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Journey_95

Will GTA V be more appreciated after GTA VI?

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TheSantader25
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Male01 said:

Seriously? How do you even get run over by the train? You just have to move left or right on time. Do you dislike how Trevor wakes up on the tracks?

No I don't. It's one of the switch cutscenes that simply tells me what Trevor was doing when I wasn't controlling him. These are simple nitpicks that can be pinned on any game. I don't know why you don't use some of V's major issues that are known as facts as an excuse to prove your points instead of this minor stuff that are subjective as f*ck. Like the lack of interiors? Bad writing in the final LS part?The AI calling the cops when you stand beside them? Weird physics? 

Edited by TheSantader25

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Official General
22 hours ago, woggleman said:

When the 3D era GTAs came out the gaming world wasn't filled with a bunch of toxic babies. People have gone seriously downhill in the last decade or am I just looking at the past through rose colored glasses?

I'd say it's rose coloured glasses.

 

It was nothing to do with gamers being toxic babies or getting worse with their attitudes or demands. GTA III, when you look at it now is a bare-bones example of a GTA title, it had like just TWO interiors on the entire map (very small and near empty too), it had very few side missions, and a very basic AI-controlled living world. But yet, III was one of the biggest selling games of it's time and it single-handedly went on to propel the GTA series into it's legendary status as one of the most successful and popular franchises in gaming ever. Now ask yourself why ? Simply because III was completely revolutionary, it had offered the gaming community something we had never seen before - free-roaming, open world, with financially motivated crime action laced with the atmosphere of a Hollywood gangster movie. GTA Vice City and GTA San Andreas both massively improved on III's success by utilising advances in gaming technology to provide more and newer essential features and content that cemented the GTA series as the greatest gaming franchise ever in more recent and modern times - it was successive moments of gaming greatness given to us, one after the other, we eventually came to expect what we had and even more and better in the GTAs after the III-era. This was something Rockstar could have easily done, clearly knowing what made VC and SA so successful, for some mysterious reason with GTA IV and GTA V (to a much greater extent) they chose to downgrade and regress in certain areas, some that were vital to retaining interest and popularity in the series; the regression received a much bigger backlash with V, simply because Rockstar had a great chance to put everything right that IV did wrong, and to a certain segment of the GTA fanbase, IV was still a better game ! The final nail in the coffin was Rockstar's neglect of SP and complete focus on V Online and that is what has enraged the more hardcore members of the GTA fan base and left them with the bitter taste of disappointment that lingers to this day.

 

Simply put, after being used to supreme quality and greatness for an SP experience in GTA, Rockstar began to lose focus and lower their standards. That's very much the truth of the matter. 

 

 

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SonOfLiberty
1 hour ago, Official General said:

This was something Rockstar could have easily done, clearly knowing what made VC and SA so successful, for some mysterious reason with GTA IV and GTA V (to a much greater extent) they chose to downgrade and regress in certain areas, some that were vital to retaining interest and popularity in the series; the regression received a much bigger backlash with V, simply because Rockstar had a great chance to put everything right that IV did wrong, and to a certain segment of the GTA fanbase, IV was still a better game ! The final nail in the coffin was Rockstar's neglect of SP and complete focus on V Online and that is what has enraged the more hardcore members of the GTA fan base and left them with the bitter taste of disappointment that lingers to this day.

The thing with GTA IV is I can forgive its flaws much greater than I can with GTA V because GTA V managed to somehow screw up things GTA IV was able to do with confidence. Even though GTA IV lacked the popular features people wanted its base foundation was/is solid. Anything it did carry over from the 3D era (like Vigilante missions for example) was greatly improved.

 

GTA V's too much of a mixed bag IMO. It has great customisation, but the property management is a joke compared to the 3D era counterpart. To me for its time GTA IV done a lot more with what it had considering it started fresh again with a new engine, physics etc. GTA V should've been the culmination of everything R* achieved up until that point, but it falls far short of the mark.

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woggleman

It always baffled me how GTA IV got crap for the friend's phone calls but people generally don't give V crap for the property management. Sometimes I would get calls at inconvenient times but at least in IV you could initiate the hangouts yourself. In V you couldn't even initiate the property missions on your own. You had to wait for a call which came whenever it wanted to come. It also gets a pass on things like the slow walking indoors which didn't bother me much but if a certain other R game gets it than so should V. V also gets a pass for terrible missions like Scouting the port and the yoga which are more boring than almost any mission in the more realistic games. V gets a lot of passes because it is considered to be the return to the so called fun and arcadey style when more grounded games get raked over the coals for the smallest things. V gets a pass because for some reason despite all these boring things it is seen as putting fun before realism and people see what they want to see. I have learned that gamers in general tend to have a hostile reaction to anything that reeks of realism.

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Grotti Vigilante
6 minutes ago, woggleman said:

I have learned that gamers in general tend to have a hostile reaction to anything that reeks of realism.

I don't necessarily think this is a bad thing given that video games are supposed to be a form of escapism and a way to evade the burdens of real life. I mean realism isn't a bad thing, sometimes it feels better when things are more realistic since you can feel ever more defiant in a world like the GTA universe. We also play games to become something we are not, and to become powerful, so if a GTA game has realism it may make you feel more powerful if it feels realistic whenever you do terrible things without consequences (almost sounds a bit like an oxymoron I know, but you probably get what I mean). It's all a matter of subjective opinions though really, so nobody will ever please everybody.

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woggleman
1 minute ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

I don't necessarily think this is a bad thing given that video games are supposed to be a form of escapism and a way to evade the burdens of real life. I mean realism isn't a bad thing, sometimes it feels better when things are more realistic since you can feel ever more defiant in a world like the GTA universe. We also play games to become something we are not, and to become powerful, so if a GTA game has realism it may make you feel more powerful if it feels realistic whenever you do terrible things without consequences (almost sounds a bit like an oxymoron I know, but you probably get what I mean). It's all a matter of subjective opinions though really, so nobody will ever please everybody.

Certain games like fantasy games or those japanese turn based RPGs shouldn't be realistic but the kind of games R makes should be. Gamers won't be happy until all R games turn into Saints Row.

 

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Grotti Vigilante
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, woggleman said:

Certain games like fantasy games or those japanese turn based RPGs shouldn't be realistic but the kind of games R makes should be. Gamers won't be happy until all R games turn into Saints Row.

 

I do worry about GTA turning into Saints Row sometimes. I like Rockstar's similarity to real life in video games even when it's a little over-the-top like some GTA missions like Black Project from San Andreas, but even then that mission isn't as goofy and over-the-top as Saints Row from what I've experienced. Later games in the Saints Row series were of an especially surreal nature that was even criticised by people who loved the first and second games, so even Saints Row was slated for becoming Saints Row if you get my meaning. 

Edited by Grotti Vigilante

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woggleman
6 minutes ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

I do worry about GTA turning into Saints Row sometimes. I like Rockstar's similarity to real life in video games even when it's a little over-the-top like some GTA missions like Black Project from San Andreas, but even then that mission isn't as goofy and over-the-top as Saints Row from what I've experienced. Later games in the Saints Row series were of an especially surreal nature that was even criticised by people who loved the first and second games, so even Saints Row was slated for becoming Saints Row if you get my meaning. 

It probably will and it won't only be GTA. If I were R I would just leave games, sell the rights to their franchises and get into making movies and tv where what they are going for is more appreciated. Gamers seem to want comic book and over the top stuff. 

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SonOfLiberty
2 hours ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

I do worry about GTA turning into Saints Row sometimes. I like Rockstar's similarity to real life in video games even when it's a little over-the-top like some GTA missions like Black Project from San Andreas, but even then that mission isn't as goofy and over-the-top as Saints Row from what I've experienced. Later games in the Saints Row series were of an especially surreal nature that was even criticised by people who loved the first and second games, so even Saints Row was slated for becoming Saints Row if you get my meaning. 

GTAO is venturing into Saints Row territory, but I doubt R* would ever let their single player games go that far atleast in the direction the latest Saints Row games have gone.

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TheSantader25
2 hours ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

I do worry about GTA turning into Saints Row sometimes. I like Rockstar's similarity to real life in video games even when it's a little over-the-top like some GTA missions like Black Project from San Andreas, but even then that mission isn't as goofy and over-the-top as Saints Row from what I've experienced. Later games in the Saints Row series were of an especially surreal nature that was even criticised by people who loved the first and second games, so even Saints Row was slated for becoming Saints Row if you get my meaning. 

So I wonder why do you call yourself Grotti Vigilante? 😀

3 hours ago, Miamivicecity said:

The thing with GTA IV is I can forgive its flaws much greater than I can with GTA V because GTA V managed to somehow screw up things GTA IV was able to do with confidence. Even though GTA IV lacked the popular features people wanted its base foundation was/is solid. Anything it did carry over from the 3D era (like Vigilante missions for example) was greatly improved.

 

GTA V's too much of a mixed bag IMO. It has great customisation, but the property management is a joke compared to the 3D era counterpart. To me for its time GTA IV done a lot more with what it had considering it started fresh again with a new engine, physics etc. GTA V should've been the culmination of everything R* achieved up until that point, but it falls far short of the mark.

I really don't know about "forgiveness". We can "understand" why certain flaws exist like a new engine for IV or hardware limitations and online focus in V. But forgiving them? I really don't think so. First of all let me say that V kinda actually WAS like starting all over as well. The backlash after IV caused R* to reconsider MANY elements that I really doubt they thought they're going to touch.

 

In the end When I buy a "sequel" I expect it to improve over it's predecessors and bring something of it's own as well. What's the point of a new engine if it's going to add some new things and cause the missing of countless loved gameplay elements? Yeah we can look for excuses to why certain flaws happened but I really don't think knowing WHY they exist is gonna make us love a game more since obviously loving a game happens because of the existence of certain content. And if they are missing you're gonna be disappointed eventhough you may find OTHER things to love and like we discussed earlier love a game and be disappointed at the same time(That's how I feel towards IV and V anyway) 

 

From what I've seen from you so far I think Story related improvements play a big role for you so I can understand why you value IV over V. But as a guy who values gameplay above anything else (eventhough story is very important as well) IV really didn't meet my expectations after a game like San Andreas. I hope you understand how I felt when I played IV. 

 

 

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Male01
3 hours ago, woggleman said:

I have learned that gamers in general tend to have a hostile reaction to anything that reeks of realism.

Not really. We only hate awful attempts at being realistic. Does the map in V seem extremely immersive and full of life or is it just a bunch of rigged repetitions and posing that you weren't supposed to look at for long? Go to Verona Beach through the alley next to Floyd's apartment at midnight. Do you see cholos sitting in the stairs and/or standing next to them? Is a hooker next to you. Do those cholos tell you to get out?

 

What ever dude.

(In GTA V, you can be surrounded by people saying the exact same thing at the exact same time. Don't deny it.)

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FadeAway
3 hours ago, Miamivicecity said:

The thing with GTA IV is I can forgive its flaws much greater than I can with GTA V because GTA V managed to somehow screw up things GTA IV was able to do with confidence. Even though GTA IV lacked the popular features people wanted its base foundation was/is solid. Anything it did carry over from the 3D era (like Vigilante missions for example) was greatly improved.

 

GTA V's too much of a mixed bag IMO. It has great customisation, but the property management is a joke compared to the 3D era counterpart. To me for its time GTA IV done a lot more with what it had considering it started fresh again with a new engine, physics etc. GTA V should've been the culmination of everything R* achieved up until that point, but it falls far short of the mark.

The vigilante missions that carried over to IV is what I appreciated transferred over from 3D. And the taxi missions. Plus Roman's cab company there were multiple storylines involving it until its demise. I don't like not being able to purchase properties. With all that money at the end a home could be bought in Vinewood Hills or throughout the game. But to be fair IV didn't have purchasable properties either and Franklin had a house in Vinewood courtesy of Lester. Online of course has been a large component unfortunately for V and probably going forward.

 

I appreciate some aspects of V like I did IV and its expansion packs. While it did feel like it was everything culminated up to this point, it was also somewhat lackluster (like didn't do nothing new than what previous games did and similar missions). The 3D games hold more of a spot obviously because of those damn physics and manually putting in codes vs saving them, not having unlimited ammo (actually having to buy ammo). HD era and especially V is a piece of cake.

 

Will have to see official news by R* about VI and a trailer.

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SonOfLiberty
47 minutes ago, TheSantader25 said:

From what I've seen from you so far I think Story related improvements play a big role for you so I can understand why you value IV over V. But as a guy who values gameplay above anything else (eventhough story is very important as well) IV really didn't meet my expectations after a game like San Andreas. I hope you understand how I felt when I played IV. 

 

I understand. Don't get me wrong or anything, but please remember I value gameplay as much as I value story. However in saying that just adding things isn't good enough to me. Yes GTA V done a great job adding more vehicles, customising etc, but it gimped most of the things that made GTA IV great.

 

As you already know San Andreas isn't very high on my favourite GTA list so my expectations for GTA IV were very different to yours. To be honest I thought the GTA series was getting a bit stale with San Andreas. It introduced too many things that felt out of place in a GTA game to me like the jetpack, gym, RPG elements and the side missions started feeling more ridiculous and absurd. These might be fan favourites and I'm probably in the minority, but it didn't upset me that they weren't in GTA IV because I was growing tired of the wacky and goofy GTA formula that hadn't changed much besides technical capabilities since 1997.

 

GTA IV felt like a mature reboot for the new generation. Some hated it, some loved it, but most fell somewhere in between. With GTA V simply adding things that weren't in GTA IV wasn't good enough and to me it felt like R* were focusing too hard on catering to the crowd that complained they didn't have much to do in GTA IV, but it made them lose sight of GTA IV's fundamentals. In the end it just ended up alienating fans of GTA IV AND the 3D era which isn't a good sign if you ask me.

 

 

 

 

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TheSantader25
6 minutes ago, Miamivicecity said:

In the end it just ended up alienating fans of GTA IV AND the 3D era which isn't a good sign if you ask me.

 

The worst thing right now is how separated the fanbase is when it comes to opinions which really makes me think what the hell R* want to do in the next game. People missing the SA elements, people missing IV elements, 3D era fans who thought V was a step in the right direction for the franchise and people who hate it and all at the same time these NEW people who like GTA ONLINE and some OTHER people who are basically very angry with R* lately. It gives you a headache. 

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SonOfLiberty
1 hour ago, TheSantader25 said:

The worst thing right now is how separated the fanbase is when it comes to opinions which really makes me think what the hell R* want to do in the next game. People missing the SA elements, people missing IV elements, 3D era fans who thought V was a step in the right direction for the franchise and people who hate it and all at the same time these NEW people who like GTA ONLINE and some OTHER people who are basically very angry with R* lately. It gives you a headache. 

It doesn't really bother me.

 

If GTA VI appeals to me I really couldn't care less how R* approach it. People still treat GTA IV like it's the spawn of Satan, but it only makes me love it more.😎

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Grotti Vigilante
8 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

So I wonder why do you call yourself Grotti Vigilante? 

Because even GTA Online is allowed to get something right every now and then. Not to mention, the name sounds awesome, the car is awesome, and it's pretty much a car driven by Batman. Need I say more?

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TheSantader25
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

Because even GTA Online is allowed to get something right every now and then. Not to mention, the name sounds awesome, the car is awesome, and it's pretty much a car driven by Batman. Need I say more?

Oh so you're a batman lover. Well IMO such a car doesn't belong in GTA But I shouldn't talk about this because I pretty much hate all Super heroes and Batman. 

Edited by TheSantader25

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Grotti Vigilante
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, TheSantader25 said:

Oh so you're a batman lover. Well IMO such a car doesn't belong in GTA but I shouldn't talk about this because I pretty much hate all Super heroes and Batman. 

I'll just pretend you didn't say that about the car. It feels like it would be disowning my entire existence...

 

in case anyone doesn't catch on, that was clearly a joke. I can deal with him having a different opinion... even if he is completely wrong.

Edited by Grotti Vigilante

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Journey_95
18 hours ago, woggleman said:

After the polarizing reaction to RDR2 I can see them going even more arcadey then V. I think from now on R will play it safe and give the masses what they will like.

They may make the controls "smoother" and tone down the realistic stuff but I really doubt the serious darker story and immersive open world are going anywhere in the next RDR. GTA obviously will always be more arcadey and also have a more fun tone (which was clear once IV got backlash, nothing to do with the RDR series)

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D9fred95
4 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

Oh so you're a batman lover. Well IMO such a car doesn't belong in GTA But I shouldn't talk about this because I pretty much hate all Super heroes and Batman. 

I might be more willing to accept the Vigilante's existence if it was introduced in a similar way the JB 700 was: on a movie set. But the way GTAO just shoves it into the universe is just silly.

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WFD1992
Posted (edited)

"GTA Is Turning Into Saints Row"

.....No, no it is not. Not even close. Just because Online added some "futuristic" stuff does not mean its turning into Saints Row. 

Until you gain the ability to run at super fast speeds (without cheats), have superpowers (without cheats) and/or jump/ glide (without cheats) by sheer will, shut the f up!

(also at least Saints Row doesnt have microtransactions)

Edited by WFD1992

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D9fred95
43 minutes ago, WFD1992 said:

"GTA Is Turning Into Saints Row"

.....No, no it is not. Not even close. Just because Online added some "futuristic" stuff does not mean its turning into Saints Row. 

Until you gain the ability to run at super fast speeds (without cheats), have superpowers (without cheats) and/or jump/ glide (without cheats) by sheer will, shut the f up!

(also at least Saints Row doesnt have microtransactions)

I'm pretty sure when people refer to GTA turning into Saint's Row they mean "wacky nonsense added in just because". That's something GTAO actually does, futuristic weaponized vehicles added in because they're cool. 

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woggleman

GTA V did turn into Saints Row and that is what much of the public wants in Rockstar games. They are catering to the fun before realism crowd and they will continue to do so.

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Journey_95
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

The worst thing right now is how separated the fanbase is when it comes to opinions which really makes me think what the hell R* want to do in the next game. People missing the SA elements, people missing IV elements, 3D era fans who thought V was a step in the right direction for the franchise and people who hate it and all at the same time these NEW people who like GTA ONLINE and some OTHER people who are basically very angry with R* lately. It gives you a headache. 

True and they can't satisfy everyone so either way lots of people will be pissed off. I just hope they try their best and don't halfass it because of Online.

50 minutes ago, woggleman said:

GTA V did turn into Saints Row and that is what much of the public wants in Rockstar games. They are catering to the fun before realism crowd and they will continue to do so.

Nah it didn't..GTA V had plenty of OTT missions but Saints Row (last two especially) are way more crazy. In those games they don't really care about the story and characters or having a detailed alive open world, just mindless fun with no logic etc.. GTA V was more than that imho (despite them clearly making it more over the top and lighthearted after the IV backlash) but GTA:O is basically Saints Row now

Edited by Journey_95

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Official General
1 hour ago, woggleman said:

GTA V did turn into Saints Row and that is what much of the public wants in Rockstar games. They are catering to the fun before realism crowd and they will continue to do so.

I would not go as far as to say that for the SP, but that is definitely the case for Online. It is such a relief we don’t see all that crap from Online in SP, or it may well give Rockstar even more stupid and sillier ideas.

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TheSantader25
10 minutes ago, Official General said:

I would not go as far as to say that for the SP, but that is definitely the case for Online. It is such a relief we don’t see all that crap from Online in SP, or it may well give Rockstar even more stupid and sillier ideas.

Some people seem to be pissed that story related content about aliens and zombies were cut. I'm thankful that they were. They shouldn't be anything more than Easter eggs. 

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Darealbandicoot
43 minutes ago, TheSantader25 said:

Some people seem to be pissed that story related content about aliens and zombies were cut. I'm thankful that they were. They shouldn't be anything more than Easter eggs. 

Well it was cut and used for GTA Online so there's that. Undead Nightmare was one of the best selling and received dlc's EVER AND didn't interfere with the main story. V DLC would probably have been just as well received since the map was supposed to be changed into decayed for the zombie and at war for the Alien. 

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Journey_95
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

Some people seem to be pissed that story related content about aliens and zombies were cut. I'm thankful that they were. They shouldn't be anything more than Easter eggs. 

It would have been fun but overall unnecessary imho. Like Undead Nightmare. I would have preferred some real canon story DLC instead but apparently they weren't planning that.

Edited by Journey_95

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woggleman

V didn't go all the way into over the top stuff because it was their first GTA after IV and they wanted to sort of balance the two which it sometimes fails at and sometimes doesn't but expect the next one to go full over the top especially with the reaction to their latest game.

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Journey_95
22 minutes ago, woggleman said:

V didn't go all the way into over the top stuff because it was their first GTA after IV and they wanted to sort of balance the two which it sometimes fails at and sometimes doesn't but expect the next one to go full over the top especially with the reaction to their latest game.

I hope not and I doubt that..sure they will have easier controls (less weight to the characters etc. too) and no realistic slow stuff but that doesn't mean they will suddenly go all Saints Row on us. No GTA game has gone that far. They can have more "open" levels (another complaint) without doing that too, I haven't seen anyone saying RDR2's isn't OTT enough.

 

 

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