The Last of Us Part II

[jje1000]

On 6/27/2020 at 9:46 AM, D9fred95 said:

Kiwifarms actually brought up a good point about this just now. While 4 million within the first week is a very good number, ultimately we're going to need to wait until the end of the year to really see if this game is a success or a "failure". Failure as in the type where the company is like "it didn't meet our expectations". Around Christmas when everyone gets the new console or just the game by itself is probably the best benchmark. ND sunk millions into TLOU2 and 4 million copies won't cut the difference.

 

I never really heard of a "boycott" for the game tbh, just that people said they weren't buying it, which isn't hard to believe. Just means other people did buy it.

Pretty much this- some things to consider:

• Negative word-of-mouth can affect game sales down the road (conversely, good word-of-mouth can sustain sales for very long time, like for GTA V and the Witcher III).
• We don't know how much the game cost to develop over its 7 years of development. $100 million would not be out of the question, with a magnitude more for the advertising costs.
• A divisive entry in a popular franchise might not sell badly, but it might damage the franchise down the road- i.e. Star Wars and its current issues stemming from the sequels, or the Battlefield franchise).
• Even if it sells "well", if it fails to sell more than its previous entry, it may be considered a failure from the corporate POV.

 

As for the story:

Spoiler

• Joel's death needed to be handled less clumsily. This is an issue with the writing, as it almost felt they wrote the entire first chapters around the need for Joel to die quickly.
• We honestly did not need Abby's POV, which dilutes Ellie's story. Make it all about Ellie and how she comes to terms with revenge and forgiveness; bring Tommy along as a dark mirror of Joel if necessary. If Abby was just a NPC, it might have had a bigger impact in mirroring TLOU's ending, with Ellie learning to forgive a random mook, rather than to kill like Joel did).
• There were comments that Ellie flipping the guitar to begin learning with her other hand would have been a perfect bittersweet send-off.
• Some 'scenes' were unnecessary and someone needed to tell Neil "No".
• I did not like the emotional manipulation the storytelling did in trying to paint Abby in a positive light, and Ellie in a negative one (i.e. pushing you to kill dogs, and then shaming you for it).
• There were too many characters that lingered for too long beyond their welcome, in contrast to TLOU, where characters came and went as needed, which helped centralize the story around Joel and Ellie.
• I personally think TLOUII severely limits the franchise going forward. The setting and world-building is honestly not strong enough to carry a sequel minus its two most beloved characters (Ellie and Joel). I suspect they'll try to make something of Lev and Abby, but I don't think people like them enough.
• The game is a technical achievement, but that should be considered separate from the story-telling. The graphical achievements were also sort of wasted on the generally samey muted Seattle aesthetic (unlike TLOU or RDRII's variety), but that's just my opinion.
• I honestly think that Neil needed someone to limit him, which is not unlike a George Lucas scenario- this is likely the result of so many original staff leaving Naughty Dog.

 

Honestly RDRII is a better example of a revenge-is-bad story IMO, and it's not even explicitly one.

 

Edited June 30, 2020 by jje1000

[Grichka Bogdanoff]

7 minutes ago, RenegadeAngel said:

The most obvious decision would be to make a redemption story for Elle since she hit the absolute rock bottom and has nothing and no one left. Maybe they could throw Abby in there too somehow.  If they want to, they'll find ways to make another one.

 

BTW One thing about the game's criticism I don't quite get but see it being brought up all the time is "you kill people/dogs in this game and then get shamed for it''. Where and how am I being judged for it exactly? I really don't get it.

But also, it's not like you're killing innocent dogs that pose no threat whatsoever. Just like the entirety of WLF and the Scars, they all want to kill you, so you're just defending yourself.

Spoiler

In particular during that scene where you kill Alice. The only dog that canonically you kill.

 

a Hideo Kojima post.

[LittleJesus]

 

A beautiful take on the game, I recommend this review even though you didn't liked the direction of the story 

[Middle Class Roadman]

Lol why do people hate Abby so much? So far the only reasons I've seen is that she is evil and violent - this coming GTA fans is absolutely laughable. You've all spent hours and hours doing evil, violent things in GTA/RDR games - so why is this such a cause for offence all of a sudden with Abby?

 

I personally loved playing as Abby - thought she was a fantastic character and thoroughly enjoyed her side of the story. I finished the game the other day and thought it was absolutely amazing - truly outstanding work by Naughty Dog. Visually it's probably the nicest looking game I've ever played - so many times I was simply left in awe at the environmental design and art direction. Especially in Seattle - this big, abandoned and decaying city looked absolutely astonishing at certain points. 

 

Highlights for me included...

 

Spoiler

 

Going into the depths of the hospital - this was so f*cking tense, you knew what you was getting into going down there. Rat King was the stuff of nightmares.

 

The crashed ship with all those infected and then reading the captains diary explaining the entire series of events on the ship from its departure in San Diego to washing up in Seattle - for me that was probably the eeriest part of the game. The story telling through these notes throughout the game was absolutely incredible - but story behind this ship was definitely the stand out for me, really well done. 

 

Being dropped in the middle of that crazy battle on the island between WLF and Scars - that literally looked like the apocalypse. The horse set piece was incredible, literally galloping through hell.

 

The shootout with Tommy where he's on the bridge trying to snipe you - that was awesome. 

 

I really liked the calmer parts of the game as well, like the museum segment. My favourite was probably on the farm with Dina and JJ with that incredible sunset over the cornfields and plains - Not sure about anyone else but I love moments like these in games (one of the reasons I loved RDR2 so much), it was such a unique moment as well given the fact that you're cradling a baby the whole time, dont think I've ever seen that in a game before.

 

With regards to the ending - I wouldnt say it was anti climatic but it was just kinda uneventful, not much happened aside from them having one last fight then both going their separate ways, with Ellie having some last thoughts about Joel. I kinda hoped we'd get control of Abbie again and maybe be able to conclude her story properly but I guess they could be leaving that for a third game (if they decide to do so).  But yeah all in all I thought it was an amazing game from start to finish.

 

 

 

[Corndawg93]

It just hit me 

Spoiler

If Ellie goes with Jesse to get Tommy, she'll run into Abby

 

[Corndawg93]

10 hours ago, TheJesus1996 said:

 

A beautiful take on the game, I recommend this review even though you didn't liked the direction of the story 

But... but... but Joe

 

[LittleJesus]

1 hour ago, Corndawg93 said:

But... but... but Joe

 

50 minutes long?! I don't know if I can take him seriously after this thoughts

https://m.twitch.tv/clip/ThankfulSoftSalamanderRaccAttack

[D9fred95]

21 hours ago, Dark Rosewood Varnish said:

Lol why do people hate Abby so much? So far the only reasons I've seen is that she is evil and violent - this coming GTA fans is absolutely laughable. You've all spent hours and hours doing evil, violent things in GTA/RDR games - so why is this such a cause for offence all of a sudden with Abby?

 

I don't think it's really valid to compare players who are put in a consequence-free world and are allowed to run amok and cause trouble to the stuff Abby does in TLOU2 since she does those things explicitly for the plot which are canon and cannot be changed. They're pretty much two separate things really.

Edited July 2, 2020 by D9fred95

[Middle Class Roadman]

46 minutes ago, D9fred95 said:

I don't think it's really valid to compare players who are put in a consequence-free world and are allowed to run amok and cause trouble to the stuff Abby does in TLOU2 since she does those things explicitly for the plot which are canon and cannot be changed. They're pretty much two separate things really.

 

I see. Well wether you hated her or not, she undoubtedly had the best sections of the game in her story - as well as the better weapon set up.

[Corndawg93]

 

[LittleJesus]

36 minutes ago, Corndawg93 said:

 

Interesting... it was originally planned to be open world. I love this discussions it gives more meaning to the story.

[Alex816]

7 hours ago, Dark Rosewood Varnish said:

 

I see. Well wether you hated her or not, she undoubtedly had the best sections of the game in her story - as well as the better weapon set up.

and that was done on purpose as one of the many ways to try to get the players to like her

22 hours ago, Corndawg93 said:

But... but... but Joe

 

i don't really watch this dude a lot, but he hit the nail on the head on everything in that one

[Zello]

I'm still playing through the game don't really hate Abby.

 

A lot of the hate is overblown. I still want them to fire Neil Druckmann though just because lol.

Edited July 3, 2020 by Zello

[Corndawg93]

1 hour ago, Zello said:

I'm still playing through the game don't really hate Abby.

 

A lot of the hate is overblown. I still want them to fire Neil Druckmann though just because lol.

Neil is the Vice Prez of Naughty Dog, the only guy who is firing him is Even Wells, and he isn't firing his prized pig

[KarimNTerr]

On 7/2/2020 at 5:39 AM, Corndawg93 said:

But... but... but Joe

 

I personally agree 100% with his review TBH

[Carmecitaas]

As someone who didn’t read the leaks and spoilers the game wasn’t THAT BAD. But a lot of the characters are just there and serve little to no purpose.

Spoiler

Examples of this would be Jesse, Yara, Mel, Owen, and low key Tommy. So when these characters die it’s just kinda like oh.... Because these characters lack depth. Sam and Henry was done so perfectly, even though we only knew them for so long their deaths were so impactful and pretty sure left everyone in shock/sadness.

 

A third game to the series is completely unneeded and they should really just end it here. We know nothing about Lev, besides she’s trans and was a Scar?? They really could’ve made him a much better character. Also the Scars vs Wolves could’ve been fleshed out a lot more. Bc their whole feud is just there in the background but we are supposed to feel sad when the Wolves attack the Scars base? I don’t even think Lev was that sad when it happened  lol. Exploring the religiousness and beginnings of the Scars with Lev could’ve been cool. 

 

Also I thought Dinah was cool but both her and the baby surviving after her being shot in the chest and having her face smashed in was really unbelievable and i kept thinking the scenes in the prairie house were like a lucid dream. Especially when Tommy came in.

 

Also Mels death was kinda pointless and i don’t know why they made her pregnant besides making her death seem different. I don’t think any expecting mother would put themselves in any of the situations she did, maybe ND did it to show women are bad asses but this could’ve been done SO much better.

 

 

 

This game just kinda proves not everything needs a sequel.

[TheSantader25]

That has to be one of Joe's best reviews to this day tbh. He pretty much covered everything that's wrong with the game. 6/10 is pretty accurate for this game. Maybe 7/10 sometimes but nah. 

[Corndawg93]

Joe's review is complete nonsensical hogwash, watch Girlfriend Reviews video, it's the video y'all should watch, not the 50 f*cking minutes of crap Joe puked out

[LittleJesus]

I'm embarrassed to share my interest in games with pieces of sh*t like that 

 

[KarimNTerr]

55 minutes ago, TheJesus1996 said:

I'm embarrassed to share my interest in games with pieces of sh*t like that 

 

Yeah, this is just wrong in every way possible, humans can be so f*cking stupid sometimes

[Corndawg93]

1 hour ago, TheJesus1996 said:

I'm embarrassed to share my interest in games with pieces of sh*t like that 

 

For the love of god, its just a fictional character, who cares who she 

Spoiler

Killed, Joels a boring character any way 

 

[Is this The Guy?]

That kind of garbage doesn’t surprise me anymore.  

Edited July 4, 2020 by Is this The Guy?

[Jabalous]

 

Especially the brain splatter part. The most brutal video game I've ever seen. 

[Zello]

On 6/25/2020 at 2:05 AM, Corndawg93 said:

I wanna talk about the 

  Reveal hidden contents

Rat King and how misunderstood he is

All he wanted was a Hug and 

  Reveal hidden contents

Abby

murdered him

Was that the Rat King man...I was actually expecting an actual rat.

 

Is it just me or does this game just feel...short? I'm already in

Spoiler

Santa Barbara. With Ellie.

Kinda happy to see Santa Barbara. Finally something sunny in this franchise lol. Infected on da beach and in the sun.

Maybe it's just the timeline of the game so much happening in so little time.

Edited July 4, 2020 by Zello

[Corndawg93]

45 minutes ago, Zello said:

Was that the Rat King man...I was actually expecting an actual rat.

Its called the Rat King for a very clever and gross reason 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_king&ved=2ahUKEwjz-e2znrPqAhUOzzgGHXRSDuQQFjAOegQIFhAH&usg=AOvVaw1_Y7MW-0IxvCHyi38rBACS

 

[Zello]

1 minute ago, Corndawg93 said:

Its called the Rat King for a very clever and gross reason 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_king&ved=2ahUKEwjz-e2znrPqAhUOzzgGHXRSDuQQFjAOegQIFhAH&usg=AOvVaw1_Y7MW-0IxvCHyi38rBACS

 

Ewwww

[Corndawg93]

This think piece f*cking nails this entire game

[Zello]

Neil says there won't be any DLC. I'm going to need DLC there's a lot of stuff I need to see explained. Issac, whatever the f*ck the scars believed, any remaining fireflies.

[Corndawg93]

4 minutes ago, Zello said:

Neil says there won't be any DLC. I'm going to need DLC there's a lot of stuff I need to see explained. Issac, whatever the f*ck the scars believed, any remaining fireflies.

I need to see Tommys pov of the 3 days or 4 because he's there longer, or Bill for whatever reason

[D9fred95]

14 hours ago, Corndawg93 said:

Joe's review is complete nonsensical hogwash, watch Girlfriend Reviews video, it's the video y'all should watch, not the 50 f*cking minutes of crap Joe puked out

I've seen her video, but it doesn't really change my opinion. The things happening the way they do to make us feel like Eliie and also making us play as Abby to see "the other side" still doesn't gel, mostly because of how I feel the characters are written. I still find Abby unsympathetic and the stuff that happens in the ending just awful. Like the video said, it's either you love it or hate it with pretty much no in between and I fall squarely in the latter category.