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RED DEAD REDEMPTION 2 - "Chronological" Mission Order


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jimmyoneshot
2 hours ago, BrandyNova said:

1.  That always seemed like such a random line to me.   I always figured he says that because Uncle and Swanson are the ones who keep finding passengers.   But I don't know of any "passengers" that they brought into the gang?  Settings up for their respective missions is an interesting idea.  

"Passengers" is usually a phrase used to describe someone who doesn't work and lives off the work of others i.e. other people are "driving" while others are sitting there being driven. I think they usually use the word "freeloaders" in the USA or "not pulling your weight". Dutch was essentially insulting them for not doing enough work while other members of the gang are.

 

2 hours ago, BrandyNova said:

Seems like that's something he would snark about.

Ye I agree, it does seem like something Micah would mention ha. Although it could be argued that the gang all managed to find each other at Lakay but in that case there was a note left at Shady Belle for them to follow. Micah would've had to track them to Clemens Point from Dewberry Creek.

 

2 hours ago, BrandyNova said:

I've also noticed that Dutch reproaches Micah about Strawberry a ways into Chapter 3 for me, after they've had several other conversations.  It always seemed a bit out of place.  

Ye that's the thing I don't think I've ever seen it in Chapter 2 and I don't think it happens until a fair way into Chapter 3 for me too. Advertising The New American Art specifically cannot be unlocked until American Pastoral is completed because Micah is in the ending cutscene of Advertising. It would be interesting to see if this dialogue ever happens before Advertising is unlocked/completed or if it only happens after that point.

 

If it does only happen after that point though it could be a couple of things:-

  • Possibly a clue that American Pastoral can be done later
  • Could be a bug and maybe this conversation was meant to unlock any time after Micah returns but didn't
  • Rockstar could've been lazy with it and just triggered it to activate at the latest possible point that Micah could be back at camp
  • Like 2
4 hours ago, jimmyoneshot said:

"Passengers" is usually a phrase used to describe someone who doesn't work and lives off the work of others i.e. other people are "driving" while others are sitting there being driven. I think they usually use the word "freeloaders" in the USA or "not pulling your weight". Dutch was essentially insulting them for not doing enough work while other members of the gang are.

 

Ye I agree, it does seem like something Micah would mention ha. Although it could be argued that the gang all managed to find each other at Lakay but in that case there was a note left at Shady Belle for them to follow. Micah would've had to track them to Clemens Point from Dewberry Creek.

 

Ye that's the thing I don't think I've ever seen it in Chapter 2 and I don't think it happens until a fair way into Chapter 3 for me too. Advertising The New American Art specifically cannot be unlocked until American Pastoral is completed because Micah is in the ending cutscene of Advertising. It would be interesting to see if this dialogue ever happens before Advertising is unlocked/completed or if it only happens after that point.

 

If it does only happen after that point though it could be a couple of things:-

  • Possibly a clue that American Pastoral can be done later
  • Could be a bug and maybe this conversation was meant to unlock any time after Micah returns but didn't
  • Rockstar could've been lazy with it and just triggered it to activate at the latest possible point that Micah could be back at camp

OH!  I get it now!  He's telling Uncle and Swanson that they can't be passengers any more and have get to work.  Funny how that just didn't parse for me hehe  Thanks Jimmy   😊

 

Good points with the other convos.   I like the idea of leaving Micah as long as possible, so I'll be trying that next.   In my last playthrough (filming), I consistently saw the Dutch/Micah convo on Day 2 in Chapter 3.  This was in the late afternoon after returning from American Distillation.    Is Advertising unlocked after those two missions are complete (American Pastoral & American Distillation)?    If so, that would support your theory that the convo won't happen until Advertising  is unlocked.   

 

 

  • Like 2
jimmyoneshot
1 hour ago, BrandyNova said:

OH!  I get it now!  He's telling Uncle and Swanson that they can't be passengers any more and have get to work.  Funny how that just didn't parse for me hehe  Thanks Jimmy   😊

 

Good points with the other convos.   I like the idea of leaving Micah as long as possible, so I'll be trying that next.   In my last playthrough (filming), I consistently saw the Dutch/Micah convo on Day 2 in Chapter 3.  This was in the late afternoon after returning from American Distillation.    Is Advertising unlocked after those two missions are complete (American Pastoral & American Distillation)?    If so, that would support your theory that the convo won't happen until Advertising  is unlocked.   

 

 

Ha no worries. I'm wondering if it's actually British slang maybe and not used in the US. 

 

Ye Advertising requires all 3 of these to be done:-

  • American Pastoral Scene
  • American Distillation
  • Course Of True Love 3

So if those 3 are completed that might actually be it.

44 minutes ago, jimmyoneshot said:

Ha no worries. I'm wondering if it's actually British slang maybe and not used in the US. 

 

Ye Advertising requires all 3 of these to be done:-

  • American Pastoral Scene
  • American Distillation
  • Course Of True Love 3

So if those 3 are completed that might actually be it.

Interesting...  I got the interaction on Day 2, but didn't do COTL3 until Day 4, right before I did Advertising.    So Advertising was not unlocked yet.  🤔

  • Like 1
jimmyoneshot
1 minute ago, BrandyNova said:

Interesting...  I got the interaction on Day 2, but didn't do COTL3 until Day 4, right before I did Advertising.    So Advertising was not unlocked yet.  🤔

Ah in that case it might mean that it requires Dutch to be back at camp and free which would be the case if A New South and American Distillation are both done because if New South isn't done he stands at the back of camp facing the water waiting for that mission to start so wouldn't get involved in dialogue and if American Distillation is available he is always out of camp. That might be it then.

There isn't much of a time gap between the end of Chapter 2 when Micah returns and day 2 or 3 in Chapter 3 when that conversation can happen, so it doesn't seem out of place to me.

 

This game is also very random when things spawn. A prime example is when Swanson gives Arthur the platinum pocket watch, which he stole from the guys at Flatneck. Usually you'd think he does this within in the next few days he's back at camp, but I've had this encounter as late as in the middle of Chapter 3 before.

  • Like 2
jimmyoneshot
2 hours ago, Dan_1983 said:

There isn't much of a time gap between the end of Chapter 2 when Micah returns and day 2 or 3 in Chapter 3 when that conversation can happen, so it doesn't seem out of place to me.

 

This game is also very random when things spawn. A prime example is when Swanson gives Arthur the platinum pocket watch, which he stole from the guys at Flatneck. Usually you'd think he does this within in the next few days he's back at camp, but I've had this encounter as late as in the middle of Chapter 3 before.

Ye true. I think in the case of Chapter 3 it likely just becomes available if Micah and Dutch are both back at camp and Dutch isn't waiting in a spot for a mission he's involved in to start which would mean New South, American Distillation and Friends In Very Low Places can't be currently available.

 

It'd be interesting to see if there is any possible way of getting it in Chapter 2. That would require American Pastoral Scene to be unlocked and done. It's a confusing one to unlock but based on my testing a while back all these missions need to be done before it unlocks:-

 

- Americans At Rest
- Paying A Social Call
- A Quiet Time
- Blessed Are The Meek
- Pouring Forth Oil 1
- Polite Society Valentine Style (Unlocks Pouring Forth Oil 1)
- The First Shall Be Last (Unlocks Pouring Forth Oil 1)
- We Loved Once And True 1 (Unlocks Pouring Forth Oil 1)
- Money Lending and Other Sins 1 - 2 (Unlocks We Loved Once And True 1)
- Money Lending and Other Sins 3

 

I'll probably do another test at some point by doing all of these and then just hanging around camp to see what happens.

  • Like 2
13 hours ago, Dan_1983 said:

There isn't much of a time gap between the end of Chapter 2 when Micah returns and day 2 or 3 in Chapter 3 when that conversation can happen, so it doesn't seem out of place to me.

 

This game is also very random when things spawn. A prime example is when Swanson gives Arthur the platinum pocket watch, which he stole from the guys at Flatneck. Usually you'd think he does this within in the next few days he's back at camp, but I've had this encounter as late as in the middle of Chapter 3 before.

Yeah it seemed like a time gap to me, since I was filming.  I filmed each mission about 20 times, then each day took many retakes to get it just right. 

 

Plus the fact that Dutch had already had a convo with Micah about Miller at that point, it seemed weird that he starts off saying "So... you're back..." as if this is the first time they had talked since Strawberry.

If Micah is near Strawberry until Chapter 3, how and when does he suggest to Dutch about Dewberry Creek if he's never back in camp in Chapter 2?

 

Micah leaves camp in Chapter 2 early to scout with Lenny and doesn't return until he and Arthur rob the banking stagecoach. 

 

I also doubt Micah suggested Dewberry Creek very early in Chapter 2 as the gang looked like they just settled at Horseshoe Overlook.

  • Like 2
10 hours ago, BrandyNova said:

Yeah it seemed like a time gap to me, since I was filming.  I filmed each mission about 20 times, then each day took many retakes to get it just right. 

 

Plus the fact that Dutch had already had a convo with Micah about Miller at that point, it seemed weird that he starts off saying "So... you're back..." as if this is the first time they had talked since Strawberry.

Actually makes more sense that one of the first conversations he has with Dutch is sucking up to him and also asking about the Blackwater money as it shows Micah's true nature. 

 

By the time Micah arrives back in camp in Chapter 2, the heat is rising on the gang again and Dutch would be more concerned about Arthur's meeting with the Pinkertons and Mac's death then to ask Micah about Strawberry. If you speak to Dutch around this time, he seems to be in a sullen mood. 

7 hours ago, Dan_1983 said:

If Micah is near Strawberry until Chapter 3, how and when does he suggest to Dutch about Dewberry Creek if he's never back in camp in Chapter 2?

 

Micah leaves camp in Chapter 2 early to scout with Lenny and doesn't return until he and Arthur rob the banking stagecoach. 

 

I also doubt Micah suggested Dewberry Creek very early in Chapter 2 as the gang looked like they just settled at Horseshoe Overlook.

Yeah that's a really good point.  It would have to have been in Ch1.     Micah may have suggested Dewberry Creek as an alternative to Horseshoe Overlook.   But Dutch listened to Hosea, rather than Micah.   At one point in Ch1, Hosea mentions Horseshoe a couple times, and the second time seems very insistent about it.  I wondered why.  Maybe he was worried Micah had been whispering in Dutch's ear?  After Blackwater, I would be.     

But other than that implication, I can't think of any thing else that might suggest that.

 

On 4/24/2023 at 12:18 PM, BrandyNova said:

Yeah that's a really good point.  It would have to have been in Ch1.     Micah may have suggested Dewberry Creek as an alternative to Horseshoe Overlook.   But Dutch listened to Hosea, rather than Micah.   At one point in Ch1, Hosea mentions Horseshoe a couple times, and the second time seems very insistent about it.  I wondered why.  Maybe he was worried Micah had been whispering in Dutch's ear?  After Blackwater, I would be.     

But other than that implication, I can't think of any thing else that might suggest that.

 

I don't think  Micah would've  suggested Dewberry Creek in Ch1. Dewberry Creek is a open area to trap the gang.   Micah probably found out about Dewberry Creek when he was in jail with a O'drisscoll.  It is likely Micah got Dutch's wanted poster while he was in jail too.  For me, Only time  Micah would've suggest Dewberry Creek is when Arthur and John prep for the Train robbery in Lemoyne.  Arthur told Dutch and Dutch told Micah about the train robbery in Lemoyne. Which means Micah should be back in camp before PFO3 and PFO4. While Arthur not in camp, It is a good time for Micah about suggest Dewberry Creek  and be in Dutch's ear about going back to Blackwater. 

 

Having Micah back in camp before PFO4 fits better with Arthur and Sean's dialogue about Micah in PFO4. Plus, before Arthur leaves for the train robbery. Micah would be in Dutch's ear about going back to Blackwater and apologizing for getting arrested. Micah only cared for taking Dutch back to Blackwater to collect the money or collecting the bounty on Dutch,Arthur and Hosea. It make sense to go back to Micah's small camp near Strawberry in CH.3 to find Dutch's wanted poster.

Edited by Psycho18
Aldous Bramley

1. If I choose to do Ellie Anne Swan bounty as John - article about it will appear in 1907 newspaper?

2. Is it possible to surrender to the lawman checking crime scene while doing Valentine doctor robbery? Or he will start shooting on sight? 

EpiceneBlue

Curious. Is it possible to do Social VlCall BEFORE Americans at Rest? I swear I read something about someone having Keiran free at Sean's party but I can't imagine doing Social Call after Americans at Rest but BEFORE First Shall Be Last.

Edited by EpiceneBlue
Role-Play Walkthrough

Damn. I wish that the thread for this GTAV had REMOTELY as much care and focus as this. I wish it was live but it's dead as can be. It even remains all unsolved to this day, nobody on any internet site in the whole entire web has EVER created a list for all the missions which INCLUDES all of the strangers  

  • 2 weeks later...
EpiceneBlue

Has anyone ever successfully gotten both Downes charity table dialgoues? The one before the Americans At Rest fight and the one after? Or can you only ever get one of them?

 

On the same note, I seem to have forgotten the order of things to get the second one to be available after the fight. Downes is never there. Arghgh..

On 5/15/2023 at 2:47 PM, EpiceneBlue said:

Has anyone ever successfully gotten both Downes charity table dialgoues? The one before the Americans At Rest fight and the one after? Or can you only ever get one of them?

 

On the same note, I seem to have forgotten the order of things to get the second one to be available after the fight. Downes is never there. Arghgh..

I got both Mr. Downes Dialogue. Everytime, I play the game. I do Polite Society and American at Rest on the same day. 

 

In Polite Society, Arthur parks the wagon near the stables. As Arthur walk pass, Mr. Downes stares at Arthur.  You cannot talk to Mr. Downes.

I notice, that while Arthur steals the horse to chase Jimmy Brooks. Thomas Downes not there anymore. I am thinking that Downes ran away for some reason or taking a break. 

 

After chasing Jimmy Brooks, I go back to camp and get Arthur's horse. Return to Valentine, hitch the horse at the stables. Should be able to talk to Thomas Downes for the 1st time. 

 

After the bar fight, either go to the general store to buy a few items and talk to store clerk. Or go to the hotel and talk to clerk. Hotel clerk will be nervous about Arthur having two fights in one day. 

Exit the store or hotel, and Thomas Downes should be there for the 2nd dialogue.

 

 

Edited by Psycho18
Role-Play Walkthrough

Wow. This is like KnickDash! My only hope is for some day soon for the GTA V canon threads to be explored as deeply as this one here! Please I beg, Please I beg! The GTA V mission list is basically dead and it is STILL UNSOLVED to this day 10 years later. Please all you people I beg you engage in that thread!

  • Like 1
3 hours ago, Dan_1983 said:

I prefer the second dialogue with Downes as Arthur warns him to never interfere again and to mind his own business.

Yeah, the 1st Downes Convo. Is not very interesting.  For me, I like take the story very slowly and see/do everything the world as to offer in RDR2.

For anybody, who wants to get both Downes dialogues.

 

!00% working

Day1:

Polite Society

Thomas Downes is in Valentine.

Without Sin

--------------------

Day 2;

Snake Oil

1st Convo. with Downes.

American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes

Mr. Downes leaves Valentine.

---------------------------------

Day3-4

First shall be Last

Debt Collecting/ Downes Unlocked.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

!00% working, the way I play it now.

Day 1:

Hunting

Without Sin

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 2:

Wake up at 6am

7-8am Polite Society

Downes in Valentine. 1st Convo.

 Afternoon, American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes.

Downes leaves Valentine.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 3-4

First shall be last

Debt collecting/Downes unlocks

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------

This order I am not sure about.  Don't like.

Day 1:

American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes. Is the only one seen.

Downes leaves Valentine.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 2:

Without Sin

First shall be last

------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 3:

Debt Collecting/Downes unlocks

Polite Society

Downes  not in Valentine, because he is dying in bed at home.

EpiceneBlue
On 5/20/2023 at 9:41 PM, Psycho18 said:

Yeah, the 1st Downes Convo. Is not very interesting.  For me, I like take the story very slowly and see/do everything the world as to offer in RDR2.

For anybody, who wants to get both Downes dialogues.

 

!00% working

Day1:

Polite Society

Thomas Downes is in Valentine.

Without Sin

--------------------

Day 2;

Snake Oil

1st Convo. with Downes.

American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes

Mr. Downes leaves Valentine.

---------------------------------

Day3-4

First shall be Last

Debt Collecting/ Downes Unlocked.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

!00% working, the way I play it now.

Day 1:

Hunting

Without Sin

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 2:

Wake up at 6am

7-8am Polite Society

Downes in Valentine. 1st Convo.

 Afternoon, American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes.

Downes leaves Valentine.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 3-4

First shall be last

Debt collecting/Downes unlocks

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------

This order I am not sure about.  Don't like.

Day 1:

American at Rest

2nd Convo. with Downes. Is the only one seen.

Downes leaves Valentine.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 2:

Without Sin

First shall be last

------------------------------------------------------------------

Day 3:

Debt Collecting/Downes unlocks

Polite Society

Downes  not in Valentine, because he is dying in bed at home.

 

Ahhhhhh. Okay so the reason I have not been able to get both Downes dialogues I believe comes down to the times of day I have been doing the missions.

 

I think I have been taking TOO LONG to start Polite Society on Day 2 because Downes is never available after Americans at Rest no matter what I do. I think because it ends up being too late in the day. He also isn't available the next day either whether you sleep to morning or sleep to noon at the hotel. Or if you leave and go  back to camp and then come back. 

 

I think I need to start Polite Society on Day 2 immediately after waking up as you have listed here. The only bummer here is missing the fun little added dialogue about the fight you get from doing Polite Society later on AFTER Americans at Rest.

 

I have tried SO MANY combinations of doing Without / Americans / First Shall Be / Polite in that order and I have finally gotten the second one to pop a few ways but never if I do the 1st one. 

 

It's like a maddening Tetris game!

4 hours ago, EpiceneBlue said:

 

Ahhhhhh. Okay so the reason I have not been able to get both Downes dialogues I believe comes down to the times of day I have been doing the missions.

 

I think I have been taking TOO LONG to start Polite Society on Day 2 because Downes is never available after Americans at Rest no matter what I do. I think because it ends up being too late in the day. He also isn't available the next day either whether you sleep to morning or sleep to noon at the hotel. Or if you leave and go  back to camp and then come back. 

 

I think I need to start Polite Society on Day 2 immediately after waking up as you have listed here. The only bummer here is missing the fun little added dialogue about the fight you get from doing Polite Society later on AFTER Americans at Rest.

 

I have tried SO MANY combinations of doing Without / Americans / First Shall Be / Polite in that order and I have finally gotten the second one to pop a few ways but never if I do the 1st one. 

 

It's like a maddening Tetris game!

What was the fun little added dialogue you get if do Polite Society after American at Rest?

 

The only reason I like to Polite Society before American At Rest, because Polite Society feels like an Intro mission to the Heartlands, Horseshoe Overlook and Valentine. Polite Society is an Extra mission to do before American at Rest.

 

I am thinking that, the reason why you can't get the 1st Downes dialogue is  that too late in the day. It also helps, to arrive in Valentine, leave and return to Valentine before American to Rest.

Thomas Downes disappears from Valentine after his 2nd dialogue/American at Rest, is because the Downes debt collecting unlocks after The First shall  be the Last/Sean's Party.

 

Heres another mission order I am trying out for Chapter 2. I like it.

 

Day 1:

Hunting

Without Sin

----------------------------------------

Day 2:

Polite Society

Thomas Downes in Valentine

Good Honest, Snake Oil

Downes in Valentine

-----------------------------------------

Day 3:

Hunting

Stranger: A Test of Faith

Stranger: Smoking and other Hobbies

Stranger: All that Glitters

Downes in Valentine

American at Rest- Afternoon

After the mission, Dutch sounds a little disappointed, because Javier, Bill, Charles, and Arthur are drinking/fighting, instead of working. Bill came into the saloon like he been drinking for two days or overnight.

2nd Downes Dialogue/ Thomas Downes disappears from Valentine.

 

 

Edited by Psycho18
EpiceneBlue
20 hours ago, Psycho18 said:

What was the fun little added dialogue you get if do Polite Society after American at Rest?

 

The only reason I like to Polite Society before American At Rest, because Polite Society feels like an Intro mission to the Heartlands, Horseshoe Overlook and Valentine. Polite Society is an Extra mission to do before American at Rest.

 

I am thinking that, the reason why you can't get the 1st Downes dialogue is  that too late in the day. It also helps, to arrive in Valentine, leave and return to Valentine before American to Rest.

Thomas Downes disappears from Valentine after his 2nd dialogue/American at Rest, is because the Downes debt collecting unlocks after The First shall  be the Last/Sean's Party.

 

Heres another mission order I am trying out for Chapter 2. I like it.

 

Day 1:

Hunting

Without Sin

----------------------------------------

Day 2:

Polite Society

Thomas Downes in Valentine

Good Honest, Snake Oil

Downes in Valentine

-----------------------------------------

Day 3:

Hunting

Stranger: A Test of Faith

Stranger: Smoking and other Hobbies

Stranger: All that Glitters

Downes in Valentine

American at Rest- Afternoon

After the mission, Dutch sounds a little disappointed, because Javier, Bill, Charles, and Arthur are drinking/fighting, instead of working. Bill came into the saloon like he been drinking for two days or overnight.

2nd Downes Dialogue/ Thomas Downes disappears from Valentine.

 

 

 

I always love your mission order experiments!

 

If you do Polite Society any time AFTER Americans at Rest, Arthur will banter with Uncle a couple of times about the bar fight with Tommy. It isn't a lot but it is a funny bit.

 

 

Edited by EpiceneBlue
  • Like 2
3 hours ago, EpiceneBlue said:

 

I always love your mission order experiments!

 

If you do Polite Society any time AFTER Americans at Rest, Arthur will banter with Uncle a couple of times about the bar fight with Tommy. It isn't a lot but it is a funny bit.

 

 

Oh, that dialogue!! That is a funny dialogue. If you must keep this dialogue. Make sure you place Polite Society after The First shall be the Last/Sean's Party.

 

Polite Society dialogue fits better for early chapter 2.

You can try this mission order.  I will try out this mission order when I get around to it.

 

Arthur and gang been Cooped for 2 weeks in Horseshoe Overlook.

 

Day 1:

Hunting

Without Sin

-------

Day 2:

Go  to Valentine. Hitch horse at stables. If you see Thomas Downes. Talk to Downes for  the 1st dialogue. If, not.

 

Leave Valentine.

 

Hunting.

Strangers: A  Test of Faith

Stranger: Smoking and other Hobbies

Stranger: All that Glitters

 

Return to Valentine. Hitch horse at stables. Talk to Thomas Downes.

 

American at Rest-Afternoon

 

Dialogue( Dutch disappointed that Javier, Charles, Bill, and Arthur are fighting/drinking, not working).

Dialogue ( Dutch will tell Arthur go to Blackwater when he ready).

 

No mission should be after Americans at Rest. 

 

Go into the Hotel/General Store.

Hotel Clerk dialogue about Polite Society will not happen yet.

Downes 2nd dialogue: Charity.  If you leave Valentine, Downes will disappear. 

---‐---------

Day 3:

The First Shall be the Last

Sean's party

‐‐---------

Day 4: 

 

Wake up noon

 

Polite Society

 

Dialogue ( Girls says Coop up for 2 weeks)(Girls We finally seeing some Civilization). 

 

Dialogue ( Uncle says so you been drinking, instead of working).

 

Dialogue (Don't help the broken down wagon- Arthur says he has no energy for Charity) .

 

 

 

Edited by Psycho18
Spydr Webz

Wow, I can't believe it's almost been five years since I posted this!! I am thrilled to see that it has continued to generate interesting discussion all these years.

 

I feel a bit guilty not coming back to this until now. Life gets busy, ya know? I've wanted to come back so many times just to fix the god-awful eyesore that is the formatting (no idea why everything was bolded, underlined and italicized when it was first posted). Over the last few years I have replayed the game 6 or 7 times and each time I revisit this list and end up making some changes in my notes. It has gone through quite a few revisions as I've noticed some glaring issues and missing bits, so I am in the process of updating the main post with my most current version (Chapter II is done, major changes noted in the notes). I'm currently wrapping up another playthrough, and so I am quite satisfied with the newest version, as it's fresh on the mind and aided by the fact that I've played it so much.

 

I wish I came back to do this sooner. My first list wasn't the greatest and I know some have used this as a guide over the years, so I should have updated it sooner. Thanks to you all for keeping this topic alive over the years while I was away farming mangoes in Tahiti! I've read some of the discussion and I love the insights people are bringing to it. Hope I can be a part of the conversation now.

EpiceneBlue
19 hours ago, Spydr Webz said:

Wow, I can't believe it's almost been five years since I posted this!! I am thrilled to see that it has continued to generate interesting discussion all these years.

 

I feel a bit guilty not coming back to this until now. Life gets busy, ya know? I've wanted to come back so many times just to fix the god-awful eyesore that is the formatting (no idea why everything was bolded, underlined and italicized when it was first posted). Over the last few years I have replayed the game 6 or 7 times and each time I revisit this list and end up making some changes in my notes. It has gone through quite a few revisions as I've noticed some glaring issues and missing bits, so I am in the process of updating the main post with my most current version (Chapter II is done, major changes noted in the notes). I'm currently wrapping up another playthrough, and so I am quite satisfied with the newest version, as it's fresh on the mind and aided by the fact that I've played it so much.

 

I wish I came back to do this sooner. My first list wasn't the greatest and I know some have used this as a guide over the years, so I should have updated it sooner. Thanks to you all for keeping this topic alive over the years while I was away farming mangoes in Tahiti! I've read some of the discussion and I love the insights people are bringing to it. Hope I can be a part of the conversation now.

 

 

WB!! And look forward to checking out your updates! 

Spydr Webz

Below are my updated lists for Chapter's II and III. Chapter III I have realized is probably the most difficult chapter for me personally and you can see why in the notes. Also, I'm curious what people think of my "Arthur's Vacation" idea at the end of Chapter III. It's something I have done on my most recent playthroughs and I really enjoy it. It allows me to experience more of the game than I would otherwise and I can even justify working it into the story.

 

Anyway...

 

 

 

CHAPTER II -- HORSESHOE OVERLOOK

 

[R] - Who is Not Without Sin?

 

[U] - Polite Society, Valentine Style

 

[H] - Exit, Pursued by a Bruised Ego

 

[?] -  Good, Honest Snake Oil

[JE] - Americans at Rest

 

[JE] - The First Shall Be Last

 

[LS] - Money Lending and Other Sins [I]

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [II] - (Chic Matthews)

 

[H] - The Spines of America

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [II] - (Lily Millet)

 

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [II] - (Wrobel)

 

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [III]

 

[K] - Paying a Social Call

 

[ML] - We Loved Once and True [I-III]

[D] - A Quiet Time

 

[M] - Blessed are the Meek?

 

[J] - Pouring Forth Oil

 

[J] - Pouring Forth Oil [II-III]

[A] - A Fisher of Men

 

[J] - Pouring Forth Oil [IV]

 

[M] - An American Pastoral Scene

 

[J] - The Sheep and the Goats

[D] - A Strange Kindness

 

 

Spoiler

Chapter II - NOTES

 

-Chapter Two is the second biggest chapter, and because of that it starts to get a bit convoluted here. This order may still be a work in progress as the placement of certain missions can be endlessly debated and a satisfying answer is not always clear. 

 

-At the very beginning of this chapter, Hosea will tell Arthur about two potential leads: one involves the boys who have gone into town, and the other involves the Reverend, who has "found something at the train station." Because Hosea is not specific about who went into town and what they are doing, we can justify leaving "Americans at Rest" for another time. Hosea is more specific about Reverend Swanson at the train station, however, and there is no reason to leave him sitting around there for several days waiting for you to arrive. You'll find that I use this as a general rule for mission priority: if a character tells you to meet a specific person somewhere and maybe even notes a specific time, its best to follow up on that as soon as possible. If they are more vague about it, you can leave it up to interpretation.

 

-Originally I had "Exit, Pursued by a Bruised Ego" after "The First Shall be Last," because after the latter mission, there is a break in the narrative where Arthur has no other obligations to anyone or anything. However, after several playthroughs doing it this way, I found that it always felt a bit off... "Exit, Pursued" does not really add anything or have any impact to the story and almost feels like a tutorial mission, while "The First Shall be Last" kind of gets the ball rolling narratively. It just feels awkward to leave it sitting for so long. It's also worth mentioning that this mission unlocks "Spines of America," but it can sometimes take several days for this mission to open up. So playing it too late may risk messing up the order entirely while waiting for "Spines of America." Plus, walking around camp getting shouted at by Hosea for days on end can get quite annoying. "Hey Arthur!" "Hey Arthur!" "HeY aRtHuR!"

 

-"Good, Honest Snake Oil" is not a required mission to progress the story. However, it is necessary to complete in this chapter if one wants a good introduction into bounty hunting side missions. The best time to do it is early, preferably before "Americans at Rest," because at this point the gang has not caused any trouble in the area and thus, are not sought after by the law.

 

-"The Spines of America" and the Lily Millet's Money lending mission are done on the same day because both are in Emerald Ranch. This will limit the amount of backtracking you have to do. Note that the order of these two depends on whether you prefer to take the daytime option or nighttime option in "Spines." If you prefer the night option, do the money lending mission first as by the time the mission is over it is already very late at night.

 

-Interesting note: I originally had "Money Lending and Other Sins [III]" occur after "We Loved Once and True," but it turns out that the game will not allow this to happen. If you try to do it in the opposite order, Strauss will confront you after reading Mary's letter and the money lending mission will trigger automatically. Therefore this needs to be done the day following the other Chapter Two money lending missions.

 

-I like to play "A Quiet Time" after "We Loved Once and True" because of one line: while drunk in Valentine, Lenny asks Arthur why he never married, to which Arthur sadly replies, "no one would have me." Having played Mary Linton's mission previously, it creates a poignant moment that contrasts well with this otherwise hilarious mission.

 

-"Blessed are the Meek?" comes the very next day after "A Quiet Time." As much as Arthur dislikes Micah, at this point saving him before he swings is pretty much a priority. 

 

-"The Sheep and the Goats" and "A Strange Kindness" occur on the same day, because after Cornwall and the Pinkertons corner the gang in Valentine, the pressure is on to leave the area immediately.

 

 

CHAPTER III -- CLEMENS POINT

 

[D] - The New South

 

[P] - Further Questions of Female Suffrage

 

[D] - American Distillation

 

[GR] - The Course of True Love [I-II]

[MO] - An Honest Mistake

 

[BG] - The Course of True Love [III]

[A] - Advertising, the New American Art [I-II]

 

[H] - The Fine Joys of Tobacco

 

[D] - Magicians for Sport

 

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [IV] - (Gwyn Hughes)

[J] - Horse Flesh for Dinner

 

[JT] - Friends in Very Low Places

[L] - Preaching Forgiveness as He Went

 

[B] - Sodom? Back to Gamorrah

 

[M] - Blessed are the Peacemakers

 

[$] - Money Lending and Other Sins [IV] - (Winton Holmes)

 

[B] - A Short Walk in a Pretty Town

[D] - Blood Feuds, Ancient and Modern

 

Spoiler

Chapter III - NOTES

 

-Chapter III is shorter than the previous chapter, but it putting it in a logical and cinematic order was MUCH trickier. I think what makes it so difficult is the fact that Dutch and other gang members are constantly telling you to go meet someone, making you feel obligated to do certain missions in a certain order, even if it is to the detriment of the narrative. Other times, the game seems to prompt you towards doing certain missions before others when said missions might be confusing if others have not been completed beforehand. I think the order above is probably the best solution to all of this, though it is not perfect. Let's dig deeper into the specifics.

 

-Immediately as the chapter opens up, you will hear Pearson and Sadie in the midst of a heated argument in camp. Naturally, you might want to go investigate. However, getting too close to the pair will trigger "Further Questions of Female Suffrage," which isn't a terrible opening mission, but Dutch's "The New South" works vastly better as an opening mission. You meet the Gray family who provide some exposition revealing their feud with the Braithwaite family, which ends up being the focal point of the chapter. They show you around area, pointing out key locations such as Rhodes and Caliga Hall, and even warn the player about the Lemoyne raiders. The mission concludes with a relaxing fishing trip alongside Dutch and Hosea. This mission has everything going for it in regards to being the perfect "opening" mission for the chapter. It's just odd that the game will naturally draw you toward Pearson and Sadie instead. My best advice would be to ignore the original bickering... chalk it up as background noise, and go straight to Dutch. After the mission, you will end up back in camp. Rather than going straight to Sadie an Pearson, take off to the left, call your horse, maybe do some hunting, then camp overnight in the woods and return the next day to begin "Further Questions of Female Suffrage."

 

-American Distillation needs to take place in the morning. No matter what time you start this mission, the game will automatically revert the clock to the morning after the mission.

 

-I originally had "An Honest Mistake" placed way later in the chapter. My reasoning was that, during the course of the mission, the law becomes aware of crime in the area, and may connect it to Dutch's gang, especially since it's another robbery on Cornwall's assets. But doing it early solves two problems: one, it prevents Molly O'Shea from sitting around under a tree calling Arthur for a week, and two, it clears some space up in the last half of the chapter to allow more focus on the Gray vs. Braithwaite Feud.

 

-After "The Course of True Love [III]," Abigail will more than likely approach Arthur as soon as he heads into camp to inform him that John and Hosea are currently waiting for him by the moonshine stash. At this point you're pretty much obligated to immediately start "Advertising, the New American Art." And that's okay, because it fits well here. Just make sure its sometime in the late afternoon/evening, as this mission will always end later in the night.

 

-After "Advertising," Dutch will instruct Arthur to meet Hosea at the Braithwaite's, and will also say that he has sent Sean McGuire as well. Therefore, "The Fine Joys of Tobacco" mission should be done next day. Feel free to spend the earlier parts of the day hunting/fishing/doing side missions, because like "Advertising," this mission will always end at night. It's worth mentioning that Dutch will also instruct Arthur to meet John and Javier at the Gray's, but that mission, "Horse Flesh for Dinner," isn't even available until after "The Fine Joys of Tobacco" is completed. I consider Dutch's instructions on this to be more of a "do it when you can," thing rather than an immediate obligation.

 

-Originally I had "Magicians for Sport" before "Fine Joys," but I discovered that after "Magicians," the game will automatically skip to the next morning and Arthur will be in Rhodes. I wonder why Arthur would go to Rhodes, and I figure a good reason would be to collect the debt from Gwyn Hughes. Make sure to speak with Strauss at a point prior so this money lending mission is available. Then, straight to "Horse Flesh for Dinner."

 

-The rest is pretty straight forward, but I would like to point out that immediately after "Blessed are the Peacemakers," is probably the best time (and last chance narratively) to explore/do tasks in Strawberry, Big Valley and the Grizzlies West. If you're trying to complete as much of the game as possible as Arthur, this is your chance. Typically, I do the money lending mission for Winton Holmes and the Joshua Brown bounty hunting mission and well as the general store side business. You also have the Legendary Buck and a nearby trapper to sell the pelt too. Then, I head up into Grizzlies West (make sure you pack some warm clothes!), complete some treasure hunts and tame the White Arabian Horse. Taming this horse is necessary if you want to get both the Legendary White Bison and the Legendary Sockeye Salmon. Load one onto your main horse and the other onto the White Arabian. Then I do the Flaco Hernandez gunslinger mission, and head back down the mountain and make my way back to camp. Hit up the trapper near Riggs Station, sell the bison pelt, then ship off the Sockeye Salmon. Take the White Arabian to the stable near Strawberry, keep it or sell it, then head back to camp and pick up the Legendary Chain Pickerel on your way back. For me, this all takes about a week in-game time. You may wonder why Arthur would return to Strawberry after shooting up the place with Micah, or even why he would go back into the mountains. I figure long enough time has passed since "Blessed are the Meek?" that its safe to return, and Arthur's appearance should be different anyway. Now that he's back on his feet after nearly dying at the hands of the O'Driscoll's, maybe Arthur wants to take a relaxing hunting/fishing trip in the mountains before returning to work. The guy deserves a vacation, right?

 

  • Like 1

I do the same 3-4 day vacation in Chapter 3 to Strawberry, but I do it earlier in the chapter just after Trelawny's stage coach as there's nothing urgent. This also gives Bill, Karen and Lenny time to make plans for the bank robbery. While there, I collect Holmes' debt, do Hector's three robberies, finish off the Appleseed Timber company mission strand and visit Watson's cabin if I haven't already (I usually do it on the way from visiting Flaco Hernandez in Chapter 2).

 

Hector's second robbery is linked with the Appleseed Timber Company as Arthur robs a stage carrying their payroll and I find it funny to help them one minute and rob their payroll the next lol. Plus it wouldn't make sense to rob payroll belonging to them if their mission strand is long done in Chapter 2 as they've cleared from site and moved on.

 

  • Like 2

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