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BRITLAND

UK Politics & Current Affairs Discussion Thread

Recommended Posts

Uncle Sikee Atric

Part of me wonders if May is the sacrificial lamb of the Conservatives - who they will feed to Labour, so she gets the brunt of the blame for the Brexit fallout.

It's a sound plan. British election history has taught us that voters will not always hold the mistakes of a PM against their successor. Everyone expected John Major to lose because of the taint of Thatcher, but people didn't connect the dots.

I think May will stay in power, but come the next election whoever succeeds her will simply steamroll back to a Tory majority by vowing to turn homeless people into kebabs or something.

 

Sadly, I just can't see Labour doing anything with this lead. I have zero faith in our people to elect them when it counts. Theresa May could goosestep over a mountain of baby seals and people here will still vote Conservative.

 

I think the corporate shows at the conferences and the sponsorship both parties receive over this year will denote how companies feel about the two parties and the confidence they feel will give a clear indication of where we're going.

 

That's partly why this conference season will be intriguing. Companies switching allegiances isn't uncommon, but companies are powerful voices in politics, especially those that control media outlets and if a few of those switch in the coming months....

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Finite

Thanks Crokey m8. Knew I wouldn't be alone in liking it.

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Uncle Sikee Atric

In keeping with the jokes, Newsthump has a distinct 'Have I Got News For You' ability to keep getting the detail ironically correct.. How long does Eeyore think we'll accept a 'mushroom management' approach to Brexit (Keep us in the dark and occasionally throw crap on us)?

 

In real news though, who thinks this week could go terrifically bad for the Tories? It's the 'Great Repeal Bill ' debate and reading on Thursday and who is quietly expecting Friday to begin with the current outline totally shot, or the entire bill thrown out? Things were looking bad for the Tories when the (still standing) regional assemblies unified to reject the bill and the Draconian style power hogging of ministers annoying a lot of back benchers....

 

Already the 'loyal' Tories are rallying the troops and the whips are screaming for the compliant members to attend. But that majority of 6 might well not be enough to keep the bill running, with the warring Tories split and squabbling behind their figureheads for Eeyore's scalp and Labours' new Brexit agenda looking much stronger.

 

It's gonna be a hot week and I suspect a very divisive result. Even if it does stagger through, expect the regional assemblies to offer no quarter or acceptance of it.

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Blaze

I expect a Vice article next week about how millennials killed religion.

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Finite

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/06/jacob-rees-mogg-opposed-to-gay-marriage-and-abortion-even-after

 

Has he told his 6 children this?

 

Explained that if they're gay, they'll have to accept being second class citizens in their own country?

 

Would he tell his daughters they must continue a pregnancy no matter the circumstances?

 

Some father.

Edited by Finite

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Svip

You you provide a bit more context? The link is just a live update from Prime Minister's Question Time, which means it will be a useless link in two seconds. Who said what?

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Finite

Sorry wrong link, fixed that now.

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Uncle Sikee Atric

Well, another week has passed and the wheels of Brexit keep turning, slowly.... The latest rounds of talks due for Spetember 18th, have been delayed until the 25th and the delay seems to be for 'consultations' in the UK (Rumor is Eeyore will give a major, outline policy speech of some kind on the issue, but nothing is confirmed).

 

But time ticks on and Jean-Claude Junker has delivered his annual, 'State Of The EU Speech' in the European Parliament, the key points are here. Seemingly to the dismay of the Brexiteers, Junker basically ignored the issue and instead centered on EU reforms post Brexit (The UK Right Wing media sees it as a snub of course, the only real mention was a sweet nod to Heil Farage with the message, "the EU will regret the loss of the UK, and I think you will regret it in time too.") But the EU is a far bigger beast than one tiny group of the population with a goal to end the entire EU system and this speech was not to be expected. The German elections end this month and there then is a 'stable political period', within the EU area, with few national elections before the EU MEP elections in March 2019 (when Brexiteers seemingly get their initial wet dream and the EU will move on).

 

The EU will reform and continue regardless of Brexit and Junker's speech outlined new ideals for the expansion of the Schengen area, the continuation and expansion of the single market and single currency (including the formation of a committee and board that will 'pre-arrange' national currencies for rapid integration into the Euro system) and the most stark proposal was the end of the 'national veto' for defense and foreign issues, with the further expansion of the 'Standing European Army'.

 

As is the way with politics, these plans seemed to split the chamber with clear divisions in certain areas. But the nationalist parties look like they might actually have to accept these proposals. The leaving of the UK will strip them of some of their most virulent supporters within the Tories and UKIP and could leave them short of the required numbers needed to block the final votes! Brexit is going to reform the EU, just a shame the UK cannot help with the reforms.... (Well, I suppose it has by leaving one side short of required numbers!)

 

Let's have look at issues within the UK though....

 

Phase one of the Repeal Bill has made it through the Commons, with a majority of 326 to 290. The Tories have now got their post-Brexit proposals into the discussion chambers and meeting rooms of the Commons where the 'Draconian Powers' that quietly unite Brexiteer and Remainer can be debated and reformed into a state where they might make sense and be actually usable, but will the senior Tories notice these reforms, or push their crazy plans anyway? All the way through the debate, the number of backbench Tories who were of the opinion that, "we'll vote for this Bill so we can actually try to reform it, but you better listen!" The final vote is due in 12 or so months, when the real votes over Brexit are all being forced through the Commons' doors so Ministers have plenty of time to notice the reforms, but since they're so blind to everything going on around them, they might well face a massive rebellion if they charge on regardless with the initial outlines.

 

The latest figures for unemployment have also been published these last few hours and at first glance, they look good! Record low unemployment figures and something that looks good, even in Brexit uncertainty. But look deeper at the numbers and serious cracks in the figures hide some stark truths....

 

These figures don't show the number of 'employed' who work on zero hours contracts and are not always employed every week, or on as little as four hours a week at rates well below the set 'minimum wage'. Add to this the general reduction in 'take home pay', in ten years, for every employed person and the number of employed that are coming from overseas to plug serious holes in key skill groups. Brexit is going to do nothing but end that 'migration' to fill the gaps and the amount of employers that want to actually employ local people to fill roles, but no one wants to do it as the locals see it as 'below them', dirty work, or even too unskilled! 2019 will show the UK what this gap means and the amount of 'fruit-picking apprenticeships' that will appear come that summer....

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Finite

http://www.businessinsider.com/jacob-rees-mogg-food-banks-rather-uplifting-2017-9?r=UK&IR=T

 

Apparently "Not being told the foodbanks were there" is the only reason why food bank usage has surged from 25,899 to 1,182,954 since 2009. That's the only reason for an increase of over one million people needing public assistance to feed themselves and their families.

 

What a delightful man he is, letting the serfs band together to make sure they don't starve.

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Finite

vbJ8vLi.jpg

 

"We send Netflix £7.49 a week. Let's fund our NHS instead."

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John Smith

It's been a while since I last posted in this sub-section, with good reason, and I was initially going to PM sivis to get his thoughts, but I thought I'd put this question on a more public platform to hopefully ignite a general discussion for educational and observational purposes. What do you guys make of Corbyn's speech today, and how much weight do you think his bold, "we are the mainstream" declaration carries? The footage of the audience acting like football fans does make me wonder just where the Labour party's base now lie.

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Finite

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/30/boris-johnson-caught-on-camera-reciting-kipling-in-myanmar-temple

 

A Dead Statesman

 

I could not dig; I dared not rob:

Therefore I lied to please the mob.

Now all my lies are proved untrue

And I must face the men I slew.

What tale shall serve me here among

Mine angry and defrauded young?

 

- Rudyard Kipling

Edited by Finite

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RedDagger

The conservative party conference happened, and uh

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41479620

 

The terms of the new offence will be designed to safeguard those who click on a link by mistake, or who could argue that they did so out of curiosity rather than with criminal intent.

Haha yeah nice to have a law with that much ambiguity...the vagueness of this doesn't inspire hope, what with the Conservative party's attitude towards the internet thus far.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41484909

 

"So today, I am also announcing a new offence, to prevent the sale of acids to under-18s."

Which is...alright, as it will stop younger people from buying it and throwing it around for the stupidest of things, but I'm pretty sure the majority of acid attacks are gang-related , and they often get them from older gang members, so...it's something, but I doubt it'll have much effect on the rates on its own. Edited by RedDagger

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Finite

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/03/theresa-may-defends-decision-not-to-sack-boris-johnson

 

I don't think you can defend it. Boris is bulletproof because of his connections and nothing more; May would also struggle to deal with the fallout of sacking him. She is between a rock and a hard place but cannot admit it to the public without admitting she has no control over her MPs.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41484909

"So today, I am also announcing a new offence, to prevent the sale of acids to under-18s."

Sale of alcohol is banned to under 18s, Amber.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/02/david-davis-plans-retire-brexit-secretary-uk-leaves-eu-2019/

 

David Davis plans to retire in 2019 and leave Boris Johnson to steer the UK through the transitional period, The Telegraph can reveal.

 

f*cking hell, what a huge f*cking mess this government is. It would be a joke if the consequences weren't so dire.

Edited by Finite

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Argonaut

The utter farce that has developed after May's conference speech is now (as if it wasn't before) less than mockable, and something which I can't see being reversed, for what opportunities lie ahead on an equal scale for her to set the record straight? We will have to see how long the line of "either this or Jeremy Corbyn in office" can sufficiently whip MPs together, which on its own I think is quite potent.

 

I can't deny feeling some apprehension to a Corbyn government out of the untested nature of his team and whether they have the competency and flexibility to deal with government. It would be false to even suggest from this that I would pick or tolerate the current one though, even implicitly, but one only has to be reminded of the GLC days to get an insight on how some of their key players act.

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Finite

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-ministers-salary-not-enough-a7976641.html

 

What about Boris himself? He can't afford to hang out with his even richer friends. He's the butt of all their jokes. They tell him to f*ck off home because he's freeloading the vintage Chablis again.

 

I pity Boris more than a struggling family doing their damnedest to make ends meet, and to provide for each other honestly.

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Svip

Boris is not deserving of your pity.

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Finite
thatsthejoke.jpg

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Uncle Sikee Atric

The entire debacle that is a Tory party is rapidly devolving into a joke, let alone any particular section of it....

 

This morning we had the outline of the 'Schapps Rebellion'. Thing is, if she has the cabinet support, why does Schapps suggest there's some members of the cabinet supporting him?

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Typhus

I get the strangest feeling that if May were to sack Boris, it might actually speed up her exit from power.

Even with a bad conference speech, and Boris actively undermining her, she can still weather the storm by simply keeping a low profile and letting the current talk of a power struggle lose its momentum. But actually firing him would cast an even brighter light on her leadership, and perhaps invite a challenge from any number of far more intelligent Conservatives than May.

 

For my money, if May was to be booted out, I predict Jacob Rees-Mogg will be the new Prime Minister. The ascent of Corbyn and Brexit have left the Tory party looking increasingly rudderless. Essentially in the same position as Labour were. In such an environment it is quite common for parties to grow more extreme, and there would be a lot of support for a man like Rees-Mogg who represents very antiquated values. It might kill the party at the next election, but he would be a strong leader, and they would want that more than either a dithering May or a rambling drunkard like Boris.

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Finite

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/06/weve-lost-control-of-the-narrative-tory-voters-on-theresa-may

 

Lost control? I see the same dystopian narrative that's been propounded all along, "citizens of nowhere", empty soundbites et al. The difference now is that reality is catching up.

 

When is the last time you knew what the narrative was?! Build a country for the future instead of looking after your own interests.

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Finite

I get the strangest feeling that if May were to sack Boris, it might actually speed up her exit from power.

Not a strange thought, it's empirical fact that if Boris goes his connections will be the end of May as the far right rags turn on her.

 

Even with a bad conference speech, and Boris actively undermining her, she can still weather the storm by simply keeping a low profile and letting the current talk of a power struggle lose its momentum.

Impossible. At this point there's little else to weather, her entire time as PM has been littered with mistakes and idiocy, there's nothing else to protect.

 

But actually firing him would cast an even brighter light on her leadership, and perhaps invite a challenge from any number of far more intelligent Conservatives than May.

There are none, to the Conservatives terror she was and still is their best bet. There is no great replacement waiting to take the roll, if there were she'd either be ousted already or would never have won the leadership to begin with.

 

For my money, if May was to be booted out, I predict Jacob Rees-Mogg will be the new Prime Minister.

Then you would lose your money, Mogg would be eviscerated by Corbyn and in conjunction with Brexit it would be the end of the Conservative party.

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Uncle Sikee Atric

 

For my money, if May was to be booted out, I predict Jacob Rees-Mogg will be the new Prime Minister.

Then you would lose your money, Mogg would be eviscerated by Corbyn and in conjunction with Brexit it would be the end of the Conservative party.

 

That's as maybe true, but the average, Hard-Brexiteer Tory might consider anyone for the role as PM, if they can guarantee they'll completely finish Brexit before any sniff of an election appears. I think most Tories admit the writing is on the wall and things look pretty bad, if Corbyn was to get in next election, why not have the Tories totally screw his ascension and leave him with the mess?

 

Seen as how Jacob is truly stuck in the 19th century and had some opinions that'll make the average Trump supporter blush, the hard right faction might just see him as their messiah, if he makes a pledge to just end in 2019 with a 'no-deal' Brexit.... It's a crazy thought, but that 'man' might just do it, especially since he's the polar opposite to Corbyn and that would attract more support in an age where UK politics is becoming more clearly segregated than it has been, for any period since the Second World War.

 

I wouldn't go out and pledge my life savings on anything right away though. The Blowjob will clearly have a pop at PM and he'll be a hard right front runner if a Leadership contest were to currently appear.

Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric

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Uncle Sikee Atric

Looks like Don Groper isn't as welcome as May first thought....

 

Add to that her disastrous conference and today's admission from Phillip Hammond over his 'No Deal Brexit budgeting refusal' and it's been a marvelous period for Tory critics to really put the boot in! Doubly so as she was at P.M.Q.'s at the same time, saying he was setting up a contingency budget!

 

How many more holes before H.M.S. Eeyore finally sinks with all hands?

Edited by Uncle Sikee Atric

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