Can R* please get rid of these tiresome conversations?

[Johnny Spaz]

I don't know if anyone else has noticed but since GTA: San Andreas these types of conversations between the protagonist and other storyline characters have become more & more common.

 

These conversations go like this:

 

For example in San Andreas: Sweet tells Carl that he left the hood that he's acting all superior , he sold out, etc. Carl responds that there's nothing left in the hood, no opportunities, so he saw a way out (in Woozie, Salvatore, whoever, etc.) Sweet responds that the only thing that matters is the hood & that he should come back, etc. Then for every conversation they have whether in cut scenes or while driving to a waypoint they have the same boring discussion.

 

This isn't the only game that has this, in GTA IV Niko & Roman fighting about gambling, Roman's lies in his letters to Niko, etc.

 

In TBoGT, Luis with Armando & Henrique, calling Luis gay, Tony's errand boy, etc.

 

TLaD, Billy telling Johnny he's a pussy, that he's soft, etc. Johnny telling Ashley to stop with the crystal meth, etc.

 

It got even worse with GTA V, Trevor & Michael's constant yapping & uninteresting discussions, "oh you were supposed to be dead whine whine whine" Mike responds "it was the only way out" etc for a bunch of f*ckin missions, its like they ran out of things to talk about so they just make them fight all the time.

 

Franklin gets the same CJ treatment for the whole game by Lamar, his aunt, tanisha, and pretty anyone from Frank's old hood.

 

It's just conversations that suck, I want the protagonist in the next game to have actually nice people he gets along with and no more recycled argument dialogues for the whole game. It gets tedious & obnoxious.

 

Does anyone else understand me here?

[DOUGL4S1]

So basically no backstory whatsoever, you're just thrown into the city, this is your friend, go kill people?

 

I'm glad you're not a GTA writter...

[Johnny Spaz]

I guess I didn't write the thread completely well or you just missed the point.

[MojoGamer]

I guess I didn't write the thread completely well or you just missed the point.

​i feel the OP is trying to hide something... Anyways, This Topic needs to get "Locked!"

[RedDagger]

What? No, as as far as I can tell the thread is best summed up with the line in the OP near the end, "It's just conversations that suck, I want the protagonist in the next game to have actually nice people he gets along with and no more recycled argument dialogues for the whole game. It gets tedious & obnoxious.", instead of the characters having general conversations they just whine and say how everything sucks.

 

As you said, V really turned up the dial on this, everyone's always complaining and being negative and it gets tiring, especially considering it's a game where you primarily dick around and have fun.

 

Having just a couple psychopaths enjoying themselves would be a welcome change.

[Lemoyne outlaw]

i love the conversations. it gives you something to think about while your driving especially if its a long drive. also it gives more backstory and some of the conversations are very funny. remember patrick its pe4 not c4! to take out these conversations would be bland and stupid. if you dont like them turn down your volume so you dont hear it.

[Shenmue18]

Characters need to have conflicts with one another, that's what builds a story. If there's no issues or problems between characters, you don't have much of an interesting plot.

[.Ryan.]

It's human nature to complain/argue with someone even if they're your best friend or close family. I mean think about it. Do you always get along with people in real life?

 

In a world where we indulge ourselves in crime and mishap it would seem silly to think conflicts wouldn't arise between characters. Maybe tone it down a bit (I got tired of Michael and Trevor bickering like old women), but it can't be rid of completely.

 

You're basically taking away central themes relative to the plots.

[Spydr Webz]

You might be the only one who thinks this.

 

The primary reason for the dialogue is to help develop the characters. I can see where you're coming from; the dialogue can get repetitive, but I'd prefer repetitive dialogue to no dialogue at all. It kind of helps to "fill the void" when on missions that require a lot of driving, and it helps you understand the characters better even if they're always talking about the same thing.

 

The arguing really doesn't bother me at all. It's conflict. All good stories have conflict. What IS a story without conflict? Boring, that's what.

[Payne Killer]

I don't want characters who suck each other off on the way to a bank robbery or to kill some people.

[slimeball supreme]

tension or disagreements are always good with a scene. really

sure, we could have a couple people enjoying themselves, but there's no banter there. nothing that keeps you interested in the conversation. if there's no conflicting points, characters don't really develop

 

the thing with the conversations in IV and V is that there were reasons for them to happen. two characters have problems with each other and they wanna talk it out. sometimes it's minor things or other times its complaints. but the problem is, the conversations flow. they sound like real people talking. i don't get why anyone would be happily chattering if they were on the way to smash a shop owners face in, kill a bunch of gangsters, or rob a bank.

 

there are plenty of conversations that aren't people being super mad!!! and that's friendship outings (also incredibly good for character development)

Edited March 16, 2017 by Mr. Fartenhate

[Dementia]

It's an inmoral atmosphere where the plot is mainly focused on doing crimes and living darkly that means no happy endings 'n sh*t.

How can you not stand the whinning coming from the characters sometimes if it is what they feed themselves from? Doing crimes and face the consequences later.

 

Do you expect to people be happy, to be leaping everytime in a round? No.

 

Those "tiresome" conversations are what make the plot even better.

 

 

 

but since GTA: San Andreas

Because San Andreas was the first step to a wide storyline development, while III remained mute and VC quiet SA was the first GTA ever to develop a huge atmosphere throughout the series to what we all known as the masterpiece GTA IV. Btw, i'm not saying III and VC lacked plot at all i'm just saying that SA is superior to them in that aspect.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Still Madd

[Sonny_Black]

From what I have understand, Johnny is complaining about the useless and stupid conversations that for an example, Michael and Trevor got all along the game.

 

And I have to say that I agree in a way, not completely but still

 

Stupid wining people, and hell some players said that this is what makes the game and the story better, f*ck no, and certainly not the way it was done in GTA 5.

 

When I think about San Andreas and GTA 4, that doesn't bothered me at all, especially in GTA 4 where Niko and Roman don't speak that much about of Roman's gambling addiction, and if they spoke about that, it's not even close to the whining stupidity level of GTA 5.

 

In TBOGT, imo that was annoying and I never really liked that much the characters anyway.

 

It's been a while since I played TLAD.

 

Thats need to be done in the right way, otherwise it will sucked.

[Tao Cheng]

Yeah I agree. Chinatown Wars probably has the best mission dialogue of all the games post San Andreas in terms of human interactivity. I'm pissed off that there's no voice actors and not enough dialogue for Chinatown Wars because Huang being a sarcastic asshole is funny to me.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Tao Cheng

[Johnny Spaz]

What? No, as as far as I can tell the thread is best summed up with the line in the OP near the end, "It's just conversations that suck, I want the protagonist in the next game to have actually nice people he gets along with and no more recycled argument dialogues for the whole game. It gets tedious & obnoxious.", instead of the characters having general conversations they just whine and say how everything sucks.

 

As you said, V really turned up the dial on this, everyone's always complaining and being negative and it gets tiring, especially considering it's a game where you primarily dick around and have fun.

 

Having just a couple psychopaths enjoying themselves would be a welcome change.

Thank you, I liked Trevor & Michael's first argument in Fame or Shame. But then the writers kept dragging on & on the conflicts between Mike & T like I don't wanna be hearing this crap on my way to a heist (Paleto Score).

i love the conversations. it gives you something to think about while your driving especially if its a long drive. also it gives more backstory and some of the conversations are very funny. remember patrick its pe4 not c4! to take out these conversations would be bland and stupid. if you dont like them turn down your volume so you dont hear it.

Again, I'm not against arguments between characters, that "PE4 not C4" conversation was golden, but if you heard it for 10 different missions, I'd bet you'd get pretty sick of it, that's the point I'm trying to make.

I don't want characters who suck each other off on the way to a bank robbery or to kill some people.

Way to exaggerate what I meant bro.

 

tension or disagreements are always good with a scene. really

sure, we could have a couple people enjoying themselves, but there's no banter there. nothing that keeps you interested in the conversation. if there's no conflicting points, characters don't really develop

 

the thing with the conversations in IV and V is that there were reasons for them to happen. two characters have problems with each other and they wanna talk it out. sometimes it's minor things or other times its complaints. but the problem is, the conversations flow. they sound like real people talking. i don't get why anyone would be happily chattering if they were on the way to smash a shop owners face in, kill a bunch of gangsters, or rob a bank.

 

there are plenty of conversations that aren't people being super mad!!! and that's friendship outings (also incredibly good for character development)

Yeah I could bear with Roman & Niko's fights mainly because they were hilarious, but Mike & Trevor's arguments weren't funny & didn't add anything to the storyline they just let you know they had a love & hate relationship (no sh*t).

 

Yeah I agree. Chinatown Wars probably has the best mission dialogue of all the games post San Andreas in terms of human interactivity. I'm pissed off that there's no voice actors and not enough dialogue for Chinatown Wars because Huang being a sarcastic asshole is funny to me.

Agreed, the conversations between Uncle Kenny & Huang were great. Edited March 16, 2017 by Johnny Spaz

[Great Britain]

I think everyone needs to understand the fact that something does not have to be disagreed with just for the sake of it. The point OP is trying to bring to everyone's attention is the sadistic under-tone of a relationship that exists between the protagonist and the various individuals he comes across through-out his journey (Old-friends, family, new acquaintances) that has a more than required touch of "things in the past that the protag should be guilty af about all his life". This is very evident in the latest installment. Now from a story point of view, it's understandable that a touch of the reminiscences of the protagonist's past and how he is at times reminded/taunted about every now and then is required. But that should be pretty much about it.

 

 

If we look at Trevor & Michael's relationship in the game, you can't help but feel that some of the things that T accuses M of doing actually have no relevance in the present time more or less and the Anti-climax of the whole "Brad's saga", which the majority of the bickering and bitching was all about pretty much, ended up in even T eventually not giving two f**ks about Brad after he found it that he was six-feet under.

 

 

Point is, it's okay to have bickering and to have people pissed off at you for something or the other in the past, but maybe having a somewhat productive conversation that is more or less going to affect the present time frame would be much appreciated along with fighting about things that would actually lead to a make or break situation in the future, unlike the whole Brad bullcrap.

 

I mean come on,

 

After finding out about Brad, the only thing that happens is that M gets mistaken for being T's associate or rather his boyfriend by the chinese, which leads to M being hung upside-down by a meat hook so to say, and T doesn't give two f**ks about him and leaves him to die. But correct me if I'm wrong, judging by the amount of frustration T has had for M or pretty much anyone through-out the game, I think it's safe to assume that that situation would happen even without the whole Brad angle. A really bad day for T is all it would really take.

 

Edited March 16, 2017 by Great Britain

[VictorVance1239]

Instead of sitting through cut scenes I wish we could have the choice from a list of responses that results in different outcomes going into each mission, and effects the relationship with whoever it is you're talking too as the story progresses. That way we have a reason to look forward to playing it again.

Edited March 17, 2017 by VictorVince1239

[Great Britain]

Instead of sitting through cut scenes I wish we could have the choice from a list of responses that results in different outcomes going into each mission, and effects the relationship with whoever it is you're talking too as the story progresses. That way we have a reason to look forward to playing it again.

Mass effect kinda thing?

[Mister Pink]

Op, I get you. Rockstar has used the same theme of getting out of the hood over and over. I first noticed this and got the feeling of deja vu playing as Luis when Armando and Henri give our protagonist grief about trying to get out of the hood. It's overused as then in V we had the same conversation between Stretch and Franklin.

 

It's true GTA will bring up the same themes and some will be impossible to avoid but it's kind of lazy of Rockstars part to have such a specific theme of your old friend(s) giving you grief because you want to do something bigger or better. Come on, where was that in Vice City? Where was that in III? It's been in San Andreas, then Ballad of Gay Tony and GTA V.

 

One a side note, Franklin's story is just Luis' story but in Los Santos. Minority/brown/black kid trying to get out of the hood and make something for himself, startsworking downtown with a rich white guy to learn his trade, gets tangled up in rich white guys problems, learns something about himself....yada, yada, yada. It's formulaic and predictable at this stage.

 

How about we have a protagonist who's friends are happy, enabling sociopath's too? Or how about Rockstar have some self awareness not to make another game so soon with repetitive writing. Like if someone put a YouTube video together of all the times your friend in the game grills you about leaving the hood, I think people would then get you OP when they actually see it all together. It's a GTA trope now at this stage that's not on the charming or ironic end of the spectrum, it's more cringe... "not this sh*t again."

 

Edit: Great Britain put it nicely "things in the past that the protag should be guilty about all his life." You can't just want to succeed and win. In San Andreas in started with Ryder grilling you for leaving LS and it was fine then because it was new then but it's been a recurring theme that you can't sort of "win" in GTA without the story trying make you feel guilty and sh*t.

 

Vice City had Vercetti give 2 fingers to the Mafia in Liberty and he done his thing his way. I think that's why it's almost unanimous that everyone likes Tommy Vercetti. There was no bitching and moaning in GTA back then. Vercetti was the great anti-hero in a crime-capitalist GTA.

 

I think Trevor was an attempt at that guy again but he's annoying as hell. I want my protagonist to me someone who wants to succeed in a GTA-crime-capitalist environment, like Tommy Vercetti and a likability of someone who if existed, I could enjoy a pint of beer with. Preferably someone who doesn't talk to much so they can't whine to much because we know if our protag is going to talk in a GTA, they'll have a lot of whining to do. Nip it in the bud and just make a mostly silent character again. Someone who doesn't talk much but curses when you bump in to them. Can't disagree with that, right?

Edited March 18, 2017 by Mister Pink

[VictorVance1239]

 

Instead of sitting through cut scenes I wish we could have the choice from a list of responses that results in different outcomes going into each mission, and effects the relationship with whoever it is you're talking to as the story progresses. That way we have a reason to look forward to playing it again.

Mass effect kinda thing?

 

I never played that but if it has the multiple choice options like Life is Strange did then yeah. Every decision you make has its own consequence that makes the outcome of the whole story different. I think GTA could use it.

[Johnny Spaz]

I think Trevor was an attempt at that guy again but he's annoying as hell. I want my protagonist to me someone who wants to succeed in a GTA-crime-capitalist environment, like Tommy Vercetti and a likability of someone who if existed, I could enjoy a pint of beer with. Preferably someone who doesn't talk to much so they can't whine to much because we know if our protag is going to talk in a GTA, they'll have a lot of whining to do. Nip it in the bud and just make a mostly silent character again. Someone who doesn't talk much but curses when you bump in to them. Can't disagree with that, right?

Only Packie McReary & Little Jacob have had actual behavior like this with a protagonist, just a couple of grown men hanging out without all the drama. I'm not against drama but sometimes R* overdoes it, there weren't any characters like Jacob or Packie in GTA V, they were all assholes & stereotypical.

[Maibatsu545]

I don't mind characters talking amongst themselves as long as it's well written, which is not the case most recently in GTA. V was an all-out cringefest.

Edited March 19, 2017 by Maibatsu545

[Great Britain]

 

 

Instead of sitting through cut scenes I wish we could have the choice from a list of responses that results in different outcomes going into each mission, and effects the relationship with whoever it is you're talking to as the story progresses. That way we have a reason to look forward to playing it again.

Mass effect kinda thing?

 

I never played that but if it has the multiple choice options like Life is Strange did then yeah. Every decision you make has its own consequence that makes the outcome of the whole story different. I think GTA could use it.

 

Your decisions are supposed to be affecting the story of the game as far as ME series goes yes but up until ME3, it didn't have that big of an impact on the story imo, but let's hope the newly released ME : Andromeda gets it right in every aspect of story-telling this time. I also do like the idea of having a similar concept for the GTA series now that I think about it.

[VictorVance1239]

 

I think Trevor was an attempt at that guy again but he's annoying as hell. I want my protagonist to me someone who wants to succeed in a GTA-crime-capitalist environment, like Tommy Vercetti and a likability of someone who if existed, I could enjoy a pint of beer with. Preferably someone who doesn't talk to much so they can't whine to much because we know if our protag is going to talk in a GTA, they'll have a lot of whining to do. Nip it in the bud and just make a mostly silent character again. Someone who doesn't talk much but curses when you bump in to them. Can't disagree with that, right?

Only Packie McReary & Little Jacob have had actual behavior like this with a protagonist, just a couple of grown men hanging out without all the drama. I'm not against drama but sometimes R* overdoes it, there weren't any characters like Jacob or Packie in GTA V, they were all assholes & stereotypical.

 

and Dwayne

[Johnny Spaz]

Dwayne was cool but he was always complaining, Niko even got sick of it at some point

[Mister Pink]

I liked Dwaynes complaining because he was just out of the joint. I felt genuinely sorry for him. There was compassion to be had. It's different than peripheral characters and protagonist complaining all the time though.

[Maibatsu545]

I liked Dwaynes complaining because he was just out of the joint. I felt genuinely sorry for him. There was compassion to be had. It's different than peripheral characters and protagonist complaining all the time though.

 

Compared to the cartoon characters of V Dwaynes story was Shakespeare.

[_Raven_]

I liked Dwaynes complaining because he was just out of the joint. I felt genuinely sorry for him. There was compassion to be had. It's different than peripheral characters and protagonist complaining all the time though.

There's even more of a dynamic during one of the friend activities where Niko points out Dwayne's bitterness and tries to tell him he shouldn't be constantly dwelling on the past, while Dwayne apologizes and tries to improve his behavior in future hangouts. This is an interesting turning point for Dwayne's character and honestly is why we need friend activities to some extent to return (or really, just more in-depth conversations)

[iddqdvie]

Yes and No. i like the conversations for what they are, even though they are 08/15 "what am

i doing with my life" conversations. i guess thats a thing in life. questioning it. tommy did that too, we just didnt hear him. they could have gone a bit deeper like in RDR. As long as they dont try to teach us morals and sheeplife its all good

[IlikeLatinaTits]

No, what's wrong with adding dialogue outside of cutscenes? so you just want the dialogue to be restricted to cutscenes? for me, they are mostly well-written & add to the narrative so no I say keep the conversations.