...::[The Footy Desk]::... (Part 2)

[Halal Cyborg]

 

 

[Lonely-Martin]

[Jason]

Given that the fans didn't really want Nuno and Spurs look awful under him, I can see him getting sacked by Christmas. Once the fans turn the pressure will be immense and one or two more losses will do it I think.

 

The style of play is just shocking, route 1 from the first minute in a derby. Deary me. Also yea they should've sold Kane and used that money to rebuild.

[Lonely-Martin]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Given that the fans didn't really want Nuno and Spurs look awful under him, I can see him getting sacked by Christmas. Once the fans turn the pressure will be immense and one or two more losses will do it I think.

 

The style of play is just shocking, route 1 from the first minute in a derby. Deary me. Also yea they should've sold Kane and used that money to rebuild.

 

Can't argue that. I think one more loss (like recent thumpings, 3 goals per, lol) will do it. Villa next (tough game really), then Newcastle (doable but given form, righty-ho, lol), might get a point or 2 out of those if we're lucky.

 

But then West Ham and your team after that, that'll probably be the period that does it.

 

That said, we could have been offered 500m for Kane but we'd not know how to spend it really, not these days. We need more than money to fix our issues. Management, coaching, culture. The works. 

[Eutyphro]

Missed a lot of this PSG - Man City game due to depending on illegal streams that didn't deliver, and bad internet, but I saw City dominate, but suffer from having no striker. Honestly, this game proves Gabriel Jesus should be a starter for them, cause they need a striker. Messi, completely out of form, and not very much part of the game, still with a fabulous goal. A very interesting game. If City had a great striker, they would tear apart every team they'd meet, but right now they can play fabulous possession football and just not deliver. Also, Sterling looks a bit past it for me these days.

Edited September 28, 2021 by Eutyphro

[TheSantader25]

Yeah Sterling is done. I think PSG was lucky. Had City scored that goal in the first half they would've cruised to victory IMO. They did good just like they did it in the semi final last season. But this time couldn't score them goals and PSG has obviously bought more players. I still don't understand why PSG play like this though. They have so many goddamn world class players and Poch decides to play like this. Makes me throw up.

 

Also f*cking Sheriff are an amazing team lol. 

Edited September 28, 2021 by TheSantader25

[Halal Cyborg]

Real Madrid

[Bob Loblaw_]

Can I just say how dumb it looks whenever a player lies down behind a free-kick wall? It was embarrassing to see Messi doing that.

[Eutyphro]

What you see with this Barca is a delusional president and media destroying team morale. There's no way these results are necessary from how they play, but the morale is bad. There's also no way with their finances they can find results that are expected, and the expectations are delusional.

Edited September 29, 2021 by Eutyphro

[TheSantader25]

We know 3-5-2 doesn't work from the Bayern game but Koeman uses it again. Barca barely have 2 functional CBs yet Koeman has this weird obsession with playing 3 CBs. Mingueza has been good in the recent games yet gets benched. Pedri comes fresh off an injury and starts. Just like how Koeman started Alba fresh off an injury against Bayern and worsened his situation. Koeman is clueless in decisive games. Yes let's use Frenkie as a CB. I'm sure that's the best position for him.

 

I'm done. I don't ask for much. I just want one single shot on target after two CL games. I'm sorry but I'm tired and I'm done. Might as well get eliminated in the Group stage instead of getting spanked 8-0 by PSG in the round of 16 with a Messi hattrick.

 

Judge these players after this team actually gets a good coach. Cause none of them have played under one since 2013.

 

Edited September 29, 2021 by TheSantader25

[Eutyphro]

I agree. But then again all his wingers are injured/coming back from injury, so what is he to do?

2 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

Pedri comes fresh off an injury and starts. Just like how Koeman started Alba fresh off an injury against Bayern and worsened his situation.

In desperate situations you reach for desperate solutions I guess.

 

Quote

Judge these players after this team actually gets a good coach. Cause none of them have played under one since 2013.

Luis Enrique is a good coach. Koeman is also a good coach.

Edited September 29, 2021 by Eutyphro

[TheSantader25]

8 hours ago, Eutyphro said:

 

Luis Enrique is a good coach.

Luis Enrique made some of the most atrocious signings in Barca history. He also was the manager that started the trend of not counting on La Masia players. As a result players like Grimaldo (who was amazing for Benfica last night) left the team and got replaced with some horrible singings like Andre Gomes, Arda Turan, .... Many people think Barca started declining during the Valverde era but I believe the start was with Luis Enrique. He also lost the CL title rivalry against Real Madrid while having arguably one of the greatest front trios of all time. That was pretty much the beginning of the end for us. Enrique does have some good tactics up his sleeve sometimes but his biggest weakness is choosing the right players. It is evident in the current Spain National team as well IMO.

 

Him and Koeman both had minimal success in their previous teams before coming to Barca, some of those teams were left with a disaster after they left. Point is, Barca barely have brought proven coaches since forever. All of the recent choices have been huge gambles and haven't paid off.

Edited September 30, 2021 by TheSantader25

[Eutyphro]

As for Man U, if Cristiano becomes manager a little bit already during playing that could be really good for them. Cristiano has the maturity to be part of decisions in the team, and he can teach the rest of the team what a winning mentality is like. Could solve Man U manager issue.

  

5 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

Point is, Barca barely have brought proven coaches since forever.

At this point your definition of proven coaches is someone with multiple CL titles or something. Anyway, what still remained to be said is Koeman is a legend of the club, and the president is a moron. That is all.

Koeman proved a lot by getting near to La liga winning with that team last season. But with so many injuries and 17/18 year olds, or players that are to differing extents past it like Busi and Pique, and a financial dump, you can only do so much. But I feel as though we're just at a differing point of opinion. Dutch pundits universally support Koeman. The only thing he is criticized for is getting Luuk de Jong. But I actually am slightly on Koeman's side there as well. I've seen 80's/ 90's Barca teams where they had large pinchhitter strikers in the squad, and could use them effectively. It's not 'unbarcalike' at all. The single thing I have a problem with with Koeman is the fact that he doesn't play Puig even when Pedri is injured/just coming back. But then again Puig has no respect for Koeman so I understand it.

I also agree the 532 doesn't work well with Luuk de Jong and Depay, as it has no depth. Neither Depay nor Luuk de Jong really make deep runs, so therefore it doesn't utilize space. But if wingers are injured, not fit enough to play a full game, what is a coach to do? I agree Koeman should start realizing that playing 532 with de Jong is out of the question when there isn't a bunch of injuries. If there is any other half decent player to play as forward in that system then it should be done. The system itself can be useful if executed well.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Eutyphro

[TheSantader25]

55 minutes ago, Eutyphro said:

 

At this point your definition of proven coaches is someone with multiple CL titles or something. 

No. A coach that hasn't failed miserably at most of the clubs he's been at before. That's a proven coach. A coach that has a distinctive style and knows what he's doing.

 

Tuchel, Klopp , Pep, Conte, etc these are proven coaches and Conte hasn't even done that well in the CL but everyone agrees that he's a proven coach. Because he does good wherever he goes. Because he has a mindset and tactics that work. There's not that many of them available at the moment. But the point is, even when they did, Barca have barely gone for them in the past decade. The idea in Barca has always been that when the squad is good, you don't need a top coach. It has worked here and there. But guess what? We don't have a good squad anymore. This is no longer a job that any mediocre manager can pull off. It's a very difficult job and it requires a top coach. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by TheSantader25

[Eutyphro]

Conte doesn't fit Barca at all. If you have a bunch of 17/18 year olds that you want to develop you don't bring in an Italian coach. Furthermore, Barca can't afford Conte, or any other coach you'd consider 'top', so the point is pretty much senseless.

[TheSantader25]

Well we need someone that actually plays these 17-18 year olds against big teams as well instead of chickening out. At least when we lose they gain some experience. Koeman chickened out last night. He dropped Gavi and Mingueza who were performing well for Roberto and a recently injured Pedri. He was afraid.

[Eutyphro]

4 minutes ago, TheSantader25 said:

Well we need someone that actually plays these 17-18 year olds against big teams as well instead of chickening out.

And there is absolutey no way Conte would do this, or even play possession football, because that is not what Conte does. You can't say "this back 3 system is sh*t" and also say "bring in Conte".

Now it seems like I'm ripping on you, but I find you very knowledgeable on football, I think more knowledgeable than me at many times, but that makes no sense.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Eutyphro

[TheSantader25]

7 minutes ago, Eutyphro said:

And there is absolutey no way Conte would do this, or even play possession football, because that is not what Conte does. You can't say "this back 3 system is sh*t" and also say "bring in Conte".
 

I personally don't think Conte is possible. But we do need a change. Because the current situation is not working. And if we lose out on top 4 and round of 16 it could only make recruitment and the financial situation worse. That's the path Arsenal and Milan took. No matter what happens you can't drop out of top 4. It will destroy the club beyond repair.

Edited September 30, 2021 by TheSantader25

[smokeless6]

8 hours ago, Eutyphro said:

Barca can't afford Conte

 

True, but perhaps more to the point is they can't afford to fire Koeman.  His severance is in the region of 13m euros.  Add that to the wages and possible fee to whoever currently employs their next coach and they have effectively spent 1/5 of their entire 98m spending limit just to change managers.

 

They talk about Pirlo, about Xavi, about Gallardo. They'd all be fools for stepping in now, to this crisis club, and their CV's aren't sparkling with European achievements are they?

 

Barca are a mess and it's all their own doing. The stake holders deserve better than this farce. Inept management on a grand scale, and it is all coming home to roost. They need to stick with Koeman, because to do otherwise further imperils their shaky position. As noted above, CL qualification is paramount, but they need to be careful how much they bet on this becoming a reality. Staking it all to only fall short in the end would double the disaster.

 

Still, Barca should qualify regardless of the current mess and regardless of who is on the touchline.

[Eutyphro]

Sadly the relation with Koeman has already been so ruined that the hostility between those who control the club and him can not be repaired. But indeed they also can't afford firing him. What's interesting is what happens if he starts getting decent results. Right now they are totally intent on getting rid of him, but what if his squad gets fit and he finds a way to get good results out of it, that'll be interesting, because the relationship between him and the club is already so f*cked that a u-turn is near impossible.

Anyway, I don't believe in Xavi as a coach. Xavi has only coached silly Arab clubs, and it is likelier that he's a lot worse than an experienced manager like Koeman, than that he is better. But then again Barca is run by morons, so they might find a way to bully Koeman out and get Xavi, so they can truly start losing almost every game.

[TheSantader25]

Nah we aren't even smart enough to bring in Xavi. Let's go get PIRLO. Some of the rumors I'm hearing are saying he's a preferred candidate. If he is, I'm literally gonna smash my head into a wall.

 

Maybe it's time we actually get someone to buy the club. The fan owned strategy is not working cause idiots keep becoming members of our board of directors.

[Halal Cyborg]

Fonseca?

[TheSantader25]

I personally think Ten Haag is the perfect coach for developing young talent and playing good football at the moment. Sadly, he's not available.

[Halal Cyborg]

Lucien Favre is amazing at developing young players 

[Lonely-Martin]

Job done in the end, but we we're poor as the game went on, complacent really which we have no right in being, until the subs came on (Kane, Sonny, Maura). I'll not knock the likes of Dane Scarlett as he's only 17 and needs plenty of time to settle and this sort of game he can learn from. Would have loved him to get a goal mind you. Nice goal from their team though, something that lad will enjoy I'm sure.

 

After three 3 goal spankings in the league, I'd have preferred we go out and blitz a poorer team like tonight's opponents (and then bring on the kids/reserves) to build some confidence and good feeling. But we got the result and that's the main thing, as we'd not be bringing on the likes of who we did if we weren't keen to progress.

 

Just didn't like how often we had chances down the wings to cross and kept reigning it in and going backwards/square. If that's Nuno's tactics, it's got to change as we're so predictable and basic like that. Got to mix it up a bit more.

 

Lo Celso needs to bring tonight's creativity into the league asap.

 

That United/Villarreal game last night was very enjoyable though. But Ole can't be giving those chances to better teams.

[Halal Cyborg]

What’s people’s verdict in terms of relegation from Prem?

 

Initially I was sure my team Palace was going down but I’ve been encouraged by how we’ve played of late so think we will survive.

 

only certainty is Norwich i would say.

 

possibilities

 

Newcastle, Wolves, Burnley, Southampton?

I mean we’re definitely in that mix too tbf along with even Leeds.

[TheSantader25]

I think Norwich, Newcastle and maybe Burnley. I have doubts about Burnley though cause Sean Dyche turns into a genius in the second half of every season.

[smokeless6]

Hard question this early. I think Norwich are going down. The other two drops are between Newcastle, Southampton and Watford. Are Brentford for real? Their form and style suggests they will avoid the drop. But we all know how this can shift over the course of a long season. Every year there's a surprise package at Christmas, who then can hardly buy a point the rest of the way. I think Leeds will right the ship and Burnley are built for relegation scraps and should survive.

 

I'm new to this thread, having just discovered it yesterday. I hang out at a lot of gaming forums and a number of them have an off topic subforum and some football talk. I was instantly impressed with this one though, with talk of formations, personel, boardrooms and bootrooms. The analysis is more in depth than the others, the folks posting here know football,  and I'm glad I found it!

Edited October 1, 2021 by smokeless6

[Eutyphro]

23 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

I personally think Ten Haag is the perfect coach for developing young talent and playing good football at the moment. Sadly, he's not available.

If we're totally honest he'd be utterly insane to become Barca coach between now and the near future.

[smokeless6]

Agreed. I think any top manager would be unwise to join Barca right now. The squad is imbalanced, the finances are a mess and could get worse before they get better. The supporters (I assume) are unhappy with the current state of affairs and they could find recruitment more difficult as a result of all of this. Now's not the best time to hitch your wagon to Barca if you're a top manager I don't think.