Worst GTA Antagonist

[Jeansowaty]

To all fellow IV fans, I have to completely disagree about Bulgarin. He served his purpose in IV and I'm glad he was not a final antag. Imagine killing someone whom you saw only in 2 cutscenes. Oh wait. In any case I feel that Pegorino was okay and he had more relevance towards Niko than Bulgarin during the time the game takes place. Ray also fits TBOGT quite good imo. Luis is reckless enough to kill him and risk some other Russian oligarchs going after him, unlike Niko. I could see the story being rewritten so Pegorino takes his role, but I cannot see Ray, who despite being a key character has a minor role, working as the main baddie of IV.

[CynicalMexican]

10 minutes ago, Jeansowaty said:

To all fellow IV fans, I have to completely disagree about Bulgarin. He served his purpose in IV and I'm glad he was not a final antag. Imagine killing someone whom you saw only in 2 cutscenes. Oh wait. In any case I feel that Pegorino was okay and he had more relevance towards Niko than Bulgarin during the time the game takes place. Ray also fits TBOGT quite good imo. Luis is reckless enough to kill him and risk some other Russian oligarchs going after him, unlike Niko. I could see the story being rewritten so Pegorino takes his role, but I cannot see Ray, who despite being a key character has a minor role, working as the main baddie of IV.

It doesn't make a whole lot of sense too, because Bulgarin largely just doesn't care about Niko, nor does he bother him. After Russian Revolution, he seems to have just cut his losses in the Adriatic and only showed up because Dimitri manipulated him.

[ThatBenGuy1998]

4 hours ago, Jeansowaty said:

To all fellow IV fans, I have to completely disagree about Bulgarin. He served his purpose in IV and I'm glad he was not a final antag. Imagine killing someone whom you saw only in 2 cutscenes. Oh wait. In any case I feel that Pegorino was okay and he had more relevance towards Niko than Bulgarin during the time the game takes place. Ray also fits TBOGT quite good imo. Luis is reckless enough to kill him and risk some other Russian oligarchs going after him, unlike Niko. I could see the story being rewritten so Pegorino takes his role, but I cannot see Ray, who despite being a key character has a minor role, working as the main baddie of IV.

I agree completely. I mean, a lot of IV fans (apart from you, Cynical Mexican, and possibly a few others of course) are all like “RaY bUlGaRiN sHoUlD bE a MaIn AnTaGoNiSt oF GTA IV!” Ok well, who the heck is gonna be the main antagonist of TBOGT? Lmao. I personally think it all fits quite perfectly. And besides, Dimitri Rascalov’s death is even mentioned in the very last mission of TBOGT so it really kinda ties in after all.

[CynicalMexican]

To get back a bit on topic, my controversial opinion is that Massimo Torini isn't really that bad of an antagonist, at least not for the game he is in.

 

GTA: LCS is interesting because the game isn't centered around a revenge narrative like all the original trilogy games are; all of those have a "get revenge on this person" narrative: Claude with Catalina, Tommy with Sonny Forelli, and CJ with Big Smoke/Tenpenny. GTA LCS doesn't follow that narrative at all, and the game instead focuses on the power struggles between the different Mafia families in Liberty City, and conflicts leading up to the present day situation in 2001. Massimo wasn't meant to be loathed or hated like say, Tenpenny or Catalina. He was a rival boss making moves abroad to achieve a goal. The game is less focused on a revenge narrative, and more of a conflict narrative.

 

[ThatBenGuy1998]

9 hours ago, CynicalMexican said:

To get back a bit on topic, my controversial opinion is that Massimo Torini isn't really that bad of an antagonist, at least not for the game he is in.

 

GTA: LCS is interesting because the game isn't centered around a revenge narrative like all the original trilogy games are; all of those have a "get revenge on this person" narrative: Claude with Catalina, Tommy with Sonny Forelli, and CJ with Big Smoke/Tenpenny. GTA LCS doesn't follow that narrative at all, and the game instead focuses on the power struggles between the different Mafia families in Liberty City, and conflicts leading up to the present day situation in 2001. Massimo wasn't meant to be loathed or hated like say, Tenpenny or Catalina. He was a rival boss making moves abroad to achieve a goal. The game is less focused on a revenge narrative, and more of a conflict narrative.

 

Agreed. I personally think that LCS is the black sheep of the GTA titles taking place in NYC (or should I say, Liberty City). In fact, it’s even the black sheep of the 3D era games. It’s sorta like GTA V in that regard. Both games are more of a conflict narrative rather than an actual revenge narrative. III, VC, SA, VCS, IV, TLAD, and TBOGT are all more of actual revenge narratives, on the other hand. While I do like revenge narratives better, I guess it never hurts to have more of a conflict narrative every now and then.

[Corndawg93]

Massimo Torini, he's barely in the game

I agree with Jimmy Pegorino, its a bit weak that one of the main antagonist is introduced so late in the game

And the last guy I want to throw shade at is Sonny Forelli, he's so boring, phone call after phone call, honestly I felt more compelled to kill Lance Vance then Sonny

[Smash Bandicoot]

Torini, no discussion.

Jerry Martinez also sucks balls and is the second worst main villain behind Torini

[CynicalMexican]

14 hours ago, Smash Bandicoot said:

Torini, no discussion.

Jerry Martinez also sucks balls and is the second worst main villain behind Torini

 

At least I can take Torini seriously. Jerry Martinez was a f*cking clown pure and simple.

[sefus]

Ryder - Shermhead 

[GhettoJesus]

Everyone in V save for Haines. Very hastily thrown together characters. To say someone else besides them I am going with Ryder. His betrayal is very poorly written, no one ever acknowledges him so you just completely forget about him and focus on Smoke until Photo Opportunity.

[Algonquin Assassin]

On 8/21/2021 at 7:27 AM, Jeansowaty said:

To all fellow IV fans, I have to completely disagree about Bulgarin. He served his purpose in IV and I'm glad he was not a final antag. Imagine killing someone whom you saw only in 2 cutscenes. Oh wait. In any case I feel that Pegorino was okay and he had more relevance towards Niko than Bulgarin during the time the game takes place. Ray also fits TBOGT quite good imo. Luis is reckless enough to kill him and risk some other Russian oligarchs going after him, unlike Niko. I could see the story being rewritten so Pegorino takes his role, but I cannot see Ray, who despite being a key character has a minor role, working as the main baddie of IV.

 

Imagine if in San Andreas (for example) Tenpenny and Pulaski are only seen at the beginning while they're taunting CJ, but then they completely disappear and show up again halfway the story before disappearing for good without any sort of resolution? Because that's what Bulgarin feels like.

 

The fact he's one of the main reasons Niko comes to the city (Niko says this himself) and he's kind of introduced as an "antagonist" when it's revealed he's working Dimitri isn't anyone's fault for assuming that he would've ended being a bigger character than he ended up becoming. It's not like anyone had any idea he was being protected by plot armour so he could be slotted into TBOGT did they? As they say hindsight is 20/20 and it's easy to see that of course the reason he's not killed is because TBOGT needed an antagonist, but it wasn't that way in 2008 before anyone had any clue what TBOGT was. Who the characters were and so on.

 

At the very least between Russian Revolution and Diamond's Are A Girl's Best Friend he could've contacted Niko every now and then (like Dimitri does) with threats or something. I have to admit when I first played GTA IV I totally forgot about Bulgarin so when he did show up again I was like "oh yeah". Dimitri's characterisation despite the lack of screentime after his betrayal is well done and there's just enough to keep him in the loop to make us think he's he's still lurking, but Bulargin's sucks in GTA IV after a promising start. Maybe he didn't have to be killed after only 2 cutscenes, but he could've been fleshed out more. It wouldn't have made his 2nd appearance so jarring like he just came back from the depths of hell after MIA for a large chunk of the game. Once again I know this is because of TBOGT, but it's blatantly more obvious when replaying GTA IV again and again that something just doesn't feel right when viewed in isolation and I say that as someone who adores GTA IV's story, but I can't defend it here. Sorry.

 

I don't even really have a problem with him being the antagonist in TBOGT necessarily, but it's more the fact he's introduced as being a bigger player in GTA IV than he ends up being that bothers me. It's a similar mistake that's repeated in GTA V when Madrazo is introduced, but nothing much comes out of it after the strong first impression. If they wanted Bulgarin to be the antagonist in TBOGT they should've just done what they done with Billy and kept him out of the main story and had no ties to Niko.

Edited October 8, 2021 by MiamiViceCity1986

[illicitstreet]

Ryder is probably my least favorite GTA antagonist, it would have been better if he died at the Green Sabre mission or Reuniting the Families, he just feels extra, and there are just too few interactions with him after CJ finds out about the betrayal or even suggesting that he's hiding something on early-game like Big Smoke 

[Jeansowaty]

On 10/8/2021 at 2:29 AM, MiamiViceCity1986 said:

 

Imagine if in San Andreas (for example) Tenpenny and Pulaski are only seen at the beginning while they're taunting CJ, but then they completely disappear and show up again halfway the story before disappearing for good without any sort of resolution? Because that's what Bulgarin feels like.

 

The fact he's one of the main reasons Niko comes to the city (Niko says this himself) and he's kind of introduced as an "antagonist" when it's revealed he's working Dimitri isn't anyone's fault for assuming that he would've ended being a bigger character than he ended up becoming. It's not like anyone had any idea he was being protected by plot armour so he could be slotted into TBOGT did they? As they say hindsight is 20/20 and it's easy to see that of course the reason he's not killed is because TBOGT needed an antagonist, but it wasn't that way in 2008 before anyone had any clue what TBOGT was. Who the characters were and so on.

 

At the very least between Russian Revolution and Diamond's Are A Girl's Best Friend he could've contacted Niko every now and then (like Dimitri does) with threats or something. I have to admit when I first played GTA IV I totally forgot about Bulgarin so when he did show up again I was like "oh yeah". Dimitri's characterisation despite the lack of screentime after his betrayal is well done and there's just enough to keep him in the loop to make us think he's he's still lurking, but Bulargin's sucks in GTA IV after a promising start. Maybe he didn't have to be killed after only 2 cutscenes, but he could've been fleshed out more. It wouldn't have made his 2nd appearance so jarring like he just came back from the depths of hell after MIA for a large chunk of the game. Once again I know this is because of TBOGT, but it's blatantly more obvious when replaying GTA IV again and again that something just doesn't feel right when viewed in isolation and I say that as someone who adores GTA IV's story, but I can't defend it here. Sorry.

 

I don't even really have a problem with him being the antagonist in TBOGT necessarily, but it's more the fact he's introduced as being a bigger player in GTA IV than he ends up being that bothers me. It's a similar mistake that's repeated in GTA V when Madrazo is introduced, but nothing much comes out of it after the strong first impression. If they wanted Bulgarin to be the antagonist in TBOGT they should've just done what they done with Billy and kept him out of the main story and had no ties to Niko.

Yeah no, I agree with you through and through, if he was given a bigger, more important role in IV then it would be fine to have him as main antagonist material. But, in the final product he only appears twice. Imagine if he would take Pegorino's place in Revenge and in Deal he would disappear or kill Dimitri and you'd have to kill him as a final boss. It would be very anticlimatic imo, we saw him only twice and that was in cutscenes. People who skipped them wouldn't even know who he is. Fun fact, in the beta Niko was able to have Bulgarin's phone number in his phone

 

In any case, as it is I would say IV did him dirty, TBOGT did him fine. His personality change isn't incredibly jarring to me. We only saw him twice in IV and that's when he's on bad terms with Niko. Even if, he has some quirky moments like "Really?" or "Niko Bellic, how come when something is stolen from me, you're not far away?". It's obvious he would be seen as more amicable and friendly with Luis, plus it's not like he's not showing off his power to Luis and trying to scare him into doing his bidding either. The way I see it, Ray is a coward and a pussy, hiding behing all his power, force and hitmen. I actually elaborated a bit on this matter in the Russian DLC I was writing. Check the spoiler if you're curious for more.

 

Spoiler

Among other things, Ray intends to buy out the Liberty City Rampage team from Marki Ashvili, who is a captain of Kenny Petrović, but Kenny is reluctant to sell the team. In order to force Marki into doing this, he gets involved with the billionaire oligarch Eduard Borodin (whom Jacob and Niko kill during Paper Trail) who is involved in financing terrorism and is a personal friend of Ashvili. Gennadi Zhukov, Dimitri's second-in-command, is sent to work for Borodin on Bulgarin's behalf, which however becomes a big problem - Borodin is very reckless and a drug addicted mess, he orders Gennadi to steal drugs from someone, no one else than the Gambetti Family. On the verge of an unwanted gang war, a meeting between Ray and Kenny is held, Dimitri can't attend as he's arrested by the LCPD. It turns out that not only did Ray order to kill Marki Ashvili, but so did Kenny and had Gogi Gamrekeli, Bulgarin's lieutenant killed. Gennadi manages to defuse the situation by claiming that internal struggle is now the least of their worries, as the Gambetti Family storm the meeting. Fighting their way out of it, Petrović flees Liberty City for a while to lay low, while Gennadi is employed by Bulgarin for a few tasks, including kidnapping the cook, then bringing his severed head to the building in Little Italy. Ray thanks Gennadi for his help and announces he intends to flee the city for a while too. His portrayal here is still eccentric like he was in TBOGT, but I guess a little toned down and more down to earth. He's definitely though not always mad like he is in IV. That would be way too boring.

 

Edited October 9, 2021 by Jeansowaty

[DR Cherry Bomb]

Lance Vance - no reason for him to be an antagonist whatsoever. Sure go on with the argument that "tOmMy mIsTrEaTeD him", but IMO Lance was a useless c*nt so it's justified and his betrayal never made sense at all.

Ryder - ngl I actually liked his character and all in all I do feel bad for him for his mistreatment by the writers, but it doesn't help that the damage had already been done. Poor dude.

Massimo Torni and the other LCS antagonists - such MF'ing jokes. at least they fit for how terrible LCS' story writing generally is.

Stretch and Wei Cheng - had potential, albeit rushed. Especially since I never even remembered Stretch until his betrayal lol.

Edited June 1 by DR Cherry Bomb

[not a bot]

Stretch and Wei Chang. Totally forgettable characters.

[sabitsuki]

Massimo Torini since he was pretty much just a vessel for the Sicilian Mob. Honestly in comparison I think him and his crew are less evil than the Leones anyway, which makes the antagonism feel really underwhelming.

 

I think Uncle Leone would have made a better antagonist if he just had more appearances, sort of like the man behind the man thing, which goes to show how poorly written LCS was.

Edited May 26 by sabitsuki

[Homicidal Hipster]

Jimmy Pegorino. Introduced too late in the game and Niko's reason's for wanting revenge are piss weak. You potentially never even took Kate out on a date so there's really no reason for Niko to give a rat's ass about peg killing her. He just seems really rushed as a character.. Bulgarian should of taken his place as secondary IV antag if Dimitri is killed in dish served cold

[Madd Slayer]

Devin Weston - Guy is literally just a rich prick who just has a private army, which is honestly a lame concept for an antagonist. Atleast Stretch & Wei Cheng are gang leaders and Steve is a FIB agent with connections. Devin would be nothing without Merryweather.

 

Madrazo should honestly take his place instead.

 

Edited August 23 by Madd Slayer

[Grov71]

Massimo  Torini is the obvious one. Asides from him I hate:

 

Ryder: his character was written poorly and i think he should have just died to the ballas in the green sabre instead

 

Devin Weston: Devin himself is not a bad character, but I hate how he's the main antagonist. He's introduced almost halfway through the game and betrays us in the last 20 missions. And "betrayal" is just scamming them. He did try to kill Michael's family as well but he only sent an army because he's a coward who has connections. He should have been a minor antagonist like stretch and cheng and Steve should have been the main antagonist. He's dangerous, does things himself and wanted to arrest michael kill trevor and make Franklin kill his friend.