't happy to have him near you. 

 

So if he was sincere then he should have been more cautious and just taken a longer way around to get there.  But being shot by someone when you're trying to do your own peaceful thing, is what causes the distrust of everyone and makes the game less fun.

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fromabovecomic

Im gonna say bad form dude. they had much more at stake. a loss of a significant amount of hunting time whereas you prominently just risked the inconvenience of a respawn. in effect you actually contributed to the distrust of others mentality as you shot first.

they would have had their guns out solely because of events like this. in the end you shot first.

 

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coelacanth72

He was warned and had his gun out. With such a valuable load he should have just gone around. Maybe you were in the wrong, maybe not, but dude made a bad choice and he paid for it. 

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miahus

You did the right thing. 

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DentureDynamite

Way too many players are outright idiots in this game.

 

I can't count the amount of times I've been minding my own business, and someone just starts riding right up to me, as if I'm expected going to implicitly trust their motive(s).

 

Last moron that tried it yesterday got the good 'ol Shotgun answer.

 

Stay alive, mind your own business.

Edited by DentureDynamite

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Enchilada

Benefit of the doubt. Next time you’re alone, use the slippery bastard ability card. 

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Winonas

Do Stranger missions pay more if you “run the clock down?” OP that was your problem, you borrowed trouble by wasting time which created the whole mess. Nonetheless, if taking more time means more pay, I get it. When I deliver a cart I make a beeline right for the finish. 

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IamCourtney
1 hour ago, Winonas said:

Do Stranger missions pay more if you “run the clock down?” OP that was your problem, you borrowed trouble by wasting time which created the whole mess. Nonetheless, if taking more time means more pay, I get it. When I deliver a cart I make a beeline right for the finish. 

More time elapsed = bigger payout, so working a bit of hunting and fishing into a stranger mission's timer can be a good way to increase your earnings. I generally take a quick look at the environment in the mission area and if things are quiet (as they were here prior to The Event) I'll slow down and gather animals. If not, I make a beeline for the goal and move on to the next thing. 

 

Being down to the wire with many minutes sunk into the mission certainly didn't make me feel any more trusting, but in all honesty I probably would have acted the same had there been more time on the clock. 

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