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Mr_Long

Do You really think the next GTA will be in Vice City

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Mr_Long

I understand that Rockstar's goal in the HD universe is to recreate cities from the PS2 era, but I just don't see Vice City working. 

 

Miami is pretty flat so everything outside the city would be swamps and all that. Los Angeles has more to offer than Miami in real life to. It worked in the 80s because it took heavy liberties to make Miami fun, but in a modern setting it wouldn't work. I mean what does Miami have to offer that Los Angeles doesn't ? Instead we should be seeing a new location, because San Francisco is the setting for Watch Dogs 2 and Las Vegas is way too close to the west coast. Instead it would be better to see a midwestern city than Vice City again. The main reason I see people choose Vice City over San Andress is because of the setting,music and story which all heavily influenced by the 80s. 

 

What does Vice City actually have to offer that Los Santos and Liberty City didn't already offer ?

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Mister Pink

It's hard to say. One part of me thinks, no, Rockstar aren't that predictable but then given their output lately and with Shark Cards and Online-centric focus, I wouldn't be surprised if Rockstar do a predictable trip to do a HD Vice City. I don't doubt in my mind that Rockstar wouldn't do a good job making a HD Vice City. The issue isn't really with how they make their cities. They're experts at this. It's just the choice of returning to same old haunts that bothers me. It's as if there's only a handful of cities we can visit in a game. 

 

Games like Mafia III going to New Orleans are my only hope of seeing something fresh in a video game. For all the criticism Mafia III got, I think it was like nowadays playing a 3D era GTA if Rockstar never made it mega-huge. It's single-player focused. It's a period piece. It focussed on gang crime with kind of rags to riches tail when you assume control over a city and allowed you do crime-based missions like growing and selling weed, drug courier missions etc. 

 

I don't think Vice City should have happened after IV. Do you really want to a predictable sequence or formula of Rockstar games or would you rather something new and surprising? I would certainly prefer a surprise than some predictable squence of Rockstar games. 

 

 

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TheSantader25

I doubt Vice City alone can be big enough for a new GTA even if they make it as big as liberty city with it's surrounding areas. it was ok for 2002 but now? I don't think so. My prediction is that R* will do Las Venturas, Vice City and possibly San fierro at the same time this time. Having more than one State can open a huge opportunity to offer different variation of missions and activities. 

Edited by TheSantader25

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Mr_Long
21 hours ago, Mister Pink said:

It's hard to say. One part of me thinks, no, Rockstar aren't that predictable but then given their output lately and with Shark Cards and Online-centric focus, I wouldn't be surprised if Rockstar do a predictable trip to do a HD Vice City. I don't doubt in my mind that Rockstar wouldn't do a good job making a HD Vice City. The issue isn't really with how they make their cities. They're experts at this. It's just the choice of returning to same old haunts that bothers me. It's as if there's only a handful of cities we can visit in a game. 

 

Games like Mafia III going to New Orleans are my only hope of seeing something fresh in a video game. For all the criticism Mafia III got, I think it was like nowadays playing a 3D era GTA if Rockstar never made it mega-huge. It's single-player focused. It's a period piece. It focussed on gang crime with kind of rags to riches tail when you assume control over a city and allowed you do crime-based missions like growing and selling weed, drug courier missions etc. 

 

I don't think Vice City should have happened after IV. Do you really want to a predictable sequence or formula of Rockstar games or would you rather something new and surprising? I would certainly prefer a surprise than some predictable squence of Rockstar games. 

 

 

Mafia 3 failed mainly because is barely about the mafia and the copy and paste missions, but thats besides the point. But I wouldn't say Mafia 3 should've been a GTA game because rockstar don't put a lot racism in any of their games. Also the game was way too rushed since lots of cutscenes aren't animated with motion capture and the amount of bugs at launch. Hangar 13 shouldn't be a studio anyone cares about anyway since they made mafia more of a GTA game than an actual Mafia game. Also the graphics for Mafia 3 are ugly since the color tint. But Mafia 3 still could of been a good game if it wasn't so rushed, but I wouldn't say it has the rockstar feel to it.

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Mister Pink

@Mr_LongI never said it should have been a Rockstar game. I'm drawing similarities to what I personally value about 3D-era Rockstar games and Mafia III. I wasn't discussing why Mafia III failed either. GTA IV had copy/paste missions but didn't fail so it's hardly, not just that. We know people are willing to enjoy copy/paste missions if there's good story and atmosphere.

The comparrisons I was drawing from are:

 

Period-piece games: 

 

(1986): Vice City, a single-player open-world, crime-based game, focussed on the criminal underworld, with known voice actors, with references/appearances of the Italian-American Mafia, is set during 1986. You play as a newly release mafioso, you go through a transformation by going rogue and taking Vice City. You start off with nothing and end up acquiring a lot of cash and assets. It was the first time GTA set a game in Miami and the first time we got an open-world, 3D game set in Miamia. 

 

(1992): San Andreas -  a singleplayer, open-world, crime-based game, focussed on the criminal underworld, with some known voice actors, and references/appearances of the Italian-American Mafia You start off returning to Los Santos with after living in Liberty City. You go through a transformation by showing leadership skills and taking over the GSF, restoring the neighbourhood and becoming the criminal king of San Andreas. It was the first time we got an open-world game of it's kind set in Los Angeles, San Francisco and Las Vegas. 

 

 

(1968) - Mafia III, set  New Orleans is a singleplayer, open-world, crime-based game, focussed on the criminal underworld, with know voice actors with references/appearances of the Italian-American Mafia set in 1968. In fact the antagonists are Italian Mafia. It was the first time we got an open-world game like this set in New Orleans

 

A game called Mafia III where the purpose is to go after and take down the Mafia, gang-hangout by gang-hangout, cutscene by cutscene is hardly a game not about the Mafia. As for the racism, Rockstar put racism and/or bigotry into GTA V when that guy got tortured because he was a suspected terrorist and he was suspected on little-to-no evidence. And you as the player actually do the torturing. You never actually be the racist in Mafia III. You fight them. But lets really look at your point there. Rockstar are known to try capture a time a place, would you agree? So in Vice City, they focussed on a lot of Haitian and Cuban crime gangs. Right? So what is that? Is it racial stereotyping or are they trying to represent the times? Now think of Mafia III. Why do you think there was racism in Mafia III? Perhaps they were trying to capture the times, no? What do you think happened the racists in the game, normally? They usually saw the end of Lincolns blade. But that's beside the point. The fact of the matter is racism exists and it certainly existed in 1968 in New Orleans and the surrounding swamplands. Why you brought up racism is beyond me. Did you complain when there was murder and crack abuse in San Andreas? Did you complain about prostitution in all GTA games? The fact of the matter is those things exist whether you like them or not. Representing the criminal underworld and shining a mirror on society is what these games do. 

 

Now, afer the topic was derailed, I'll stand by my original point that Mafia III is more like a 3D-era GTA game. It's set in a city we haven't been before at the time in a open-world game. It focusses on rags to riches. It features Italian-American mafia, heavility. And it's single-player focussed. I value those things greatly in a GTA. That's why I made the point. 

 

Back on the topic. Yeah, GTA could go to Vice City for the 3rd time. For me, that's unoriginal. It's lazy and it's not the type of ballsy, try-something-new Rockstar we knew in the late-90's and early 2000's. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mister Pink

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Mr_Long

@Mister Pink

 

To when did I say I was against racism being in video games ? I just said that rockstar doesn't include a lot of racism in their games and you took it out of context. Also GTA 5 is a lot about American sterotypes so thats not very suprising. Rockstar weren't intending to make Haitians and Cubans racial sterotypes as they removed Cuban and Haitain references in future releases of the game.

 

Your basically calling me a SJW at this point who wants to ban video games. If I didn't like things in GTA I wouldn't be posting on this forum, so there you go.

 

And yeah I think we should go to a new midwestern city, but unfortunately GTA Online has changed the way rockstar do things. Just like Take Two(Rockstar's parent company) said every future title of their's will have microtransactions.

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Mister Pink

I never said you were against racism depicted in video games although your comment seemed to imply you were.  

 

On 8/19/2018 at 2:29 PM, Mr_Long said:

But I wouldn't say Mafia 3 should've been a GTA game because rockstar don't put a lot racism in any of their games.

In fact, that covers the other time you misrepresented or responded to something I didn't insinuate - a straw man if you will: I never said it should have been a GTA game and then I don't quite understand what you mean now by the rest of the comment as it doesn't make much sense after what you just said. 

 

On 8/19/2018 at 5:10 PM, Mr_Long said:

Rockstar weren't intending to make Haitians and Cubans racial sterotypes as they removed Cuban and Haitain references in future releases of the game.

You are missing the point. I never suggested they were trying to make stereotypes. I was suggesting that they added representations of gangs of the time and location (Miami 1986). just like the racist Southern Union in Mafia III.

 

On 8/19/2018 at 5:10 PM, Mr_Long said:

Your basically calling me a SJW at this point who wants to ban video games. If I didn't like things in GTA I wouldn't be posting on this forum, so there you go.

 

 

I'm not, nor did I insinuate it. I'll concede that I probably misunderstood your comment about racism. What I think you meant to say is "Mafia III shouldn't be compared or likened to a GTA game because it's not Rockstar's style to have racism in their games." Is that a fair representation? If so, my point still stands. That Mafia III and Rockstar go for social realism, in the sense that it will represent the underbelly of society. That includes drug dealers and pimps. Hangar 13 included racists. It comes from the same logic though - to represent people that existed at the time, even if they're bad/criminal.  And on that subject, Officer Pulaski from San Andreas is named presumably after the town where the KKK was formed. You had the cop that used to say "I aint a racist, boy" when he chased you and then you had their parody of the L.A. Riots which were very racially characterised. I don't think Rockstar shy away from it representing it, just it's in a much more subtle and indirect way that Mafia III.

 

I've spent to much time on this. I think it was just a misunderstanding between the both of us. I don't mean be inflammatory or you to think I don't think you enjoy GTA. We're all fans here.

 

On 8/19/2018 at 5:10 PM, Mr_Long said:

And yeah I think we should go to a new midwestern city, but unfortunately GTA Online has changed the way rockstar do things. Just like Take Two(Rockstar's parent company) said every future title of their's will have microtransactions.

I agree. Microstransactions are cancer to GTA in my opinion but that's another topic. 

 

As for Vice City.. damn, I would be curious to see it but I want somewhere new. Somewhere fresh that hasn't been done by Rockstar or a competitor. 

Edited by Mister Pink

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Reno_

It will. But it won't be just vice city. Multiple states. Maybe some outside the US. That's the direction i very much believe they are going for with this next game.

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Zello

I'd like a return to Vice City only if it's in the eighties. We've already had two modern day games back to back and part of what made Vice City amazing was that it was in the eighties also modern day is getting stale. Part of me wants to see them do Vice City next but another part of me wants to see them go someplace else like Boston, Philadelphia, Chicago or Detroit. Anyplace new we haven't seen before.

 

They really need to expand GTA to new places instead of just Liberty City, Vice City, and San Andreas all the time.

Edited by Zello

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luisniko

This thread is kinda clusterf*ck because OP missed Mister Pink's post by miles and came up with his own ideas of what Pink said. Usual video game community stuff.

 

Anyway, a (modern) Vice City doesn't have to follow new Los Santos and new LC. It can have its own identity by focusing the action more in the water or areas across the sea. This means more water and air transportation as well as more islands, smaller landmasses, and buildings at the ocean. The protagonist doesn't have to be a neo-Scarface rip-off. It doesn't have to be another emo vengeful man, f*ck-machine club bouncer, or rich daddy going back to crime. Instead, go back to what GTA hero being GTA hero; cold blood killing, smuggling, stealing, and all the hustling crap rag-to-rich kind - except without the betrayal-themed GTA-cliche-ending-ever.

 

Otherwise I need that GTA3 feel back in the next GTA. So while Vice City has a lot of potential to hit back and being cool, I want island-to-island map with fictional Detroit (the Portland-esque city), then split by sea, next to it the fictional Chicago (the Staunton-esque city), then a land mass of forest followed by another big city of fictional Toronto.

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Domac

They should put the HD Liberty City and San Andreas (which would be remastered) + remastered Las Venturas, San Fierro and Vice City... and a countryside with a nice forest.

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GrudgefromSanAndreas

It doesnt necessarily have to be the setting of the next gta but some future gta after that. I'd insist they do a new HD version of VC anyway cause LC and LS were done and both appeared in 3D.

Well i said something similar once somewhere and i'll say it again: i see 3 options when it comes to year of setting in case they go era and not contemporary: 1995, 1998 and 2003. And i really think they should draw inspiration from the 2 Bad Boys movies or any other movie that isnt Scraface coz that was already done

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Lioshenka

I agree with what many people here have said.

 

I was actually looking at Florida images on the internet the other days, and I must say that if it's set in modern day (most probably, since this is the direction R* seem to like now) it will be dead boring and unoriginal. Miami is no different than any other city - glass and metal skyscrapers, concrete jungle of motorways. There's nothing original or attractive about it.

 

For GTA to appeal to me it needs to have either a memorable setting, either time-wise or location wise, or a good original storyline - so far if the game is set in modern day Miami it's not going to be either.

 

I also think that the Rage engine will ruin the neon lights, even if it is set in the 80-ies. Rage is nowhere near as appealing as Renderware, and R* seem to be choosing small things (like grey maps and radars, annoying features like phone or weapon selection wheel etc) to even more distance me from their games.

 

Throw in the appalling choice of contemporary music and the prospect of wandering around similar looking swamps and mansions and you have yourself another mediocre game.

 

All hope for The Benz finishing his game.

Edited by Lioshenka

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TheSantader25
18 minutes ago, Lioshenka said:

 

 

All hope for The Benz finishing his game.

The Benz game is Online-Only for what I've heard. 

Also he was the one that pushed GTA Online to be the priority instead of SP. Yes. He wasn't the reason for R* greed in GTA Online from 2015 and so on but he was the main reason many features were cut for online and SP suffered. He always had a dream of a massive multiplayer experience. I don't know why people think he is the good guy in this situation. 

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GiveMeLiberty78

Vice City has not yet been officially revisited in the HD/Next Gen eras, so maybe. I'm really never sure exactly where leaked information comes from and hence its credibility (I imagine a little rumour mill spins somewhere churning out ideas!). The cynic in me says to leave Victy City alone but the nostalgic in me says, "Go back...perhaps here things will be different?".

But I am an old dinosaur in this forum and some days I don't know what is up and what is down. Kinda an existential question here but expanding on the original poster's final question, what could GTA 6, another GTA, offer that the previous GTAs do not offer? I could swear I read shortly after the PC release of GTA 5 that the writers/developers basically said they're not doing another GTA for a very long time. But maybe that was a nightmare or just a side effect...

..now, where are my pills..?

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Zello

People say they don't want the 80s again because it was done twice but I'd like to see Vice City in 1989 when the 80's were coming to a close and the colors were fading away.

 

With the music since its 1989 they can have all the music that came out in the 80s. They wouldn't be limited like San Andreas and Vice City were because they couldn't add songs that came out after 1992 or 1986.

Edited by Zello

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TheSantader25
6 minutes ago, GiveMeLiberty78 said:

Vice City has not yet been officially revisited in the HD/Next Gen eras, so maybe. I'm really never sure exactly where leaked information comes from and hence its credibility (I imagine a little rumour mill spins somewhere churning out ideas!). The cynic in me says to leave Victy City alone but the nostalgic in me says, "Go back...perhaps here things will be different?".

But I am an old dinosaur in this forum and some days I don't know what is up and what is down. Kinda an existential question here but expanding on the original poster's final question, what could GTA 6, another GTA, offer that the previous GTAs do not offer? I could swear I read shortly after the PC release of GTA 5 that the writers/developers basically said they're not doing another GTA for a very long time. But maybe that was a nightmare or just a side effect...

..now, where are my pills..?

That's what I think as well. They really need to take their time with the next one and do it like it's the last one they do. I will wait until the end of next gen(2025+) if I have to. I just want R* to give it their best shot. They need to push everything this series has to offer to the limit and release the biggest gaming project ever. That could be a good end to an amazing series. 

Edited by TheSantader25

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DisCrafted
57 minutes ago, GiveMeLiberty78 said:

Vice City has not yet been officially revisited in the HD/Next Gen eras, so maybe. I'm really never sure exactly where leaked information comes from and hence its credibility (I imagine a little rumour mill spins somewhere churning out ideas!). The cynic in me says to leave Victy City alone but the nostalgic in me says, "Go back...perhaps here things will be different?".

But I am an old dinosaur in this forum and some days I don't know what is up and what is down. Kinda an existential question here but expanding on the original poster's final question, what could GTA 6, another GTA, offer that the previous GTAs do not offer? I could swear I read shortly after the PC release of GTA 5 that the writers/developers basically said they're not doing another GTA for a very long time. But maybe that was a nightmare or just a side effect...

..now, where are my pills..?

They've never said anything like this. GTA is a 'permanent' franchise as Zelnick mentioned a few years ago.

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TheSantader25
1 hour ago, DisCrafted said:

They've never said anything like this. GTA is a 'permanent' franchise as Zelnick mentioned a few years ago.

The Benz is gone but if I'm not mistaken he said they have 45 years worth of ideas left to do. 

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DisCrafted
4 minutes ago, TheSantader25 said:

The Benz is gone but if I'm not mistaken he said they have 45 years worth of ideas left to do. 

Yup. As I've said before there are basically endless possibilities for a series like GTA.

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GiveMeLiberty78
3 hours ago, DisCrafted said:

They've never said anything like this. GTA is a 'permanent' franchise as Zelnick mentioned a few years ago.

Well that is indeed good news, thanks! As I said, I really thought I had read that somewhere before and I remember thinking, "that'd be like cancelling football!" (Well, I don't give a toss about football but GTA ending any time soon would be a pretty big deal to a lot of people.)

 

2 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

The Benz is gone but if I'm not mistaken he said they have 45 years worth of ideas left to do. 

I can believe that actually. GTA: Mars, anyone? We laugh but in years to come...plus, we already Grand Theft Space. I remember when I first played GTA III on an old friend's PS2, I was wowed - had you told me we'd have in-game cell phones, flyable aircraft, GTA:Online, 3D steak and bowling, I'd have found that hard to believe. Anything is possible, I guess.

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PaddsterG2k3

I think this topic raises some interesting questions which are questions that cause much head scratching for GTA fans:

 

Will Rockstar maintain a single location (like IV and V) or will they go the SA route and have more than one city?

 

Will Rockstar maintain the modern era (like IV and V) or go back to a period piece, like Mr Pink references.

 

In my opinion, a single location VC in the modern era would not work. However, VC as one of a dual or tri city location could work and perhaps moreso as part of a period location. It purely depends on the route Rockstar goes.

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Hmmm nice bike
11 hours ago, PaddsterG2k3 said:

In my opinion, a single location VC in the modern era would not work. However, VC as one of a dual or tri city location could work and perhaps moreso as part of a period location. It purely depends on the route Rockstar goes.

If Vice City on its own wouldn't be good enough, how about an entire state based on Florida? They'd obviously have to retcon the fact that Florida is mentioned numerous times in GTA if they decided to call it something different, but they could have VC, the Gator Keys (a cut area from the original VC map that was meant to be based on the Florida Keys), swamps, small towns, a city based on the Tampa and St. Petersburg area to the northwest, and then a city based on Orlando to the north with a theme park. It'd make an interesting-enough map, and unlike V (and much like SA), you'd actually have the sense of going somewhere when you're driving on a long stretch of highway, instead of how it is on V's map where you're just infinitely looping back to the city.

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Lioshenka
On 8/21/2018 at 1:37 PM, TheSantader25 said:

The Benz game is Online-Only for what I've heard. 

Also he was the one that pushed GTA Online to be the priority instead of SP. Yes. He wasn't the reason for R* greed in GTA Online from 2015 and so on but he was the main reason many features were cut for online and SP suffered. He always had a dream of a massive multiplayer experience. I don't know why people think he is the good guy in this situation. 

I hope he learns from his mistakes. Multiplayer can be good if done well (e.g. anything, but GTA: Online). I's like to think The Benz will make something nice, but I don't rule out that it will be a disaster.

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luisniko
On 8/21/2018 at 10:29 AM, Am Shaegar said:

The thing that really attracts me is the whole atmosphere of the period setting, but more so, I really loved the cartoonish graphics that has its own charm I doubt modern graphics can offer. 

It was affected by the technical lag, instead of art style. So I think nodding to hyper realism has always been their aim and now the got the skill to do it. I don't think we could see another art style unless under special occasion spin off like CTW.

 

What I personally feel the HD era lack charm is that they copy-pasted way too much of the referenced city. 3's Liberty City got its own identity compared to 4's obvious NYC/NJ copy.

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Journey_95
On 8/18/2018 at 5:26 PM, Mister Pink said:

It's hard to say. One part of me thinks, no, Rockstar aren't that predictable but then given their output lately and with Shark Cards and Online-centric focus, I wouldn't be surprised if Rockstar do a predictable trip to do a HD Vice City. I don't doubt in my mind that Rockstar wouldn't do a good job making a HD Vice City. The issue isn't really with how they make their cities. They're experts at this. It's just the choice of returning to same old haunts that bothers me. It's as if there's only a handful of cities we can visit in a game. 

 

Games like Mafia III going to New Orleans are my only hope of seeing something fresh in a video game. For all the criticism Mafia III got, I think it was like nowadays playing a 3D era GTA if Rockstar never made it mega-huge. It's single-player focused. It's a period piece. It focussed on gang crime with kind of rags to riches tail when you assume control over a city and allowed you do crime-based missions like growing and selling weed, drug courier missions etc. 

 

I don't think Vice City should have happened after IV. Do you really want to a predictable sequence or formula of Rockstar games or would you rather something new and surprising? I would certainly prefer a surprise than some predictable squence of Rockstar games. 

 

 

Mafia 3 was crap. It doesn't matter if its more like the 3D Era GTA's (superficially too, like a rip off and they dumped Mafia's identity for it), it had a fresh city but the rest was lacking so why does that matter?

In one way you say that Rockstar is too predictable but then you praise Mafia 3 for being like a 3D Era GTA, do you want Rockstar to just rehash old concepts (but not cities)?

 

I think a HD Vice City set in modern day would be fine, even if I would like a period piece GTA. Like you said Rockstar's are experts at making fantastic cities to explore and considering how HD LC and HD LS are completely different and way more detailed than their 3D counterparts, I'm not worried about returning to "old haunts"). Not to mention they could also add another city (that seems to be the next step for the HD maps)

 

14 hours ago, luisniko said:

It was affected by the technical lag, instead of art style. So I think nodding to hyper realism has always been their aim and now the got the skill to do it. I don't think we could see another art style unless under special occasion spin off like CTW.

 

What I personally feel the HD era lack charm is that they copy-pasted way too much of the referenced city. 3's Liberty City got its own identity compared to 4's obvious NYC/NJ copy.

Well thats the point..recreating the referenced city as much as possible. 3D LC has barely anything to do with New York, at that point we may as well be in Saints Row territory with its own fictional cities. Its the exception anyway, even with 3D LS as small and underdeveloped as it was, you can see Rockstar already trying to make it more like the real one. This is a natural progression of the series

Edited by Journey_95

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TheSantader25

Tbh tho if there is one thing I'm not worried about in VI it's the map. R* are the best in that regard and never disappoint. 

Edited by TheSantader25

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universetwisters
On 8/18/2018 at 9:53 AM, Mr_Long said:

Miami is pretty flat so everything outside the city would be swamps and all that.

 

Lmao f*cking liar we have hills here in Florida

 

341692-L.jpg

Julia-Tuttle-Causeway.jpg

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Zello

Those are the only beautiful hills in that state.

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Ondr4H

But, but in CSI MIAMI there were some hefty hills in Miami!

 

P.s.;I know that this csi was filmed in California

 

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