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Donatello

Was Obama a good president?

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Donatello

 

 

Jimmy Dore's epic reply to President Obama.

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Gnocchi Flip Flops

^ All I saw was a prick with a punchable face running his mouth...

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Blaze

^ All I saw was a prick with a punchable face running his mouth...

 

I typically want to punch anyone who says "punchable face"

Edited by Blaze

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Alexander

He tipically wants to punch himself

 

OT:

 

I think he was ok. But because of the next administration, I think he will be overestimated.

Edited by Alexander

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Eutyphro

I personally think it's ludicrous to say with utmost certainty that Obama, Bush or any other President within the last few decades is the absolute worst of all time,

I've not made an academic study of the exact track record of every single US president ever, but considering the financial crisis and the Iraq war happening under Bush, it is hard for me to imagine him not ranking very high on any 'worst US president' list. He might be the very worst one ever.

 

As for Obama, I don't think he was a good president. He was somewhere in between mediocre and bad. I like Obama as a person though. He seems like a cool guy.

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Gnocchi Flip Flops

 

^ All I saw was a prick with a punchable face running his mouth...

 

I typically want to punch anyone who says "punchable face"

 

I was waiting for that! :lol:

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El Dildo

Dissenting opinion.

seeing as to how virtually everything you wrote is demonstrably and categorically false, you didn't really need to clarify that this was "opinion," but thanks for your input.

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Chiarii

No. Economically speaking he is the single worst president in 50 years.

 

You say that like having freer, fairer, happier, more prosperous and more collaborative societies is a bad thing.

 

Freer: No

Fairer: Yes

Happier: ...

More prosperous: No

More collaborative: No

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El Dildo

Economically speaking he is the single worst president in 50 years.

this statement is patently false.

nice try, though.

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Eutyphro

No. Economically speaking he is the single worst president in 50 years.

Ever heard of 'George W. Bush'?

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Chiarii

 

Economically speaking he is the single worst president in 50 years.

this statement is patently false.

nice try, though.

 

 

It must be hard for you to accept.

 

 

Ever heard of 'George W. Bush'?

 

 

Yes.

 

Anyway, this site won't let me paste the chart. Bush was 1.8% GDP growth per quarter. Obama was 1.78. So, Obama is the worst in 50 years.

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Eutyphro

Anyway, this site won't let me paste the chart. Bush was 1.8% GDP growth per quarter. Obama was 1.78. So, Obama is the worst in 50 years.

 

That would make sense, if you would want to blame Obama for most of the consequences of the financial crisis and the subprime mortgage crisis under Bush. Which doesn't make sense, but is f*cking stupid.

Edited by Eutyphro

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Chiarii

 

Anyway, this site won't let me paste the chart. Bush was 1.8% GDP growth per quarter. Obama was 1.78. So, Obama is the worst in 50 years.

That would make sense, if you would want to blame Obama for most of the consequences of the financial crisis and the subprime mortgage crisis under Bush. Which doesn't make sense, but is f*cking stupid.

Let me guess: you think inheriting an economically turbulent climate is unique to Obama?

 

To reiterate... Obama is economically the worst president in 50 years.

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Eutyphro

And you are the worst and dumbest troll in 50 years. It's not an 'economically turbulent climate', but the largest recession since the great depression.

Edited by Eutyphro

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Chiarii

So I'm a troll because I crushed your little fantasy about obama being a good president. LOL you aren't fit for a public forum.

 

Gtaf basket of emotionals.

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sivispacem

Freer: No

They consistently rank higher than the US on the majority of freedom induces (press, political, corruption, etc), ergo freer.

 

Happier: ...

Consistently best the US in measures of national well-being and happiness, ergo happier.

 

More prosperous: No

Higher nominal GDP per capita, higher PPP GDP per capita, higher Gini, typically higher HDI, higher ranking in the Legatum Prosperity Index and higher average incomes.

 

More collaborative: No

Most measures of societal cohesion, such as institutional trust, freedom from corruption et cetera consistently rank Scandinavia higher than the US. I'd love to know your rationale for blindly asserting that the US is a more collaborative society.

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Eutyphro

I think you are a troll, because you clearly repeat things that you understand are false. Bush is a much worse president economically than any other in the last 50 years, to anyone sane and reasonable. Apart from that:

your little fantasy about obama being a good president.

 

Did you see me post I thought Obama was "in between mediocre and bad"? I've never thought or said Obama has been a good president.

Edited by Eutyphro

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X S

These sort of questions are for posterity to judge, and proper consideration should be left to others about 20 to 30 years following a presidency. With that said, I'd place him in the top half of great presidents. I'm not sure about where he stands any further than that, though. He's definitely not top 10, but may be deserving of top 20 simply for the social significance of becoming the first black or non-white president. Other than that, he reigned over an economy of stagnation that was largely inherited from probably one of the worst presidents in history, GW Bush, but that still shouldn't excuse him from sub-3% growth in GDP for eight years. He'd be the first president since Hoover to do that.

 

Regardless, there's some presidents in the top 10 or 20 that commonly draw controversy amongst political partisans, such as Woodrow Wilson or Andrew Jackson, which is why they need to be considered in proper context of the issues of the time. Specifically, presidents need to be considered in terms of who preceded and succeeded them, ie. Lincoln succeeding Buchanan.

Edited by X S

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The Deadite

I think you are a troll, because you clearly repeat things that you understand are false. ñ

You are dealing with Chiari here, don't you understand he's intelectually superior to you in every way?

Step off kiddo.

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El Dildo

It must be hard for you to accept.

well see, the nice thing about reality is that it's true whether you want to believe it or not.

Obama is - objectively speaking - not the worst economic president we've had in the last 50 years.

 

it's just a stupid statement because it's not true.

you can't support that statement with facts.

 

would you like to try again?

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GTA Czar

Sure he was.

 

Because he won a Nobel-piece prize: A few more pieces and he will have a complete one.

Oh yeah, lets not forget how he went on to bomb 7 countries and practically founded ISIS and toppled regimes and created general chaos in the Middle East, watched ISIS go from an infant to what it is now. Really, those of you saying he was a good president why dont you elaborate with specifics besides being black or a democrat cause when you put the facts out there he was a horrible president. Expanding the surveillance state and putting race relations at an all time low, Fast & Furious man the list goes on about his f*ck ups.

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GTA Czar

White* civilization.

 

Little racist of a comment dont you think? Want to talk about "white civilization" it was white people who invented those computers, electricity, cell phones and cars you use.

I'm most impressed with the health reforms that were passed, amazing step forward for America.

 

But yes I think he was a fantastic President. Importantly he represented America well.

For one he didn't sound like a bumbling fool when he spoke, he was very quick witted, charming and funny, spoke very clearly and answered questions without much ambiguity and question dodging.

Even if you disagree with someone, how you come across makes a huge difference In getting people to listen to what you're saying.

 

I could keep listing stuff but it would take forever, here's something that looks at the positives.

http://www.alternet.org/story/154840/top_50_things_accomplished_by_president_barack_obama

The cost of health care has skyrocketed and they give you a tax on breathing by penalizing you $1000 on taxes if you dont have insurance. When you take away competition in the market place thats how prices rise and thats what he did. It's basic economics. Main reason Sanders would of made a horrible president, knows nothing about economics or how competition affects the market place. Trump will do a much better job. I'd rather have the guy with a bachelors degree in Economics and has over 500 successful businesses running my economy than some socialist who never earned a paycheck until he weasled his way into politics or some race baiting lawyer.

 

 

Best one since Roosevelt. The guy shows that he cares about people. Offcourse he couldn't do many things but he tried and it shows.

The only thing I could hold against him is the drones killing innocents. Still not worse than Bush's mistakes.

FDR was not a good president, the economy started to collapse in the late 30's and WW2 saved us from the depression, not FDR and his welfare state. The guy quadrupled the national debt BEFORE WW2 and multiplied THAT times 5 during WW2. WW1 didnt even come close to racking up that much debt. The best President since his time was JFK, Reagan and Eisenhower in that order and the rest were all trash.

 

 

As an outside observor, not from the US, I have to say I think he did. He did some good things, he did some questionable things, but overall, his intentions were pretty clear - he wanted to make life better for Americans in general, and to try to elevate those in poverty to a more comfortable and acceptable quality of life, especially through the Affordable Care Act. Though of course it has many flaws, it was an attempt to ensure people who would otherwise not be able to afford or get healthcare were able to.

How f*cking noble is that? Making sure that more people live. Preventing people from dying and suffering.
Good luck with Trump, guys. I hope it's as much fun as you all expected it to be, having an actual mad man in office.

Well poverty has increaased since he has come into office.

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jan/7/obamas-rhetoric-on-fighting-poverty-doesnt-match-h/

 

Affordable Care Act made insurance premiums skyrocket, quite the opposite, all it did was FORCE people to buy insurance and eliminated competition in the market place which anybody who paid attention in Economics class or actually owns a business would know thats why prices go up.

 

Preventing people from dying and suffering, really? Last time I checked there are 0 deaths per year from starvation in the United States before he came into office and now and like posted above he has made poverty worse.

 

And how is Trump a "mad man"? Please elaborate with facts and not ad hominem. I dont think putting Americanism over globalism and prioritizing American needs over foreigners, balancing the budget, downsizing government spending and waste, simplifying the tax code and making a flat tax for EVERYONE, not wanting to start WW3 with Russia, stop whiping China's ass, and protecting our border from illegals and potential terrorists is being a mad man. That MErkel in Germany allowing those crazy "refugees" invade by the boatload and commit act of terror after act of terror in Europe while telling you to accept it is the real mad man (or woman). We'll have just as much fun with Trump as Britain will have with Brexit and France with Le Pin. The nation state will prevail over globalist tyranny.

 

Heres how that "cultural enrichment" has been going for Germany:

 

 

 

 

Yes. He represented America with class and thoughtfulness. He couldn't get a lot done. But he truely cared about people and the environment. Our planet is crying and Obama heard it. His approval is at an all time high. Beautiful family.

You have any statistics to back that up or is that just your personal opinion? Pretty sure Trump being elected was a result in a low approval rating of Obama seeing as Clinton ran on nothing but being a third term of Obama.

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/americas-fed-obama-approval-rating-hits-all-time-low-poll-n173271

 

Sorry to burst your bubble of denial.

Edited by GTA Czar

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Tchuck

 

Sure he was.

 

Because he won a Nobel-piece prize: A few more pieces and he will have a complete one.

Oh yeah, lets not forget how he went on to bomb 7 countries and practically founded ISIS and toppled regimes and created general chaos in the Middle East, watched ISIS go from an infant to what it is now. Really, those of you saying he was a good president why dont you elaborate with specifics besides being black or a democrat cause when you put the facts out there he was a horrible president. Expanding the surveillance state and putting race relations at an all time low, Fast & Furious man the list goes on about his f*ck ups.

 

 

Good lord. We have been putting out the facts, but you and your ilk has just been ignoring them. Also, founder of ISIS, BAHAHAHAHAHAHAH. Also putting race relations at an all time low. Wow. Really?

 

On topic: He was a pretty good president. Helped improve the image of the US around the world (except those places where he droned them), sadly was severely hamstrung by the insane republicans that don't want things becoming better for those who are not wealthy white religious americans. Can only imagine what he could have done if the houses were more friendly. Oh well. In the context of the orange douche that's coming up, people will be dying for the Obama times to come back. Figuratively, and possibly literally.

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GTA Czar

 

 

Sure he was.

 

Because he won a Nobel-piece prize: A few more pieces and he will have a complete one.

Oh yeah, lets not forget how he went on to bomb 7 countries and practically founded ISIS and toppled regimes and created general chaos in the Middle East, watched ISIS go from an infant to what it is now. Really, those of you saying he was a good president why dont you elaborate with specifics besides being black or a democrat cause when you put the facts out there he was a horrible president. Expanding the surveillance state and putting race relations at an all time low, Fast & Furious man the list goes on about his f*ck ups.

 

 

Good lord. We have been putting out the facts, but you and your ilk has just been ignoring them. Also, founder of ISIS, BAHAHAHAHAHAHAH. Also putting race relations at an all time low. Wow. Really?

 

On topic: He was a pretty good president. Helped improve the image of the US around the world (except those places where he droned them), sadly was severely hamstrung by the insane republicans that don't want things becoming better for those who are not wealthy white religious americans. Can only imagine what he could have done if the houses were more friendly. Oh well. In the context of the orange douche that's coming up, people will be dying for the Obama times to come back. Figuratively, and possibly literally.

 

Was ISIS not a baby during Obamas presidency? Does the Obama administration not send weapons to "rebels" with ties to ISIS? Have minorities not been going on about "racism" and assaulting white people at higher numbers than ever? You ot hear about the Trump supporter who was mauled by blacks just for his political views? Did you not hear about those blacks in Chicago who kidnapped and tortured that retarded white kid? Were blacks not rioting all over the country for the last 3 years? Boy you have some serious tunnel vision. And I have yet to see a single fact posted about Trump, literally nothing but ad hominem, which is what your response is. Clearly you dont know what that is, but its a logical fallacy that says you're implying something is true just because you and your constituents believe it but are not supporting it by fact. "And wealthy whites", you do realize that link I posted showed the truth of the matter that wealth inequality got worse under Obama. Please, cite some sources and stop talking out of your ass.

 

Oh and you must be psychic, cause last time I checked Trump isnt in office for two more weeks and hasnt come close to screwing things up. In fact, companies have brought jobs back to the US already in anticipation of his policies of withdrawing from TPP and renegotiating NAFTA.

 

Oh, and Obama ruined the US image, he makes America look weak as the apologist and chief and is treated by total disrespect in other countries like China, Cuba

 

ISIS getting US weapons: http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/08/politics/amnesty-international-isis-weapons-u-s-/

 

Race relations all time low: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/19/race-relations-reach-all-time-low-under-obama-poll/

 

Trump brought jobs back: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/01/03/ford-to-scrap-mexico-plant-invest-in-michigan-due-to-trump-policies.html

 

Obama disrespected by world leaders: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/sep/5/obama-disrespected-by-china-rodrigo-duterte-on-fin/

 

Sorry your opinion doesnt align with reality.

 

 

Edited by GTA Czar

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Tchuck

 

Was ISIS not a baby during Obamas presidency?

 

You said it was founded by Obama. It wasn't. It existed as far as the late 90s. It was strengthened during the Iraq and Afghanistan invasion thanks to Bush. Bush's policies also increased the radicalism among those in the middle east, who began to view the US as an enemy. So sorry, the "Obama founded ISIS" is just bullsh*t.

 

 

Does the Obama administration not send weapons to "rebels" with ties to ISIS?

 

Proof, please. As far as I know, the rebels they do support are those fighting al-Assad's forces in Syria. Show me the ties to ISIS. All your link showed was that some weapons that were provided by the US to rebels for the fighting against ISIS ended up in ISIS hands after being captured. That doesn't at all mean Obama sending weapons to ISIS. Sorry, you are wrong.

 

 

Have minorities not been going on about "racism" and assaulting white people at higher numbers than ever?

 

Oh I'm sorry, I must have not been paying attention to black on whites assault in face of the overwhelming numbers of police brutality and hatred against minorities coming from the whiter part of the population. In any case, show me the data cause I smell bullsh*t on these assaults. And the minorities are going on about racism because f*cking hell the US IS racist, and Obama tried to make things better. But you had a white republican opposition that painted him as the godless demon from Africa, further driving racism between certain ranks of the US population. Obama's only fault in it is being black. But that's blaming the victim. Again, bullsh*t.

 

 

You ot hear about the Trump supporter who was mauled by blacks just for his political views? Did you not hear about those blacks in Chicago who kidnapped and tortured that retarded white kid?

 

Some people are just plain stupid. There's been an increase in racially motivated attacks since Trump won the election. That's fact. For every "attack" on Trump supporters, there's dozens more FROM Trump supporters. And when your political views are based on prejudice, racism, and a whole other host of evil, I have no sympathy for you getting your ass kicked. For the Chicago thing, yeah it's terrible it happened. Irrelevant to this discussion though.

 

 

Were blacks not rioting all over the country for the last 3 years?

 

Rioting all over the country! The blacks are out of control! Who let them out of the plantation! Around blacks, never relax! Yeah, do you know what they were protesting for? Clearly you don't. Go study the subject a bit.

 

 

And I have yet to see a single fact posted about Trump, literally nothing but ad hominem, which is what your response is. Clearly you dont know what that is, but its a logical fallacy that says you're implying something is true just because you and your constituents believe it but are not supporting it by fact.

 

They've been posted and examined at length at the Presidential discussion in the D&D section of this forum. And sorry, I do know what an ad hominem is, I do know what logical fallacies are, and all my beliefs are supported by fact. Look at every thing that Trump has said, look at the increase in racial violence since his victory, look at the nominations he's making for his cabinet. Those are facts that CLEARLY support my position. But do go on. And Tunnel Vision, lol.

 

 

"And wealthy whites", you do realize that link I posted showed the truth of the matter that wealth inequality got worse under Obama. Please, cite some sources and stop talking out of your ass.

 

Ooops looks like I was right again and wealth inequality actually got better Obama.

 

 

Oh and you must be psychic, cause last time I checked Trump isnt in office for two more weeks and hasnt come close to screwing things up. In fact, companies have brought jobs back to the US already in anticipation of his policies of withdrawing from TPP and renegotiating NAFTA.

 

Oh wow I didn't know that we can only count on his stuff after he gets elected. Oh wait, he already has began screwing things up. Do you not see the nominations he's made for his cabinet? A walstreet lackey for the head of the SEC; CEO of an Oil Company for secretary of state; Goldman Sachs banker for the National Economic Council; Anti-worker CEO for the Secretary of Labor; Climate Change Skeptic to head the EPA; Education wrecker as Education Secretary; Competent surgeon but completely inapt at everything else as Secretary of Housing and Urban development; f*cking disgusting scumbag piece of sh*t racist as Chief Strategist. His administration is ALREADY screwing up before it even started.

 

OH and these companies that brought back jobs to the US? Yeah, they won't be the manufacturing jobs for the vast numbers of Americans in search for a job. Those will stay comfortably where they are. And his promises of bringing Coal et al back, are all empty. Just as is his promise to drain the swamp from Washington, with hims filling it with even more billionaire lobbyists than ever before.

 

So yeah, I can safely, factually say his administration is already a disaster, without even going into the racial side of things. You think Obama brought race relations to an all time low? You just wait.

 

And if you wanna continue to argue about US politics, feel free to drop by the D&D topic on the subject.

 

And sorry, it's your opinion that doesn't align with reality.

Edited by Tchuck

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MeisterJazz

He was a terrible president for black people.

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Switch

He was a terrible president for black people.

Other presidents didn't help much either, then again it seems hard to remove inequality in capitalism, doesn't it? What did you expect him to do? Give them reparations for slavery? White Americans would never let that happen. There is not much you can do to make a people who was enslaved for many years and then having the system go against them, suddenly become equal, they will always be at a disadvantage. Obama tried making college more accessible and made a health care reform that helped millions of Americans especially lower class. Realistically speaking in America there isn't much you can do, the rest is just economics which is getting worse for everyone (especially the lower class and marginalized people) and that can hardly be contributed to one man..

Edited by Switch

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Shaytan

As an European, President Obama tried to bring to some typical European concepts into the US such as the country providing health care for those that couldn't afford it (ObamaCare was a very close form of social security and I see that as a good thing because everyone has the right and receives from the State free education and health, avoiding situations like in the US where the idea of big private initiative leads to those with less having even less possibilities for all these basic needs - and then we end with the result of this like Detroit) and environmental protection policies. While I think both of those are great (and I have to say anyone decently informed should agree with the second), apparently American citizens didn't thought the same way and wanted that to change.

 

On the other side though, I have to point out Mr. Obama didn't seem to retain much from Vietnam experience and kept the model of engaging in avoidable wars, plus with the development of drones that, although media always wants to show the bright side of them, get interesting when you think people see with terror terrorist groups that explode themselves, yet find perfectly fine remote controlled planes, controlled from something reassembling a gaming setup, shooting explosive rounds at possible terrorists. Imo America, and the experience of the government of Mr. Obama and some of his processors, should realize they're not the police of the world, and it's very arguable the legitimacy to all the attacks performed.

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Yinepi

No. But Trump seem like he not much better... and maybe worse.. but only in time can tell us.

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Jimmy

Obama is one of the most successful presidents in the recent times. Taking up presidency after Bush when the economy was in complete free fall, his policies have helped it and have managed to put the country back on track. Obama came to power, US was in the middle of a financial crisis, US was in the middle of a war and was losing jobs. But now, with his careful economic policies and management the country is in a much better shape altogether and consistently producing more and more jobs and decreasing the unemployment. And, because of that today, the Stock market is stronger than it has ever been. Just have a look at the current conversion rates and you'll get a clear idea.

Edited by Arrow

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