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Young Martini

Why do some of you hate CJ?

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Young Martini

I saw some peeps in here hating CJ. Why? I really loved that guy so much... Anyone can give me reasons?

Edited by lil weasel

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Flachbau

Some people say they hate him because he comes from the "gangster" part of life.

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Young Martini

Some people say they hate him because he comes from the "gangster" part of life.

Well, that's pathetic.

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latigreblue

I'm going to put what I've seen so far and my opinion on that:

 

  • He's a whiny bitch - well, so far, he's the youngest protagonist except for maybe Franklin. They keep comparing him to Tommy, who did a 15 year stint in jail and was sent down to Vice City to do a risky job. CJ just went home for his mom's funeral and found himself in the middle of all of the crap. Of course, he is going to be unhappy to do it.
  • Because he's a gang-banger/from the ghetto, he should not be able to fly a plane or do any of the other stuff he can do. I just say Tommy was also a gang member and spent his younger years in jail but I don't anyone questioning how he came by his skills. (Don't get me wrong, I lurve Tommy)
  • Because he is black. Many people don't want to come out and say it but I found there were people who would not play San Andreas because of the 'gang' lifestyle portrayed. They start back with the series at IV. It's their preference but I find it hypocritical that they can play as a dope using, psychotic, Mafia capo but their high principles won't let them play as a black gang member. Some who did play could only do so if they changed the skin of the character to some generic white guy.

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Young Martini

<p>

 

I'm going to put what I've seen so far and my opinion on that:

 

  • He's a whiny bitch - well, so far, he's the youngest protagonist except for maybe Franklin. They keep comparing him to Tommy, who did a 15 year stint in jail and was sent down to Vice City to do a risky job. CJ just went home for his mom's funeral and found himself in the middle of all of the crap. Of course, he is going to be unhappy to do it.
  • Because he's a gang-banger/from the ghetto, he should not be able to fly a plane or do any of the other stuff he can do. I just say Tommy was also a gang member and spent his younger years in jail but I don't anyone questioning how he came by his skills. (Don't get me wrong, I lurve Tommy)
  • Because he is black. Many people don't want to come out and say it but I found there were people who would not play San Andreas because of the 'gang' lifestyle portrayed. They start back with the series at IV. It's their preference but I find it hypocritical that they can play as a dope using, psychotic, Mafia capo but their high principles won't let them play as a black gang member. Some who did play could only do so if they changed the skin of the character to some generic white guy.

He's 25 in SA, and Franklin is 25 at V I guess. And thanks for the explanation and opinion ;).

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Mr_Leone

I couldn't give a Jim Bob Jibbery f*ck about the fact he's black. I don't even hate Young Maylay, I liked CJ's voice work, even if he's a whiner, you want to know why CJ isn't a good protagonist? You want to know why? BAD SCRIPT. 105 missions aren't going change that. You can't have the thug from Grove come back and do things so quickly. Tommy came out of prison and took over a town, and you could see it, Tommy was the f*cking Harwood Butcher. CJ in my opinion should have never left the hood. San Fierro and Las Venturas are terrible for CJ. Imagine if the drama was all in the hoods? A gang story. Something Young Maylay could have portrayed perfectly. CJ should have never worked for Toreno, or Truth, or anybody like that. CRASH with Samuel L Jackson and Chris Penn would have been far better than the drivel we got in GTA V, let alone Tenpenny's inconsistency throughout SA, not showing up enough. I didn't like how they didn't have CRASH up CJ's ass. What happened to the Ralph Pendelburry case? Why not use that as leverage against CJ?

 

 

GTA V and GTA SA have the same problem. They are only good during the beginning.

Edited by Mr_Leone

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SonOfLiberty

He was a soft cock who let everyone push him around.

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latigreblue

Oh please, every GTA protagonist has been forced to do work for someone they found distasteful. SOL, your precious Niko is tricked and betrayed by Dmitri. Flaccid dick syndrome must be a condition that they were all born with.

 

Most of us had fun in Los Santos at the beginning but we end up losing everything and being put in some back-a-yard little town far away. But the story was never solely about gang life in Los Santos, it was about a gang member being taken out of his usual environment and experiencing this journey in a fictional California with Vegas thrown in.

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SonOfLiberty

Oh please, every GTA protagonist has been forced to do work for someone they found distasteful. SOL, your precious Niko is tricked and betrayed by Dmitri. Flaccid dick syndrome must be a condition that they were all born with.

 

Of course every protagonist is forced to work for someone they may find distasteful. I'm not sure how any of the stories would progress if they didn't. However I couldn't see CJ having any state of mind to make sarcastic jabs whilst being tied up in a dirty, sh*thole basement and being threatened with a hacksaw like Niko did.

 

IMO he's too juvenile. I can't take someone seriously who can orchestrate a hit on a mafia run casino yet has the tendency to get teary eyed when a gun is pulled on them.

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Mr_Leone

OH PLEASE DONT SHOOT ME T BONE

 

I'LL SUCK YO DICK T BONE

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mrfilmpjesmaker123

We know you'd like to see that^^

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Mr_Leone

We know you'd like to see that^^

Hot coffee mod.

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latigreblue

I think we're making the same point. Yup, some of that was truly cringe-worthy and I think his age is a factor in that. But I also think that by the time Carl returns to Los Santos for a Home in the Hills he's changed and grown as a character. Even by the time of the casino job, I feel Carl has hardened enough to be able to make sarcastic jabs whilst being tied up in a dirty, sh*thole basement and being threatened with a hacksaw like Niko did.

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SonOfLiberty

I think we're making the same point. Yup, some of that was truly cringe-worthy and I think his age is a factor in that. But I also think that by the time Carl returns to Los Santos for a Home in the Hills he's changed and grown as a character. Even by the time of the casino job, I feel Carl has hardened enough to be able to make sarcastic jabs whilst being tied up in a dirty, sh*thole basement and being threatened with a hacksaw like Niko did.

I don't think it has anything to do with his age. Franklin and Luis are the same age yet I don't feel the same way about them.

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latigreblue

Luis hard because he been to jail and Franklin level headed to the point of boring. If that joker Lamar wasn't there, you'd fall asleep at your console.

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Tyla

Let's watch it again shall we?

 

[YOUTUBE]

[/YOUTUBE]

 

Maybe I'm watching a different video but it looks to me as if he's having his airway closed off by a psychotic 200lb Mexican with the jump on him. The hell do you expect him to do other than struggle?

 

I noticed Niko was hardly a barrel of laughs after Andrei started to lay into him with the hacksaw. Coupled with Roman's screams I seem to think he realised the game could be up.

 

Carl's whole "I'm just tryna make some money!" spiel is him attempting to carry off his infiltration of the Loco Syndicate and to not give his game up, no different to Niko putting on a front when he first wakes in the basement. They're both very good actors - hardly the skill of a juvenile.

 

I don't think CJ was weak. He arrives back in Los Santos five years after f*cking everything up. He sticks around and puts work in despite everyone riding his ass over Brian. That shows strength of character.

 

His dealings with Tenpenny - who else of the protagonists had to deal with someone like Tenpenny? Someone who at every turn can get at them?

 

This is a guy who dismantles a drug syndicate and infiltrates the Mafia to rob their casino. I don't think anyone can say he's anything less than versatile. As for him turning his hand to a lot of things - yeah, consistency isn't San Andreas strong point - but it presents a formula that doesn't deviate from Vice City and Vercetti picking up and learning things along the way. Hardly think a guy who'd been canned for 15 years and couldn't swim was magically equipped to deal with everything thrown at him through the game.

 

Only time it slips with Carl is Catalina. That stuff was pathetic. Case of Rockstar sacrificing any character development up until then to throw in a crossover with GTAIII, sadly.

 

Why do I think CJ gets a lot of hate? Because the general audience can't understand no one before or since CJ navigated so many challenges/antagonists in the games as Carl faced in San Andreas. Would the game have been a lot better without being drawn out over the Badlands/Fierro/Robada/Venturas? Absolutely. The extent he's talked up as a pussy? Bullsh*t. He takes his licks, callouses up and comes out of the game head over heels over the other protagonists in terms of success.

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Osho

CJ is cool.

I liked him and still enjoy him playing, but why the f*ck should I care about those who hate him?

I don't like Niko, but each to its own. Seriously, the only reason comes to my mind is that many are just trying to get worked up for no other reason than to have some laughs, because of the silly adventures CJ had.

There is no way they can digest the fact that it's the developers who chose to offer "not so serious and saddy-saddy experience", rather light-hearted fun that really worked well and fitted CJ, esp. the way he's starting out and meeting kinds of people throughout, not only for you to enjoy but also experiencing ( by playing the missions ) what troubles he face.

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Young Martini

I enjoyed playing GTA SA, too. In my opinion it would be better if R* made SA only in the hood. But anyways it was ok, except for some missions like breaking into Area 69 to get a jetpack to steal stuff... Well isn't that too unrealistic and too much for a gangbanger? Then some people hate him that he let people ride on him. I disagree. He's just a young naive guy, who came on his hometown after 5 years being away. And of course the sh*t changed. Everything changed. He gets blamed for his brother's, Brian's, death by his elder brother, Sweet. Then he just came on his mom funeral, and for one moment he got in the middle of all the crap in there. People rode on him, but he's a legend anyways. We can't blame the character because of R*. It had some mistakes but it's still a fantastic game, which's being liked and played since its first day until now. So we all agree with this? Haha :p

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|-Dan-|

The story itself was good,some points from it were not...After he got taken out of LS and Sweet got in prison,LS turned into chaos,so CJ had to look for other places to get the $...The Badlands part is very good...And then,SF,meeting Wu Zi,this part was also very good...But then,the stupid Jizzy...All of a sudden,he gets into contact with this pimp,and works for him...Things go well,untill Truth`s dumb missions from VM..Stealing a jetpack and green sh*t ? Too much for a ghetto boy...Same for Toreno`s missions..Stealing a Hydra,destroying boats,and the army won`t give a sh*t ? Lucky CJ...The LV part is excellent...Having to take a card to enter the casino,and together with your team robbing Caligula,it was perfect,except for the part where you had to run on the buildings...And then,the return..Going back in the hood was like a breath of fresh air..Now CJ has to deal with the stuff which he should`ve done ni the beggining,proving Ballas GS is the best...The only bad thing about it is that this happens quite fast..2 or 3 missions and bam! Hood`s are yours,without even Sweet`s help..And the final mission...After CJ took care of Ryder,he had to take care of BS too,and he did it in style..All the way...untill Tenpenny`s appearance...All of a sudden,he comes from nowhere,and almost gets CJ...Weird thing is:How did he get in the building and got the fire truck in the front of the palace without being seen by Sweet? And then the revenge...Driving trough half of the city,trying to get Tenpenny...Chasing him,all the way untill he falls of the bridge...And then,he dies

 

The story is about 8/10,but it could be better with no jetpacks,goo,Jizzy,and army attacks

 

And one more thing: Dumbest mission? The one when you had to steal the van using the helicopter..Wtf man,why he couldn`t just use a tow-truck and evade from cops? He managed to escape the army...

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Mr_Leone

I don't think CJ's the most successful protagonist, I'd say that title goes to Tommy Vercetti.

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DepLexOr

 

I'm going to put what I've seen so far and my opinion on that:

 

  • He's a whiny bitch - well, so far, he's the youngest protagonist except for maybe Franklin. They keep comparing him to Tommy, who did a 15 year stint in jail and was sent down to Vice City to do a risky job. CJ just went home for his mom's funeral and found himself in the middle of all of the crap. Of course, he is going to be unhappy to do it.
  • Because he's a gang-banger/from the ghetto, he should not be able to fly a plane or do any of the other stuff he can do. I just say Tommy was also a gang member and spent his younger years in jail but I don't anyone questioning how he came by his skills. (Don't get me wrong, I lurve Tommy)
  • Because he is black. Many people don't want to come out and say it but I found there were people who would not play San Andreas because of the 'gang' lifestyle portrayed. They start back with the series at IV. It's their preference but I find it hypocritical that they can play as a dope using, psychotic, Mafia capo but their high principles won't let them play as a black gang member. Some who did play could only do so if they changed the skin of the character to some generic white guy.

 

  • Yeah he's a whiny bitch until pilot school. After that he becomes big headed which is pretty funny. That makes him likable.
  • He's a super-ni**er so he can do everything. That's the point.
  • He's black. Black people steal cars. Grand Theft Auto is the name of the game.

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Sergiu

 

 

I'm going to put what I've seen so far and my opinion on that:

 

  • He's a whiny bitch - well, so far, he's the youngest protagonist except for maybe Franklin. They keep comparing him to Tommy, who did a 15 year stint in jail and was sent down to Vice City to do a risky job. CJ just went home for his mom's funeral and found himself in the middle of all of the crap. Of course, he is going to be unhappy to do it.
  • Because he's a gang-banger/from the ghetto, he should not be able to fly a plane or do any of the other stuff he can do. I just say Tommy was also a gang member and spent his younger years in jail but I don't anyone questioning how he came by his skills. (Don't get me wrong, I lurve Tommy)
  • Because he is black. Many people don't want to come out and say it but I found there were people who would not play San Andreas because of the 'gang' lifestyle portrayed. They start back with the series at IV. It's their preference but I find it hypocritical that they can play as a dope using, psychotic, Mafia capo but their high principles won't let them play as a black gang member. Some who did play could only do so if they changed the skin of the character to some generic white guy.

 

  • Yeah he's a whiny bitch until pilot school. After that he becomes big headed which is pretty funny. That makes him likable.
  • He's a super-ni**er so he can do everything. That's the point.
  • He's black. Black people steal cars. Grand Theft Auto is the name of the game.

 

That's quite racist, if you're black you're meant to steal, according to you.

 

OT: People dislike Carl because he doesn't know what he wants to really be.

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Queen Elizabeth II

At least he is not as annoying as Lamar (idiot) or Franklin.

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Alexander

I never found CJ "weak". IMO he just preffers to use people, and look like he's "inoffensive" in order to get what he wants, even if that means to act weak and work for his enemies.

Yes, he tells T-Bone what he wants in that car, but he later kills him the Pier 69 mission, right?

To me, R* tried to write the story with CJ "keeping himself to himself", like he mentions on a mission.

Is a good or a bad protagonist? That's up to you mate, it really is just a matter of perspective I guess.

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latigreblue

Hold up though. Do some of y'all honestly believe that black gang members equates limited or reduced intelligence? That's prejudice. That line about him being able to fly a plane keeps coming up. The guy had to go through flight school. Back when I first played this game I couldn't pass the circle the strip for nothing. I swear I must have heard Free Bird and Eminence Front about a thousand times. And I couldn't leave because Toreno's calling every minute to say go back and finish.

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Mr_Leone

Hold up though. Do some of y'all honestly believe that black gang members equates limited or reduced intelligence? That's prejudice. That line about him being able to fly a plane keeps coming up. The guy had to go through flight school. Back when I first played this game I couldn't pass the circle the strip for nothing. I swear I must have heard Free Bird and Eminence Front about a thousand times. And I couldn't leave because Toreno's calling every minute to say go back and finish.

You can try and make it about race all you'd like but we both know that we're talking about environment.

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Im2akillerfish

One thing that annoys me is that I can't stop him from talking. For example. Has Bald hair, Big beard, is fat and wears a biker jacket. Next time I crash I still hear the high pitched "Where'd you get your license!"

 

His objectives are just weird. I need to save my brother! While I'm on it, why not steal a jetpack and use it to steal Alien Crap. Then I'll go to Venturas and get given a part of a casino, only to be able to sleep outside the front door. No bonus on gambling, no revenue, nothing. Only a save point, which was there all the time.

 

Not to mention his Trevor-style killfest on the construction yard. A couple of workmen talked bad of my sister. Boo Fu*king Hoo. Let's Kill them, ruin the lives of their families, to make a point to nobody, as they are all dead. Then let's bury the leader, who most likely had nothing to do with the incident, under a layer of cement.

Edited by Im2akillerfish

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latigreblue

 

You can try and make it about race all you'd like but we both know that we're talking about environment.

 

 

I really don't know what you are talking about. I realise that Rockstar creates stereotypical characters but it is prejudiced to assume that someone from an economically depressed community would be incapable of flying a plane.

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Mr_Leone

 

 

You can try and make it about race all you'd like but we both know that we're talking about environment.

 

 

I really don't know what you are talking about. I realise that Rockstar creates stereotypical characters but it is prejudiced to assume that someone from an economically depressed community would be incapable of flying a plane.

 

I'm not really the glass half full guy, chances are, he couldn't, that's just the way it is. How many future pilots do you in Grove Street? CJ does things a bit advanced for an amateur, but I guess that's just my opinion.

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Tyla

Being taken under the wing of the CIA certainly expedited the situation.

 

I can see your point. CJ isn't expected to get out of the gutter let alone into the sky. Good cause for Toreno to get claws into him -- he's disposable. If CJ f*cked up whose going to come looking?

 

Green Goo... the Area 69 thing... all a little farfetched for me. The flying part wasn't.

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