Offroad wheels, stock wheels, racing

[JustinR512]

It's been discussed and determined that offroad tires are the best for racing. There's no difference in traction between the different types, but apparently, offroad tires are better at absorbing impacts from curbs and road debris, so they upset the handling of the car less.

 

I understand that.

 

I also understand that the amount of curb impact absorption differs depending on wheel type, and that Hi-end wheels are the worst.

 

What I'd like to know is: Where do stock wheels fit into that? How good (or bad) are they at absorbing road impacts?

 

I also wonder if stock wheels will give different amounts of impact absorption depending on which wheel type listing you buy them from. What I mean is that you can go into any wheel type, and stock wheels will always be at the top of the list. But they cost different prices, depending on the type you're looking at. For example, if I'm looking at High-end wheels, stock wheels might cost $8000, but if I'm looking at Offroad wheels, stock wheels might cost $3200. So I wonder if there's any difference in road impact absorption based on which wheel type you're looking at when you buy stock wheels. I wonder if I buy stock wheels while looking at Offroad, if I'll get the same amount of road impact absorption as any other Offroad wheel.

[Gridl0k]

^ your last sentence = why a lot of people have stock off-road wheels on their supers these days

 

It's a bug, not a feature - fit them while you can, IMO.

 

It's a no brainer on the two racecars if nothing else.

Edited February 10, 2015 by Gridl0k

[JustinR512]

^ your last sentence = why a lot of people have stock off-road wheels on their supers these days

It's a bug, not a feature - fit them while you can, IMO.

It's a no brainer on the two racecars if nothing else.

Are you confirming that stock wheels bought whole looking at the Offroad wheels will give the same benefit as any other Offroad wheel?

[Strachan]

test it with arguably the car most affected by road impacts: the Voltic. If there's any worthwhile difference it will be clear with that car.

[Gridl0k]

AFAIK, yes - the offroad stats (kerb riding etc) should apply to all offroad wheels, no matter the visual sidewall depth.

 

I'm not a hardcore racer though, I'm sure someone will post to either back this up or call me an idiot

 

But I'm fairly sure most racers are running stock offroads.

This is a bit old now but I think it still applies

 

 

 

And that's why I say it's a bug that you can currently buy "stock offroad" wheels, and you should buy them before it's fixed. Notice he has hideous wrong wheels on that zentorno because the video predates this bug.

Edited February 10, 2015 by Gridl0k

[Nacho Z]

Good question, I have no answer though. Kind of a pointless post to be honest.

[JustinR512]

Good question, I have no answer though. Kind of a pointless post to be honest.

Any compliment to me is never pointless.

[Nacho Z]

 

Good question, I have no answer though. Kind of a pointless post to be honest.

Any compliment to me is never pointless.

Accept it and embrace it my friend.

[Drake Vengeance]

There is no actual stat bonuses or negatives to a type of tire. That being said, it is about visual sidewall height. It's about how much space there is between the ground and the collision box of the rim.

 

Stock tires are as good as what they look like. More visual sidewall mean more space to aborb an impact.

[JustinR512]

On a related subject, does anyone know of any glitch to color stock wheels?

 

I've seen that sometimes if you have an aftermarket wheel that's been painted, and you look at stock wheels in LSC, he stock wheels sometimes take on the coloring of your aftermarket wheels. But the color gets erased if you actually buy it. Nevertheless, I'm hoping someone's found a way to color stock wheels.

 

And before anyone tells me to search, YOU try to search, and see how well that works out for you. These forums don't allow you to search for the word "color" for some strange reason.

[JustinR512]

There is no actual stat bonuses or negatives to a type of tire. That being said, it is about visual sidewall height. It's about how much space there is between the ground and the collision box of the rim.

Stock tires are as good as what they look like. More visual sidewall mean more space to aborb an impact.

You may not know of any stat bonus, but the game apparently does take into account what type of wheel you have. It's been tested and there is an observable, measurable difference between the wheel types, and I don't believe the game calculates it based on what it "looks like".

 

A couple of the wheel types appear to have the same sidewall size as each other, yet there is a known performance difference between the two.

 

Finally, from vehicle to another, not all stock wheels habe the same amount of sidewall.

 

It is this lack of understanding on the matter that has led me to ask the question. I want to know if anyone has actually done any testing that includes stock wheels to show where they perform, including stock wheels bought from within different wheel types. I know he aftermarket types were all tested, but I don't know if anyone bothered to include stock wheels in any testing, or if they compared stock wheels bought from different categories with each other.

[Drake Vengeance]

 

 

You may not know of any stat bonus, but the game apparently does take into account what type of wheel you have. It's been tested and there is an observable, measurable difference between the wheel types, and I don't believe the game calculates it based on what it "looks like".

 

A couple of the wheel types appear to have the same sidewall size as each other, yet there is a known performance difference between the two.

 

Finally, from vehicle to another, not all stock wheels habe the same amount of sidewall.

 

It is this lack of understanding on the matter that has led me to ask the question. I want to know if anyone has actually done any testing that includes stock wheels to show where they perform, including stock wheels bought from within different wheel types. I know he aftermarket types were all tested, but I don't know if anyone bothered to include stock wheels in any testing, or if they compared stock wheels bought from different categories with each other.

 

I am giving you my interpretation of the research done by Broughy, mainly, his video that was kindly provided by Gridl0k up above. I believe he makes it pretty clear in his video that there wasn't any noticable difference between tires to himself until his research on tire sidewalls. He even claims that you'll get the same lap time with high-end tires compared to off-road tires if you manage to race perfectly and stay away from curbs and bumps with both races. Sounds to me if there was any actual difference between stats for tires, it would be most noticably between off-road and end-end tires, which, as claimed by Broughy, there isn't.

 

Now, I could be mis-interpreturing the research or you could dis-agree with Broughy's reseach, but, please if you have a video or a link showing evidence for a stat difference between tires, I'd like to see it.

Edited February 11, 2015 by Drake Vengeance

[KoingWolf]

For the record, if anyone out there is wondering, wheels really do NOT have a ground breaking amount of difference in performance of your car and the "off road has more wheel to rim ratio" sh*t is so niche that it is practically useless.

 

I don't touch off-road wheels and choose what I think looks best;

1300-380 wins/losses.

All of 0 losses due to curb to rim ratios.

 

Anyone who scrambles for an "advantage" such as this probably should focus their attention on their fundamentals and hitting an apex. THAT will get you a lot further.

Edited February 11, 2015 by KoingWolf

[DJS]

For the record, if anyone out there is wondering, wheels really do NOT have a ground breaking amount of difference in performance of your car and the "off road has more wheel to rim ratio" sh*t is so niche that it is practically useless.

 

I don't touch off-road wheels and choose what I think looks best;

1300-380 wins/losses.

All of 0 losses due to curb to rim ratios.

 

Anyone who scrambles for an "advantage" such as this probably should focus their attention on their fundamentals and hitting an apex. THAT will get you a lot further.

A problem arises when you hit the apex and then bounce off it because you have the wrong wheels type. I dont touch the off road tyres myself as I think they are far too hideous. I usually go for tuner or muscle on cars that are known to handle bumps and such quite bad.

 

I'm interested if anyone has tested what OP is suggesting though. Would mean I could possibly revert my Jester to the stock wheels (which I prefer).

[xInfamousRYANx]

No if you buy stock under offroad it will not inherit the offroads property.

 

As for not being at much of a disadvantage that is true with randumbs. Join a race crew with serious racers and wheel choice means something

[JustinR512]

I am giving you my interpretation of the research done by Broughy, mainly, his video that was kindly provided by Gridl0k up above. I believe he makes it pretty clear in his video that there wasn't any noticable difference between tires to himself until his research on tire sidewalls. He even claims that you'll get the same lap time with high-end tires compared to off-road tires if you manage to race perfectly and stay away from curbs and bumps with both races. Sounds to me if there was any actual difference between stats for tires, it would be most noticably between off-road and end-end tires, which, as claimed by Broughy, there isn't.

 

Now, I could be mis-interpreturing the research or you could dis-agree with Broughy's reseach, but, please if you have a video or a link showing evidence for a stat difference between tires, I'd like to see it.

I think it's fairly obvious that if you can avoid the road hazards which make having offroad wheels a benefit, there'd be no difference between offroad and any other type of wheel.

 

I also think it is fairly obvious that there must be a stat difference somewhere. If something different happens under one set of circumstances than in another set of circumstances, there must be something to cause that difference. This "game" is a computer program, and nothing can happen that the game hasn't been programmed to make happen. There must be programming in the game that makes the car react differently to road bumps depending on wheel type. You may call it something else, or maybe I have the terminology wrong, but I think the game's program code is calculating the car's reaction based on the statistic of its wheel type.

 

It was from Broughy1322's videos that I first learned that wheel type made any difference. My recollection was that he said he didn't believe there was any difference, until some crew mates insisted there was, and he tried it himself.

 

The difference in reaction to road bumps from one wheel type to another is attributed to the sidewalls, as a sort of real-world attempt to explain the difference. In the real world, this is partly correct, but not entirely. In the real world, yes, a larger sidewall is better at soaking up road bumps...but a taller sidewall also flexes more, which leads to worse cornering performance. In the game, there is no difference in cornering performance from one wheel type to another.

 

My understanding of what you're trying to say is that the better road-bump handling of offroad wheels is based on sidewall height, whereas I'm saying that sidewall height AND road-bump handling are probably based on the same stat.

Edited February 11, 2015 by JRebbert512

[JustinR512]

For the record, if anyone out there is wondering, wheels really do NOT have a ground breaking amount of difference in performance of your car and the "off road has more wheel to rim ratio" sh*t is so niche that it is practically useless.

I don't touch off-road wheels and choose what I think looks best;

1300-380 wins/losses.

All of 0 losses due to curb to rim ratios.

Anyone who scrambles for an "advantage" such as this probably should focus their attention on their fundamentals and hitting an apex. THAT will get you a lot further.

You say the difference isn't ground-breaking, and that the difference is practically useless.

 

Any difference is a difference, no matter how small.

 

Go ask any professional racing team in the real world if they'd take advantage of any small advantage that is "practically useless" and see what they say.

[KoingWolf]

Can... Can you ever tell me or show me a single instance that you've ever "hit the apex" and got bounced off the curb like that? I mean I get the hypothetical situations getting thrown about, but it's total bullsh*t to think it serves any real purpose.

 

As for the "real racing crew" argument... Aside from being elitist, means nothing. I can (and have) trade 30 wins with a group of highly competitive racers... Tire choice will not matter as much as picking the right line and reacting appropriately to what is going on. Situational awareness.

 

People will clutch any type of placebo (sport wheels have the best traction!) or perceived advantage they can, so yes, it might be popular... Doesn't mean it's effective. Hence, yes, it will give you a better ratio, but the percentage and situation behind it will not help you under practical use.

 

And Well yes of course in the REAL WORLD the difference between a stock tire and slicks can change everything. In this VIDEO GAME however, it does not.

 

[mobile, no multi quote edit]

[JustinR512]

Can... Can you ever tell me or show me a single instance that you've ever "hit the apex" and got bounced off the curb like that? I mean I get the hypothetical situations getting thrown about, but it's total bullsh*t to think it serves any real purpose.

As for the "real racing crew" argument... Aside from being elitist, means nothing. I can (and have) trade 30 wins with a group of highly competitive racers... Tire choice will not matter as much as picking the right line and reacting appropriately to what is going on. Situational awareness.

People will clutch any type of placebo (sport wheels have the best traction!) or perceived advantage they can, so yes, it might be popular... Doesn't mean it's effective. Hence, yes, it will give you a better ratio, but the percentage and situation behind it will not help you under practical use.

And Well yes of course in the REAL WORLD the difference between a stock tire and slicks can change everything. In this VIDEO GAME however, it does not.

[mobile, no multi quote edit]

I never claimed to get bounced off a curb, I'll let whoever made that claim answer that one.

 

As for tire choice not mattering as much as picking the right line...I never claimed it mattered more than picking the right line. I never claimed it mattered more than anything else. I agree, it makes a relatively small difference. My point, though, was that even a small difference is a difference. And my point about what real racing crews would do is that they'll go after any difference, no matter how small.

 

Under practical use, to use your terminology, you and another driver can race the exact same car on the same track and take the exact same line and make identical control inputs. But if the other guy has one tiny little difference that gives him the teensiest-tiniest little advantage, guess what, he's going to win. And you're going to lose, because you passed on an advantage that was too minuscule to be worthy of your notice.

 

I don't know what this "better ratio" you're speaking of is, but regardless of how good you are, if you turn your nose up and something hays been proven to make even a tiny improvement, then that's just stupid. And make no mistake, the difference in this VIDEO GAME has been proven.

[Arms Dealer]

On a related subject, does anyone know of any glitch to color stock wheels?

 

I've seen that sometimes if you have an aftermarket wheel that's been painted, and you look at stock wheels in LSC, he stock wheels sometimes take on the coloring of your aftermarket wheels. But the color gets erased if you actually buy it. Nevertheless, I'm hoping someone's found a way to color stock wheels.

 

SilverFox1's iFruit tutorial over at se7ensins has this to say about coloring stock wheels:

 

Paint Stock Rims (Charles not required) source 1 source 2

 

1. buy any aftermarket set of wheels in the default wheel Category of your car
2. change to the color you want the stock wheel to be
3. leave LSC
4. in iFruit, find your car in the LSC app
5. order the stock wheel and confirm the purchase (no Charles breakpoints)
6. you should get a message from the social club in GTA Online saying your LSC order is ready
7. drive back into LSC and process the order.
8. stock wheels should now be painted

[elfoam]

I run painted stock rims chosen from the offroad class these days. They handle as if they are offroads but look better.

[bloatedsack]

People will clutch any type of placebo (sport wheels have the best traction!) or perceived advantage they can, so yes, it might be popular... Doesn't mean it's effective. Hence, yes, it will give you a better ratio, but the percentage and situation behind it will not help you under practical use.

 

B-b-b-ut there's a video! With an English accent! It must be true, I saw it on Youtube!

[theicide]

I don't know if you've seen the tests i've done on wheels. you might find it interesting. I've posted my results in a thread called which car for which class race? in the guides & strategies section. I don't know if stock wheels bought from the Off-Road class will give you the same results as Off-Road wheels. I doubt it though. I have tested a few different wheel types. When I test the stock wheels I usually buy it from the cheapest class. I think muscles are usually the cheapest. But I think i've bought Stock wheels from the off-road category as well and still found the true off-road wheels to be better. Wheels is a difficult thing to test. It takes allot of time and is hard to get good test result to see the differences. And the differences are minimal. You might try testing Stock wheels from each category and see if there is a difference. I suggest to collect the 5-10 best lap times and then add the times together for each wheel see if one category is better. That's how I've been testing them. If you do test them, I would love to see your results. Below are links to quickly jump to each wheel test I've posted in that thread.

Zentorno Off-Road vs. Stock Wheel Test

Top 3 Super Cars tested with different Wheels and Suspensions

Sports Classics Scroll down to the Hipster Death Rally test to see Wheel comparisons.

Sedans scroll down to Hipster Death Rally and Cutting Coroners test for Wheel comparisons.

[KoingWolf]

 

-snip-

I never claimed to get bounced off a curb, I'll let whoever made that claim answer that one.

 

As for tire choice not mattering as much as picking the right line...I never claimed it mattered more than picking the right line. I never claimed it mattered more than anything else. I agree, it makes a relatively small difference. My point, though, was that even a small difference is a difference. And my point about what real racing crews would do is that they'll go after any difference, no matter how small.

 

Under practical use, to use your terminology, you and another driver can race the exact same car on the same track and take the exact same line and make identical control inputs. But if the other guy has one tiny little difference that gives him the teensiest-tiniest little advantage, guess what, he's going to win. And you're going to lose, because you passed on an advantage that was too minuscule to be worthy of your notice.

 

I don't know what this "better ratio" you're speaking of is, but regardless of how good you are, if you turn your nose up and something hays been proven to make even a tiny improvement, then that's just stupid. And make no mistake, the difference in this VIDEO GAME has been proven.

Yes, as I stated and then you totally ignored in your example; practical use. You will never have 100% exact lines and turns and games and laps. It doesn't happen. And not only does it not happen, you will either once in a blue moon or straight up never be in a situation where you straddle the curb in a way for this "improvement" to even come into effect.

 

I'm not turning my nose up at anything, I'm DYING for a more competitive race scene, as arcade as it is, and spreading misleading "tips" such as this is not helping at all. I want people to focus on getting their handling down and learning what brakes and an apex are. Not wasting their times on this.

[elfoam]

Offroads wheels will give you one second a lap, one second a lap beyond any personal record you have after 1000 laps. Its a very big deal, that's almost the difference between a Zentorno and an entity.

[JustinR512]

 

On a related subject, does anyone know of any glitch to color stock wheels?

I've seen that sometimes if you have an aftermarket wheel that's been painted, and you look at stock wheels in LSC, he stock wheels sometimes take on the coloring of your aftermarket wheels. But the color gets erased if you actually buy it. Nevertheless, I'm hoping someone's found a way to color stock wheels.

 

SilverFox1's iFruit tutorial over at se7ensins has this to say about coloring stock wheels:

 

Paint Stock Rims[/size] (Charles not required) [/size]source 1 [/size]source 2

 

 

• buy any aftermarket set of wheels in the default wheel Category of your car
• change to the color you want the stock wheel to be
• leave LSC
• in iFruit, find your car in the LSC app
• order the stock wheel and confirm the purchase (no Charles breakpoints)
• you should get a message from the social club in GTA Online saying your LSC order is ready
• drive back into LSC and process the order.
• stock wheels should now be painted

Thanks. I can confirm that the method does work; however, it does not seem to work on all cars. I believe this was also pointed out in one of the two sources. The stock wheels of some vehicles just can't be painted. You can tell,ahead of time if your car's stock wheels can be painted by first buying aftermarket wheels and painting them, then going to another wheel category and looking at stock wheels. If they appear painted there, they should hold the color if you use the quoted method. But if they appear as unpainted, they they won't hold the color using this method.

 

The disadvantage to this method is that you don't get to buy the stock wheels from the Offroad class. So far, there does not seem to be a consensus on whether or not this actually makes any difference, with some people saying it does, and others saying it doesn't.

 

It's also worth pointing out that using this method, the color of painted stock wheels will appear somewhat darker than the same color on aftermarket wheels. I'm not sure why this is, but if there's a particular color you want to match exactly, you may have trouble getting it.

 

For example, I had Fluorescent Blue on a set of Sports-class wheels on this Sultan, and used this method to,get painted stock wheels. You can see in the photo that the color is considerably darker than Fluorescent Blue. However, this color actually goes quite well with the car (this car was custom painted back on PS3 via a save editor, an effect that as yet cannot be reproduced on PS4).

[JustinR512]

 

 

-snip-

I never claimed to get bounced off a curb, I'll let whoever made that claim answer that one.

As for tire choice not mattering as much as picking the right line...I never claimed it mattered more than picking the right line. I never claimed it mattered more than anything else. I agree, it makes a relatively small difference. My point, though, was that even a small difference is a difference. And my point about what real racing crews would do is that they'll go after any difference, no matter how small.

Under practical use, to use your terminology, you and another driver can race the exact same car on the same track and take the exact same line and make identical control inputs. But if the other guy has one tiny little difference that gives him the teensiest-tiniest little advantage, guess what, he's going to win. And you're going to lose, because you passed on an advantage that was too minuscule to be worthy of your notice.

I don't know what this "better ratio" you're speaking of is, but regardless of how good you are, if you turn your nose up and something hays been proven to make even a tiny improvement, then that's just stupid. And make no mistake, the difference in this VIDEO GAME has been proven.

Yes, as I stated and then you totally ignored in your example; practical use. You will never have 100% exact lines and turns and games and laps. It doesn't happen. And not only does it not happen, you will either once in a blue moon or straight up never be in a situation where you straddle the curb in a way for this "improvement" to even come into effect.

I'm not turning my nose up at anything, I'm DYING for a more competitive race scene, as arcade as it is, and spreading misleading "tips" such as this is not helping at all. I want people to focus on getting their handling down and learning what brakes and an apex are. Not wasting their times on this.

Not only did I not ignore your mention of practical use, I actually directly referred to it. It was even in what you quoted from me. So who is ignoring who here?

 

Or more to the point, who is misunderstanding who here?

 

Offroad wheels CAN make a difference, that is a proven fact. Their effect has nothing to,do with "straddling a curb", their effect comes into play when you hit a curb, or an odd bump in the road, or small debris in the road. The concept at work is that the taller sidewall soaks up those little bumps better, which reduces the upsetting effect on the cars handling, which allows the car to do a better job of maintaining the line you're trying to keep. This has nothing to do with "straddling the curb" and I don't even know where you got that nonsense from.

 

If you can find a line through a course that has no curbs or bumps or anything else, just perfectly smooth asphalt the whole way, then no, you won't see a difference. And if you can find a line like that through every single track that exists or will be created in the future, then this will never ever make any difference to you. Good luck with that. But many tracks do have curbs or other road irregularities in the way of what could otherwise be the best line, and guess what, Offroad wheels won't hurt on tracks where they don't matter...so other than looks, why not? Or if you're going around curbs and other road features, while someone else can take a better line over them...who has the advantage then?

 

I'm done arguing about it, this isn't even what this thread is about. You want to ignore something that so many others have found does make a difference, that's fine, good for you, go be ignorant somewhere else. I didn't ask if Offroad wheels make a difference, so if you want to argue about that, find a great about it and go there.

[GTA Forums User99521]

You also get a small boost when you drive over kerbs and offroad wheels will mean it's easier to control the car when going over them

[elfoam]

Lol! There's no argument here. Offroads are significantly faster. Its hugely obvious, if you are going to argue the world is flat go for it, but please do it from the ward of your mental home.

[roboticsuperman]

I have always swore by using tuner tyres dished eight! They are considerably wider tyres than the rest of the tuner tyres, and I find they do give better grip. If you take the comet out stock tyres and then change it to the dished eights and feel the difference in handeling.

Wether the height of the tyre wall makes a difference to impacts, I've never noticed it much myself.