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aqarwaen

why dont gta protagonists just lock car doors,to avoid getting busted by police?

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Son of Zeus
Posted (edited)

 

 

 

 

So... how did he do it then?

He did it by relying on a very scripted AI, similar to quick time events.

If he doesn't have the skills then he couldn't have completed the mission. The mission is essential for storyline progress and not optional so it canonically occurred, so it had to have happened. Or did everything that happens after Truck Hustle just exist as a figment of Niko's mind because he couldn't climb the truck?

Then where do those skills/abilities disappear outside the cutscenes and pre-scripted paths? That's the problem with IV. Outside the cutscenes, the player is restricted in many ways, and if you find my points weirder then the blame is on the developers, for not allowing the players to USE those skills/abities in normal gameplay. That's the general idea behind ludonarrative dissonance that irked many fans upon IVs release.
I can say the same about CJ in Freefall. He can get aboard a plane mid air, but cant do it in free roam. I guess using your logic thats not an exhibition of ability or skill because the game just forgets about it after the mission.

Also comparing the actions Niko does in Truck Hustle to a QTE really makes no sense. You still have to control his actions to scale the truck. If the whole thing was a cutscene then Id agree its not really an exhibition of his skills, but it still requires player input to carry it out regardless if its not used in regular gameplay since it was specifically designed for that mossion.

Weak argument there mate. SA wasn't a grounded game like IV. So what CJ does in Freefall doesn't really matter. But IV took itself seriously and is the most grounded game in the series...which is why it's odd that he can't do Truck Hustle actions in normal gameplay. Just face it...IV isn't perfect and it's OK to admit it.Another annoying thing was how slowly Niko ran, like an idiot with something heavy stuck in his pants. You'd think a soldier would run faster and smoother.That's a piss poor excuse and you know it.

 

And of course GTA IV isn't perfect. No game is after all.

How is it a piss poor excuse? Just saying facts here. In Freefall CJ jumps and hijacks the plane in a cut scene. In Truck Hustle you are actually controlling Niko and doing the actions on the truck yourself. So it's just strange that they didn't put it in normal gameplay despite having the animations. Anyway it isn't a huge deal, but it would've made freeroam gameplay more interesting. Edited by Son of Zeus

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Derphoe

I've never been busted, they usually just blast me to hell.

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Algonquin Assassin

yh

 

 

 

 

So... how did he do it then?

He did it by relying on a very scripted AI, similar to quick time events.

If he doesn't have the skills then he couldn't have completed the mission. The mission is essential for storyline progress and not optional so it canonically occurred, so it had to have happened. Or did everything that happens after Truck Hustle just exist as a figment of Niko's mind because he couldn't climb the truck?

Then where do those skills/abilities disappear outside the cutscenes and pre-scripted paths? That's the problem with IV. Outside the cutscenes, the player is restricted in many ways, and if you find my points weirder then the blame is on the developers, for not allowing the players to USE those skills/abities in normal gameplay. That's the general idea behind ludonarrative dissonance that irked many fans upon IVs release.
I can say the same about CJ in Freefall. He can get aboard a plane mid air, but cant do it in free roam. I guess using your logic thats not an exhibition of ability or skill because the game just forgets about it after the mission.

Also comparing the actions Niko does in Truck Hustle to a QTE really makes no sense. You still have to control his actions to scale the truck. If the whole thing was a cutscene then Id agree its not really an exhibition of his skills, but it still requires player input to carry it out regardless if its not used in regular gameplay since it was specifically designed for that mossion.

Weak argument there mate. SA wasn't a grounded game like IV. So what CJ does in Freefall doesn't really matter. But IV took itself seriously and is the most grounded game in the series...which is why it's odd that he can't do Truck Hustle actions in normal gameplay. Just face it...IV isn't perfect and it's OK to admit it.Another annoying thing was how slowly Niko ran, like an idiot with something heavy stuck in his pants. You'd think a soldier would run faster and smoother.That's a piss poor excuse and you know it.

 

And of course GTA IV isn't perfect. No game is after all.

How is it a piss poor excuse? Just saying facts here. In Freefall CJ jumps and hijacks the plane in a cut scene. In Truck Hustle you are actually controlling Niko and doing the actions on the truck yourself. So it's just strange that they didn't put it in normal gameplay despite having the animations. Anyway it isn't a huge deal, but it would've made freeroam gameplay more interesting.

 

 

Because you said San Andreas isn't grounded like it's allowed to get away with such things and I disagree that it's strange it's not incorporated into freeroam.

 

The whole mechanic is so specific in its purpose it was clearly designed only to be used once. Niko chases after the truck as it's speeding away and he only scales it to get to the driver's cab to commandeer it. In a run of the mill play session of GTA IV I don't see where it would have a practical purpose.

 

GTA IV doesn't have many action set piece moments, but I've always considered Truck Hustle to be unique for this reason. I mean you say it's not a huge deal, but why all the fuss?

 

I'm not a fan of mission exclusive content and quite honestly you could lay a blow on GTA IV (No pun intended) for the "stun" punch that's only used in one mission and never again for whatever reason, but this is an entirely different level of coding/programming.

 

Just to clear the air I never said what CJ did in Freedall should've been something he should do in freeroam either if you read what I was getting at.

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Am Shaegar

Judging by the nature of all the GTA protagonists, if they ended up getting surrounded after a high-speed chase, the first thing they would do is reverse the hell out of there, not sit patiently in the car awaiting to be arrested. And if they do just sit the car, locking the car won't be much use seeing how trigger-happy the police are in GTA V.

 

I think that needs some clarity because I am sure even OP understands that sitting inside a locked car isn't a sound advice for a criminal to avoid getting busted. It could be related to some sort of stealth mode that makes you invisible to the cops, once you lock yourself inside the car, provided you have already escaped their line of sight. The idea isn't really bad, if the developers manage to make it more interesting and useful beyond just locking yourself up inside the car.

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DirtCheap

 

Judging by the nature of all the GTA protagonists, if they ended up getting surrounded after a high-speed chase, the first thing they would do is reverse the hell out of there, not sit patiently in the car awaiting to be arrested. And if they do just sit the car, locking the car won't be much use seeing how trigger-happy the police are in GTA V.

 

I think that needs some clarity because I am sure even OP understands that sitting inside a locked car isn't a sound advice for a criminal to avoid getting busted. It could be related to some sort of stealth mode that makes you invisible to the cops, once you lock yourself inside the car, provided you have already escaped their line of sight. The idea isn't really bad, if the developers manage to make it more interesting and useful beyond just locking yourself up inside the car.

 

 

No offense or anything dude, but I don't think locking your car can make you invisible to the police as it makes no sense why you'd disappear all of the sudden if you decided to lock the car as all you are doing is making the car doors locked.

 

Also, I said

 

locking the car won't be much use seeing how trigger-happy the police are in GTA V.

which means that locking your car when the police have you surrounded is extremely redundant as they would easily shoot your head off in milliseconds.

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Lioshenka
Posted (edited)

 

It's not stupid actually. R* just didn't bother wasting time coding the physics for a pointless gimmick like standing on top of moving cars.

 

 

Woah, chill out, IV fanboy.

 

Riding atop cars was one of my favourite pastimes in SA, when I couldn't be bothered to control CJ, e.g. if I was eating. You jump on the car roof, shoot once and enjoy the views. It was very short-minded from R* not do the same thing in IV, given the huge city asking to be admired, and the only options being pre-scripted helicopter and taxi rides.

 

On topic: door locks never bothered me in Renderware games. It became more of a desired feature in IV (but even more so in V) after R* changed too many things.

 

I never thought of using it against the police though, I just wanted to keep the gangs and crazy peds away.

Edited by Lioshenka

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Tycek
Posted (edited)

Riding a top of the cars in 3D era games wasn't purposely programmed feature, but just a fault coming from rather simply physics the games had in the time. R* didn't decide to include in IV, because they didn't include it in any other previous game of theirs.

 

And was that IV fanboy name was really that necessary?

Edited by Tycek

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Algonquin Assassin

 

 

It's not stupid actually. R* just didn't bother wasting time coding the physics for a pointless gimmick like standing on top of moving cars.

 

 

Woah, chill out, IV fanboy.

 

Riding atop cars was one of my favourite pastimes in SA, when I couldn't be bothered to control CJ, e.g. if I was eating. You jump on the car roof, shoot once and enjoy the views. It was very short-minded from R* not do the same thing in IV, given the huge city asking to be admired, and the only options being pre-scripted helicopter and taxi rides.

 

So I'm a fanboy because I don't care for something you do? And you said it yourself GTA IV has helicopters and taxis to admire the city. It even has heli-tours if you just want to sit back and relax. Before it was mentioned in this thread I had forgotten it was even possible to ride on top of cars in the 3D era.

 

Yes that's how much I value its existence.

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Am Shaegar

Riding a top of the cars in 3D era games wasn't purposely programmed feature

That's not true. In GTA V, there are a couple of vehicles that allow the player to stand on top like, the ambulance, buses, trucks and even helis, tanks that I think only Online players can access to the feature. Not many vehicles in the SP mode, but the fact is that it is a separate, purposely programmed feature that can allow the players to stand on top, and not because of simple physics movement - based on the FLAG_PEDS_CAN_STAND_ON_TOP entry in the vehicles data file of GTA V. That's why there's a separate mod called Stand On Vehicles that simply makes 1 change to the file to allow access to this feature, so there's no reason for GTA IV not to include it in the game, if it's possible in GTA V.

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ChiroVette

Woah, chill out, IV fanboy.

 

In Algonquin's defense, he may be a IV fan and certainly likes IV better than V, but that just makes him a tasteless douche with a Mommy complex someone who doesn't agree with us about IV versus V. All joking aside, he and I disagree about a lot of things in V and IV, but he always beings good points to the table, even when we find ourselves on opposite sides of the debate. In point of fact, he is right about this. Car-surfing was never really a thing in GTA. You could kind of, sort of do it, granted, but it is more of a weird or odd happenstance than anything Rockstar did intentionally. You can tell this is true because even when you can make it work, its quite loose and sloppy and never really feels right.

 

Saints Row is the only sandbox series I have seen actual car surfing in, and it is a lot of fun, far more so than trying to artificially make it happen in any GTA game. This is because, unlike GTA, Volition actually created not only a mini-game for vehicle surfing, BUT added the gameplay aspect of it to the physics.

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Tycek
Posted (edited)

 

Riding a top of the cars in 3D era games wasn't purposely programmed feature

That's not true. In GTA V, there are a couple of vehicles that allow the player to stand on top like, the ambulance, buses, trucks and even helis, tanks that I think only Online players can access to the feature. Not many vehicles in the SP mode, but the fact is that it is a separate, purposely programmed feature that can allow the players to stand on top, and not because of simple physics movement - based on the FLAG_PEDS_CAN_STAND_ON_TOP entry in the vehicles data file of GTA V. That's why there's a separate mod called Stand On Vehicles that simply makes 1 change to the file to allow access to this feature, so there's no reason for GTA IV not to include it in the game, if it's possible in GTA V.

God give me the strength. I was taking about 3D era games as you probably could read in this fourteen words sentence of mine. 3D era is limited to games between GTA III and GTA San Vice City Stories, in other words was developed between 2001 and 2006. GTA V isn't by any mean part of 3D era as it even uses totally different engine, not to mentioned storyline things of course. GTA V came out 5 years after GTA IV if you didn't realize and it's quite good that this time was spent on upgrading the code of the game allowing player to stand on some of the vehicles. Fact that something is possible in GTA V doesn't automatically made it available for IV, due to being much older and using not refined RAGE engine.

Edited by Tycek

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Am Shaegar

I was taking about 3D era games as you probably could read in this fourteen words sentence of mine.

 

I did read and understood everything in your post. I was specifically addressing your claim that standing on vehicles isn't a programmed feature, irrespective of the game. In my opinion your claim isn't true, at all, based on the available information in both IV and V. Niko can be clearly seen interacting with the truck in the mission which isn't possible w/o being programmed or scripted to perform those actions, the mod for the game GTA V also indicates the existence of such a feature that also requires a tweak to enable it, including the possibility to stand on top across all the 3D era games, and not limited to SA that I don;t think is possible w/o certain in-game script allowing the protags to stand on top of the vehicles.

I don't think this can be considered as weird or odd happenstance when it comes to Renderware games, since they are based entirely on game scripting code and do not rely on a complex physics calculations like Euphoria that might lead to certain oddities that aren't entirely scripted since all these calculations happen in real time, and that's the distinction I was trying to make when you claim that it wasn't programmed in 3D era games.

It may not be advertised as a feature, but its still a feature nonetheless. Just looking at the video posted by the modder I get the impression just how fun this feature is to use, if it was properly implemented by default.

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Lioshenka
Posted (edited)

 

So I'm a fanboy because I don't care for something you do?

 

I did not like your tone and the way you said it. In fact, you repeatedly say rather rude and disrespectful things about other games with complete disregard to what other people think and inability to accept other people's opinion, so yeah, that's my reason.

 

I accept that what you say probably sounds innocent and fine to you, but this is not the impression I get when reading your posts.

Edited by Lioshenka

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ChiroVette
Posted (edited)

I did not like your tone and the way you said it. In fact, you repeatedly say rather rude and disrespectful things about other games with complete disregard to what other people think and inability to accept other people's opinion, so yeah, that's my reason.

 

I accept that what you say probably sounds innocent and fine to you, but this is not the impression I get when reading your posts.

 

To be frank, he is a IV fan and a little whinging bitch not so much a fan of V, but he is not like some of the fringe-cultist-IV-Froot-Loops I have argued vehemently against. Also, bear in mind that I break his balls an awful lot, and I think he likes to kid around, too. Trust me, I know the guy pretty well on this forum, and factoring out his ridiculous Snore fetish and even though we disagree about a lot of things, I read his posts and I am 99% sure he meant nothing offensive by it. Oh my f*cking God, I just noticed it. I can't believe they made this tool a moderator again, God help us all! Oh and I am happy to see you are moderating again, Algonquin!!

Edited by ChiroVette

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Cheatz/Trickz

Weak argument there mate. SA wasn't a grounded game like IV. So what CJ does in Freefall doesn't really matter. But IV took itself seriously and is the most grounded game in the series...which is why it's odd that he can't do Truck Hustle actions in normal gameplay. Just face it...IV isn't perfect and it's OK to admit it.Another annoying thing was how slowly Niko ran, like an idiot with something heavy stuck in his pants. You'd think a soldier would run faster and smoother.

What does not being able to do the Truck Hustle animations in normal gameplay have to do with the grounded nature of the game? You say it as if IV being more grounded means that those animations should be in normal gameplay and I don't see the corralation there. What CJ does gets a pass because the game isn't grounded?

 

Anyway, you can't stand on top of moving cars in IV because it's unrealistic and the physics are actually good. You can't use the Truck Hustle animations anytime because they are only needed in that mission. Same for similar situations like when Luis jacks the train car, they are just cinematic events.

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gunziness
Posted (edited)

To be fair, the Trucks hustle animations would serve no purpuse in freeroam, why would someone do that to steal a Mule? Not anyone from here thats for sure. Also even if it would be a thing in freeroam, i believe it would be glitchy as hell.

 

To the OP, i think locking doors could have been a nice feature if it served a real purpose. Police literally shoot on sight so it wouldnt make sense with that in mind. Now if there were goons around who could steal your car in a red light for example it would make more sense, but since that doesnt happen (ever in any other GTA for that matter (in SA maybe iirc, but if so, its very situational)) it has its reasons why it isnt available.

Edited by gunziness

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JuliusCaesar
Posted (edited)

 

 

 

 

 

So... how did he do it then?

He did it by relying on a very scripted AI, similar to quick time events.

If he doesn't have the skills then he couldn't have completed the mission. The mission is essential for storyline progress and not optional so it canonically occurred, so it had to have happened. Or did everything that happens after Truck Hustle just exist as a figment of Niko's mind because he couldn't climb the truck?

Then where do those skills/abilities disappear outside the cutscenes and pre-scripted paths? That's the problem with IV. Outside the cutscenes, the player is restricted in many ways, and if you find my points weirder then the blame is on the developers, for not allowing the players to USE those skills/abities in normal gameplay. That's the general idea behind ludonarrative dissonance that irked many fans upon IVs release.
I can say the same about CJ in Freefall. He can get aboard a plane mid air, but cant do it in free roam. I guess using your logic thats not an exhibition of ability or skill because the game just forgets about it after the mission.

Also comparing the actions Niko does in Truck Hustle to a QTE really makes no sense. You still have to control his actions to scale the truck. If the whole thing was a cutscene then Id agree its not really an exhibition of his skills, but it still requires player input to carry it out regardless if its not used in regular gameplay since it was specifically designed for that mossion.

Weak argument there mate. SA wasn't a grounded game like IV. So what CJ does in Freefall doesn't really matter. But IV took itself seriously and is the most grounded game in the series...which is why it's odd that he can't do Truck Hustle actions in normal gameplay. Just face it...IV isn't perfect and it's OK to admit it.Another annoying thing was how slowly Niko ran, like an idiot with something heavy stuck in his pants. You'd think a soldier would run faster and smoother.That's a piss poor excuse and you know it.

 

And of course GTA IV isn't perfect. No game is after all.

How is it a piss poor excuse? Just saying facts here. In Freefall CJ jumps and hijacks the plane in a cut scene. In Truck Hustle you are actually controlling Niko and doing the actions on the truck yourself. So it's just strange that they didn't put it in normal gameplay despite having the animations. Anyway it isn't a huge deal, but it would've made freeroam gameplay more interesting.

 

 

Those are extremely context sensitive controls when you're doing that with Niko on the truck. That truck itself isn't equipped with the ability to do that at all times, it's a scripted ability that has special animations, a special collision Niko is riding on, a special animation perceived as a cutscene when jumping in. It's more of a quicktime event/interactive cutscene than a player controller thing. You feel in control, and you are, but you weren't controlling the same way as sprinting or jumping except that it's input. what you're doing on that truck is more like hydraulic showdowns and dance offs in San Andreas than player controller stuff. you're giving it inputs, but it's a separate machine you're inputting to, and niko is just puppeted to it doing some canned animations and sliding around, you don't take control of the real niko controller again until you've taken the truck.

 

Like, they didn't add that ability and then only "turn it on" for the cutscene, it's not an ability, it's a cinematic set piece that awaits some inputs and has a fail state.

Edited by JuliusCaesar

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Johnny Spaz

It's not specific to CJ, but all 3D era games though. Not a really big issue. What I find the most idiotic is the fact that the so-called highly skilled war veteran Niko (yay, don't laugh, if people think he's, then let's not argue :D) can't even stand on the roof of the car or stand on top of any moving vehicle?!? I mean, its really stupid that he can't stand on a moving vehicle but just falls off, as if his legs got paralysed or something. LOL

 

TIL, being a war veteran makes you impervious to the laws of physics

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