Hardcore Mode

[kraftwerkd]

I think Hardcore Mode is an aspect of gaming that doesn't get enough attention, especially in third-person open world games. Red Dead Redemption had an awesome Hardcore Mode that made the game much more enjoyable, more challenging, and overall more fun. Some of the more prominent features were as follows:

• Aiming is permanently set to Expert.
• Maximum health is reduced by half.
• Dead-eye does not automatically fill over time. It must be earned by killing enemies or using items.
• Horses do not regenerate. If killed, you must purchase, steal, mount, or break another horse and then hitch it to a post to earn the right to call it by whistling. Note that horse deeds are still available and unlimited, but twice as expensive.
• Store items cost more. Sell values are lowered.
• Reward/drops/looting amounts are lowered (ammunition and money).
• Pardon letters are more rare.
• Fame and Honor gains are reduced.
• Mini-game buy-ins are lowered to match the scarcity of money.

So, let's take some of that and apply it to what, IMO, would make a pretty cool Hardcore Mode for VI.

• Aiming is permanently set to Expert/Free Aim.
• Maximum health/armor is reduced by half, but police and enemy accuracy is decreased.
• Bullet damage is increased, but police and enemy accuracy is slightly decreased. (thanks cp1dell)
• Injury model will read where a player has been shot, and apply proper procedural animations (shot in the leg they'll limp and jog/run slower, shot in the arm will make aiming harder, etc).
• Barefisted attacks do less damage to keep fistfights fun but melee weapons deal more damage.
• Crimes can turn into arrest warrants, which depending on severity, can last for a short or long amount of in-game time.
• The impound will not retrieve vehicles you stole, only purchased and personal vehicles.
• Store items cost more, store robberies yield less money.
• Reward/drops/looting amounts are lowered (ammunition and money).
• More police on patrol than regular mode.
• The "stars" notification is still present, but the map will not flash blue and red when wanted.
• Police and enemies do not show as blips on the mini-map.

I've left most HUD options out because those are typically already options in GTA.

 

Any thoughts, ideas? Hate it, love it? Discuss!

Edited May 25, 2016 by kraftwerkd

[Sir Michael]

On your first sentence, I agree. We don't see hardcore (or survival, depending on the game in question) aspects much in console and AAA gaming because of the rather casual and multiplayer audiences some of these companies aim for, but there are loads of survival games and mods on PC. Fallout took the hardcore route with its survival mode, both in New Vegas and in 4, and like you mention, Red Dead also did. Personally, something like this would be great in GTA. This hardcore mode would make me think twice about committing a senseless crime in public. I would like to discuss one point though:

 

• Aiming is permanently set to Expert/Free Aim.

 

In my opinion, I think it's time for GTA to ditch its rather notorious auto-aim system in favor for a more conventional one. I know GTA isn't a full-on shooter, but it plays such a huge aspect on gameplay that it needs to be highly fine-tuned and revamped so that it feels natural to pick up a gun and kill people like we do in third-person shooters... Free Aim unfortunately isn't for everybody, and auto-aim is a concept from the 2000's and possibly the late 90's that just doesn't fit with today's advances in gaming. For GTA VI's multiplayer, having a conventional aim assist system that we can simply toggle on and off prevents segregation of the community, which is exactly what happened with GTA Online and its numerous aiming preferences.

[Mister Pink]

You've certainly planted the idea in my head and I would definitely welcome it as an option. Also, if I'm playing RDR again, I might give that mode a try. I never knew there were so many differences between the modes.

 

May I add that playing in Hardcore you might get unique unlockables/rewards like unique cars or weapons. It would just be a nice incentive for players to try a harder mode and a little something to make you feel good to going in to a long game with such a big challenge.

 

Lately, GTA is just kind of something fun to play through and there's not much challenge to it since San Andreas, really.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Mister Pink

[Maibatsu545]

I'd love for there to be a more hardcore game mode. Right now I play with no map and HUD as a substitute.

[Sir Michael]

Lately, GTA is just kind of something fun to play through and there's not much challenge to it since San Andreas, really.

 

Certainly feels like that, doesn't it? Despite people clamoring for a more realistic game, one with more difficulty would make single player more fun. And I agree with the lack of challenge since San Andreas. Getting gold medals for everything in driving and flight school were some of the toughest challenges in the GTA series to date.

[Rhoda]

Did V have a fluid difficulty setting that adjusted to your playing ability or am I talking out of my arse?

 

In any case, if such a thing is possible and if it hasn't yet been done, I'd like to see this. I'm not very well versed when it comes to this, but I seem to remember the game offered a bit of leniency if it noticed you were struggling with a certain aspect of a mission. As nice as this seems, it doesn't really cater to the players thirsty for a bit of a challenge and other than turning off the HUD and radar there isn't much set up for people unless they self impose restrictions to up the difficulty. Having preset difficulty settings from the beginning of the game could be extra work for the developers because they may have to program separate strands for each difficulty for as many tiers as they offer. For example, if there are three settings (easy, medium and hard for example), a mission may have to be written and scripted in three different ways to accommodate the difficulty spikes.

 

A fluid difficulty setting or a more refined way of adjusting to the player's ability and style would be nice to see.

[Sir Michael]

Did V have a fluid difficulty setting that adjusted to your playing ability or am I talking out of my arse? i

 

I don't think GTA V had that system, but I know Metal Gear Solid V did. I always went for headshots in that game, then people started wearing bulletproof helmets and riot armor. I had to use CQC more often.

[kraftwerkd]

May I add that playing in Hardcore you might get unique unlockables/rewards like unique cars or weapons. It would just be a nice incentive for players to try a harder mode and a little something to make you feel good to going in to a long game with such a big challenge.

 

Yeah, a unique armoured car, maybe even of your choice, if you can complete the story mode or something. Something like that would be cool.

 

A fluid difficulty setting or a more refined way of adjusting to the player's ability and style would be nice to see.

 

You're right, that would be way cool.

 

 

Did V have a fluid difficulty setting that adjusted to your playing ability or am I talking out of my arse? i

 

I don't think GTA V had that system, but I know Metal Gear Solid V did. I always went for headshots in that game, then people started wearing bulletproof helmets and riot armor. I had to use CQC more often.

 

 

I like the sound of that. A dynamic difficulty system would offer so many opportunities.

Edited May 25, 2016 by kraftwerkd

[cp1dell]

To OP, if health is already reduced I don't see why bullet or melee damage needs to be increased. That's just overdoing it. Essentially giving you 1/4 of the default health instead of 1/2. I like the idea of the arrest warrant type of system. Makes me think of Red Dead Redemption's wanted system where you could escape a chase, but the chase would resume after a random amount of time has passed (they "pick up your trail"), you hang around some law enforcement too long and they recognize you, or you break the law again and attract attention.

 

With the playstyle GTA has I feel like you can't go too overboard though with some of the things, like the reactions and procedural animations to being shot. In my opinion Red Dead Redemption's Hardcore Mode was close to perfect. Basically removing any hand-holding aspect the original game had and making things more difficult, but not in a ridiculous manner.

 

Still waiting on someone to create a mod similar to RDR's Hardcore Mode for GTA V...

Edited May 25, 2016 by cp1dell

[DarkSavageDeathlyCloud]

On your first sentence, I agree. We don't see hardcore (or survival, depending on the game in question) aspects much in console and AAA gaming because of the rather casual and multiplayer audiences some of these companies aim for, but there are loads of survival games and mods on PC. Fallout took the hardcore route with its survival mode, both in New Vegas and in 4, and like you mention, Red Dead also did. Personally, something like this would be great in GTA. This hardcore mode would make me think twice about committing a senseless crime in public. I would like to discuss one point though:

 

 

 

• Aiming is permanently set to Expert/Free Aim.

In my opinion, I think it's time for GTA to ditch its rather notorious auto-aim system in favor for a more conventional one. I know GTA isn't a full-on shooter, but it plays such a huge aspect on gameplay that it needs to be highly fine-tuned and revamped so that it feels natural to pick up a gun and kill people like we do in third-person shooters... Free Aim unfortunately isn't for everybody, and auto-aim is a concept from the 2000's and possibly the late 90's that just doesn't fit with today's advances in gaming. For GTA VI's multiplayer, having a conventional aim assist system that we can simply toggle on and off prevents segregation of the community, which is exactly what happened with GTA Online and its numerous aiming preferences.

Mgs5 still had auto aim.

[B Dawg]

GTA would greatly benefit from a Hardcore Mode or Difficulty settings (maybe even make it customizable)

 

And yes, get rid of Auto Aim!

[Osho]

Nice ideas. But I don't think R* will ever introduce such a mode knowing their target audience. The number of casual players liking GTA games usually find it appealing for being too much fun in finding the enjoyment from playing GTA without much complications involved nor challenges involved ( exceptions noted ). Its not an annual release but GTA titles take at least 4-5 years to make, and as such, puts the developers in a state in which they'd want to focus on how to cater to the tastes of a larger audience by prioritising more important things than working on introducing a hardcore mode that might only look appealing to a small fraction of the audience, since nowadays, multiplayer has become the popular source for many players who want some challenge to test their skills by playing against humans, rather than the artificial AI which nobody finds appealing ( in GTA ) anyways, and seeing as how Rockstar is pushing for the idea of having a "crew" to be able to play many activities online with a group of people rather than solo, then certainly, Online will attract more players for the challenge they are seeking, and as such, I really don't think GTA Single Player will ever get a separate Hardcore mode.

Games might become a bit challenging in certain ways but expecting a difficulty setting seems very unlikely to happen.

Modding is the only way to tackle that issue.

[kraftwerkd]

To OP, if health is already reduced I don't see why bullet or melee damage needs to be increased. That's just overdoing it. Essentially giving you 1/4 of the default health instead of 1/2.

 

Still waiting on someone to create a mod similar to RDR's Hardcore Mode for GTA V...

Whoa, you're totally right. Good catch, because I obviously didn't think too hard about that one.

 

For GTA V mods, look at SOB's stuff on GTA5-mods.com. He's got a couple mods that for example hide wanted notifications and police chatter, and a realistic concussions injuries and fatigue mod.

Edited May 25, 2016 by kraftwerkd