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eshenk

Improved Traffic Densities - the most comprehensive tutorial yet!

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eshenk
Posted (edited)
I have been tinkering with this since the GTA V release in April of 2015. For much of my efforts, the struggles I have had, have been a great many. Of recent though, I have finally cracked the mystery of why densities were so easy to increase in the countryside and freeway, but much more difficult to get a handle on in the city. Finally getting what I was after all along, I have decided to share here, with the community, how to go about getting much, much more traffic in your game without your PC chucking itself out the window, LOL...
I am aware that on gta5-mods.com there are mods that do this, but I have reviewed and tested them all, and they don't get anywhere close to what I have managed to pull off. I will be demonstrating here, why that is the case, and how to fine-tune everything to get that near picture-perfect feel. Trust me, when you get this in your game, the feeling is absolutely glorious.
We will need to make edits to three files, which are popcycle.dat, vehicles.meta, and gameconfig.xml. Other's who have brought to the mod site their version of increased traffic densities, outright neglected any attention to vehicles.meta, and several parameters in the gameconfig, which are absolutely necessary to get these inner cities traffic really ramped up.
First up, we must deal with popcycle.dat. Below we have a snippet of an entry for Rockford Hills shopping district. If I were to do the same for the countryside, the traffic would be so over-the-top, it wouldn't even resemble what the countryside would really lool like. So this is how I have it for anything inner-city, except a few exceptions like terminal island which would not be nearly as populated. In the countryside, I have set the quantity of cars to spawn at 50, the freeway I have set to 280. Other rural areas like cult, slab, and sandy shores a bit lower.
POP_SCHEDULE:
ROCKFORD_HILLS_SHOPPING
// Weekday
//
// #Peds #Scenario #Cars
100 20 800
50 10 800
50 20 800
65 25 800
100 50 800
200 50 800
200 50 800
200 50 800
200 50 800
100 50 800
100 35 800
100 35 800
Keep in mind, that the 800 is not what will actually spawn in game, as we will soon see. Next up we examine the vehicle section of the gameconfig - we will see exactly why the vanilla-state of the game lools so absolutely barren.
<VehicleAmbientDensityMultiplier_Base value="156"/>
<VehicleAmbientDensityMultiplier value="200"/>
This group (above) doesn't do what other modders thought in their own traffic density mods. You raise these values to 25, 000, and nothing changes, nothing.
<VehicleMemoryMultiplier value="6000"/> - needs to be increased beyond the default, to allocate the necessary quantity of memory to spawn the amount of traffic I want to see in-game. Still not enough yet, as we will continue to see.
Below we have what I believe is a safeguard. The base value is what we start with, and the next value is telling the game-engine "give me this, if you can". So we start with 160, and if the vram and CPU is enough to give more, it will do so.So we will get somewhere between 160 - 520 vehicles PER ZONE - not as in on the entire map.
<VehicleUpperLimit_Base value="160"/>
<VehicleUpperLimit value="520"/>
So far though, not much has changed because there are other parameters that also must be adjusted to provide enough space for the cars to spawn in, AND we must set the culling to occur AFTER the max creation distance!
Neglected by other modders is this section right here -
<VehicleKeyholeShapeInnerThickness_Base value="10"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeInnerThickness value="10"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeOuterThickness_Base value="130"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeOuterThickness value="130"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeInnerRadius_Base value="10"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeInnerRadius value="10"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeOuterRadius_Base value="190"/>
<VehicleKeyholeShapeOuterRadius value="190"/>
<VehicleKeyholeSideWallThickness_Base value="20"/>
<VehicleKeyholeSideWallThickness value="20"/>
Most imporant section of the config, because this will define how much space we have to spawn cars from what we can see forward of us, behind us, and to either side of us - this will make more sense when we are within the vicinity of a four-way intersection. Game-engine needs to know how far away from were I am at a moment, how far back from me, am I given space to spawn traffic in ALL four directions?
InnerThickness_Base value="10" - this is defining how close cars are to spawn when they are beside me. If I am looking forward, there are still areas to spawn traffic to the left and right of me.
OuterThickness_Base value="130" - ok, now it needs to know how much real-estate it has behind the nearest spawned vehicle to spawn additional traffic? As you can see, I pulled the inner value in real close, and pushed the outer value out way more so than the default values, to ensure there is plenty of room to spawn the quanity of vehicles I expect to see in-game.
InnerRadius_Base value="10"/> -This is all about what is spawning in front of you! The idea here, is I want to bring in the radius so I create more real-estate for traffic to spawn in. The larger the value the less traffic I will have.
OuterRadius_Base value="190"/> - never bring this value in! This is for a "second wave" of vehicles spawned beyond our inner radius. These vehicles are merely for show as they are the lowest of it's LOD models, and don't even have collisions. They are merely "marages" that float above the ground if you get close enough to see them up close. If you did try to get close enough, they will start rapidly despawning.
SideWallThickness_Base value="20"/> - elusive! Through all testing and analyses, I have never made out what this parameter controls, LOL.
<VehicleMaxCreationDistance_Base value="400"/>
<VehicleMaxCreationDistance value="400"/> - this tells the game-engine how far out it is allowed to spawn a vehicle. You starting to see just how complex it really is to get traffic densities right in a game like this? If you do not account for what each paramter will do when changing it, it can undo what you are really after.
<VehicleMaxCreationDistanceOffscreen_Base value="100"/> - same thing as above but for what is spawning behind us. R* had it at 50, but it's just too low man! It means I will see very little traffic once I turn in the opposite direction! I could set it higher, but performance will suffer because we are already - at this point - doing WAY more than R* default values!
<VehicleCullRange_Base value="671"/>
<VehicleCullRange value="671"/>
<VehicleCullRangeOnScreenScale_Base value="500"/>
<VehicleCullRangeOnScreenScale value="500"/>
<VehicleCullRangeOffScreen_Base value="150"/>
<VehicleCullRangeOffScreen value="150"
Remember I said we need to set culling after the max creation distance? Looking at these values you can clearly see that is exactly what I have done here. Think about how counter-productive it would be to have vehicles culled before the max creation distance (which R* does with it's default values). It would mean I would not only be killing off vehicles I want to see when I come around a corner that is obstructed by a building, but then also I would be treated to cars now spawning right before my eyes!
<DensityBasedRemovalRateScale_Base value="72"/>
<DensityBasedRemovalRateScale value="72"/>
<DensityBasedRemovalTargetHeadroom_Base value="20"/>
<DensityBasedRemovalTargetHeadroom value="20"/>
Values above is responsible for how quickly to despawn vehicles once our thresholds have reached it's maximum. The smaller the number, the quicker we start to see vehicles despawn off in the background.
Through all of this, we see only mimimal difference yet still - we are now getting to the why of it all.
Next group of values are the vehicle spacing values. How can we spawn more traffic in when the spacing is SO far apart from each other? There are a total of 16 values for the base and maximum. I set them all to be the same per value(zone) so it's always the same. Each value represents an area of the GTA V map itself. Zones 0 - 6 are the spacing values for out in the countryside and the main interstates that drive through and around the countryside - everything happening from when we are heading towards Zancudo and beyond from the del perro area, all the way to the other side of the map - through Paleto Bay and on down to where we get off the exit ramps connecting back to Vinewood.
The rest of the zones represent every other part of the map, much of which concerning inner-city traffic. Notice how close the spacing is for these zones are? Obviously I want a LOT of traffic spawning!
<VehicleSpacing_Base>
<VehicleSpacing_0_Base value="70"/>
<VehicleSpacing_1_Base value="63"/>
<VehicleSpacing_2_Base value="52"/>
<VehicleSpacing_3_Base value="44"/>
<VehicleSpacing_4_Base value="45"/>
<VehicleSpacing_5_Base value="54"/>
<VehicleSpacing_6_Base value="53"/>
<VehicleSpacing_7_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_8_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_9_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_10_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_11_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_12_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_13_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_14_Base value="1"/>
<VehicleSpacing_15_Base value="1"/>
Finally we have the player road and non-player road densities. Obviously the further we push these values up, the more dense traffic will be within what ever we had set our inner radius values to as done from our above example. You can see they are far beyond the defaults! Notice I kepts the densities down in the first 6 zones, and then doubled up on it for the zones concerning inner-city areas?
</PlayerRoadDensityInc_Base>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_0 value="5"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_1 value="5"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_2 value="5"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_3 value="5"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_4 value="7"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_5 value="7"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_6 value="7"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_7 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_8 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_9 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_10 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_11 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_12 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_13 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_14 value="15"/>
<PlayerRoadDensityInc_15 value="15"/>
Also, for performace sake, I brought down the vehicle population fram rates down a bit, because after all, we are asking a lot of the game-engine, LOL. You would really be surprise just how much traffic you can get in this game. Sometimes while driving through bumber-to-bumper traffic I can see expanding way out into the distance, I fear the game will choke, and it never ceases to amaze me just how well this game can cope with it with nary a hiccup.
Nope, not done yet! We still have vehicles.meta to contend with. We have one for the base game in update/update/common/data/levels/gta5 but also one for each and every DLC that has been added since release date!
When left in it's default state, we will miss out on a LOT of potential traffic spawning in our game! See below -
<identicalModelSpawnDistance value="20" />
<frequency value="30" />
<maxNum value="4" />
Each and every vehicle has these three very important values. First, I bring in the spawn distance from 20 to 10. Next, I will increase the fequency value to something higher depending on which vehicle is in question. Some I push to 100, other I give a more modest increase, and some (for rare vehicles) I leave as is. Finally, I will definitely boost up on the maxnum value! If for example the value is 4, I might raise to say 10. Other might say 20, so I will push it up to say 40. I do this with almost every vehicle in ALL vehicle.meta files, with only special exceptions to certain classes to keep things real.
Done! If you have a PC as strong or stronger than my own, You can run with this without worry. If you have lesser of a PC, you still have room to increase traffic just not such extremes - but atleast now you know what to tinker with and how much, to get more very sorely needed traffic into your game. Kinda hard to have fun in a freakin' ghost town ya know?
PC specs:

I7-4970k
16 Gb mem
nVidia 1070 FE
850 W PS
Soon I will do a tutorial for peds!
Edited by eshenk

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Sleepwalking

Thank you for your effort, nice tutorial.

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_ReNNie_
Posted (edited)

 

<identicalModelSpawnDistance value="20" />
<frequency value="30" />
<maxNum value="4" />

 

Hey you

 

I've been tinkering with these values in vehicles.meta aswell for my Lore (& LODs) friendly dlcpack

and tbh I'm still struggling to understand the differences between them and how exactly they tie in with popgroups

 

Let me clarify that by my interpretation (and own wording) of things and an example

identicalModelSpawnDistance value= 0 - ??? (haven't gone further than 200)
the distance between two entities for this model to be spawned in the streets (in meters ?)
so when set to 200 you won't see two Pounders right after each other
frequency value= 0 - 100
this is the one I don't fully grasp
is this the chance (in %) that this model is included in a spawn cycle?
is there even such a thing as a spawn cycle?
maxNum value= 0 - 999
the total overall number of entities for this model spawned in the game world
And now the example
I'v edited popgroups to include one non-LOD model: Durzo's Chevy G20 Service model with my own liveries on it.
It has a SMALL_WORKER flag and a _DELIVERY flag.
No matter what other models spawn in the VEH_UTILITY the g20 is always there.
Ambiently parked. Never driven.
No matter if it's the first model in the list or the thrid or forth.
Extra models like speedo3, burrito6,burrito7 and 8, the rumpo4, rumpo5 and pounder2 and pounder3 from TheF3nt0N are included in VEH_HAULAGE and VEH_FREEWAY

alongside added trucks like the haulerclassic, roadkiller, juggernaut etc using the add-on version of mapped trailers2 and 3 and the mapped tanker2 (not released yet)

Sometimes I see them roaming about, sometimes I don't. So to me, it looks like the game randomly choses how to build up the population.
So questions I've pondering for quite some time now and from time to time investigate
Is there a preference from the game in the sort order of the models included in a vehicle category like VEH_HAULAGE and VEH_UTILITY?
If not how does the game go about choosing which models to spawn to fill up the population?
How can I manipulate the game in having preference over certain models over others in a VEH_group, indeed by using frequency value= with values like 20 - 40 - 60 - 80 - 100?
Edited by _ReNNie_

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Tengerecki

I'm definitely going to try it out, thank you for sharing. Before this I used to increase one multiplier value called "CityDensity". I used to crank it up to 1.6 and that meant a ~60% increase in traffic and peds. But the problem is that anything above 1.4 is unstable and causes crashes over time. I hope your mod won't crash the game.

Having as many peds / cars as on the GTA V PS4/PC trailer would be glorious so fingers crossed.

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eshenk
Posted (edited)

 

 

<identicalModelSpawnDistance value="20" />
<frequency value="30" />
<maxNum value="4" />

 

Hey you

 

I've been tinkering with these values in vehicles.meta aswell for my Lore (& LODs) friendly dlcpack

and tbh I'm still struggling to understand the differences between them and how exactly they tie in with popgroups

 

Let me clarify that by my interpretation (and own wording) of things and an example

identicalModelSpawnDistance value= 0 - ??? (haven't gone further than 200)
the distance between two entities for this model to be spawned in the streets (in meters ?)
so when set to 200 you won't see two Pounders right after each other
frequency value= 0 - 100
this is the one I don't fully grasp
is this the chance (in %) that this model is included in a spawn cycle?
is there even such a thing as a spawn cycle?
maxNum value= 0 - 999
the total overall number of entities for this model spawned in the game world
And now the example
I'v edited popgroups to include one non-LOD model: Durzo's Chevy G20 Service model with my own liveries on it.
It has a SMALL_WORKER flag and a _DELIVERY flag.
No matter what other models spawn in the VEH_UTILITY the g20 is always there.
Ambiently parked. Never driven.
No matter if it's the first model in the list or the thrid or forth.
Extra models like speedo3, burrito6,burrito7 and 8, the rumpo4, rumpo5 and pounder2 and pounder3 from TheF3nt0N are included in VEH_HAULAGE and VEH_FREEWAY

alongside added trucks like the haulerclassic, roadkiller, juggernaut etc using the add-on version of mapped trailers2 and 3 and the mapped tanker2 (not released yet)

Sometimes I see them roaming about, sometimes I don't. So to me, it looks like the game randomly choses how to build up the population.
So questions I've pondering for quite some time now and from time to time investigate
Is there a preference from the game in the sort order of the models included in a vehicle category like VEH_HAULAGE and VEH_UTILITY?
If not how does the game go about choosing which models to spawn to fill up the population?
How can I manipulate the game in having preference over certain models over others in a VEH_group, indeed by using frequency value= with values like 20 - 40 - 60 - 80 - 100?

 

I jumped the gun a bit on edits to vehicles.meta I am afraid to report. The extremes turned out to be too much for even my PC, and thus started experiencing crashes. The crashes were occurring only when in the city I noticed. Soooooooo...... So, I really looked at this much closer, and realized that there were far too many 999 entries for atleast half of the vehicles. 999?!? Think about that! Entries for vehicles that would say 20 meters for identical spawn distance, 100 % frequency, and maximum quantity 999! And I had brought many of those identical spawn distances in from 20 to 10!!

 

These defaults worked for R* BECAUSE of how they set the default values in the gameconfig. When I modified the gameconfig to make available space for a sh*t-ton of traffic to spawn in, It put sh*t into overdrive, LOL. Yesterday, I restored all the vehicles.meta files to original, and then went in and changed all 999 values to 100. With many vehicles that were not 100 frequency values, I upped them. For example many were set at a frequency of something as low as 5% to say 20% - I upped them to 20 - 40 % depending on what vehicle it was, and then I upped the max num values for some that were really low. So I found a comfortable compromise here that ended up working. I still have tons of traffic but without the crashing when travelling throughout the urban areas of Los Santos.

 

Regarding your question though, here is a bit to chew on that may help. popcycle sorts vehicles by class, and popgroups is where specific vehicles are assigned to said class per zone. If you want a specific vehicle to be seen much more often, then you need to find such vehicle in vehicles.meta and turn frequency on to 100%. Make sure said vehicle is in popgroups and part of a group specified in popcycle. Remember many vehicle, by default, will only appear in certain parts of the map. Looking at both popcycle and popgroups, you should very well see where specific cars will spawn depending on where on the map we are speaking of, but of course, we can change all this to our own liking if wanted.

Edited by eshenk

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eshenk
Posted (edited)

I'm definitely going to try it out, thank you for sharing. Before this I used to increase one multiplier value called "CityDensity". I used to crank it up to 1.6 and that meant a ~60% increase in traffic and peds. But the problem is that anything above 1.4 is unstable and causes crashes over time. I hope your mod won't crash the game.

Having as many peds / cars as on the GTA V PS4/PC trailer would be glorious so fingers crossed.

I can help you if needed, you probably will need help. If so, give me your specs, and I will be available for help here if/when needed. BTW, that option in settings.xml doesn't mean what you think it does, LOL. It is also a POOR man's solution to getting traffic to spawn properly on a whole-map perspective. To be done right, we need above said files and edits to control how much traffic is spawning depending on what areas of the map we are in at a given moment. Will the same quantity of traffic be in Sandy Shores as would be in West Vinewood or say Hawick? It will increase traffic, but just won't do it realistically.

Edited by eshenk

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Tengerecki
Posted (edited)

 

I'm definitely going to try it out, thank you for sharing. Before this I used to increase one multiplier value called "CityDensity". I used to crank it up to 1.6 and that meant a ~60% increase in traffic and peds. But the problem is that anything above 1.4 is unstable and causes crashes over time. I hope your mod won't crash the game.

Having as many peds / cars as on the GTA V PS4/PC trailer would be glorious so fingers crossed.

I can help you if needed, you probably will need help. If so, give me your specs, and I will be available for help here if/when needed. BTW, that option in settings.xml doesn't mean what you think it does, LOL. It is also a POOR man's solution to getting traffic to spawn properly on a whole-map perspective. To be done right, we need above said files and edits to control how much traffic is spawning depending on what areas of the map we are in at a given moment. Will the same quantity of traffic be in Sandy Shores as would be in West Vinewood or say Hawick? It will increase traffic, but just won't do it realistically.

 

 

cpu: i5-4460 3.2ghz

ram: 32gb

gpu: gtx-750 ti 2gb

SSD where GTA V is installed on: plextor M8pe(y) 256gb pci-express nvme drive

monitor resolution: 2560x1080 (native)

OS: Windows 7 x64 Ultimate ~220 updates, .NET 4.7+, C++ redist etc

page file: 3gb allocated

 

gta v in-game settings:

Res: 2560x1080, asp ratio: 21:9

dx: dx11

vsync: off

soft shadows: nvidia pcss

 

Every graphics options are maxed out except the following:

- MSAA is only x2

- Reflection MSAA is off

- Nvidia TXAA is off

- High resolution shadows is off

 

Everything else is maxed out.

 

Graphics mod: None

Add-on mods: only vegetation (does not affect performance much)

 

Video ram usage: ~3200mb out of the available ~2040 gb lmao

 

Average fps: ~17 to 20

 

settings.xml changes:

<CityDensity value="1.600000"/> for more peds and traffic >_<

<MaxLodScale value="1.200000"/> for a little bit higher render distance

Edited by Tengerecki

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