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Jeemy

The Great Train Robber

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bish0p2004
4 hours ago, anthony said:

Did that already, I would say there is chances we are going to get a "We do not have any information to provide on this topic" answer lol.

But hey at least we are 'letting' them know about that.

What kind of response did you get?  Was it the generic "restart the consle" automated response?

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AdmiralJT
5 hours ago, bish0p2004 said:

I've posted this before but I sent in a bug report to Rockstar.  You guys should do the same.

I don't think the guards are considered authority figures because I can kill quite a few of them on the train before becoming wanted.  I'm not talking silent kills either.  I've killed all of them before and as soon as i start robbing the train, I become wanted.  No Witness investigating or anything...just straight up Wanted.  If you kill any other authority figure loudly and another one sees you, you become Wanted.

 

I think you're right though in that I don't think we are supposed to rob trains.  However, if you have in-game hints on, whenever a train passes, you get a notification saying thst they are great sources of income.  

I must not be doing it right, because I've seen a few others aging what you're saying about being able to take out the train gaurds. I finished the epilogue last night and have plenty of free time now, I'm gonna work on the train tonight and see if I can figure out where I'm messing it up.

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guardian1816
20 hours ago, ¡MAYDAY! said:

You're wrong. I haven't had a bounty in a week because I know how to properly commit crimes anonymously. Ive  even shot the bartender in the smaller saloon in Valentine with no bandana on and left without getting a bounty. 

I love people that do this...."Hey! I have this piece of knowledge that you guys really want, but I'm not going to share it"  Chances are these people do not have the knowledge they are claiming and are just beating on their chest to impress the internet, for whatever that is worth.

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Gallows

Try robbing both kinds of trains. The ones that naturally drive around the world and the ones you spawn when buying a ticket. They may have different rules to prevent people from just spawning trains to rob.

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¡MAYDAY!
31 minutes ago, guardian1816 said:

I love people that do this...."Hey! I have this piece of knowledge that you guys really want, but I'm not going to share it"  Chances are these people do not have the knowledge they are claiming and are just beating on their chest to impress the internet, for whatever that is worth.

LoL ok dude. It's not that hard to commit a crime without getting a bounty, and if I wanted to know how I would do some research myself instead of expecting people on a forum to tell me. A simple Google search would tell you what you need to know.

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Lonely-Martin

Re: I don't think we're supposed to rob trains.

 

It maybe flawed or too tricky for some, but we very much are meant to rob trains. You'll not get 100% if not. It's key to a certain challenge. (To not get caught/killed).

 

Just to confirm we are meant to. Haven't got there myself as busy hunting/studying all these animals. :)

Edited by Lonely-Martin

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anthony

The support answer that I got is "Thank you for your valuable feedback".

 

 

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Jeemy
18 hours ago, Lance_Vance89 said:

I haven't tried it yet myself, but if you stop the train on a bridge over water, the law can't get to you and you can take all the time in the world to rob the train. No idea about bounty or being recognized though.

Not true to my knowledge. I've stopped the train on the bridge north of Saint Denis multiple times. And the magic steam-powered mobile phone will still call in all your crimes, racking up a bounty that makes the crime pointless.

 

Did another batch of runs this morning. 

 

Of course as soon as I get a successful run I stop, so its probably good to list things that *don't* work too!

 

Not trying to be condescending but here's what I worked out thus far. All of this is tested multiple times so I am as sure as I can be:

 

- there is clearly a "train zone" - if you're inside the zone, guards magically aggro and call lawmen

- so if you are beside the train and shoot the rear guard, you'll aggro the remainder of the guards

- but if you are some distance behind the train and shoot the rear guard, they won't aggro. Of course, then you have to catch the train back up; my horse isn't fast enough to do this easily

- you can do it with no aggro if you fall off the back of the train and stand right at the edge; or if you run past him, defuse the situation and kill him from the edge; but its not worth it as you can easily fall off entirely

- make sure you're not maxed out on cigarettes; you'll almost certainly pick a pack up on the train and you don't want to miss out on the card in the rush

- worth saving before you get on train, safe contents seems to be randomised*

- hogtying the rear guard doesn't seem to make a difference to aggro; you may as well just kill him

- you almost definitely can't crack a safe with lock breaker or knives 

 

So as before I changed clothes & masked up, hopped on at the front of the second-to-last carriage, walked to the back and disposed of the guard.

 

Back to the safe, plant dynamite with R2, ignite, run away, back and empty the safe by which point there is likely 2 guards who will need popped.

 

Then hop off the train and by the time you get on your horse, the crime is reported and you are almost at the end of the red circle.

 

It then immediately enters investigated, the law are despatched and for some reason they seem to know exactly where you are, so its a case of not letting them get in range, and then you are clear without a bounty.

 

Take this time was $40 and a cigarette card. Not brilliant.

 

Things I am still wondering:

 

- if I can punch the guard off the train

and

*if there is a Pocket Watch in the safe then it appears to be glitched. You already hold a Pocket Watch, a unique item which you can't drop. You can't therefore pick up the Pocket Watch in the safe, which means you cannot pickup the moneybags and billfolds you can clearly see. Does anybody know how to switch between items in your view short of lumbering around randomly? There isn't time to do this on the train and the positioning makes it impossible. So effectively if there is a Pocket Watch in the safe, you can just give up.

 

 

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Mister Pinkerton
On 11/8/2018 at 12:02 PM, Jeemy said:

I read a review of RDR2 where the reviewer said he drove a train all the way around the map; to have done this he'd have had to have all the guards gone, and no bounty. Review code could have been different but I doubt it.

 

If you are lucky, you can find a train being robbed by someone else. I found a train being robbed by O'Driscolls or other bandits. I wiped them out because they were being hostile/breaking the law and I didn't receive a bounty. Everyone else was dead already and I managed to drive the train around the whole map which took be about 45mins because it's so slow. An interesting thing was the train was also going the opposite way than it normally does. 

 

Ui6mvROHU=

 

BTW, great work on doing all those tests. I'm dying to rob a train and get away with it. Only tried it a couple of times but gave up. I'm going to practice today to see if I can do it. 

Edited by Mister Pink

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GN 92
20 hours ago, Cutter De Blanc said:

I found a train being robbed during a random event that I was able to drive around the map with no incident.

 

I wonder what happens if you rob the train as it passes Van Horn, where there's no law

I did that. The law will still spawn and pursue you.

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Gallows
8 minutes ago, GN 92 said:

I did that. The law will still spawn and pursue you.

I entered the train and looked for valuables, after shooting the bandits. Nothing happened. Perhaps driving the train is what triggers it?

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Jeemy
25 minutes ago, Mister Pink said:

BTW, great work on doing all those tests. I'm dying to rob a train and get away with it. Only tried it a couple of times but gave up. I'm going to practice today to see if I can do it. 

Cheers!

 

I have the game sitting on a monitor on my work computer on Remote Play so I can just keep retrying without it being too much of a time sink.

 

In actual time expended I got $140 in 5 minutes flat plus a platinum watch and a cigarette card. So its definitely worth doing this ad hoc as they come past, but not worth camping out, unless I can work out how to get away with robbing an entire train without a bounty that renders the whole thing pointless.

 

I'm not going to keep doing only this, obviously; I am just hunting and exploring near the rail tracks and then when a train comes past I save and then run a few tests.

 

As I got the charm item but had to reload, I'm going to move onto robbing passengers next. So I'll post up more next time I do more.

 

WRT selecting items and the Pocket Watch, sometimes I see a prompt for R1 when looking at stuff in shops or on tables. But it didn't seem to work in the safe as things are either too close together, or on top of one another. Camera panning sometimes flips the item in view but again the space is too tight. Anyway, hopefully more soon.

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GN 92
1 minute ago, Gallows said:

I entered the train and looked for valuables, after shooting the bandits. Nothing happened. Perhaps driving the train is what triggers it?

Yeah maybe that's the thing there. I was driving the train when it happened.

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Cutter De Blanc

Hopped a mixed passenger/freight train. Guard told me to get the f*ck out of the freight car, which I complied with,  Was able to wander around the passenger cars freely with no wanted status

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The1raven

This game's wanted/witness/911 system is all screwy in my not-so-humble opinion.  Witnesses literally spawn out of thin air and the law responds faster to any infraction faster than in modern times. 

 

Train robberies are bunk.  I'm glad your happy with your success, but seems like a lot of aggravation for $80.

 

Sorry, recent experiences in this game have unfortunately really soured me.

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ZHPbim

I care less about robbing a train and more about being able to derail it from too much speed. I remember you could do that in San Andreas and I thought I remember you could do it in RDR1

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Gallows
2 hours ago, ZHPbim said:

I care less about robbing a train and more about being able to derail it from too much speed. I remember you could do that in San Andreas and I thought I remember you could do it in RDR1

You could not derail the train in RDR.

 

Tried not driving the train, I killed all the guards. As soon as I blew up the box I was wanted. 

 

There is a Challenge to rob 5 trains without dying or getting caught however, so train robbing was intended as part of the game.

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rebeldevil
On 11/8/2018 at 9:50 PM, Lonely-Martin said:

Re: I don't think we're supposed to rob trains.

 

It maybe flawed or too tricky for some, but we very much are meant to rob trains. You'll not get 100% if not. It's key to a certain challenge. (To not get caught/killed).

 

Just to confirm we are meant to. Haven't got there myself as busy hunting/studying all these animals. :)

If we weren't supposed to be able to rop trains, you wouldn't get tips on how to rob trains every time you got on one.

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Lonely-Martin
3 hours ago, rebeldevil said:

If we weren't supposed to be able to rop trains, you wouldn't get tips on how to rob trains every time you got on one.

Yeah, lol. Don't know why some think we're not meant to. But still, big game and easy to forget bits while taking it all in on the first run. :)

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Mister Pinkerton
On 11/9/2018 at 3:32 PM, Jeemy said:

Cheers!

 

I have the game sitting on a monitor on my work computer on Remote Play so I can just keep retrying without it being too much of a time sink.

 

In actual time expended I got $140 in 5 minutes flat plus a platinum watch and a cigarette card. So its definitely worth doing this ad hoc as they come past, but not worth camping out, unless I can work out how to get away with robbing an entire train without a bounty that renders the whole thing pointless.

 

I'm not going to keep doing only this, obviously; I am just hunting and exploring near the rail tracks and then when a train comes past I save and then run a few tests.

 

As I got the charm item but had to reload, I'm going to move onto robbing passengers next. So I'll post up more next time I do more.

 

WRT selecting items and the Pocket Watch, sometimes I see a prompt for R1 when looking at stuff in shops or on tables. But it didn't seem to work in the safe as things are either too close together, or on top of one another. Camera panning sometimes flips the item in view but again the space is too tight. Anyway, hopefully more soon.

4

Haha, that's genius! 

 

Yeah that loot defitely seems worth it. I'm keen on collecting the cigarette cards/ collectable cards and never really thought to try looking on a train for them. 

 

I did have a nice save where I could catch the train from Riggs Station. I didn't plan it, I just past it and a train was going by and saw the opportunity. Admittedly, I was trying to remember your findings from memory but mostly just doing my own toying around with the system. I tried killing the rear guard with a bow at a relative distance. Once or twice I would get caught by witnesses (non-passenger travellers on horseback) as there is a bit of a crossroads or a place where trails converge near the tracks, so sometimes it wasn't ideal but mostly it was OK. Once the guard is down there seems to be a moment where it's OK. Nobody seems alerted and the next challenge is to catch up with the train before it reaches the massive bridge (Bards Crossing). That's easily done around 95% of the time. Once I'm on there I think I can last about 10 seconds before the other guard is alerted. 

 

Two things happen. Either the train halts and Flatneck Station or what I think happened one time is that I alerted the guards before I could hop on so it didn't even stop at the station. However, once I got on it then stopped about 0.5km past Flatneck Station. Once it stopped there I had escaped and I kept the train in my sight and hid in some shrubbery. The law nearly caught me. 3 of them hung around for a couple of minutes. The two of them, then they left and the train was just left there abandoned. 

 

The only issue with this was the train didn't seem to have any safes. Think I was just unlucky that the particular spawn of the train in my save file wasn't very robbable. It did get me wondering about stopping the train again, hiding and waiting for the law to go and then trying to rob the train. Anyone ever try that?

 

I pulled this image off another site about legendary fish but the location is almost spot-on to where I hid and could still keep the train in sight. 

 

rdr2-legendary-fishing-quest-location-10

 

Mild spoiler early on in the story... 

 

Spoiler

As per the mission where you stop the train with the tank of grease/fat, it might be worth trying to stall it with a stagecoach. I haven't tried this. Will try this evening.  

 

Edited by Mister Pink

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Jeemy

Sup!

And good work.

 

I have more train facts & conjecture.

 

Firstly if you find a train in the middle of a robbery:

 

- the train I found was completely empty. None of the dead passengers had anything on them. No safe, no collectibles, nothing at all.

- I killed the robbers and let the public escape, no bounty. Robbers got me about $10 worth of stuff so its not like they were even holding the passengers' worth; but I forgot to check the saddlebags on their horses; next time I'll kill/apprehend the passengers too.

- you could then drive the train with no penalties

 

Second, I am now in progress testing different ways to rob the passengers instead of the safe; whether its better/worse or for an alternative if you get a train with no safe.

 

I've had the Alligator charm item a couple of times, but also still getting a $60 bounty. Once I finish up I'll report back with everything that did / didn't work, literally doing this now.

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Gallows

I still think Train robberies are not working as intended. It may be a slight balance issue where the law is called perhaps just 15-30 seconds too soon.

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Cutter De Blanc

I just noticed that the law that comes when I rob the train homes in on my location, like the Blackwater kill squad, can't evade them

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Jeemy

Oh, they definitely are not. 

 

As I said ages ago; the goal would be to engender a situation where you rob & stop the train, and kill all the guards before a witness escapes.

 

After that the train is yours to carefully loot, rob all the passengers, and then drive off. Eventually its noticed as missing but you should have ample time in the middle of nowhere.

 

In fact, it should act EXACTLY as it does when the O'Sphincters do a hold-up. The random event has you happen upon a stopped train with all guards and most passengers dead and no law incoming, at all.

 

So the behaviour is scripted right for that. I think its something connected to this "train zone". Which I have tested more and more; getting my horse killed repeatedly when it isn't actually touching the train shows its about a horses's width all the way round the train.

 

As far as I gather it, when you are within it, law is called magically. And it does appear to be random, sometimes killing a guard triggers it and sometimes picking up a can of beans does it, sometimes its after 2-3-4 kills or robberies.

 

So @Gallows I think you have it dead right: there is a timer if you languish within the "train zone", and its set too short. I surmise its intended to simulate the company noticing the train has not arrived, and its set to 15 seconds instead of 15 minutes; something like that. If this is the case, any "witness" behaviour is immaterial as its always overridden - and as I've generated witness behaviour in cities, I think that fits.

 

I really hope this is the case and now I am comfortable with the behaviour, I'll report it to R* too.

 

When the train is within a city, city rules override the train zone, I *think*.

 

Today I climbed on a train just south of Valentine. Simply concentrated on robbing passengers, as it had no safe.

 

- As soon as I entered Valentine, it worked the same as other armed robberies - you're almost instantly wanted, but they don't know where you are. A witness can also report your location, and see next point on identification.

- I am certain that changing to an outfit only used for crime and a mask rather than a bandana, prevents "Arthur Morgan" wanted status and just grants "Unidentified Suspect" 

- You can stand on the train between carriages in your robbery outfit and mask infinitely. You can even walk through the train and as long as you Defuse, guards won't aggro.

- You can 50/50 hogtie the rear guard and rob a non-safe train's rear carriage for goods & items.

- If you hop on around the rear of the passenger cars you can do it the same way as a train with a safe: out of town, commit about 4-5 offences then hop off. By the time crime is reported, you will be almost at the edge of the circle.

 

However:

 

I think I must have been lucky/under city rules the first time, because if you are at the edge of the red circle, and leave it, you still have to endure the Investigating scenario.

 

And when trains are involved, the lawmen are issued with genuine 1899 heat sensors, linked directly to your implanted steam-powered ID chip.

 

So once you are in this state they generate just out of range and follow you directly, ignoring roads and terrain, as the crow flies, until the status expires.

 

The best solution I've seen to this is to literally ride off a cliff. Your horse might die, you'll lose momentum but they won't follow you.

 

If you can outrun them grand.

 

So now I've robbed 3 trains, netting approx $40-60 from 4-5 passengers across 2 cars plus about $10 worth of meds and about $30 worth of watches and wedding rings. Seems like its on par with a safe robbery.

 

Next; I am going to try pulling trains to a halt and circling them looking for witnesses. See if I can get to a reasonable state that way.

 

9 minutes ago, Cutter De Blanc said:

I just noticed that the law that comes when I rob the train homes in on my location, like the Blackwater kill squad, can't evade them

Sorry, was posting as you wrote this. See above and yeah, exactly. They know where you are so unless you get a good escape route, which isn't terribly hard, they'll find you.

 

Hence the ride-of-a-cliff tip. They will pull up, or fall off and die; I see them hit the marker on the map and then stop moving and usually by that time they are close to dropping off my radar as I am out of Investigating mode; so I am not 100% sure what they do.

 

Also as a side note I did thoroughly test hiding in a sparsely-leaved bush. It works 100%. If you are in a bush with your head poking out, nobody can see you. Not under crazy train homing mode, but in city mode.

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Jeemy

*************

 

Oh yeah, and one other thing.

 

If you are riding alongside a carriage or stagecoach; you have the option "Jump to XX" to jump to it.

 

But if you are on a train, you cannot jump back to your horse, which would make getaways a load more expedient.

 

Yet to test the old "leap at your horse and mid-air correct by up to 2 metres and land on the c*nt" trick from RDR1; it works from balconies in RDR2, that much I do know.......

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Cutter De Blanc

Just a thought, but the train robberies might be working as intended with online mode in mind

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Jeemy

You can jump to horse manually or via prompt from the roof of a train.

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Gallows
13 hours ago, Jeemy said:

*************

 

Oh yeah, and one other thing.

 

If you are riding alongside a carriage or stagecoach; you have the option "Jump to XX" to jump to it.

 

But if you are on a train, you cannot jump back to your horse, which would make getaways a load more expedient.

 

Yet to test the old "leap at your horse and mid-air correct by up to 2 metres and land on the c*nt" trick from RDR1; it works from balconies in RDR2, that much I do know.......

You can actually jump back to your horse, I do it all the time. I also jump from buildings and onto my horse. As long as you land reasonably close to your horse, you will land in the saddle. Practice from buildings first... because it requires more skill and is not automatic like pressing a button.

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Jeemy

@Gallows; see the post above yours? I just hadn't tested it yet.

 

@THis Guy:

Quote

 

 

 

Train robberies are bunk.  I'm glad your happy with your success, but seems like a lot of aggravation for $80.

 

 

It really depends what you view as "aggravation". I know fine well if you keep on with the game you have money coming out of your ears.

 

I know fine well lots of people have finished it already. Me, I'm at the very start of Chapter 3. I'm hunting, trapping, fishing, exploring and generally trying to explore the open world.

 

I like the realism, sure there are niggles but as I said at the start I don't want to keep this as a bitch-fest, I want this thread to be about robbing trains. If I need to know anytning else about any other aspect of the game, I would either make a thread if I felt it was worth discussing, or I'd work it out myself.

 

If a perfect pelt is worth $2 (when I buy 4 leather skins to refurbish a car its about £800 these days) then that makes an $80 train robbery present-day value of $8,000, if my maths is right.

 

I think that's fitting, and in keeping. With my 2 methods its under 2 minutes to rob a train. The fact I've spent several hours working out how to do it, doesn't impact on the value per minute of the action.

 

And it gives me more value-per-hour on my game.

 

"Bunk" or not, either there is a way to rob a train "well", or the game is broken. I don't agree with the "magic mobile phone" but I do agree with the difficulty level, especially when you can't adjust it.

 

I like games to be challenging and I like exploring mechanics. I could rush through the game and be rich and finished, but that's not really what I am about....YMMV and that's fine. I'm glad I am happy too.

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Jeemy

PS Its maybe relevant that I did not like GTAV much. I've completed it on PS3 and PS4 but never got into online, so I may be missing out on stuff. I know I am breaking my own thread rule here but I feel like R* are concentrating so hard on world-building, they seem to have a blind spot for basics.

 

EG in GTA the stock market (for me and only on PS4) was so broken I could buy stocks and find them gone the next save. It seemed to be a completely ruined and tragically wasted mechanic. It could have added so much. You couldn't enter shops, hundreds of mechanics that were fine on SA and IV were suddenly gone/broken.

 

Don't want to get into it too much, but I don't hold up much hope for them patching the evidently broken in RDR2. Perhaps this is why I like to explore the mechanics. In previous gens maybe it was exploiting, now at least it feels like exploring.

 

Apologies for breaking my thread rules. Maybe you can direct me to a thread for general moaning.....

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