Biggest performance killer & how to circumvent

[surxenberg]

This isn't another "GTA V runs like sh*t on my (sh*tty) PC" thread. This is to let you guys know what I have discovered for myself:

 

The biggest FPS Killer in this game is MSAA. My system is:

 

>AMD FX-8350 @ 4.8 GHz

>nVidia GeForce GTX980 @ 1.35GHz

>24 GB DDR3 1866 RAM

 

I play on 1080p, VSync always off. The game runs perfectly fine as long as MSAA is turned off. Turning on MSAA x2 results in a ~20% performance drop, x4 in around ~33%.

 

Downsampling + FXAA costs less performance than MSAA. Usually, people use MSAA because it's cheaper to run than higher resolutions, but in GTA V this appears to be not the case.

 

When looking at benchmarks, you can also see that whatever settings the GTX 980 runs at without MSAA it will yield pretty much the same FPS as a GTX Titan X with 4xMSAA.

 

For me, running the game at 2304x1296 with FXAA results in an effectively smoother gameplay than using 4xMSAA @ 1080p, even though there are 44% more pixels to push than on 1080p.

 

This is funny, because even 2560x1440p w/o MSAA runs better than 1080p w/ Multisampling (that's almost 80% more pixels to push than on 1080p) according to this benchmark:

http://www.computerbase.de/2015-04/gta-v-benchmarks-grafikkarten-prozessoren-und-kantenglaettung-im-vergleich/2/#diagramm-grafikkarten-benchmarks-in-2560-1440

(select the 1080p benchmarks for comparison in the drop down menu above the chart).

 

TL;DR unless you have a SLI'd 980's or CrossFired 290X's don't use multisampling. Resort to downsampling instead.

 

[TheMostKnowledgable]

Biggest performance killer is really the advanced graphics menu and shadows.

 

If you avoid FXAA and TXAA and use MSAAx4, it's fine. I do 50fps on that, 45 on x8. So I vsync half and turn everything to ultra and enjoy the best looking at 30fps with good motion blur.

 

I have gtx960. I am enjoying msaa with mfaa optimizing it to be better and faster. I like it, but I use ultra and very high everything too, so my computer is taking it easy on 30 fps and no problem at all.

Edited April 20, 2015 by TheMostKnowledgable

[surxenberg]

FXAA and TXAA come at literally zero additional performance loss.

The advanced graphics settings don't hit performance as hard as Multisampling does. Unless you enjoy playing on 30 FPS or you have Dual Titans I'd say stay clear of MSAA.

 

 

Biggest performance killer is really the advanced graphics menu and shadows.

 

If you avoid FXAA and TXAA and use MSAAx4, it's fine. I do 50fps on that, 45 on x8. So I vsync half and turn everything to ultra and enjoy the best looking at 30fps with good motion blur.

 

I have gtx960. I am enjoying msaa with mfaa optimizing it to be better and faster. I like it, but I use ultra and very high everything too, so my computer is taking it easy on 30 fps and no problem at all.

[solrayz]

The biggest fps killer and stutter producer is High levels of grass with MSAA enabled. Everything else is negligible on my rig. DSR x2.0 eliminates most shimmers without MSAA and allows me to set High levels of grass.

[TheMostKnowledgable]

Yea, they have negligable impact, but they look like sh*t. FXAA introduces its own jaggies. MSAA with MFAA and not the others produces the nices end result, I've compared them all. I prefer no aa at all over the FXAA and TXAA with MSAA.

 

MSAA is 50fps and it's steady. Whatever you sacrifice for MSAA, at least you know it's a steady non-variable cost. The shadows on the other hand are going to make FPS spike and dip. If you want any type of ultra in this game on single card, it's probably best to 30fps.

30fps is just fine, too. Especially for this game. It even makes it look like a movie.

 

Different strokes for different folks.

 

But MSAA is going to be a steady tradeoff, it's the difference of 10 fps. Shadows, again, will vary wildly. I prefer very high fidelity, maxing out what 1080p can display, so I'm playing 30fps. But I go 45 to 50 with 4x msaa if I didn't. But then it dips for ultra grass and for when shadows are getting too complex, so just lock it to half refresh rate, problem solved, extra processor time leftover for whatever else like self fm when I jump into that

[surxenberg]

Maybe you should really just try a higher resolution instead. As I said, 2560x1440 runs slightly better than [email protected], but it will produce an overall smoother image.

[TheMostKnowledgable]

Max res is 1080p here. Why don't you go set 2x and 4x msaa, drive around 5 minutes and take average fps and take note of stuttering.

 

Now go turn shadows on very high, and use high resolution shadow map with no AA. Tell me which is worse. The shadows are!

 

Now, use MSAA instead and it automatically is rendering some better shadows and every other effect anyway, and then being smooth and nice looking.

 

Whole point is, shadows are the biggest performance killer in the game. Tesselation causing problems for some, but I have no problems with it. Shadows make it very unsteady, very unpredictable performance. That's all I'm getting at.

 

50 steady fps better than variable fps from shadows being too high, when steady change caused by msaa gives better shadows anyhow.

 

MSAA and ultra grass are basically the only two things that make the game look better than consoles when played at 1080p.

Edited April 20, 2015 by TheMostKnowledgable

[Dyngsur]

Max res is 1080p here. Why don't you go set 2x and 4x msaa, drive around 5 minutes and take average fps and take note of stuttering.

 

Now go turn shadows on very high, and use high resolution shadow map with no AA. Tell me which is worse. The shadows are!

 

Now, use MSAA instead and it automatically is rendering some better shadows and every other effect anyway, and then being smooth and nice looking.

 

Whole point is, shadows are the biggest performance killer in the game. Tesselation causing problems for some, but I have no problems with it. Shadows make it very unsteady, very unpredictable performance. That's all I'm getting at.

 

50 steady fps better than variable fps from shadows being too high, when steady change caused by msaa gives better shadows anyhow.

 

So your saying that if you turn off High Res Shadows at advance settings and use MSAA *2 or *4 you will gain FPS and still have a better looking game?

[TheMostKnowledgable]

Close. I'm saying the tradeoff in performance for high res shadows is more than using 2 or 4x msaa and the msaa makes the shadows look better automatically because MSAA. So instead of make it constantly dip all the time, just spend on the MSAA and it's a steady predictable cost and isn't jarring like higher shadows are. Why set shadows to high res and only improve that ONE aspect of the scene for very costly results messing with framerate, when you can instead MSAA and improve everything, including shadows at the same time, without a variable cost - it's only going to cost like up to 10fps max any time.

 

It all depends on your own goals. That's the whole reason the settings are so broad - "to each his own".

 

But MSAA does more for the overall image at a lesser impact than shadows.

 

Shadows are the most impacting thing in the scene, as well as the distance scaling in combination with extreme shadow settings.

 

MFAA in control panel makes it even less impact for MSAA, cause it makes it better and faster at the same time. AMD users don't have that though.

Edited April 20, 2015 by TheMostKnowledgable

[Dyngsur]

Close. I'm saying the tradeoff in performance for high res shadows is more than using 2 or 4x msaa and the msaa makes the shadows look better automatically because MSAA. So instead of make it constantly dip all the time, just spend on the MSAA and it's a steady predictable cost and isn't jarring like higher shadows are. Why set shadows to high res and only improve that ONE aspect of the scene for very costly results messing with framerate, when you can instead MSAA and improve everything, including shadows at the same time, without a variable cost - it's only going to cost like up to 10fps max any time.

 

It all depends on your own goals. That's the whole reason the settings are so broad - "to each his own".

 

But MSAA does more for the overall image at a lesser impact than shadows.

 

Shadows are the most impacting thing in the scene, as well as the distance scaling in combination with extreme shadow settings.

 

MFAA in control panel makes it even less impact for MSAA, cause it makes it better and faster at the same time. AMD users don't have that though.

I see never tryed it but i will try it out and see, and btw what ive heard tha slider for extended shadow quality is bugged. But so to speak i will try turning High Res Shadow off in advance and use MSAA *2 or 4 with MFAA and see the diffrence. I will also try DSR later and see. I dont have bad fps at all . with MSAA off and High Shadows i got like 80-90 sometimes 70 the only thing that makes the fps drop is when im out in the bush the grass etc.

[Dyngsur]

And my own goal is to have 60 fps + constant with the best possible looking game!

[surxenberg]

And my own goal is to have 60 fps + constant with the best possible looking game!

That's everyone's goal

 

MSAA does not affect shadow quality in any way. The only thing that could do this would be SSAA, but since we have access to downsampling, SSAA isn't even necessary.

[DWeasel]

@surxenberg

"Downsampling + FXAA costs less performance than MSAA. Usually, people use MSAA because it's cheaper to run than higher resolutions, but in GTA V this appears to be not the case."

 

 

 

Not for everyone. When i play with downsampling i get ~50 FPS in the city and ~35-40 FPS in grass areas. But when i play with MSAA x2 (x4 works also) + FXAA i get 60 FPS/~45FPS

I play in 1080p + Ultra Settings (Advanced Settings OFF and Grass on "Very High") - i also set the "maximum of pre-rendered frames" to "3", Shader Cache "OFF" and "Adaptive VSync"

 

My System:

i7-2600k

16 GB RAM

GTX 970

Win7, 1 TB HDD

Edited April 20, 2015 by DWeasel

[Dyngsur]

i also set the "maximum of pre-rendered frames" to "3", Shader Cache "OFF" exactly what does things do?

[Runnin_Gag]

And how do you downsample in gta5?

[Dyngsur]

And how do you downsample in gta5?

you need a monitor with DSR.