Why is GTA online so play to win?

[Weedell]

Maybe its supposed to be an inventive to playing PvE jobs, maybe having less health now will help you later -- if you can survive now...

 

This game is a sandbox with a multitude of game types and you can level up your health and every other stat by playing invite only and doing solo missions, races, flight school, etc. Not taking advantage of those is foolish, pretending they don't exist is either ignorant or dishonest.

[Taintedsoul_x]

Answer me this, why would it EVER be fair to have more health than another player, from a gameplay perspective? No ''realistic'' or ''weapons'' or anything else, purely the health. Why would that ever be fair?

You literally just have an advantage. I don't care if you worked for it, you just have an advantage. That makes it unfair.

Because things shouldn't be the same for low levels and high levels?! It's more reason for those low levels to grind and in the end the grind will be worth it. Again, R* shouldn't hand feed the newbs.

[Test Subject #1498]

Maybe its supposed to be an inventive to playing PvE jobs, maybe having less health now will help you later -- if you can survive now...

 

This game is a sandbox with a multitude of game types and you can level up your health and every other stat by playing invite only and doing solo missions, races, flight school, etc. Not taking advantage of those is foolish, pretending they don't exist is either ignorant or dishonest.

Oh so you're saying just cut yourself off from the entire community until you reach level 130?

 

Answer me this, why would it EVER be fair to have more health than another player, from a gameplay perspective? No ''realistic'' or ''weapons'' or anything else, purely the health. Why would that ever be fair?

You literally just have an advantage. I don't care if you worked for it, you just have an advantage. That makes it unfair.

Because things shouldn't be the same for low levels and high levels?! It's more reason for those low levels to grind and in the end the grind will be worth it. Again, R* shouldn't hand feed the newbs.

 

And why should it not be fair? This would mean a combat system focussed on your level and not your skill. Skill would still play a role, but it'd not be 100% of the reason you'd win or lose.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Test Subject #1498

[Taintedsoul_x]

 

Maybe its supposed to be an inventive to playing PvE jobs, maybe having less health now will help you later -- if you can survive now...

 

This game is a sandbox with a multitude of game types and you can level up your health and every other stat by playing invite only and doing solo missions, races, flight school, etc. Not taking advantage of those is foolish, pretending they don't exist is either ignorant or dishonest.

Oh so you're saying just cut yourself off from the entire community until you reach level 130?

 

Dude. This happens in every damn game online.

Get used to it.

[Test Subject #1498]

 

 

Maybe its supposed to be an inventive to playing PvE jobs, maybe having less health now will help you later -- if you can survive now...

 

This game is a sandbox with a multitude of game types and you can level up your health and every other stat by playing invite only and doing solo missions, races, flight school, etc. Not taking advantage of those is foolish, pretending they don't exist is either ignorant or dishonest.

Oh so you're saying just cut yourself off from the entire community until you reach level 130?

 

Dude. This happens in every damn game online.

Get used to it.

 

Uh like what game? I havent seen any in which this is neccesary

[CrazyFerret]

 

 

 

Icant, the problem IS severe enough, as it allows the heavy sniper to be a 1 shot kill on lower levels. Which isnt fair.

 

 

 

Of course its fair.

 

Its an upgraded weapon you acquire from leveling up. Its a 50 Cal BMG.. FFS... not a hunting rifle with a scope. Of course its going to one shot kill... in fact I've 1 shot killed players TWICE my level with it.... AND shot down Lazer's with it!

 

Hows that for a level 1 with a Lazer, against a level 134 with a Heavy Sniper?

 

What if you turn the scenario around? You don't have the instakill weapon as a level 1. You shouldn't have to level up to not die in one shot. This is called play-to-win, and is bad.

 

 

Thats the point of the game... to PLAY, to WIN...

 

I consider it good.

 

Winning, is good.

 

The game you're describing sounds like it would be boring as heck and I wouldn't want to play it.

Edited May 20, 2016 by CrazyFerret

[Test Subject #1498]

Maybe it shouldn't be, Ferret.

If it makes for an unfair experience, from a gameplay perspective it is flawed.

 

It has been 6 pages and yet noone has been able to show me how having more health is fair. Once this reaches its 7th page, Im going to play some games. Had enough discussion today.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Test Subject #1498

[Taintedsoul_x]

Its safe to say OP gotten his ass handed to him multiple times on gtao.

[StangOne50]

Op I think everyone here can see the point you are trying to make but it seems the majority is heavily against it.

To be fair the game has been out nearly 3 years by now.

R released the game for everyone on the same day.

You cant blame the makers for players not starting the game till 2 years later.

 

If you said to R its not fair that noobs have low health, they are gonna say its not our fault he started the game so late and even if we gave him full health and all the weapons a day 1 player will most likely destroy him anyway. So that pretty much voids out your argument answers you're question.

 

You can have a rank 100 with say 25 hours played and a rank 50 with 50-75 hours played. Its going to come down to smarts and experience.

 

If you're talking about very low ranked players like under 20 that may be different but if your not willing to rank yourself over 20 then you have no right to complain.

Edited May 20, 2016 by StangOne50

[CrazyFerret]

Maybe it shouldn't be, Ferret.

If it makes for an unfair experience, from a gameplay perspective it is flawed.

 

It has been 6 pages and yet noone has been able to show me how having more health is fair. Once this reaches its 7th page, Im going to play some games. Had enough discussion today.

 

Again, thats your opinion.

 

How bout you go play your "fair" games now, and leave.

 

I for one do not want this game to be fair, I do not want to start out at full health at level 1.. .I do not want to start out with all the best gear and weapons available at level 1...

 

Thats not considered a "fun game" to me.

 

Every game that I play.. involves starting with a low end character, and building that character up to make it better, get it more health, better gear, etc...

Edited May 20, 2016 by CrazyFerret

[Azirah]

Bet OP would hate to be a noob in Destiny. That game is unfair this game isn't.

Nah, he would hate the Division and the Dark Zone.

 

You think being a level 1 vs a 134 in GTA is bad? Try playing the division & being a level 12, doing a level 30 mission on hard with only veteran and elite enemies while your sh*tty ass gun does nothing to the level 30 enemies bc your DPS is so damn low.

 

THEN YOU CAN TALK ABOUT UNBALANCED. If anything, GTA is very balanced in some aspects.

[Test Subject #1498]

Op I think everyone here can see the point you are trying to make but it seems the majority is heavily against it.

To be fair the game has been out nearly 3 years by now.

R released the game for everyone on the same day.

You cant blame the makers for players not starting the game till 2 years later.

 

If you said to R its not fair that noobs have low health, they are gonna say its not our fault he started the game so late and even if we gave him full health and all the weapons a day 1 player will most likely destroy him anyway. So that pretty much voids out your argument.

 

You can have a rank 100 with say 25 hours played and a rank 50 with 50-75 hours played. Its going to come down to smarts and experience.

 

If you're talking about very low ranked players like under 20 that may be different but if your not willing to rank yourself over 20 then you have no right to complain.

 

Let me adress all of your points here:

1. Rockstar CAN be blamed for people starting later, after having three seperate launches, on last gen, current gen and pc.

2.This voids your second argument about them saying its not their fault they started the game so late.

3. It highly depends on their skill, and the issue is that the skill you have is slightly voided by your lower health.

4.It's going to come down to smarts and experience, yes, but the rank 100 still has a statistical advantage.

[xxviolentbenxx]

I'll say this new players in online have so many good weapons that match the weapons you obtain through leveling up compared to launch when I was a noob, hell I have a under 100 second character and got around the lower health and stats by bettering myself and bettering how I play and take on others in pvp being able to fight well against 200+ level players. Improve yourself or die, the fundamental rule of all pvp games.

[Test Subject #1498]

 

Maybe it shouldn't be, Ferret.

If it makes for an unfair experience, from a gameplay perspective it is flawed.

 

It has been 6 pages and yet noone has been able to show me how having more health is fair. Once this reaches its 7th page, Im going to play some games. Had enough discussion today.

 

Again, thats your opinion.

 

How bout you go play your "fair" games now, and leave.

 

I for one do not want this game to be fair, I do not want to start out at full health at level 1.. .I do not want to start out with all the best gear and weapons available at level 1...

 

Thats not considered a "fun game" to me.

 

Every game that I play.. involves starting with a low end character, and building that character up to make it better, get it more health, better gear, etc...

 

How is it my opinion? IT IS FLAWED, OBJECTIVELY, FROM A GAMEPLAY PERSPECTIVE, TO GIVE ONE PLAYER MORE HEALTH THAN THE OTHER. This is not objective in any way. Ask anyone that knows even a little about game mechanics.

 

 

 

Bet OP would hate to be a noob in Destiny. That game is unfair this game isn't.

Nah, he would hate the Division and the Dark Zone.

 

You think being a level 1 vs a 134 in GTA is bad? Try playing the division & being a level 12, doing a level 30 mission on hard with only veteran and elite enemies while your sh*tty ass gun does nothing to the level 30 enemies bc your DPS is so damn low.

 

THEN YOU CAN TALK ABOUT UNBALANCED. If anything, GTA is very balanced in some aspects.

 

*she

The division isn't a good game imo, mostly because bullet spongy enemies. It actually says a level 30 mission though, you're not supposed to play it yet.

[StangOne50]

You ignore the whole point of experience.

[CrazyFerret]

 

Op I think everyone here can see the point you are trying to make but it seems the majority is heavily against it.

To be fair the game has been out nearly 3 years by now.

R released the game for everyone on the same day.

You cant blame the makers for players not starting the game till 2 years later.

 

If you said to R its not fair that noobs have low health, they are gonna say its not our fault he started the game so late and even if we gave him full health and all the weapons a day 1 player will most likely destroy him anyway. So that pretty much voids out your argument.

 

You can have a rank 100 with say 25 hours played and a rank 50 with 50-75 hours played. Its going to come down to smarts and experience.

 

If you're talking about very low ranked players like under 20 that may be different but if your not willing to rank yourself over 20 then you have no right to complain.

 

Let me adress all of your points here:

1. Rockstar CAN be blamed for people starting later, after having three seperate launches, on last gen, current gen and pc.

 

 

 

 

So its Rockstars fault now, that technology advances and improves?

 

Its Rockstars fault now, that last gen is made obsolete by these technological improvements, and its Rockstars fault for wanting to keep a popular game running and available on newer and more technologically advanced hardware?

 

Yea great logic there. I think we know one of the key aspects of OP's problem here, they're an Old Gen player.

[Test Subject #1498]

I'll say this new players in online have so many good weapons that match the weapons you obtain through leveling up compared to launch when I was a noob, hell I have a under 100 second character and got around the lower health and stats by bettering myself and bettering how I play and take on others in pvp being able to fight well against 200+ level players. Improve yourself or die, the fundamental rule of all pvp games.

But the pvp is flawed because of the health difference. Sure you can take down 200+ level players, but that's because your skill level is above theirs by a bit more than would be neccesary if you were their level. You see what i mean?

 

Ferret, I used to be old gen but have been on the PC for quite a while right now. And no, it isn't their fault that technology improves, it IS their fault that they didn't launch pc until 2 years or so after the initial launch.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Test Subject #1498

[CrazyFerret]

 

 

Maybe it shouldn't be, Ferret.

If it makes for an unfair experience, from a gameplay perspective it is flawed.

 

It has been 6 pages and yet noone has been able to show me how having more health is fair. Once this reaches its 7th page, Im going to play some games. Had enough discussion today.

 

Again, thats your opinion.

 

How bout you go play your "fair" games now, and leave.

 

I for one do not want this game to be fair, I do not want to start out at full health at level 1.. .I do not want to start out with all the best gear and weapons available at level 1...

 

Thats not considered a "fun game" to me.

 

Every game that I play.. involves starting with a low end character, and building that character up to make it better, get it more health, better gear, etc...

 

How is it my opinion? IT IS FLAWED, OBJECTIVELY, FROM A GAMEPLAY PERSPECTIVE, TO GIVE ONE PLAYER MORE HEALTH THAN THE OTHER. This is not objective in any way. Ask anyone that knows even a little about game mechanics.

 

 

Your "opinion" is that the game is flawed.

 

I happen to disagree with that opinion. I do not think the game is flawed, I think it performs precisely how it is designed to perform.

 

Lastly, again... please explain to me WHY... at level 1... I would want equal health to a level 134? Frankly in MY opinion, that is flawed and unfair.

 

You still haven't explained this, after 6 pages...

[Azirah]

Sorry then ma'am - she*. They're not bullet sponges if your DPS is at least over 100k and you aim for the head. No, the game says 'recommend level xx'

 

But seriously, even GTA is more balanced than the division and you know it.

 

This game isn't about taking people out in FR, it's about having fun and ranking up or whatever. We were all once low levels and we all had to grind to get to where we're at now. As I said, the game is balanced for low levels now. Better weapons to start with, you can do VIP work at rank 5??? You can have a high level friend help you - the possibilities are endless tbh.

[Test Subject #1498]

I have explained it several times. It is purely unfair. You are going off topic again. I asked from a gameplay perspective, you're adding story into the mix again.

 

The reason it is flawed not to have equal health is because it gives an advantage to one player over the other, disregarding player skill. If you were to put two clones against each other, one with a level 130 character and one with a level 1 character (They did not raise that character themselves), the level 130 would win.

 

Two people with the same amount of skill, the one that wins is going to be the highest level.

 

This is why it's flawed from a gameplay perspective.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Test Subject #1498

[Private Custard]

I started a second character recently. I ended up being a level 6, with only basic weapons, absolutely wrecking lobbies.

 

To put it bluntly, OP......maybe you're just crap!

[xxviolentbenxx]

 

I'll say this new players in online have so many good weapons that match the weapons you obtain through leveling up compared to launch when I was a noob, hell I have a under 100 second character and got around the lower health and stats by bettering myself and bettering how I play and take on others in pvp being able to fight well against 200+ level players. Improve yourself or die, the fundamental rule of all pvp games.

But the pvp is flawed because of the health difference. Sure you can take down 200+ level players, but that's because your skill level is above theirs by a bit more than would be neccesary if you were their level. You see what i mean?

 

I don't see more health for being a higher level as a problem tbh, if you have the skill it negates the extra health when you instantly kill a max health person in one well placed shot.

 

I don't see it as a big problem, you level up get more health to last longer, being rewarded for playing the game and bettering yourself.

Edited May 20, 2016 by xxviolentbenxx

[carnerd3000]

 

 

 

Maybe it shouldn't be, Ferret.

If it makes for an unfair experience, from a gameplay perspective it is flawed.

 

It has been 6 pages and yet noone has been able to show me how having more health is fair. Once this reaches its 7th page, Im going to play some games. Had enough discussion today.

 

Again, thats your opinion.

 

How bout you go play your "fair" games now, and leave.

 

I for one do not want this game to be fair, I do not want to start out at full health at level 1.. .I do not want to start out with all the best gear and weapons available at level 1...

 

Thats not considered a "fun game" to me.

 

Every game that I play.. involves starting with a low end character, and building that character up to make it better, get it more health, better gear, etc...

 

How is it my opinion? IT IS FLAWED, OBJECTIVELY, FROM A GAMEPLAY PERSPECTIVE, TO GIVE ONE PLAYER MORE HEALTH THAN THE OTHER. This is not objective in any way. Ask anyone that knows even a little about game mechanics.

 

 

Your "opinion" is that the game is flawed.

 

I happen to disagree with that opinion. I do not think the game is flawed, I think it performs precisely how it is designed to perform.

 

Lastly, again... please explain to me WHY... at level 1... I would want equal health to a level 134? Frankly in MY opinion, that is flawed and unfair.

 

You still haven't explained this, after 6 pages...

 

 

^This. I'm sorry OP, but your opinion literally does not make any sense at all. That's how games are supposed to work: you start from the bottom and work your way up to earn better stuff.

[CrazyFerret]

 

Ferret, I used to be old gen but have been on the PC for quite a while right now. And no, it isn't their fault that technology improves, it IS their fault that they didn't launch pc until 2 years or so after the initial launch.

 

 

You realize you just contradicted yourself right?

 

How can they release the game sooner, if they do not account for the technological advances, and redesign the game for them?

 

How can they take a game designed for a game system that is 10 years out of date; and release it to a newer and more state of the art system like the PC?

 

It takes time to test the hardware, ya know.... or, did you expect them to test every single stick of RAM, from every single Ram manufacturer... every model ram stick... test it with every model of video card from every video card manufacturer... test that with every cpu model, from every cpu manufacturer... and test all this and release it all in a weeks time?

 

I for one am pleased that they took two years to test the game on all this hardware.... and I am more so pleased that they took the time, to optimize it for better performance on an SSD as opposed to those outdated and obsolete hard drives..

[Elektra]

How is it fair simple we ALL started at level 1 with the same health *drops mic*

 

You want better health you have to work for it *he's probably just garbage at the game

 

Also you don't have to fight anyone you don't want to #passive mode

Edited May 20, 2016 by Elektra

[Taintedsoul_x]

And honestly it's fun to play and level up in this game unlike The division.

[Test Subject #1498]

 

 

Ferret, I used to be old gen but have been on the PC for quite a while right now. And no, it isn't their fault that technology improves, it IS their fault that they didn't launch pc until 2 years or so after the initial launch.

 

 

You realize you just contradicted yourself right?

 

How can they release the game sooner, if they do not account for the technological advances, and redesign the game for them?

 

How can they take a game designed for a game system that is 10 years out of date; and release it to a newer and more state of the art system like the PC?

 

It takes time to test the hardware, ya know.... or, did you expect them to test every single stick of RAM, from every single Ram manufacturer... every model ram stick... test it with every model of video card from every video card manufacturer... test that with every cpu model, from every cpu manufacturer... and test all this and release it all in a weeks time?

 

I for one am pleased that they took two years to test the game on all this hardware.... and I am more so pleased that they took the time, to optimize it for better performance on an SSD as opposed to those outdated and obsolete hard drives..

 

They could have just waited with the last-gen release as well, and just released it simultaneously. They rushed it to console to avoid the costs of testing for PC and porting it to PC because they weren't sure it was going to make enough money. But that doesn't mean that they aren't held accountable for how some people couldn't play until the PC release.

[CrazyFerret]

The reason it is flawed not to have equal health is because it gives an advantage to one player over the other, disregarding player skill. If you were to put two clones against each other, one with a level 130 character and one with a level 1 character (They did not raise that character themselves), the level 130 would win.

 

You're not taking into account that the level 1 player has access to all types of "advantages" such as the Lazer and Buzzard, which allows them to insta kill that level 130...

[Azirah]

I'm adding a 'story' into the mix because I'm merely explaining how you believe that GTA is unbalanced due to lower levels not being able to take on higher levels when it in fact is possible. So no, it's not off topic at all.

 

Your logic in all 6 pages have been flawed.

[CrazyFerret]

Nothing to say, just bumping this thread closer to the seventh page. We need some fresh air, don't we?

 

 

What an excellent idea! I'm quoting you just to bump us closer to the seventh page!