Take-Two plans to only release games with 'recurrent consumer spending' hooks

[flexcreator]

In the meantime

 

Grand Theft Auto V has now sold in more than 85 million units," the report says. "According to The NPD Group, Grand Theft Auto V is now the all-time best-selling video game, both in revenues and units, based on combined U.S. digital and physical sales across PC, console and portable

 

So, yeah... I don't think negative reviews affect the sales in a any way.

 

RIP game industry. From Valve to T2.

 

[*] [*]

 

Valve and T2 are just a small part of the industry.

 

We still have indie scene. Things like Observer.

We still have things like PUBG that don't have a pay-to-win model.

 

DICE and Blizzard are still not completely consumed by microtransactions.

[Black-Dragon96]

 

indy. we are going to enter a gaming renaissance in a few years. where people will start buying more indy than aaa games. due to a full game with a lower price.

I hope Indie games become more popular. I've had way more fun with things like Undertale, Binding of Isacc, and Life is Strange than with GTA or any other huge AAA game recently.

 

Judging by recent trends, I can certainly see huge developers losing their grip on the industry if they keep trying to push things too far. If they could just accept how things were, they would be at the top for ever. But day after day I see more and more people jumping ship.

I actually hope that indy wont get more popular.

Because if it would get more popular it will probably go down the the same was that aaa gaming goes right now, down the crapper.

[flexcreator]

Same goes for every other company, I`m done with everything and anything by them.

I`m willing to give only one company a chance though, for a specific title in a franchise. That is Bethesda and TES 6.

 

I'm sorry to disappoint you.

 

Bethesda recently released the Creation Club. They hired anonymous modders to produce small low-quality content (that can't even compete with the amateur creations which can be downloaded for free). Also. these items are not lore-friendly and don't contribute to immersion. You can buy these mini-mods from the in-game menu (yes, $$$). Both of the recent titles (Fallout 4 and Skyrim: SE) are bombarding you with advertisments about the stuff you can buy.

 

So, yeah, they follow the same path now. And they learned no lesson from the previous paid-mods fiasco. Still want to give them a chance?

[HamwithCheese]

Creation Club was basically giving ps4 players mods with external assets and Sony being ok with it. I'm almost 100% positive they knew they'd get basically no money from Xbox and pc players, so its kinda not the same,

[0cta]

So, yeah, they follow the same path now. And they learned no lesson from the previous paid-mods fiasco. Still want to give them a chance?

 

They learned one very important lesson: They were too early with their DLC horse armor. Then they waited until others made built-in mod support (like steam workshop), microtransactions, loot crates and buyable cosmetic items mainstream and here they are again.

[Happy Hunter]

"Vote with your wallet".

 

I and plenty others voted by not buying cash cards and it still screwed us over in the end thanks to whales. I can pretty much say at this point that the "just don't buy them" argument is completely worthless.

I don't use it as an argument. Why would I need to defend them lol?

 

I say it because it's all you can do, aside from making your opinion clear and heard. Plus, you know, if you're going to buy something you think's been butchered, then that doesn't make sense since you're supporting it.

 

No, I'm not referring to GTA V there. That's a different case since no one knew there'd be all the grinding, etc. But if there is another GTA, people should look into it, and if its got stuff they can't tolerate, then they owe it to themselves not to buy the game.

 

I never bought a cash card myself. GTA VI - that will depend on a few things. If they make it too child-friendly/make helicopters ridiculously vulnerable, then I probably won't buy it. If there's no Hunter, I'd probably avoid unless they added it (even then, the rest of the game would have to be decent). Overall, they'll need to make something very special for me to overlook any old BS in the next game.

[Shaundi.]

The only real game developer left is CD Projekt Red who actually care about their customers. They care that much that they're taking their time with Cyberpunk 2077.

[Rewdalf]

 

 

 

RIP game industry. From Valve to T2.

 

[*] [*]

 

Valve and T2 are just a small part of the industry.

 

We still have indie scene. Things like Observer.

We still have things like PUBG that don't have a pay-to-win model.

 

DICE and Blizzard are still not completely consumed by microtransactions.

 

See, TF2 is dying due to other reasons.

And in my opinion, it's just as bad as microtransactions.

 

It's the push for competitive game models.

 

TF2, pre-matchmaking update, was endless fun. Games were easy to find, there were plenty of players, and there was never an issue with filling up a team.

 

Now that they're forcing a matchmaker into this, the game has tanked (in my opinion).

The matchmaker takes forever.

They've removed two of my favorite maps because they "aren't good enough" to fit into their competitive model.

Teams are constantly stacked. Half the players leave and the matchmaker takes too long to find replacements, usually ending in one side getting rolled.

 

You can't queue up for only one type of game.

So if you only queue up for CTF games, once the initial round is over you get a vote for two random maps with random gamemodes, and the option to just replay the map you were just on.

Like, f*ck you. I want to play CTF and only CTF.

If the teams are unbalanced and the game ends instantly then you have to go back and queue again...

 

I miss valve community servers.

I miss autobalance (man, never thought I would say that...)

I miss when games didn't shove all this competitive bullcrap down everyone's throat...

 

Why can't casual players play on the removed maps?

Why can't we just join a community server and change teams freely?

Why can't we play a rotation of one type of map instead of being forced to re-queue every time a game ends?

 

It's all trash.

 

The only good thing I can say came out of all this is that I made a hefty sum of money selling all of my ingame items.

And most of them I traded for. True, I bought my share of items, crate keys, and tickets.

But I can confidently say that I made money off that game.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Rewdalf

[HamwithCheese]

The only real game developer left is CD Projekt Red who actually care about their customers. They care that much that they're taking their time with Cyberpunk 2077.

BUT WHAT IS IT THO

[Quinn_flower]

 

The only real game developer left is CD Projekt Red who actually care about their customers. They care that much that they're taking their time with Cyberpunk 2077.

BUT WHAT IS IT THO

CD projekt red...they have their own issues with management. People are leaving left and right.

[DangerZ0neX]

As usual, the GTA subreddits are being diehard apologists with generic posts like "I dont like it either, but a business needs to make money and all the updates are free so you cant say anything bad about the game or R* and T2!".

They just reek of bullsh*t. Bullsh*t spewed by apologetic, spineless fanboys who are fine with being stomped on as long as you give them their meme cars.

Edited November 9, 2017 by DangerZ0neX

[Yellow Dog with Cone]

As usual, the GTA subreddits are being diehard apologists with generic posts like I dont like it either, but a business needs to make money and all the updates are free so you cant say anything bad about the game or R* and T2!.

 

They just reek of bullsh*t. Bullsh*t spewed by apologetic, spineless fanboys who are fine with being stomped on as long as you give them their meme cars.

"B-b-b-but Take Two is a business and business want to make money!"

 

True, but you can make money without predatory psychological tactics on players with addictive or compulsory gambling tendencies.

 

Being a business doesn't give you the right to exploit your customers.

[DaveyGravy]

The only time Mt's are bad is when they nerf the game in an attempt to make you spend money. This sort of happened when the CEO expansion arrived and enemies could shoot through buildings streets away either to hit you or reduce the value of your car. Don't know if you guys have Uncharted on PC, but Naughty Dog used it in the worst way. Basically they brought out DLC and nerf'd the hell out of your weapon power and when customers complained that they could not reach a target in the game due to having no weapon power, ND responded that they should buy Mt's. Very bad indeed and I won't ever touch them again.

 

The same goes for 2K Games who hammered the latest basketball game so much, that you have to buy them otherwise you cannot advance.

 

You can understand a business wanting to bring in further revenue when a title is released, but there's a very right way of doing it and a very wrong way of doing it. At the moment Rockstar Games are on the border of both with GTAO, but I can only see it getting much worse in the future RG games, especially when its TT who has the final say as publisher. Such a shame to destroy 20 years of incredible gaming if this happens.

 

As for RDR2 and how it can use the system, we won't know that until we see the game. I personally don't think RDR2 Online will have the depth of GTAO though, and after a few months people will tire of 1 horse power and go back to GTAO for fast cars, flying bikes and heat seekers.

[Bruce Khansey]

I'm concerned about games future and how dangerously addicting they're going to be. Multiplayer should focus on the experience of playing and having fun with other players.

 

My experience with GTAO left me "shocked", you have to deal with people focusing on solo playing because the only goal is making money all over again, even if you don't actually need them. Just read to all the guides for afk playing and stuff like that, or to those comments like "I have 34456730 millions, I make 666 millions everyday, just buy supplies for 316m, afk for 9 hours, then sell the goods of twenty different businesses for 982m". This game has become a job for f*ck sake.

 

I say this because I started playing this game this way, but then I realized it was no more fun, it was becoming an addiction. Now I'd love to play this game for what it should be, but that's exactly the point, "what it SHOULD be"; because when I log on I'd like to play races, contact missions, activities, cruise in freemode and buy/upgrade/modify vehicles. Instead, I find myself struggling to find players to do this, and those jobs/activities are also not rewarding at all. Because if I play a missions, the payout is so low that I don't feel rewarded for what I do, not to mention the fact that it'll take you years to just buy a car with money earned with these activities.

 

Which brings me to another point: the money you earn should be spent on vehicles, weapons, character customization and so on, not in more businesses to earn money, so you can buy more businesses to earn even more money. It's just a dangerous, unhealty cycle.

[nik_west]

Strauss Zelnick more and more reminds me of another charming gentlemen, who had nothing but the best interest of gamers in mind.
I made an fitting image. Hope you guys like it...

 

[EkaSwede]

 

 

 

 

RIP game industry. From Valve to T2.

 

[*] [*]

 

Valve and T2 are just a small part of the industry.

 

We still have indie scene. Things like Observer.

We still have things like PUBG that don't have a pay-to-win model.

 

DICE and Blizzard are still not completely consumed by microtransactions.

 

 

See, TF2 is dying due to other reasons.

And in my opinion, it's just as bad as microtransactions.

 

It's the push for competitive game models.

 

TF2, pre-matchmaking update, was endless fun. Games were easy to find, there were plenty of players, and there was never an issue with filling up a team.

 

Now that they're forcing a matchmaker into this, the game has tanked (in my opinion).

The matchmaker takes forever.

They've removed two of my favorite maps because they "aren't good enough" to fit into their competitive model.

Teams are constantly stacked. Half the players leave and the matchmaker takes too long to find replacements, usually ending in one side getting rolled.

 

You can't queue up for only one type of game.

So if you only queue up for CTF games, once the initial round is over you get a vote for two random maps with random gamemodes, and the option to just replay the map you were just on.

Like, f*ck you. I want to play CTF and only CTF.

If the teams are unbalanced and the game ends instantly then you have to go back and queue again...

 

I miss valve community servers.

I miss autobalance (man, never thought I would say that...)

I miss when games didn't shove all this competitive bullcrap down everyone's throat...

 

Why can't casual players play on the removed maps?

Why can't we just join a community server and change teams freely?

Why can't we play a rotation of one type of map instead of being forced to re-queue every time a game ends?

 

It's all trash.

 

The only good thing I can say came out of all this is that I made a hefty sum of money selling all of my ingame items.

And most of them I traded for. True, I bought my share of items, crate keys, and tickets.

But I can confidently say that I made money off that game.

 

 

Oh,man, TF2. I agree on almost everything here. IT's crazy to say I miss Quickplay bcause Matchmaking is just bad. Sure, team stacking could happen in Quickplay, but it's way more obvious in "casual" Matchmaking by a long shot. And it's SO much fun to play 5v12 becuase your team rage quit and anyone that joins will quickly leave because there's no way anyone is playing against a super stacked team like that.

 

I also remember when PAYDAY 2 introduced microtransactions. For a game with lots and lots of paid DLC the community was having none of that. Mts were removed one year later, but the damage and painful memories of betrayal was still there.

Edited November 9, 2017 by EkaSwede

[Darealbandicoot]

 

The Houser's and Zelnick are on the same page no? The Houser's aren't grudgingly going along with this. They are willing partners. Housers/Zelnick = same.

 

T2 and R* are cut from the same cloth in terms of 'chopping wood' with macrotransactions. I'm not really keen to make R* look like Snow White while T2 is the big bad meanie.

 

Both f*cking quack like a duck, one just quacks with action the other does more press.

 

 

Strauss Zelnick, ever since you called people who don't pay for microtransactions freeloaders and saying your not ripping us off ENOUGH I have started to dislike you more and more. This latest statement about microtransactions is no surprise to me that every R* and T2 game will have microtransactions,lets hope it doesn't effect red dead 3 TOO much.

Of course. T2 and R* are EQUAL partners. Who do you think advised T2 about which mod menus to take down and about the RDR and GTA 4 map mods in gta v? The old R* are long gone but unless they keep pumping out re releases like LA Noire then RDR2 might be my final R* game if they continue to "chop that wood" and push a F2P online mode with inflated prices and little to no single player content unless it's cut for the online.

[TheDoombringer]

Just to add more sh*t on this sh*t cake on how they raised PSN subscriptions even though they have more holes in security than swiss cheese

 

This to me makes it worse, i just want my awesome single player game, is that so hard? Now its reduced to a piece meal campaign thats over in a day then its all, buy our latest sh*tty map that kinda looks like the other ones but we still charge you for them, single player? Thats for antisocial losers

 

Im so tired of the over monetizing of gaming that i know it won't change much but it feels good to vent

[Lc gta]

The E.T game almost killed gaming in the 80s. Now Take Two is trying to finish what it started.

 

This is wrong, it did not kill the gaming industry in Europe and Asia. I agree with the above comments about R* and Take Two becoming more scummy.

[DaveyGravy]

Just to add more sh*t on this sh*t cake on how they raised PSN subscriptions even though they have more holes in security than swiss cheese

 

This to me makes it worse, i just want my awesome single player game, is that so hard? Now its reduced to a piece meal campaign thats over in a day then its all, buy our latest sh*tty map that kinda looks like the other ones but we still charge you for them, single player? Thats for antisocial losers

 

Im so tired of the over monetizing of gaming that i know it won't change much but it feels good to vent

Yeah my subscription runs out on December 6th. I only play GTAO online and the free games are hardly worth downloading. Plus they whacked it up to £50 as you mentioned and so I'm gonna leave it. I get to play GTAO everyday for whatever amount of time I get, but a vast majority of the time its a miserable experience anyway due to quitters, the state of the freeroam and how its turned into a Saints Row game, the servers seem to always stick me with French people so its a pretty dull experience when you can't even have some online banter, and so the only time I get to enjoy it is when I turn the MTU down to 850 on the net connection which allows me to play the CEO and bunker stuff without hassle. But even after a few goes of that its all the same. Don't get me wrong, GTAO is the best online game I've ever played, but its a mess now and plus its 4 years of age. It can only get worse as the months pass by.

 

As for RDR2. To be honest I wasn't blown away by the protagonist in the new trailer. Seems like a real tool and thats just not a character I want to experience. Mike was bad enough in GTAV. And as for how MT's will effect RDR2 I don't know, but this is TT and RG's new plan and I can only see it making for a boring experience.

[Shaundi.]

Tell me I'm the only person praying desperately for an industry recession, like what happened in 1983. A recession so bad that it f*cks up Turd-Two and nice personstar, they go under, scattered into the wind.

 

Speaking of, who was around at the time?

[Hécate-II]

I'm concerned about games future and how dangerously addicting they're going to be. Multiplayer should focus on the experience of playing and having fun with other players.

 

My experience with GTAO left me "shocked", you have to deal with people focusing on solo playing because the only goal is making money all over again, even if you don't actually need them. Just read to all the guides for afk playing and stuff like that, or to those comments like "I have 34456730 millions, I make 666 millions everyday, just buy supplies for 316m, afk for 9 hours, then sell the goods of twenty different businesses for 982m". This game has become a job for f*ck sake.

 

I say this because I started playing this game this way, but then I realized it was no more fun, it was becoming an addiction. Now I'd love to play this game for what it should be, but that's exactly the point, "what it SHOULD be"; because when I log on I'd like to play races, contact missions, activities, cruise in freemode and buy/upgrade/modify vehicles. Instead, I find myself struggling to find players to do this, and those jobs/activities are also not rewarding at all. Because if I play a missions, the payout is so low that I don't feel rewarded for what I do, not to mention the fact that it'll take you years to just buy a car with money earned with these activities.

 

Which brings me to another point: the money you earn should be spent on vehicles, weapons, character customization and so on, not in more businesses to earn money, so you can buy more businesses to earn even more money. It's just a dangerous, unhealty cycle.

 

 

Thats what is very dumb, contact missions are for beginners who own zero business or veterans who already have 300 Mio banked and got bored from the grind. Myself I still play those contact missions, survivals, and join my favorite heist setups, its the true GTA imo. I never wanted to play Grand Theft Post Van Simulator, but eh, its that or glitch to buy what you want.

 

Its also related to R* policy in term of new good contents, if you want play something that look like new contact missions, it will be more likely Bunker supply missions or SR supply missions.

[APB]

 

Same goes for every other company, I`m done with everything and anything by them.

I`m willing to give only one company a chance though, for a specific title in a franchise. That is Bethesda and TES 6.

 

I'm sorry to disappoint you.

 

Bethesda recently released the Creation Club. They hired anonymous modders to produce small low-quality content (that can't even compete with the amateur creations which can be downloaded for free). Also. these items are not lore-friendly and don't contribute to immersion. You can buy these mini-mods from the in-game menu (yes, $$$). Both of the recent titles (Fallout 4 and Skyrim: SE) are bombarding you with advertisments about the stuff you can buy.

 

So, yeah, they follow the same path now. And they learned no lesson from the previous paid-mods fiasco. Still want to give them a chance?

 

 

Did you read what I wrote, I said SPECIFIC TITLE in a franchise. I don`t care about Creation Club no matter how many advertisements they put of it everywhere. There is still Nexus who does a superior job compared to anything from Creation Club. For the record Beth has no intention in shutting them down, because they know what sh*t-storm that would cause (Nexus is what makes their games so long-term successful too).

 

At least Bethesda isn`t locking content behind pay-walls or loot boxes (YET) like many other companies do, including our own R* (with pay-walls for Gunrunning content). Or more so recently with NFS, promising content at release and not delivering it. (I`m looking at you old Volvos and RX7, Cops in free-roam and much more. The cars at least are coming later in a "Patch") Yet they had time to implement loot box, err I mean Speed Cards system.

[KornbreadMaf1a]

Why are so many people surprised that a corporation is trying to maximize profits? A lot of y'all act like you were born yesterday and this is a foreign concept to you when it's been happening since the invention of currency.

Edited November 9, 2017 by KornbreadMaf1a

[R3CON]

Why are so many people surprised that a corporation is trying to maximize profits? A lot of y'all act like you were born yesterday and this is a foreign concept to you when it's been happening since the invention of currency.

And what stake do you have in it?

 

This is a forum about Grand Theft Auto ran by players and fans of the series. The makers of which intend to monetize the game in a ways that could potentially have an adverse affect on players and fans of the series. Discussion on this topic is not only welcome, but the purpose of sites like this in the first place. Of anywhere.

 

I hate the "think about the corporation" vibes some of you put out like you own stock in the company or stand to gain financially from these moves. As a player of this game - i.e. consumer - it is in our interest to get the highest quality product for a reasonable asking price. It is in the business' interest - TakeTwo Interactive via Rockstar Games - to minimize their development and overhead costs while maximizing profit. This is often at the expense of...you guessed it, the consumer.

 

Ideally, the needs of the business and the wants of the consumer can align and everyone would be happy. Such a balance is very possible to attain. However this is not always the case. Therefore, conflict brews when the scales are tipped in favor of one side over the other.

 

No one is surprised that a business is trying to do more to make money, people are just upset that players seem to be getting the short end of the stick. But rather than address that conflict and try to figure out a way forward people like you would rather stifle debate entirely.

[mirthless]

I googled this strauss zelnick guy and he basically seems like a real life devin weston.

 

First page of google;

"

 

Take-Two's Strauss Zelnick publishes big games, but doesn't play them.

 

Strauss Zelnick has an intense workout regimen that fuels his success ...

Strauss Zelnick's intense workout - Business Insider

 

Strauss Zelnick | ZMC

zmclp.com/team/strauss-zelnick/

Strauss Zelnick founded ZMC (originally known as ZelnickMedia) in 2001. Mr. Zelnick is responsible for originating, structuring and monitoring investments.

"

"

 

I'm now wondering if there are real life michael, trevor and franklins out there.

Edited November 9, 2017 by mirthless

[CosmicBuffalo]

I think the Shark model is in desperate need of an overhaul when it comes to exchange rates. It would require just a bit more planning on R* part, so that I would say 60 per year is enough to buy all the content planned to be released in a year. Maybe an optional subscription for people who want the content, but don't want to grind for new content.

 

I still think R* current exchange rate for actual money vs what it can buy in game is borderline predatory. I can see some neglectful parent going bonkers when she realizes her kid spends over 1k on shark cards in a year, or something similar, and lawsuiting R*. I am pretty sure that's already happened to some phone games. I think South Park really nailed this with freemium gaming addiction canbucks episode.

 

So, will R* go full canadian devil or include nuance as the actual devil would approve? I am leaning towards them going full on canadian devil in RDR and 6.

Edited November 9, 2017 by GenericGTAO

[Jenkiiii]

Anyone who still thinks T2 are doing us a big favour through the release of 'free' DLC, take a look at this:

 

T2 shareholders are having a very good time right now, and it's us who are lining their pockets.

 

 

Shocking, isn't it?

 

And who knows how far their stock is going to rise? But all bubbles burst eventually, and T2 are getting closer to a fall the more awareness is raised about them.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Jenkiiii

[Commander S]

What's really annoying is that it's so often the really big publishers that do this - meanwhile, things that are still AAA titles, but not monolithic are in the position where they maybe could argue that they need to claw back every penny in order to cover costs.

 

Case in point? Volition - previously under THQ's umbrella, sold to the smaller publisher Deep Silver, had to make Saints Row IV by cutting corners and recycling most of SRIII's assets (and still put out a fun, funny, imaginative and surprisingly smart game!), only for their next full follow-up (Agents of Mayhem) to get a lukewarm reception, because the whole thing felt like a game with bigger ambitions than Deep Silver's budget would allow. The result: layoffs all the way up to the top of the company, despite Volition having a good track record for not nickel-and-dime-ing their players, and having much better communication and community outreach than R*'s ever done with the likes of GTAO. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

...yeah, that's not the most encouraging comparison, is it? More modestly-sized games from companies that treat their customers with respect = diminishing returns, while big-budget juggernauts that embody the concept of 'too big to fail' can get away with murder because ...well, they're 'too big to fail'. For the time being, at least - until the whole thing results in a massive bubble bursting, and entire genres of game go the way of Guitar Hero because of constant exploitation and saturation.

[Luigi22]

Anyone who still thinks T2 are doing us a big favour through the release of 'free' DLC, take a look at this:

 

T2 shareholders are having a very good time right now, and it's us who are lining their pockets.

 

 

Shocking, isn't it?

 

And who knows how far their stock is going to rise? But all bubbles burst eventually, and T2 are getting closer to a fall the more awareness is raised about them.

 

Us only includes persons who buy Shark Cards and I'm not one of them. It's have been said many times but nobody forces buying Shark Cards. Rockstar ain't even close to worst game dev featuring microtransactions in their games.

 

In the end, it's not Rockstars fault they are part of publicly traded company and what gaming world has become in 20 years (Take 2 bought them in 1998 and Take 2 was listed previous year). We don't even know if we would have R* without being part of Take 2 and all GTA's on 2000s. Or more likely we would have had them but maybe not as great as they were.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Luigi22