UK Politics & Current Affairs Discussion & DIY Home Improvement Thread

[ilovebender.com]

Tories aren't Islamophobic at the grassroots level, that's a made up fabrication with nothing to back it up;

Where are you getting your information from?

 

Momentum attack Jews, Moderate Labour alike; they commit hate crimes based on race and on politics.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/29/mp-chris-leslie-deselection-threats-momentum-labour-party

I'm a Conservative, do I hate Muslims?

I joined the Tories because Momentum are like the Nazi Party and have to be stopped.

Edited February 11, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Smith John]

I realise you've just edited your source from Vice to The Gaurdian, but I'm going to stick with the Vice article you initially shared and say they were in a sticky wicket as to who not to offend less. This ultimately is what it's gotten to.

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

Tories aren't Islamophobic at the grassroots level, that's a made up fabrication with nothing to back it up;

Where are you getting your information from?

 

The issue has been covered in Private Eye over several months and started to reach the mainstream papers too.  The lower ranks and Young Conservative groups are experiencing issues with Islamophbia on a regular basis.

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/islamophobia-conservative-party-racism-boris-johnson-muslim-inquiry-a9207191.html

 

Quote

Momentum attack Jews, Moderate Labour alike; they commit hate crimes based on race and on politics.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/sep/29/mp-chris-leslie-deselection-threats-momentum-labour-party

I'm a Conservative, do I hate Muslims?

 

Not necessarily, do you know for sure of any other members yourself that hate Muslims and display Islamophobic tendencies?  Would you stand up and vouch for them to say they're not Islamophobic?

 

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I joined the Tories because Momentum are like the Nazi Party and have to be stopped.

 

Politics suggest Momentum are Communists.  Tories are surely far closer to Nazis than they are.

[ilovebender.com]

9 hours ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

The issue has been covered in Private Eye over several months and started to reach the mainstream papers too.  The lower ranks and Young Conservative groups are experiencing issues with Islamophbia on a regular basis.

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/islamophobia-conservative-party-racism-boris-johnson-muslim-inquiry-a9207191.html

 

 

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Not necessarily, do you know for sure of any other members yourself that hate Muslims and display Islamophobic tendencies?  Would you stand up and vouch for them to say they're not Islamophobic?

I don't see what this has to do with Momentum or antisemitism; other than you don't want us to talk about it.

Quote

 

Politics suggest Momentum are Communists. 

That's nothing to be proud of even.

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Tories are surely far closer to Nazis than they are.

Now that's ridiculous. Momentum and Nazis both

 

• Hate capitalism
• Have a problem with Jews
• Advocate for nationalization
• Claim to be left winged https://consequenceofsound.net/2018/04/morrissey-hitler-was-left-wing/

 

The Tories on the other hand; love capitalism, don't hate anybody, champion the private sector, don't claim to be left winged.

 

The shared iconography and behaviour between Momentum and Nazis.

 

 

 

Why aren't Muslims protesting against islamophobia in the Tory party if there's islamophobia in the Tory Party?

 

Why are Jews protesting against antisemitism in the Labour party if there's no antisemitism in the Labour party?

 

 

 

Are you capable of talking about antisemitism in Labour or are you going to try and deflect this so we don't talk about Labour's problem with Jews?

Whenever I bring this up, you say nothing about it, even pretend it doesn't exist and then you try and paint the Tories as islamophobic in an attempt to steer the conversation away - probably because it's easier than admitting that you've backed a conceptual Nazi horse.

 

 

Do you think this is why Boris Johnson won an overwhelming majority?

It's also why I became a Tory, because it's a choice between centre right and the Nazi Party; I became a card carrying Tory, and I'm glad Momentum were handed their backsides at the last general election.

 

The real crux of the matter, a truth you even deny; Why are Labour and the BNP the only 2 political parties in the UK to come under investigation for racism if Tories supporters are racists and Momentum supporters aren't?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48433964

 

Why aren't you willing to discuss this, instead immediately trying to paint the Tories as islamophobic instead?

Edited February 12, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

 

I don't see what this has to do with Momentum or antisemitism; other than you don't want us to talk about it.

 

You're not exactly in a rush to discuss Islamophobia within the Tories either. 

 

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

Now that's ridiculous. Momentum and Nazis both

 

• Hate capitalism
• Have a problem with Jews
• Advocate for nationalization
• Claim to be left winged https://consequenceofsound.net/2018/04/morrissey-hitler-was-left-wing/

 

Morrissey is a clueless freak and his recent musings / comments have turned him into a joke.  The best thing is, he thinks he's smart!

 

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

 

The Tories on the other hand; love capitalism, don't hate anybody, champion the private sector, don't claim to be left winged.

 

If they championed business, they wouldn't be in such a rush to sanction them from their biggest trade partners.

 

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

 

The shared iconography and behaviour between Momentum and Nazis.

 

 

 

Why aren't Muslims protesting against islamophobia in the Tory party if there's islamophobia in the Tory Party?

 

Why are Jews protesting against antisemitism in the Labour party if there's no antisemitism in the Labour party?

 

 

 

I'm not even going to bother, you cannot identify a photoshopped image! 

 

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

 

Are you capable of talking about antisemitism in Labour or are you going to try and deflect this so we don't talk about Labour's problem with Jews?

 

Are you capable of talking about Islamophobia in the Tories or are you going to try and deflect this so we don't talk about Tory problems with Muslims?

 

1 hour ago, ilovebender.com said:

Whenever I bring this up, you say nothing about it, even pretend it doesn't exist and then you try and paint the Tories as islamophobic in an attempt to steer the conversation away - probably because it's easier than admitting that you've backed a conceptual Nazi horse.

 

Do you think this is why Boris Johnson won an overwhelming majority?

It's also why I became a Tory, because it's a choice between centre right and the Nazi Party; I became a card carrying Tory, and I'm glad Momentum were handed their backsides at the last general election.

 

The real crux of the matter, a truth you even deny; Why are Labour and the BNP the only 2 political parties in the UK to come under investigation for racism if Tories supporters are racists and Momentum supporters aren't?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48433964

 

Why aren't you willing to discuss this, instead immediately trying to paint the Tories as islamophobic instead?

 

Because this is winding you up....  I'd discuss racism in political groups if you'd accept that balance is required, however as soon as I mention Islamophobia in the Tories you're immediately on the defensive and desperate to divert everything back on Red Jezza and the far left of UK politics.  I do think certain individuals within Momentum have antisemitic views, but the views are not shared within the wider movement, so painting them all as antisemitic is incorrect.

 

Meanwhile you're squirming over Islamophoba as if you know something is going on and you're trying to hide it.

 

[ilovebender.com]

7 hours ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

You're not exactly in a rush to discuss Islamophobia within the Tories either. 

That's not what happened, you didn't start by talking about Islamophobia in the Tory party; that was your tool to avoid discussing antisemitism on the left. - you're not in a rush to discuss this though - and the funny thing is, you think you're smart.

Quote

 

Morrissey is a clueless freak and his recent musings / comments have turned him into a joke.  The best thing is, he thinks he's smart!

Reminds me of you then you f*cking Dunning-Kruger.

Quote

 

If they championed business, they wouldn't be in such a rush to sanction them from their biggest trade partners.

Did they? I'm beginning to doubt your sanity given you chose to ignore facts.

Quote

 

I'm not even going to bother, you cannot identify a photoshopped image! 

The fact that you can speaks volumes; I mean, they're not, but now you're ignoring photographs of what I'm talking about calling them fake. Are they photoshopped though? I call bunk on your claim; show me how they're photoshopped; is it because you refuse to see the truth?

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Are you capable of talking about Islamophobia in the Tories or are you going to try and deflect this so we don't talk about Tory problems with Muslims?

How am I deflecting from what I'm talking about? You only started talking about Boris Johnson's letter box joke after I raised antisemitism in Labour and the very real concerns there; rather than address the issue, you chose to justify it by claiming the Tories were the nasty racist party.

Quote

 

Because this is winding you up....

 

No you're not, and if that's how you get your thrills, see a head doctor you control freak, seriously, you thought pretending Croydon wasn't in London would get to me, you just seem to get your thrills that way; Do you remember when Boris Johnson had a domestic in Camberwell and some Labour supporters decided to make a fuss out of it because they wanted to sink low; that's you, you sink low; your whole damn movement is like that of the Nazi party imo. 

Quote

  I'd discuss racism in political groups if you'd accept that balance is required,

I'm talking about something that's a real problem and you're trying to throw mud on the Tories, so, I'm not going to accept this and you cannot talk about antisemitism in the Labour party because you want to include the notion that Tories are islamophobic.

Quote

however as soon as I mention Islamophobia in the Tories

I see you're avoiding the issue, that's what I do.

 

Quote

you're immediately on the defensive and desperate to divert everything back on Red Jezza and the far left of UK politics.  I do think certain individuals within Momentum have antisemitic views, but the views are not shared within the wider movement, so painting them all as antisemitic is incorrect.

No... But the fact that he's also Red Jezza doesn't help him either.

We're talking about the intolerant left, the Labour leadership, and those Tory hating scum who follow Jeremy Corbyn who chant a brainwashed chant.

 

https://news.sky.com/story/politics-live-boris-and-brexit-on-the-agenda-11493738

This is the moderate Labour, and he was forced out of Labour, calling it racist.

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Meanwhile you're squirming over Islamophoba as if you know something is going on and you're trying to hide it.

 

Hide what, all your squirming is just you trying to hide something you wished would go away! lol

Edited February 12, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

On 2/12/2020 at 10:16 AM, ilovebender.com said:

That's not what happened, you didn't start by talking about Islamophobia in the Tory party; that was your tool to avoid discussing antisemitism on the left. - you're not in a rush to discuss this though - and the funny thing is, you think you're smart.

Reminds me of you then you f*cking Dunning-Kruger.

 

Well then, use of that phrase makes you the prime candidate for who is really suffering from it.  There's no need for the swear words either.

 

Quote

Did they? I'm beginning to doubt your sanity given you chose to ignore facts.

The fact that you can speaks volumes; I mean, they're not, but now you're ignoring photographs of what I'm talking about calling them fake. Are they photoshopped though? I call bunk on your claim; show me how they're photoshopped; is it because you refuse to see the truth?

How am I deflecting from what I'm talking about? You only started talking about Boris Johnson's letter box joke after I raised antisemitism in Labour and the very real concerns there; rather than address the issue, you chose to justify it by claiming the Tories were the nasty racist party.

 

They are the nasty racist party and the Government are busily getting to work at being racist :
 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-man-blocked-uk-home-office-passport-brussels-a9332311.html?fbclid=IwAR2SPEf6tuf3DtgVS71UqGM4cfvDkdEFO8ude3wXokoS2ZI_vsYXMsJUXxE

 

The key quote from the article :

 

"A British citizen has been blocked from entering the UK after a holiday because the Home Office revoked his passport with no warning – rendering him stateless.

Fatush Lala, 33, who has lived in Britain since the age of 14, was told by border officials as he tried to board a flight home from Brussels airport that he had no right to do so.

 

Mr Lala, who lives in north London, has now been forced to live on the streets of the Belgian capital for more than three weeks. He says he has been pushed “from pillar to post” as he tries to rectify the situation. The Home Office has not responded to a letter from his MP sent a week ago.

 

David Lammy, Labour MP for Tottenham, said it was “grossly inhumane” for the government to prevent entry to someone who arrived in Britain as a minor and has called the country his home for the past 20 years.

 

Mr Lala, who was born in Serbia but moved to the UK as a teenager and naturalised, said he went to the UK embassy in Belgium to seek help, only to be told his British passport – the only one he has ever owned – was no longer valid and have it confiscated from him, leaving him stateless."

 

----------

 

They've even managed to claim this was an 'admin error,' although I'm not so sure asking a 101 year old man for proof of residence from his parents is giving people a warm, fuzzy feeling about settled status applications.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/12/home-office-tells-man-101-his-parents-must-confirm-id?fbclid=IwAR0wnCP0PIPdA1ZnkiuNAuTNIHZi6_-Cv9Qc4sG3WFdjmv_GvIgL0tTEphY

 

The Tories are really busy letting this blatant racism and discrimination flood out, it doesn't matter who the targets are.

 

----------

 

And the blatant racism continues on the street as well, bolstered by the fact Government is behaving in the same way :

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-chinese-people-face-abuse-in-the-street-over-outbreak-11931779?fbclid=IwAR20Fle7w_s-0tanSw5rzWtbK9mqNPRGzWF1l49g7yYlLZL0H46SjArS5Gg

 

Now it's people of far eastern origin.  Apparently, they deserve the coronavirus and shouldn't be spreading it over here, even when they British nationals or have been studying in the UK for years and never returned home for a visit....

 

 

Quote

-SNIP-

 

Hide what, all your squirming is just you trying to hide something you wished would go away! lol

 

All that is pontificating bullplop.....  I don't want racism in politics, no matter the political side it's coming from.  You're still thinking you know which political side I support and you couldn't be more wrong with your conclusions (as you are with pretty much every post you've contributed to D&D).  If there are antisemites in Labour, I hope the next leader does root it out and expel them.  It'll set the standard that Boris will be expected to follow, rather than acting like he is, Caligula....  Trying to tap into the nostalgia for a Britain long gone, never to return.

 

Meanwhile, his position on deportations has been picked up by a certain opponent, and I'm posting this here because it's great and about the first tweet I agree with from this individual :

 

----------

 

EDIT : Javid resigns during the reshuffle as Boris wanted him to sack his team of aides....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-51487171

 

In other words, Sajid didn't like the idea of answering to Boris and Cummings directly, instead of having some opportunity to think for himself.

 

[ilovebender.com]

I see I'm trying to debate with a social warrior lol.

I've already told you, you cannot discuss Labour Antisemitism.

If you could, you would have.

5 hours ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

Well then, use of that phrase makes you the prime candidate for who is really suffering from it.  There's no need for the swear words either.

 

 

They are the nasty racist party and the Government are busily getting to work at being racist :
 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-man-blocked-uk-home-office-passport-brussels-a9332311.html?fbclid=IwAR2SPEf6tuf3DtgVS71UqGM4cfvDkdEFO8ude3wXokoS2ZI_vsYXMsJUXxE

 

The key quote from the article :

 

"A British citizen has been blocked from entering the UK after a holiday because the Home Office revoked his passport with no warning – rendering him stateless.

Fatush Lala, 33, who has lived in Britain since the age of 14, was told by border officials as he tried to board a flight home from Brussels airport that he had no right to do so.

 

Mr Lala, who lives in north London, has now been forced to live on the streets of the Belgian capital for more than three weeks. He says he has been pushed “from pillar to post” as he tries to rectify the situation. The Home Office has not responded to a letter from his MP sent a week ago.

 

David Lammy, Labour MP for Tottenham, said it was “grossly inhumane” for the government to prevent entry to someone who arrived in Britain as a minor and has called the country his home for the past 20 years.

 

Mr Lala, who was born in Serbia but moved to the UK as a teenager and naturalised, said he went to the UK embassy in Belgium to seek help, only to be told his British passport – the only one he has ever owned – was no longer valid and have it confiscated from him, leaving him stateless."

 

----------

 

They've even managed to claim this was an 'admin error,' although I'm not so sure asking a 101 year old man for proof of residence from his parents is giving people a warm, fuzzy feeling about settled status applications.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/12/home-office-tells-man-101-his-parents-must-confirm-id?fbclid=IwAR0wnCP0PIPdA1ZnkiuNAuTNIHZi6_-Cv9Qc4sG3WFdjmv_GvIgL0tTEphY

 

The Tories are really busy letting this blatant racism and discrimination flood out, it doesn't matter who the targets are.

 

----------

 

And the blatant racism continues on the street as well, bolstered by the fact Government is behaving in the same way :

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-chinese-people-face-abuse-in-the-street-over-outbreak-11931779?fbclid=IwAR20Fle7w_s-0tanSw5rzWtbK9mqNPRGzWF1l49g7yYlLZL0H46SjArS5Gg

 

Now it's people of far eastern origin.  Apparently, they deserve the coronavirus and shouldn't be spreading it over here, even when they British nationals or have been studying in the UK for years and never returned home for a visit....

 

 

 

All that is pontificating bullplop.....  I don't want racism in politics, no matter the political side it's coming from.  You're still thinking you know which political side I support and you couldn't be more wrong with your conclusions (as you are with pretty much every post you've contributed to D&D).  If there are antisemites in Labour, I hope the next leader does root it out and expel them.  It'll set the standard that Boris will be expected to follow, rather than acting like he is, Caligula....  Trying to tap into the nostalgia for a Britain long gone, never to return.

 

Meanwhile, his position on deportations has been picked up by a certain opponent, and I'm posting this here because it's great and about the first tweet I agree with from this individual :

 

----------

 

EDIT : Javid resigns during the reshuffle as Boris wanted him to sack his team of aides....

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-51487171

 

In other words, Sajid didn't like the idea of answering to Boris and Cummings directly, instead of having some opportunity to think for himself.

 

Since when are things equal?

 

Labour, Conservatives, not equal.

EU, US, not equal.

 

 

I'm afraid, you're going to have to grow up and learn that life can't be made equal, you should be able to discuss something; but you're not able to even discuss Labour antisemitism because in your warped world, everything's equal, so you won't discuss it at all it seems since you're way to discuss this is to point the finger at the Tory party.

You don't even understand the concept being closer to the US over the EU because in your mind, you believe the US and the EU are equal because they're both not British, so can't understand why someone would advocate for America First to replace EU First. I've told you, the US and the EU aren't equal, so it makes perfect sense to chose one over the other.

I fail to see how anything you have said about Labour's antisemitism is anything to do with Labour being the nasty party. Left winged idiots who don't know the UK might not even beware of the situation of Labour and Momentum; so if we don't discuss this, they wouldn't know about all the hate crimes committed by the 'so called' Left in the UK.

 

So I'm not debating someone so immature.

Grow up, because it's high time you learned the concept of favouritism and the ability to not hold 2 things in the same light.

Edited February 13, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

22 minutes ago, ilovebender.com said:

-SNIP-

 

You didn't even read my post, so why should I bother with breaking down your steaming excretions?

 

32 minutes ago, ilovebender.com said:

So I'm not debating someone so immature.

 

Immaturity is not something I'd link to your posting and debating style.

 

32 minutes ago, ilovebender.com said:

Grow up, because it's high time you learned the concept of favouritism and the ability to not hold 2 things in the same light.

 

Given your constant deflection from the racism right in front of you, with multiple pieces supporting it, it's clear you're blind to the fact that Tory policy is promoting racism of it's own.  Not just in office but in society in general.

[ilovebender.com]

19 minutes ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

You didn't even read my post, so why should I bother with breaking down your steaming excretions?

I read you trying to avoid discussing Labour Antisemitism and I saw you went into Social Warrior mode.

19 minutes ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

Given your constant deflection from the racism right in front of you...

No, given your constant deflection of the racism right in front of you! lol

Edited February 13, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

18 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

I read you trying to avoid discussing Labour Antisemitism and I saw you went into Social Warrior mode.

 

Social Warrior?  If that's the case why am I asking for a more realistic look at this issue, with suggestions that both main parties have evidence trails of racism to follow.  One-dimensional thinking isn't the best way to highlight this issue.

 

Besides, there's been very little in evidential sources since Autumn 2019, when the Media Reform Coalition published their report, stating that while there may be some issues with antisemitism, it's been overplayed and in their study of over 250 news articles, over 80 were misleading in their content.  This has fueled and mislead other investigations into the issue and now this is the main reason why I believe the next Labour Leader should promote a full and frank enquiry.  If the media is publishing misleading articles, then what's the real data and the possible culprits promoting antisemitism?

https://www.mediareform.org.uk/blog/new-mrc-research-finds-inaccuracies-and-distortions-in-media-coverage-of-antisemitism-and-the-labour-party

 

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No, given your constant deflection of the racism right in front of you! lol

 

Again, it's like you cannot answer the question, can you?  It's obvious the Government is promoting and enforcing a racist agenda, with numerous sources showing hostility to any non-natural UK citizens, yet you won't discuss it.  Rather than acting like a little brat, answer the question you've got and stop trying to peddle issues back onto one sole party..

[Pesos]

I'd be willing to bet that the majority of those articles, the misleading ones, originated from Murdoch owned papers. Which says it all really.

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

2 minutes ago, Pesos said:

I'd be willing to bet that the majority of those articles, the misleading ones, originated from Murdoch owned papers. Which says it all really.

 

Either that or the Daily Mail / Express.

 

Let's not forget the Mail Online has been de-listed as a trusted source from Microsoft (Now it has a banner stating it is not a trustworthy source) and Wikipedia (Who have refused to cite the Mail Online for entries since 2017, without a secondary source confirming the details).

[ilovebender.com]

13 minutes ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

Either that or the Daily Mail / Express.

 

Let's not forget the Mail Online has been de-listed as a trusted source from Microsoft (Now it has a banner stating it is not a trustworthy source) and Wikipedia (Who have refused to cite the Mail Online for entries since 2017, without a secondary source confirming the details).

You blame the media for reporting stories that turn our trust away from Labour and bring the Jewish Labour supporters to Parliament Square to protest against the reaction of their party?

Rather than admit the problem that is Momentum who campaigned against Labour and harassed and threatened Labour councilors. 

There is no trust in the Labour party with the voter, and you can blame who you want, it doesn't mean a thing.

5 hours ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

Social Warrior?  If that's the case why am I asking for a more realistic look at this issue, with suggestions that both main parties have evidence trails of racism to follow...

Because you think government is racially motivated when it deports criminals back to Jamaica; do you know that Jamaicans come in all races, black, white and Asian etc.. All colours.

Because you seem to think a racist joke by a Tory Toff is the same as a hate crime committed by a Momentum racist;

Saying a joke, unfunny; covering up your members from attacking Jews and defacing Jewish graves, hate crime, gets you investigated by watchdog - Stupid (like BNP) - Labour and BNP are the only two political parties to be investigated for racism - how is that equal to the Tory Party? How is that fake news when it's 'the news'?

Why don;t you realise Labour have a nasty cancer that hands us Tories power; It sucks when the only Opposition is Adolf Hitler though.

Edited February 14, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

3 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

You blame the media for reporting stories that turn our trust away from Labour and bring the Jewish Labour supporters to Parliament Square to protest against the reaction of their party?

Rather than admit the problem that is Momentum who campaigned against Labour and harassed and threatened Labour councilors. 

There is no trust in the Labour party with the voter, and you can blame who you want, it doesn't mean a thing.

 

I think you'll find the last time Jewish Labour Supporters marched on Parliament Square, was March 2018, while the report I cited was Oct 2019....  Spot the problem?

 

(I'll refer you to an Isreali site for this one, hopefully timeline issues might shock you into understanding the flaw in your argument.)

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/europe/shame-on-you-rally-against-anti-semitism-in-u-k-labour-gets-heated-1.5949527

 

Quote

Because you think government is racially motivated when it deports criminals back to Jamaica; do you know that Jamaicans come in all races, black, white and Asian etc.. All colours.

 

Doesn't stop the underlying issue that the appeal court issued orders over the phone to not deport 25 of the victims, due to phone access issues.  Also, separating a father from his wife and children, when they arrived as a child and have one drugs charge of possession, looks a little like the Home Secretary is busily being racist....

 

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Because you seem to think a racist joke by a Tory Toff is the same as a hate crime committed by a Momentum racist;

 

That Tory Toff is currently Prime Minister!  Boris seems to think it's okay to be racist, while back In 2017, the Labour Student leader resigned over past racist tweets and Alastair Stewart stood down from ITV News a few weeks back, amid a racist tweets row.

 

One rule for Tories and PM's, one rule for everyone else, eh?

 

 

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Saying a joke, unfunny; covering up your members from attacking Jews and defacing Jewish graves, hate crime, gets you investigated by watchdog - Stupid (like BNP) - Labour and BNP are the only two political parties to be investigated for racism - how is that equal to the Tory Party? How is that fake news when it's 'the news'?

 

One Dimensional news again....  Please confirm that it was Labour supporters defacing Jewish graves, because your accusations seem to be misleading.  The story appears to rise from the French muddy fields, are you sure they wern't stopped from mowing their lawns and spent Sunday defacing graves instead?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-50657066

 

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Why don;t you realise Labour have a nasty cancer that hands us Tories power; It sucks when the only Opposition is Adolf Hitler though.

 

I think you're mixing up Hitler with Good Old Uncle Joe....  Boris is the one very much in the mustachioed Nazi corner.

[Creed Bratton]

This picture sums up your average Brexit voter almost perfectly:

 

[jpm1]

@ilovebender.comsomewhere you asked me what was for me the definition of far right. i can't find back the post, so i'll quote like this. for me far right is a protester/contester that protests, or complain but has no idea of what he wants, or complaining for. and who gives very poor to none argument when you ask him about a subject. for example he wants to quit EU, to become stronger alone. that's true that since Man is Man, he succeeded better when he was alone. he wants to stop immigration, but has not a single coherency into his project to achieve this. Europe is the bad guy that is praying the devil into a European secret room. but he has not a single clue, of how economy works, and not a single clue of how to replace what he is critizising. he wants to put France on fire. but when you ask him what he would do to replace actual government, he has absolutely no idea. i would say far rightist is a c..t, but actually i won't, coz a c..t is useful to something, while a far rightist knows only destruction, in its most stupid version

[Ned Bingham]

Bring back Ed Milliband as Labour leader. Him being Jewish (at least mildly so), he might be able to sort out Labour's "Jewish Problem" (ahem). And with Labour presumably being out of power for the next few years, he need only be an interim leader until Labour's glorious return to victory.

[Grotti Vigilante]

2 hours ago, jpm1 said:

@ilovebender.comsomewhere you asked me what was for me the definition of far right. i can't find back the post, so i'll quote like this. for me far right is a protester/contester that protests, or complain but has no idea of what he wants, or complaining for. and who gives very poor to none argument when you ask him about a subject. for example he wants to quit EU, to become stronger alone. that's true that since Man is Man, he succeeded better when he was alone. he wants to stop immigration, but has not a single coherency into his project to achieve this. Europe is the bad guy that is praying the devil into a European secret room. but he has not a single clue, of how economy works, and not a single clue of how to replace what he is critizising. he wants to put France on fire. but when you ask him what he would do to replace actual government, he has absolutely no idea. i would say far rightist is a c..t, but actually i won't, coz a c..t is useful to something, while a far rightist knows only destruction, in its most stupid version

Let us not pretend that qualities of being a loudmouth on policies with no practical solutions are only those of the far-right. The far-left are exactly the same with their annual women's marches, pro-European protests, and climate change marches, which means it cannot be used as a definition for far-right. The definition of far-right is, quite simply, politics that lean further to the right on the left-right spectrum than the standard political right-wing, or the extreme right-wing sect of a political party or group. Some common ideologies include things such as extreme nationalism (particularly ethnic-nationalism), chauvinism, religious fundamentalism, homophobia, anti-communism, and reactionary politics. The part of your post I have highlighted does align with the qualities of extreme nationalism and tribalism.

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

21 minutes ago, Grotti Vigilante said:

Let us not pretend that qualities of being a loudmouth on policies with no practical solutions are only those of the far-right. The far-left are exactly the same with their annual women's marches, pro-European protests, and climate change marches, which means it cannot be used as a definition for far-right.

 

I think you'll find the far and extreme left are as Pro-Brexit as the far right, and it's no real secret that Red Jezza and his closest supporters are as anti-EU as the Tories, it's just the relationship after Brexit they differ on.  So being Pro-EU is more a liberal centrist issue and it encompasses both moderate Tories and Labour supporters, as well as other parties, such as the Lib-Dems, SNP and Greens.

 

As for women's and climate change marches, they're more broadly anyone but the far right....

 

 

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The definition of far-right is, quite simply, politics that lean further to the right on the left-right spectrum than the standard political right-wing, or the extreme right-wing sect of a political party or group. Some common ideologies include things such as extreme nationalism (particularly ethnic-nationalism), chauvinism, religious fundamentalism, homophobia, anti-communism, and reactionary politics. The part of your post I have highlighted does align with the qualities of extreme nationalism and tribalism.

 

Finding scapegoats and refusing to admit your flaws and faults is a common trope in politics.  In the case of the current Tories, it's blame anyone, the EU for ongoing issues and upcoming complications in Brexit, Remainers for not having faith in Brexit, experts for trying to explain to them Brexit is a really bad idea....

They'd try and find a way to blame God himself, if they thought their devoted would believe them, that's the level to which they've sunk to pass the buck.

[jpm1]

actually i think far right, and far left are pretty much the same. thus there's no reasons not to put these in the same bucket. in these dudes mind it's maybe different, because they want to give themselves some good conscience, not to see how c..t they are. so they try to say they have right, or left values. but they have very similar behaviors. they navigate at sight, in the fog, have no clue of where they going, and prone the use of violence

Edited February 15, 2020 by jpm1

[Grotti Vigilante]

2 hours ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

I think you'll find the far and extreme left are as Pro-Brexit as the far right, and it's no real secret that Red Jezza and his closest supporters are as anti-EU as the Tories, it's just the relationship after Brexit they differ on.  So being Pro-EU is more a liberal centrist issue and it encompasses both moderate Tories and Labour supporters, as well as other parties, such as the Lib-Dems, SNP and Greens.

I did consider the more senior left-wing figures in terms of Brexit, but with a right-wing government and the tribalist nature of extremists in general, I'd imagine they'd oppose leaving the EU just because it's contrarian to their perceived enemies. I've no doubt in my mind that Jeremy Corbyn would support a no-deal exit if he were the one doing it. Dare I even say though that it should've been the Tories who opposed leaving the EU since preserving the status quo is the nature of conservatism? I mean right-wingers are more risk averse than the left, so why they would support Brexit outside of nationalism and tribalism baffles me. Indeed the centrists may just as well have their own opinions since Brexit isn't really much of a left-right issue. It's a complex one that cannot be boiled down to such.

 

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As for women's and climate change marches, they're more broadly anyone but the far right....

I think the point still stands about both of them having no solutions to the problems they go on about though. That was Labour's problem at the 2019 election in my opinion. They were a party of protesters rather than a government-in-waiting. 

 

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Finding scapegoats and refusing to admit your flaws and faults is a common trope in politics.  In the case of the current Tories, it's blame anyone, the EU for ongoing issues and upcoming complications in Brexit, Remainers for not having faith in Brexit, experts for trying to explain to them Brexit is a really bad idea....

They'd try and find a way to blame God himself, if they thought their devoted would believe them, that's the level to which they've sunk to pass the buck.

I've always said that democracy's biggest problem was that it was always going to be someone else's fault. In this modern political climate, there's absolutely no escaping it even if you don't watch the news or keep up with it much.

 

1 hour ago, jpm1 said:

actually i think far right, and far left are pretty much the same. thus there's no reasons not to put these in the same bucket. in these dudes mind it's maybe different, because they want to give themselves some good conscience, not to see how c..t they are. so they try to say they have right, or left values. but they have very similar behaviors. they navigate at sight, in the fog, have no clue of where they going, and prone the use of violence

Completely agree. There's more in common with Communism and Nazism (in practice, not ideology) than there is between either one of them and Liberalism. That's probably why it'd be more appropriate to depict the spectrum as a circle rather than a bar. The left side of the circle being left-wing politics, and the right being right-wing politics. The bottom of the circle is the centre, while the top is the extreme grounds.

Edited February 15, 2020 by Grotti Vigilante

[ilovebender.com]

On 2/14/2020 at 4:29 PM, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

I think you'll find the last time Jewish Labour Supporters marched on Parliament Square, was March 2018, while the report I cited was Oct 2019....  Spot the problem?

 

(I'll refer you to an Isreali site for this one, hopefully timeline issues might shock you into understanding the flaw in your argument.)

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/europe/shame-on-you-rally-against-anti-semitism-in-u-k-labour-gets-heated-1.5949527

I remember when the Jewish Labour Movement took to Parliament Square.

What's your point? You don't see a problem with the fact that they marched in the first place or that the same leadership's still festering in the opposition?

On 2/14/2020 at 4:29 PM, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

Doesn't stop the underlying issue that the appeal court issued orders over the phone to not deport 25 of the victims, due to phone access issues.  Also, separating a father from his wife and children, when they arrived as a child and have one drugs charge of possession, looks a little like the Home Secretary is busily being racist....

Why do you claim it's racially motivated when right to remain in the UK doesn't come down to race; these people probably all black probably not, it's Jamaica, Jamaica's a country as I said, made up of many people to form one Jamaican people; they have a national motto to that effect I don't know by heart by am paraphrasing, but I've met Jamaicans of all colours, so I don't buy it being racial; more; harsh immigration; you commit a crime, you lose your right to stay mentality.

It's not exactly something I support; I liken it to Donald Trump utilizing ICE and making America look more like a police state; but I won't listen to any claims that it's somehow racist and that's it's racially motivated.

On 2/14/2020 at 4:29 PM, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

 

That Tory Toff is currently Prime Minister! 

 

You'd have to grow up butter cup; it's just a stupid joke, not a hate crime.

 

On 2/14/2020 at 4:29 PM, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

Boris seems to think it's okay to be racist, while back In 2017, the Labour Student leader resigned over past racist tweets and Alastair Stewart stood down from ITV News a few weeks back, amid a racist tweets row.

Was that person forced out or did they choose to leave? If they chose to leave, then that's on them.

[Uncle Sikee Atric]

14 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

I remember when the Jewish Labour Movement took to Parliament Square.

What's your point? You don't see a problem with the fact that they marched in the first place or that the same leadership's still festering in the opposition?

 

Still not understanding timelines....

The protest by the JLM was 18 months before the investigations into misleading articles and content in the media was published.  At the time they thought it was right, but events and evidence since show they were not given the correct information.

 

14 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

Why do you claim it's racially motivated when right to remain in the UK doesn't come down to race; these people probably all black probably not, it's Jamaica, Jamaica's a country as I said, made up of many people to form one Jamaican people; they have a national motto to that effect I don't know by heart by am paraphrasing, but I've met Jamaicans of all colours, so I don't buy it being racial; more; harsh immigration; you commit a crime, you lose your right to stay mentality.

 

It's about hatred of non-natural UK citizens, regardless of skin colour.

 

By your mentality, you'll be deporting a 40 year old, who came to the UK aged five, if they get a speeding ticket.

 

14 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

It's not exactly something I support; I liken it to Donald Trump utilizing ICE and making America look more like a police state; but I won't listen to any claims that it's somehow racist and that's it's racially motivated.

You'd have to grow up butter cup; it's just a stupid joke, not a hate crime.

 

If that's your opinion, let me conclude some opinions about you.

1 : You have 'Bernard Manning's Greatest Stand Up Routines,' on your playlist.

2 : You are an avid collector of Robertson's Jam Golliwog memorabilia.

3 : You're eagerly awaiting the return of, 'The Black & White Minstrel Show,' to the BBC.

 

The PM making racial jokes isn't acceptable at any point, no matter how long ago it was.  If you're still still eager to defend him with, 'it's a joke,' I guess you're one of those people to use the P word to describe all people from the Indian sub-continent.

 

14 hours ago, ilovebender.com said:

Was that person forced out or did they choose to leave? If they chose to leave, then that's on them.

 

At least they were happy to admit their previous comments were wrong and accepted the consequences....

[ilovebender.com]

1 hour ago, Uncle Sikee Atric said:

 

Still not understanding timelines....

The protest by the JLM was 18 months before the investigations into misleading articles and content in the media was published.  At the time they thought it was right, but events and evidence since show they were not given the correct information.

No smoke without fire; the protests were the smoke, the behaviour was the fire, the investigation happening post fact-um makes perfect sense in this chronological existence we all live in.

 

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It's about hatred of non-natural UK citizens, regardless of skin colour.

No it's not. It's illogical to jump to this conclusion though.

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By your mentality, you'll be deporting a 40 year old, who came to the UK aged five, if they get a speeding ticket.

 

It's like you can't read or something; how does this support anything I've said on this policy? I feel it's harsh, but not racist.

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If that's your opinion, let me conclude some opinions about you.

1 : You have 'Bernard Manning's Greatest Stand Up Routines,' on your playlist.

2 : You are an avid collector of Robertson's Jam Golliwog memorabilia.

3 : You're eagerly awaiting the return of, 'The Black & White Minstrel Show,' to the BBC.

Well, your conclusions are often wrong, but this one just smacks of desperation on your part.

 

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The PM making racial jokes isn't acceptable at any point, no matter how long ago it was.

I don't know, it's not like he covered up hate crimes like Jeremy Corbyn, there's a reason why the police in London investigated him; it was because they thought he was obstructing the course of justice by hiding incidents of hate crimes made by Momentum from the police.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-party-antisemitism-latest-criminal-investigation-met-police-jeremy-corbyn-hate-crime-a8613851.html

This isn't even a reference to the watchdog that also had to investigate Labour, that's somebody else.

 

If it's so unacceptable to make a joke, then why aren't the Tories under investigation for being racist or obstructing the course of justice to hide hate crimes?

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  If you're still still eager to defend him with, 'it's a joke,' I guess you're one of those people to use the P word to describe all people from the Indian sub-continent.

 

I've met people who's described themselves as Paki, I've met a lot of people who call themselves Nigga and say Nigga a lot too.

If the UK ever turns into a country where we can't make bad jokes, that would be a sad day, a lot sadder than the bad joke imo; when you liken a bad joke to a hate crime, you're acting rather desperate to paint the Tories as racist despite the mounting evidence that has lead to investigations of Labour. 

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At least they were happy to admit their previous comments were wrong and accepted the consequences....

I guess you're just a PC baby who can't take a joke - as for your assertion I support deporting people, I just think it's harsh, but it's not racist; I don't support or condemn it - it is what it is; you commit a crime, you have a conviction; that then results into that person no longer being illegible to remain in the UK logic.

 

You're talking to a white boy from a black neighbourhood (Thornton Heath), you're talking to a straight man also at home in an LGBT neighbourhood (Soho) - this is just life.

You're talking to a Tory like you're some active social warrior who has a problem with admitting you're intolerant and feel a joke is a step too far and so probably want to police it so people can't even make unfunny jokes anymore; How is a racist joke a hate crime?  

How does one unfunny joke and a harsh immigration policy have any equivalence to hate crimes committed by Momentum?

 

You might call the media misleading, but that's just you trying to mislead.

In your warped head, it's a conspiracy against Labour, but in the real world, it's nothing but life; you commit a hate crime, you act antisemitic, then people will investigate, people will make a fuss about it; that's not misleading media, that's just investigative journalism.  

 

If you deny facts, that's on you, but the fact is, Labour lost hard because nobody can trust them given their reputation on antisemitism and their vision of the UK; they lost hard at the general election; Because Momentum are racist thugs who back the Labour leader who in turn he backs back. If that's your answer to being Left in the UK, I'm sticking with the Centre Right.

 

In reality, it's just handing people like Boris Johnson power. Decent people across the country who support Labour couldn't even bring themselves to vote for Momentum or Corbyn; that's the truth.

Edited February 16, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[ilovebender.com]

On 2/15/2020 at 11:00 AM, Ned Bingham said:

Bring back Ed Milliband as Labour leader. Him being Jewish (at least mildly so), he might be able to sort out Labour's "Jewish Problem" (ahem). And with Labour presumably being out of power for the next few years, he need only be an interim leader until Labour's glorious return to victory.

Why no Chukka Ummana? That's a guy who could make me think about electing Labour if I ever return to being A-political/floating voter status - that's the guy to do it.

He took Momentum to task and even once spoke to my dear ol' Granny may she rest in peace; since they shared 'stomping grounds' so, anyone who makes my grandmother smile's okay in my books, but this person has proven himself loyal to his party by taking Momentum to task, and was chewed up and spit out by what I liken to Nazis, the cancer within the party.

Sure, he jumped ship and ran to Change who weren't pleased with Antisemtism or Brexit (Labour or Tories), which kind of killed his career, or, hasn't helped it - I think he's now a Lib Dem.

Edited February 16, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[Smith John]

Meanwhile, I'm facing the massive decision whether to watch the Labour leadership debate on Channel 4+1, or, Love Island on ITV2; both coincide with each others' 9pm slots, and both are of equal importance.

[IGLOO WHITE]

love island represents everything wrong with this country bunch of dolescum looking for a meal ticket suppose thats the same as labour debate nice one good job

[ilovebender.com]

I've only heard of Love Island because of Your Face Or Mine tends to have people from Love Island on as 'celebrities'...

BBC News made a big thing about the presenter's death; I want a rebate on my TV license for it; I pay for the news, not Love Island news. Actually, I pay because this country's not paradise and can still find a reason to mess with me.

Edited February 18, 2020 by ilovebender.com

[jpm1]

@ilovebender.comi'll answer the other post here

 

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burqa isn't extremism... It's like a niqab.

we forbidde niqab because of public security reasons. plus as i said once, we don't like religious zeal in public. if you didn't have enough love during your youth find yourself another way to affirm yourself. but don't pi.. off the people around you

 

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Then don't say you're like UK or USA where the notion of the rights of minorities makes us a beacon for those fleeing persecution from the likes of France and Germany since time and memorial from the Huguenots to the Jews.

yeah the US segregation was a cool exemple of minorities caring. as a gran-gran son of an Italian immigrant, i never ever had any racism problems in my life. simply because when my gran-granpa at the moment he reached the French frontier, he became French and nothing else. in my family we all got raised like that. and we never ever had integration issues. linking immigration, to a insalubrious camp destruction makes me think you like shortenings. if all the brexiters behave like that, good luck to the British. maybe in your mind you wanted us to let young kids live among rats. because of course you didn't read the story until the end. in France when such thing happens we ensure the people are in good health, and they find new homes

 

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more like 1974.

dude maybe you misunderstand France with another country

 

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I judge your country for being so in the EU, what's it to you? You're 'so in' the EU, you literally can't comprehend existence without it, and are telling me my country's over because we can picture life outside the EU; good luck with the EU.

you should read few books about WWI. i wonder if you'd be still pro division after having lived few months in the trenches

 

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It's one comment indeed, in a French problem; the problem isn't one comment, the problem is rape culture and France.

like i said it seems you like shortening. in your head it's like that because you think it should be like that. no matter how stupid your arguments are. even a 3 yo kid wouldn't say things like that

 

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Well, also, you bull doze minorities and think you're somehow civilized just because you're in Europe, yet you regard rape as nothing and bull doze minorities. Given countries in Europe, how they are, how they were, why isn't it a backwards mud hole with backward beliefs and a dodgy past?

already answered