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Paul723

Am I the only one… [Big Smoke]? <Spoiler>

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Paul723

who knew Smoke would betray CJ? People are always saying that they would've never expected Smoke to turn his back on CJ and that they were shocked. The first time Big Smoke was introduced, I knew that he was definitely up to something. The clues to his betrayal were that he stayed in CJ's house during his mom's funeral, he lives in Idlewood, Ballas' territory, he tried to change the subject while CJ and Sweet were discussing their mom during the drive thru mission, he refused to shoot at the Ballas at the same mission, using the food as an excuse, and he had Tenpenny and Pulaski coming out of his house every time CJ would arrive. All those clues should've been obvious to everyone that Smoke would betray CJ some point of the game. I wan't fooled the slightest bit by Smoke's "good guy" act. In fact, that just made me more suspicious of him. When someone tries too hard to be nice to you, you know that they're up to something. I cannot possibly be the only one who expected Smoke to become a traitor, because those clues I mentioned were too obvious.

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mrfilmpjesmaker123

When i play it now i know x)

But at first i would never guess something like this would happen

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watersgta3

No you're not. I too was suspicious of Smoke's actions in the game. People are always saying how they would expect Ryder to turn into a traitor, but let's face it. Based on his attributes in the game, there's no way that Ryder would betray the gang on his own. If he was going to become a traitor, then he had to have had another member with him to do the same, and who else besides Big Smoke? So if Ryder's betrayal was obvious, then Big Smoke's betrayal should've been obvious too since there were clues to his betrayal that were far more obtrusive.

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Boyz2Society

You're not alone, my friend. The fact that Smoke kept on being nice to CJ throughout the whole game made me question his true nature. By the time that Cesar showed CJ his friends' betrayal, I wasn't surprised a bit, though I really wish they would've kept Ryder a member of the GSF and had just Smoke as the traitor.

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GTA19somethin

People were fooled by Smoke's good-guy act. That's why they wouldn't have suspected him. But it was so easy to tell that he was definitely up to something.

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Alexander

It was too obvious that he was on something IMO. I mean, why CJ and Sweet believed all his bullsh*t? It was right in front of them.

 

"I got some money from my aunt"

"I'm just finising my fries"

Dude, Wtf?

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lloydo

"I'm just finising my fries"

 

What did that mean? He didn't want shoot because he bitched out? Or was scared he'd be recognised by the ballas?

 

I was suspicious a few missions into the game. There was quite a few signs he wanted to more control.

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Jioyt 123

It was too obvious that he was on something IMO. I mean, why CJ and Sweet believed all his bullsh*t? It was right in front of them.

"I got some money from my aunt"

"I'm just finising my fries"

Dude, Wtf?

Bull sh*t = BS = Big Smoke.

Surely at least one of tye Johnson brothers would have realised somthing fishy about him, unless (story wise, like before the game) he has allways acted like he wanted more. Thats my idea of it anyways.

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lil weasel

Stupidity in literature/movies/plays is common, in that common sense would end most of these in the first 20 minutes. It is necessary to allow the stories to continue.

When dealing with fantasy people must close down parts of the brain.

 

The question should be not how much will the most Players accept.

Example: IV, and V are no fun to play with all their 'realism' but San Ann is with all its inane and improbable missions. SA has missions that are improbable, you can use weapons, vehicles, and approaches that are not forced in many.

 

For those with no imagination, who cannot get into the Play of the game, it is sad. We do have a real world out there. Just turn off the machine and take a walk.

Edited by lil weasel

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Alexander

That's not the point. Do you think I care about SA being unrealistic? No, I love this game the way it is, I'm just saying that the whole Big Smoke thing was obvius since the beginning.

This game is my favorite, thanks to the unreal things, like the jetpacks, secret agencies, and the gangster/musical producer/car saler/casino owner.

It's a GAME, It's not important.

 

Do I found little things that I don't like? Yes, but that's normal. I like surprises in the games, that's all.

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lil weasel

Actually Big Smoke did not 'betray' Carl....
He was in business long before CJ returned for the funeral.
Sweet being the loser he is, did not notice anything or even suspect anything.
And, it seems that BS & Ryder actually did not do anything to Carl other than to stay in business. They made no overt attacks on Carl, they did not "turn in" Carl for any of his crimes. It was Carl who attacked them. It seems that Carl is Psycho (burning people alive, buried a man alive, abandoning aircraft in flight, espionage, sabotage, etc.)

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Alexander

Sure, Big Smoke wasn't trying to betray Carl. CJ returns to Los Santos after he starts with his drug business, but he did betray the Families, sold the 'hood to the Ballas, and turn the gang into a bunch of crack addicts and drug dealers.

Where was Sweet when Smoke did all of that? Was he too busy being an asshole? Even when CJ saves him from the SBF, the cops and gets him out of jail, he still acts like an idiot to Carl.

CJ did good attacking them. Ryder and Smoke were going to take him out of the way as soon as they could, and I think they tried. Carl was supposed to be in the ambush in "The Green Saber" with Sweet.

Edited by AlexanderS4

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lil weasel

Carl was in the ambush. Just that he figured out it was an ambush before he got there.

But apparently Tenpenny had other plans for Carl.

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SAVILLAIN

cj should have pulled a ryder and faked his death

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Son of Zeus

Smoke in CJ's house in the beginning of the game could have also implied he was waiting to take CJ to the funeral. After all, he was coming after 5 years.

 

However that mission Drive Thru was suspicious. Until that I thought Smoke was a very good friend....

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roadrage19

I thought I was the only one who was suspicious of Smoke since the beginning. Glad to know I wasn't the only one after all.

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hot-temper27

I can't see why no one would've expected Smoke to turn on the game. Did they not see how he lives in Idlewood, refused to shoot at the Ballas when the friends were getting something to eat, and had Tenpenny and Pulaski walking out of his house when CJ arrived there? That should've been obvious that Smoke would betray Grove Street at some point. I always knew that he would since the first time I played the game too.

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PoeticWhisper

Not to mention, the cutscene where he was trying to defend crack dealers actions to Sweet.

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MrPeteyMax

I didn't know when I first played, but I was like 12 or something at the time. I like how they did it with The Introduction and stuff, as well. Big Smoke was my favourite character though and it upsets me that he had to die :(

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Jioyt 123

Dont worry MrPeteyMax, Ryder was my favourite character. And look at the death he got. :( sad times... :)

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MrPeteyMax

Dont worry MrPeteyMax, Ryder was my favourite character. And look at the death he got. :( sad times... :)

 

The beta one was better, but still not that good :(

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Jioyt 123

Agreed. Maybe he survived and dies cooler on last mission.... Blah blah blah :). It wasn't the best death in the world but i can live with it. Anyways, the first couple of times i played SA (never got past green sabre.) i never even thought of smoke or Ryder betraying, just expected something bigger to evolve with tenpenny.

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90sGTA

It was pretty easy to catch on to Smoke's betrayal from the beginning of the game. I don't see how anyone missed those clues you pointed out, because they were pretty obvious.

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Jioyt 123

In my defence, when i first got this game (2006 or 2007?) i was rather 6-7 or 8 (depending on time of the year). All i cared about then was taking it in turns with my friend OR Having fun in 2 player.

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helpplease

TBH I forgot about the plot when you got to the countryside and San Fierro.

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Stoney0503

On my first playthrough I didn't expect him to betray you, but now that I look back at it, It was so obvious he was gonna betray them, he moves out into Ballas territory, doesn't kill any ballas (except in the mission 'Drive by').

 

I wish Ryder didn't betray GSF as it would make some kind of irony in the story, the good guy betrays you but the asshole doesn't.

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helpplease

I think we all saw OG betray coming a mile a way.

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PhillBellic

In my opinion, he gave off negative vibes, to say the least.

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TheMcSame

I had my suspicions since the drive thru mission tbh.

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JB1982

First time I played the game I can't say I was expecting it but it wasn't a shock either when it happened as I had picked up on some of the clues that others have mentioned but hadn't worked out their relevance. Once the reveal took place in TGS I instantly thought of things such as the house in Idlewood, the cosiness he seemed to have with Tenpenny and Pulaski and had an "Ah, of course!" moment.

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