GingerIceCube Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I thought so. I loved reading that by the way, your a very talented writer. are you thinking about updating it. Aw! Thank you so much. I'm blushing my ass off. >/////< I'm definitely going to continue with my Trikey stuff, particularly my manifesto, but I've had a bit of a writer's block lately. >_< I think it's starting to go, though. Hopefully I should be back on track really soon. Thank you again for your support. This made my day. ^^ Homicidal Hipster 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homicidal Hipster Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I thought so. I loved reading that by the way, your a very talented writer. are you thinking about updating it. Aw! Thank you so much. I'm blushing my ass off. >/////< I'm definitely going to continue with my Trikey stuff, particularly my manifesto, but I've had a bit of a writer's block lately. >_< I think it's starting to go, though. Hopefully I should be back on track really soon. Thank you again for your support. This made my day. ^^ your very welcome I'm really looking forward to reading the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicktestbranch Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 @GingerIceCube, very well written and intelligent response to this thread. I rarely ever see that on the forums and I'm glad someone finally analyzed something of what it was, and while giving their opinion, didn't resort to unnecessary vulgarities or "cockstar". Also, props on the recognition of the confusing English pronoun of "he" when Trevor has that bit of dialogue about "Little Trevor and Brad". It's confusing, but I think it could be up to interpretation. I honestly don't feel sorry for Brad. He did seem like a piece of sh*t, although I think his agonizing death was still not enough. I would have loved to see his character reunite in LS, with Trevor and Michael finally deciding that they're done with him. I guess the dramatic mission "Bury the Hatchet", one of my favorite turning points of the game, would not have happened without Brad dying. Unless of course someone took the idea of having a fake corpse in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp1dell Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) The drive to Los Santos isn't the only time Trevor brings that up. If I remember correctly, Trevor will tell this to Franklin when they're hanging out. Brad didn't like Michael, and wanted to have him killed so he could run their crew. Brad told this to Trevor thinking he felt the same way. Trevor admits at one point post-ending C that he didn't like the fact that Brad wanted to kill Michael, and that he was probably going to kill him (Brad), himself sooner or later. Also, if you're lost on where OP is coming from - there have always been people on this board who hate Michael with a passion, and loved to spout "snitches get stitches" and other nonsense, arguing that Michael is the worst since he screwed over his friends. Obviously the more sensible people are able to have some empathy, and see why Michael did what he did. But I haven't seen any of those people/posts in a while. And I can see where Rockstar was coming from with the "switching between Michael and Trevor's POV of the situation" thing. Of course, I always sympathized with Michael and his decision to get out. But this is the thing that Dan Houser mentioned in an interview a while back, where you would "play as the antagonist" and the roles would get "swapped around until you don't really know who is the bad guy." I'm not going to bother describing Michael's side of things since everyone here seems to already know and agree with that. With Trevor's side of things, you have a guy who was screwed over by his best friend. Though at first he didn't even know he was set up, he believed Michael was killed and that sent him even more over the edge. He was on the run for ten years, and had no access to any of his funds because of Michael's stunt. I mean you have to feel bad for him a little bit. He wasn't trying to directly harm Michael, he just wanted to continue living that kind of life that they were used to, and Michael didn't. Then you have parts of the game where Michael seems extra shady, especially when talking to Franklin and refusing to tell him the whole story of what happened. Of course what Michael did was sort of justified, but he did screw over Trevor pretty bad. With the whole North Yankton thing, Trevor and Brad were sort of put on the same level, hell you could say Trevor was below Brad considering Michael wanted Trevor killed - not Brad. Even though it's obvious which one was less of a threat to Michael. Ugh, and Trevor caring about Michael's family isn't "bullsh*t." The only person Trevor didn't like was Amanda. Fame or Shame, conversations in the game, phone calls etc. emphasize how much Trevor likes Jimmy and Tracey. Edited June 8, 2015 by cp1dell nicktestbranch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicktestbranch Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 The only person Trevor didn't like was Amanda. He liked her nice new pair of tits, by the way. Anda7x 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDH92 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Trevor was a physcopath throughout the game. When Michael murdered it was justified in terms of the GTA world. The easiest and most logical option if you follow the games narrative is to kill Trevor. Killing Michael is the choice of a physcopath, it's not Michael who goes around killing random people, Michael's got a family, choosing to kill him demonstrates a lack of empathy. MrDeSanta and LeonarXL 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp1dell Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Trevor was a physcopath throughout the game. When Michael murdered it was justified in terms of the GTA world. The easiest and most logical option if you follow the games narrative is to kill Trevor. Killing Michael is the choice of a physcopath, it's not Michael who goes around killing random people, Michael's got a family, choosing to kill him demonstrates a lack of empathy. I find it very odd how many people hated working for the FIB for a large majority of the game, but when it comes to the end-game choice, people love siding with Steve Haines and kill Trevor. Same goes for the people that killed Michael. I guess their hatred for a protagonist surpasses their hatred for the actual antagonists. And if you want to talk about "following the narrative of the story" and you somehow end up with Option A, what about the fact that Franklin declines both Option A and B when presented with them? Yet for whatever reason the player is still given the choice to kill Trevor or Michael. A.O.D.88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRaijin Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Don't forget that Michael was so eager to kill Trevor to the point where he aided Franklin into crashing into his vehicle. Michael is more of a piece of sh*t than Trevor and Brad put together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fac316 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 The way I see it, Mikes a snake, he says he did it for his family, bullsheet. He did it for himself. Selfish to the end. Slam_Jones and LordRaijin 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRaijin Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Yes because murdering Floyd and manupilating Wade is real loyalty... His loyalty is limited to Michael and anyone who he perceives as valuable to him that he can't manupilate and even then he has a really odd way of showing it continually doing things that he KNOWS will displease Michael. If someone continually puts you in an awkward position one could interpret that as being disloyal. I'm not going to say Michaels a good guy, he's not supposed to be, he's meant to come across as a snake but because Trevor continually does things that put Michael in an awkward position both before and after Michaels feigned death, it makes Michaels response look rational and it's not supposed to look rational. Trevor killed Floyd and Debra because they were about to kill him. It was self defense. Go back and watch the clip again. If a couple of people did that kind of sh*t to me they be dead too. Edited June 8, 2015 by LordRaijin A.O.D.88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDeSanta Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Yes because murdering Floyd and manupilating Wade is real loyalty... His loyalty is limited to Michael and anyone who he perceives as valuable to him that he can't manupilate and even then he has a really odd way of showing it continually doing things that he KNOWS will displease Michael. If someone continually puts you in an awkward position one could interpret that as being disloyal. I'm not going to say Michaels a good guy, he's not supposed to be, he's meant to come across as a snake but because Trevor continually does things that put Michael in an awkward position both before and after Michaels feigned death, it makes Michaels response look rational and it's not supposed to look rational. Trevor killed Floyd and Debra because they were about to kill him. It was self defense. Go back and watch the clip again. If a couple of people did that kind of sh*t to me they be dead too. Was molesting Floyd, abusing him, threatening him, trashing his home and ruining his life also a self defense? Or what about abusing Ron all the time? Was that also a self defense? Trevor enjoyed molesting weak people and i`m having a really hard time to understand how is he loyal? I guess that abusing and bullying people whom you consider as friends is loyalty to some of you. And interesting part is how Trevor perfectly knew who he can afford to bully and who not. Like how come he never bullied Michael, Franklin, Devin Weston, Steve Haines or Davey? Because he knew they`d kick the sh*t out of him. Beneath all that crazy hard look Trevor was basically just a coward, he was nothing more than Weston`s and FIB`s bitch at the end. As for endings i always pick C ending because it`s the only ending that makes at least a bit of sense. Even tho i hate Trevor i still don`t want to choose killing him because in that case all of the scumbags (Weston, Haines, Stretch and Cheng) go away unpunished. That`s a great logic Rockstar. As for killing Michael, that ending doesn`t have any sense at all. And not just because i like Michael and he`s one of my best protagonists but because it would never happened in real life. Just why exactly would Franklin kill his good friend turned out father-like figure who made him more money with one score that he did in his whole repo career? Because Weston told him to? Really? A guy who could be considered as Franklin`s biggest enemy because he scammed him on those cars, Franklin would kill Michael just because a scum like Weston told him to? And as if this whole plot wouldn`t be stupid and ilogicall enough there`s even more. Devin Weston owns a big share of Merryweather and somehow he can`t get a soldier to kill Mike for him and he needs Frank to do it instead? I mean this is such a load of crap and plot holes i could write a novel about this. Not to mention that in A and B endings those loose ends aren`t important anymore. Like Stretch and Cheng somehow aren`t a threat to Frank and Trevor anymore if Frank chooses A or B. A huge f*cking mess. So C ending always wins in my case. It`s still far from being a good ending but it sure has alot more sense than A or B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dedito Gae Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 ...was nothing more than Weston`s and FIB`s bitch at the end.you are talking about Michael in here, he's the lapdog of the FIB, that's why Trevor is not present in the bureau raid, he could walk away when he wanted. hell, he even saves Michael from that Merryweather chopper, but , you know, keep making sh*t up. it's really working LordRaijin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicktestbranch Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Just why exactly would Franklin kill his good friend turned out father-like figure who made him more money with one score that he did in his whole repo career? It's basically a callback to Michael siding with the FIB after setting up a failed heist at North Yankton to get Trevor and Brad either busted or killed so he could live safe. Franklin could have done the same with Trevor, but Trevor had nothing on Franklin anyway. With Michael, who can really trust the guy? Despite him aiding Franklin all along with the big scores they pulled, think about setting up one more score to try ridding Trevor and Franklin again so Michael would have no connection with them and enjoy his life as a movie producer. Yeah, not a happy plot either, but even though Michael wasn't a psychotic molester, there was little loyalty and strength in him. It would be interested to see what would have happened if the NY score was not a bust, and it worked out as usual. Brad was almost a mix of Trevor and Michael, to where he was a disloyal and psychotic sh*thead. Eventually, I think Trevor would have cracked on him and let Michael be free, thus not setting up any of the drama in GTA V. Also Franklin would keep his job at Simeon's place, living the boring life like usual. Lamar would eventually get killed by the Ballas at some point. and Franklin would live with his annoying aunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cutter De Blanc Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Trevor killed Debra after Debra killed Floyd. It's in the news. A.O.D.88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NDH92 Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I find the way the story is presented most of the time, that the most logical option is in choosing to kill Trevor. However this makes no sense because it's detrimental to the overall game. Therefore I think Option C is the best option, as it addreses all the issues the three characters had. Personally I don't see the point of options A or B. Being able to switch to characters is a key element of the game, it's unlogical you'd kill one of them. Bring back the default endings!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp1dell Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) The way I see it, Mikes a snake, he says he did it for his family, bullsheet. He did it for himself. Selfish to the end. I don't understand how you can just claim he didn't do it for his family - when there's nothing that indicates that. Have you ever played Bury the Hatchet as Michael, and listened to the flashback on the way to the graveyard? Or any of the hangout conversations Michael has with Franklin? There is nothing whatsoever that suggests that Michael did it for himself and not his family, hell that makes absolutely no sense. Like his therapist even says, he's addicted to chaos. Michael himself says the only way he's content and competent, is with a gun in his hand or a price on his head. After pulling down Madrazo's mistress' house down, Michael easily slips back into the criminal lifestyle he tried to leave behind, and as the story goes on he embraces it more and more. Michael met Dave at a bar. Lester told Michael's crew not to do that North Yankton bank job. Michael could have avoided that whole situation and continued making money if he wanted to. But no, like he says, he had a family and he didn't want to continue hanging around with Trevor and Brad, and possibly put his wife and kids in danger. I'll say it again, there is nothing that suggests he didn't do it for his family. The game clearly states that is why he did it. The only reason some of you have a hard time accepting this, is so you can further justify your resentment towards Michael. @NDH92 Hell, they could continue doing multiple endings if they wanted to. IV did it right, V did it wrong. At least with IV, both endings were very similar - there were just a couple characters swapped around for some events. Other than that, you got the same missions and gameplay, just a slightly different outcome for the story. Plus, each choice had their pros and cons and a reason to choose either one. With V, you have two drastically different endings which are completely anti-climatic, and leave multiple loose ends open. There's only one ending that actually brings the story to a close, and is your typical GTA finale. A and B are such basic and short missions, that they don't even deserve to be a final mission from a gameplay point of view. Edited June 8, 2015 by cp1dell Dangerous and sad, MrDeSanta and nicktestbranch 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDeSanta Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 ...was nothing more than Weston`s and FIB`s bitch at the end. you are talking about Michael in here, he's the lapdog of the FIB, that's why Trevor is not present in the bureau raid, he could walk away when he wanted. hell, he even saves Michael from that Merryweather chopper, but , you know, keep making sh*t up. it's really working You really are buthurt aren`t you? Just how childish one must be to get so emotional because someone insulted their fav video game character. You`re acting like i talked sh*t to your wife or mother. Just think about it. You just prey on my posts like a fly over sh*t. Get a life. And most of all, get over it. You like Trevor, i hate him. Period. You wanna cry about it 24/7 or what? You can say whatever you like about my fav character- Michael and i won`t get all hurt because of it it. Because i know they`re just a video game characters, because 100 people have 100 different tastes and because i`ve got bigger problems in my real life than someone`s insulting my fav GTA protagonist. Just knock it off already because you`re acting totally immature. There`s at least 1/3 of the people on this forum who dislike Trevor, but no you`re only coming at my posts. Why? Are you obsessed with me or something? Just give up already because none of what i`ve said earlier about Trevor is a fact but just my personal opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dedito Gae Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 could you start replying like a f*cking adult? sorry, i guesss that's not a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRaijin Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Yes because murdering Floyd and manupilating Wade is real loyalty... His loyalty is limited to Michael and anyone who he perceives as valuable to him that he can't manupilate and even then he has a really odd way of showing it continually doing things that he KNOWS will displease Michael. If someone continually puts you in an awkward position one could interpret that as being disloyal. I'm not going to say Michaels a good guy, he's not supposed to be, he's meant to come across as a snake but because Trevor continually does things that put Michael in an awkward position both before and after Michaels feigned death, it makes Michaels response look rational and it's not supposed to look rational. Trevor killed Floyd and Debra because they were about to kill him. It was self defense. Go back and watch the clip again. If a couple of people did that kind of sh*t to me they be dead too. Was molesting Floyd, abusing him, threatening him, trashing his home and ruining his life also a self defense? Or what about abusing Ron all the time? Was that also a self defense? Trevor enjoyed molesting weak people and i`m having a really hard time to understand how is he loyal? I guess that abusing and bullying people whom you consider as friends is loyalty to some of you. And interesting part is how Trevor perfectly knew who he can afford to bully and who not. Like how come he never bullied Michael, Franklin, Devin Weston, Steve Haines or Davey? Because he knew they`d kick the sh*t out of him. Beneath all that crazy hard look Michael was basically just a coward, he was nothing more than Weston`s and FIB`s bitch at the end.(Fixed) As for endings i always pick C ending because it`s the only ending that makes at least a bit of sense. Even tho i hate Trevor i still don`t want to choose killing him because in that case all of the scumbags (Weston, Haines, Stretch and Cheng) go away unpunished. That`s a great logic Rockstar. As for killing Michael, that ending doesn`t have any sense at all. And not just because i like Michael and he`s one of my best protagonists but because it would never happened in real life. Just why exactly would Franklin kill his good friend turned out father-like figure who made him more money with one score that he did in his whole repo career? Because Weston told him to? Really? A guy who could be considered as Franklin`s biggest enemy because he scammed him on those cars, Franklin would kill Michael just because a scum like Weston told him to? And as if this whole plot wouldn`t be stupid and ilogicall enough there`s even more. Devin Weston owns a big share of Merryweather and somehow he can`t get a soldier to kill Mike for him and he needs Frank to do it instead? I mean this is such a load of crap and plot holes i could write a novel about this. Not to mention that in A and B endings those loose ends aren`t important anymore. Like Stretch and Cheng somehow aren`t a threat to Frank and Trevor anymore if Frank chooses A or B. A huge f*cking mess. So C ending always wins in my case. It`s still far from being a good ending but it sure has alot more sense than A or B. Can you provide evidence of this molestation allegations? The only thing I heard Floyd complaining was about was how Trevor violated Mr. Rapsberry Jam.... so yeah he technically raped a stuffed teddy bear. Prior to Trevor entering Floyds life... Floyds life was already in ruined. Busting his ass all day for minimum wages, and getting married to that cheating bitch. Trevor did right by trashing Debra's (Not Floyds) house. Hell even Wade thinks that Debra is a terrible person, and ask why Floyd puts up with her. Other than that one particular incident where Franklin laughed at Trevor when he fell to the ground in front of his Aunts house... What reason must Trevor bully Franklin? These two have a good friendship going. Do you know just how suicidal it would be for Trevor to do anything to Dave Norton and Steve Haines? While they're corrupted they're still Agents for the FIB.... Government workers. He might be a Meth eating gas inhaling fool, but he does have some common sense. He knows his limitations. Michael was Trevors closest friend. What reason does he need to bully him for? Despite him being a snake and a backstabber. Edited June 8, 2015 by LordRaijin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peachrocks Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Yes because murdering Floyd and manupilating Wade is real loyalty... His loyalty is limited to Michael and anyone who he perceives as valuable to him that he can't manupilate and even then he has a really odd way of showing it continually doing things that he KNOWS will displease Michael. If someone continually puts you in an awkward position one could interpret that as being disloyal. I'm not going to say Michaels a good guy, he's not supposed to be, he's meant to come across as a snake but because Trevor continually does things that put Michael in an awkward position both before and after Michaels feigned death, it makes Michaels response look rational and it's not supposed to look rational. Trevor killed Floyd and Debra because they were about to kill him. It was self defense. Go back and watch the clip again. If a couple of people did that kind of sh*t to me they be dead too. I hope you enjoy that real life wanted level then for invading somebody else's home and murdering them which doesn't go away when you are out of the cops sight for a few seconds... Trevor was invading someone else's home without their approval. Floyd certainly doesn't excuse Trevor's actions in this and he's too terrified to go against either Trevor or Debra so has no say in the matter either way. Debra is quite understandably pissed off about this. Also self defence? Please. We are meant to believe that a 'rampaging' (wannabe) bad ass like Trevor was under serious threat from Floyd? Who mind you I'm pretty sure is more willing to attack Debra than Trevor based on the fact she makes it very clear she's been cheating on him. Debra, I don't give a damn, she was an ass however Floyd could have betrayed Trevor numerous times and had every reason to but he never does. Either way it might mean nothing... Trevor killed Debra after Debra killed Floyd. It's in the news. Really now? I need to look into this, know where I can dig it up on the news or does it expire? All this time I've said Trevor killed Floyd. Still, how the hell would anyone really know what happened even if Floyd died of a gunshot wound. All the same though, it does at least cast some doubt on that situation which makes Trevor for once seem less of a douche. if that's how it went down why did Trevor lie to Wade? All the while telling us the story of how he manipulating him in the past putting his douche meter beyond 10,000 if at the time you believed he murdered Floyd because that's how it damn looks like. I find the way the story is presented most of the time, that the most logical option is in choosing to kill Trevor. However this makes no sense because it's detrimental to the overall game. Therefore I think Option C is the best option, as it addreses all the issues the three characters had. Personally I don't see the point of options A or B. Being able to switch to characters is a key element of the game, it's unlogical you'd kill one of them. Bring back the default endings!!! The problem is not in killing one of the characters but the timing. The only time where it's possible to kill Trevor is the ONLY time in the plot where it makes absolutely no sense to do so. For example, Dave and Michael are talking about how much of a problem Trevor is when he comes back and 'ooo what if he finds out about Brad?'. I dunno, maybe kill him? Maybe arrange a heist like the blitz play and have it set up so Trevor is horribly outnumbered and dies, he isn't as super human as the game makes out because he can be killed in ending A obviously and that was just Franklin and Michael and stupidly in that ending he wasn't even ambushed Franklin dropped a big "im gunna kill you" sign to Trevor. When Trevor kidnaps Patricia and attacks Martin Madrazo and Michael is exiled from LS, you want to give Martin a peace offering? How about Trevor's head then tell Martin the truth and return Patricia to him. Trevor did this without Michael knowing about it and went behind his back. Killing him then resolves that plot problem instantly. There's other times too but those are the most notable ones. You could say Michael's connection or whatever to Trevor is why he didn't die in the prologue, or any of those above examples but then why agree to help Franklin kill him. Above all else killing Trevor achieves nothing at all. There's nothing stopping Haines continuing to use Michael and Franklin as puppets because I strongly doubt a manipulator like Haines had all his chips in one place and Devin Weston will still want Michael dead no matter what. Ending C doesn't resolve things either mostly in that the problems they have don't just go away from murdering a few people, certainly not with the IAA knowing damn well about Michael and what's he done by the end of the plot but it does at least resolve it more than A or B does. Edited June 8, 2015 by Peachrocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRaijin Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Because Michael is a snake. He betrays his best friend and is all calm and not caring when his crew dies, even willing to leave Franklin in the Bureau Raid. He has no sense of loyalty Trevor actually has loyalty, he refuses to kill Michael when Franklin asks him to. Trevor's the most loyal of the trio. Yes because murdering Floyd and manupilating Wade is real loyalty... His loyalty is limited to Michael and anyone who he perceives as valuable to him that he can't manupilate and even then he has a really odd way of showing it continually doing things that he KNOWS will displease Michael. If someone continually puts you in an awkward position one could interpret that as being disloyal. I'm not going to say Michaels a good guy, he's not supposed to be, he's meant to come across as a snake but because Trevor continually does things that put Michael in an awkward position both before and after Michaels feigned death, it makes Michaels response look rational and it's not supposed to look rational. Trevor killed Floyd and Debra because they were about to kill him. It was self defense. Go back and watch the clip again. If a couple of people did that kind of sh*t to me they be dead too. I hope you enjoy that real life wanted level then for invading somebody else's home and murdering them which doesn't go away when you are out of the cops sight for a few seconds... Trevor was invading someone else's home without their approval. Floyd certainly doesn't excuse Trevor's actions in this and he's too terrified to go against either Trevor or Debra so has no say in the matter either way. Debra is quite understandably pissed off about this. Also self defence? Please. We are meant to believe that a 'rampaging' (wannabe) bad ass like Trevor was under serious threat from Floyd? Who mind you I'm pretty sure is more willing to attack Debra than Trevor based on the fact she makes it very clear she's been cheating on him. Debra, I don't give a damn, she was an ass however Floyd could have betrayed Trevor numerous times and had every reason to but he never does. Either way it might mean nothing... At no time did Floyd nor Debra ever called the police to get Trevor and Wade out of their home. They had the power to do it yet they did not so I call bullsh*t on that part. Using the terrified card is utterly ridiculous. And yes. It was self defense. Floyd armed himself with a weapon that could be use to kill someone, and so did Debra by pointing a loaded gun straight at Trevor. While I would gain the attention by the police for killing two people that was threatening me with imminent death.... after a full investigation, and possible trial I would most likely be found not guilty. I would be fully protected by the Florida Statutes JUSTIFIABLE USE OF FORCE act. http://www.leg.state.fl.us/STATUTES/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.012.html (2) A person is justified in using or threatening to use deadly force if he or she reasonably believes that using or threatening to use such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony. A person who uses or threatens to use deadly force in accordance with this subsection does not have a duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground if the person using or threatening to use the deadly force is not engaged in a criminal activity and is in a place where he or she has a right to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuke. Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Michael Klebitz > Michael De Santa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarnageRacing00 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 When Michael betrayed them. If he wouldn`t do this then Trevor and Brad would do the same and worse to him and his family as evidenced by the dialogue between Trevor and Wayde. "Trevor: So little Trevor made a new friend called Brad, and he was thinking about cutting Mike off, when it all went to sh*t and Mike got killed and Brad went to jail!" I think Mike did the right thing and he didn`t do it so much for himself but for his family. He was in fear for his young family and he knew Trevor can freak out any moment. And i hate how the story is always portraying Michael as the bad backstabber while Trevor is just a poor naive soul who is "loyal" and a good friend. Bullsh*t! It`s totally reverse in my opinion. Your thoughts on this? Michael DID do the right thing. Examine the evidence: 1. Trevor is a cannibal 2. Trevor is a rapist 3. Trevor is unpredictable 4. Trevor is so bad that the FIB made a deal with a career multi-million dollar criminal (Michael) to STOP Trevor Michael has a family, wanted one last score before retiring forever AND to put and end to the monster that is Trevor. A little back story would be nice, but I have to imagine it goes something like this: Michael was a good thief, doing his thing on his own, then he met Trevor one day and couldn't get away from him. How COULD you escape Trevor? Look what he did to Johnny, after all... Michael was bound to end up the same way because of how psychotic Trevor is. So, he decides to hang up his life of crime and retire gracefully in exchange for stopping Trevor, whom is apparently such a threat that even the FIB wants him dead bad enough to warrant letting a murderous thief like Michael get away free and clear. Michael did the right thing... but in the back of his mind, he knows Trevor is also the only person who has ever shown Michael an ounce of real respect, or love, so part of him doesn't want him dead, either. The story is actually pretty good if you read beyond all the bullsh*t. nicktestbranch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Real_Badgirl Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I'm not going to participate in the argument being formed here, instead I'll repeat something I've probably said ten times by now. I don't like Trevor, and there are many reasons why. His 'LOLOL craaaaazy Trevor the unkillable super badass' persona that the game shoves down our throats all the time is one. The fact that he always shouts instead of using a normal speaking voice is another. Then of course there's the way he feels he has to kill or at least severely injure anyone who so much as asks if he's Canadian. Oh, and we can't forget his impulsive foolishness, strongly implied cannibalism and the creepy way he lusts over and ogles people like an untamed animal. However, the thing about Trevor that really irks me is the way he constantly bullies and harasses people who are afraid to stand up for themselves. I really like Ron. In fact, he might even be my favorite GTA V character. He's supposed to be Trevor's friend and co CEO of TPI, yet Trevor never has anything nice to say to him. Just "SHUT UP RON YOUR MOTHER SHOULD HAVE ABORTED YOU!" or "I know you nearly got killed back there, but I'm taking 100% of your cut because you aren't worthy of licking the ass of the sweat shop worker who made my Impotent Rage statue. That toy meant more to me than you ever will." If we get post ending C story mode DLC, I really, really want there to be a moment where Ron finally stands up to Trevor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp1dell Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Oh would you look at that, this conversation has devolved into how bad of a person Trevor is because he murdered a couple of innocent characters in the game, and was trespassing in their house at the time. In the newest installment of Grand Theft Auto. Wouldn't be the GTAForums unless someone was sitting on their moral high-horse and getting all bent out of shape because a character was a scumbag in GTA. Good thing one of the characters never f*cked a hooker and killed her after to get their money back, in a cutscene, establishing that as a canon event. I can't imagine how flustered some of you would be. Time to get out of this thread. No point in arguing with a wall. I'll admit Trevor is nothing like we've ever seen in GTA, but god damn. Some of you have your heads too far up your asses and can't see how ridiculous you look when you complain about stuff like this. Makes me think of Lester's line in the first assassination mission: "That's why the world is the way it is today, when a paid thug gets all namby pamby when someone asks him to act like a paid thug." Edited June 9, 2015 by cp1dell BurnettVice, Homicidal Hipster, The Dedito Gae and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
viperdk Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) I sure as hell don't feel bad for Brad. As stated, he was an asshole, and was planning on taking out Michael (which Trevor knew would happen one day). Michael did what he had to do. IMO I think Brad got what he deserved. I have no doubt what happened was the original plan, Brad killed, Michael put in protection, and Trevor was suppose to be arrested. They couldn't have predicted his escape. Trevor was pissed, but post Option C when he's hanging with Michael, they talk about what happened and pretty much bury the hatchet. I think Trevor realized why Michael did what he had to do. That's why I don't understand the hate for Michael...and those saying he screwed over everyone he's ever worked with, is bullsh*t. He helped pull off the biggest heist of their lives, and helped both Trevor and Franklin deal with their loose ends. Michael patched things up with his buddy Trevor, and he made a new friend in Franklin, and gave him a better life outside of living in the hood. Edited June 9, 2015 by viperdk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRaijin Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) When Michael betrayed them. If he wouldn`t do this then Trevor and Brad would do the same and worse to him and his family as evidenced by the dialogue between Trevor and Wayde. "Trevor: So little Trevor made a new friend called Brad, and he was thinking about cutting Mike off, when it all went to sh*t and Mike got killed and Brad went to jail!" I think Mike did the right thing and he didn`t do it so much for himself but for his family. He was in fear for his young family and he knew Trevor can freak out any moment. And i hate how the story is always portraying Michael as the bad backstabber while Trevor is just a poor naive soul who is "loyal" and a good friend. Bullsh*t! It`s totally reverse in my opinion. Your thoughts on this? Michael DID do the right thing. Examine the evidence: 1. Trevor is a cannibal 2. Trevor is a rapist 3. Trevor is unpredictable 4. Trevor is so bad that the FIB made a deal with a career multi-million dollar criminal (Michael) to STOP Trevor Michael has a family, wanted one last score before retiring forever AND to put and end to the monster that is Trevor. A little back story would be nice, but I have to imagine it goes something like this: Michael was a good thief, doing his thing on his own, then he met Trevor one day and couldn't get away from him. How COULD you escape Trevor? Look what he did to Johnny, after all... Michael was bound to end up the same way because of how psychotic Trevor is. So, he decides to hang up his life of crime and retire gracefully in exchange for stopping Trevor, whom is apparently such a threat that even the FIB wants him dead bad enough to warrant letting a murderous thief like Michael get away free and clear. Michael did the right thing... but in the back of his mind, he knows Trevor is also the only person who has ever shown Michael an ounce of real respect, or love, so part of him doesn't want him dead, either. The story is actually pretty good if you read beyond all the bullsh*t. Michael has a family yet doesn't act like the typical family man that hes suppose to take on. Michael cheats on his wife by having sex with hookers. He doesn't seem to give a sh*t if his daughter goes out, and blows every guy in Los Santos. Not once did he ever punished her for selling her body out just to go places. Michael can afford to buy a nice fancy yacht for him to enjoy yet can't seem to find the money to buy his son a car... oh and by the way he cared for his stolen boat a lot more than he did with his flesh n blood son. Didn't seem to care much about his son being kidnapped only that his boat was being stolen. Even his son got annoyed by his reaction considering what he been through. I'm getting so sick of tired of hearing the excuses from the Michael fan boys here about how Michael was shackled up to Trevor, not being able to escape. That is just f*cking bullsh*t right there. Michael confessed to his Shrink that he LOVES the life of crime. Even his shrink said that hes addicted to chaos. He had no intention of retiring. Edited June 9, 2015 by LordRaijin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp1dell Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Nice of you to chalk it up as people just being "fan boys." He did plan on retiring. Those were his full intentions. And from what the game tells us, things worked out for a while. If you ever had Michael and Franklin hang out, Michael will ask Franklin about Los Santos - since he's lived there his whole life. That if it makes people crazy, or something. He'll explain how happy him and his family were when they moved there, but after a while things just got out of control. Yeah, at one point Michael f*cked up and he cheated on Amanda. At some point, he started going to therapy so he could work out his issues. Yeah he's addicted to chaos, and a life of crime, but before the game's events he was trying to work on that. But when he cheated on Amanda, she started cheated on him too, and things just got more out of control. Like she said, she was faithful until she found him with a stripper. After ten years in LS, him and his family started to develop a lot of issues. Even after the game it's not perfect, but it gives you an idea of what things might have been like before the game's events (after the Prologue). But hey, whatever. You're just going to dismiss this as "typical Michael fan-boy excuses," even though it's all there in the game, so what's the point? nicktestbranch and Slax_Vice86 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarnageRacing00 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 When Michael betrayed them. If he wouldn`t do this then Trevor and Brad would do the same and worse to him and his family as evidenced by the dialogue between Trevor and Wayde. "Trevor: So little Trevor made a new friend called Brad, and he was thinking about cutting Mike off, when it all went to sh*t and Mike got killed and Brad went to jail!" I think Mike did the right thing and he didn`t do it so much for himself but for his family. He was in fear for his young family and he knew Trevor can freak out any moment. And i hate how the story is always portraying Michael as the bad backstabber while Trevor is just a poor naive soul who is "loyal" and a good friend. Bullsh*t! It`s totally reverse in my opinion. Your thoughts on this? Michael DID do the right thing. Examine the evidence: 1. Trevor is a cannibal 2. Trevor is a rapist 3. Trevor is unpredictable 4. Trevor is so bad that the FIB made a deal with a career multi-million dollar criminal (Michael) to STOP Trevor Michael has a family, wanted one last score before retiring forever AND to put and end to the monster that is Trevor. A little back story would be nice, but I have to imagine it goes something like this: Michael was a good thief, doing his thing on his own, then he met Trevor one day and couldn't get away from him. How COULD you escape Trevor? Look what he did to Johnny, after all... Michael was bound to end up the same way because of how psychotic Trevor is. So, he decides to hang up his life of crime and retire gracefully in exchange for stopping Trevor, whom is apparently such a threat that even the FIB wants him dead bad enough to warrant letting a murderous thief like Michael get away free and clear. Michael did the right thing... but in the back of his mind, he knows Trevor is also the only person who has ever shown Michael an ounce of real respect, or love, so part of him doesn't want him dead, either. The story is actually pretty good if you read beyond all the bullsh*t. Michael has a family yet doesn't act like the typical family man that hes suppose to take on. Michael cheats on his wife by having sex with hookers. He doesn't seem to give a sh*t if his daughter goes out, and blows every guy in Los Santos. Not once did he ever punished her for selling her body out just to go places. Michael can afford to buy a nice fancy yacht for him to enjoy yet can't seem to find the money to buy his son a car... oh and by the way he cared for his stolen boat a lot more than he did with his flesh n blood son. Didn't seem to care much about his son being kidnapped only that his boat was being stolen. Even his son got annoyed by his reaction considering what he been through. I'm getting so sick of tired of hearing the excuses from the Michael fan boys here about how Michael was shackled up to Trevor, not being able to escape. That is just f*cking bullsh*t right there. Michael confessed to his Shrink that he LOVES the life of crime. Even his shrink said that hes addicted to chaos. He had no intention of retiring. There it is, the fan boy term. Do you have some sort of phobia of other people's opinions? Christ. Anyway, yeah, Michael DID and DOES love his life of crime. But Trevor is on another level. Trevor was too much. Michael is careful, methodical, smart. Trevor is absolutely out of control and puts Michael in danger CONSTANTLY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racuch89 Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 (edited) Brads bragging about shoving a woman's face up against the glass made him very unlikeable for me, the way he said it, ultimate turd. I couldn't feel sorry for him. Am I in a minority?! I never really felt sorry for Trevor, I didn't know you was meant to. I think that dialogue line alone was made just for making us feel better about Michael. People just thought that Brad was probably as psychotic as Trevor, so no regrets for him. The fact that Trevor thought so highly about Brad for most of the storymode is important too. Btw. I actually felt more sadness about the death of the security guard from the bank. I tried to just injure him but the game forced me to do this in trevor way. Edited June 9, 2015 by Racuch89 nicktestbranch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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