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The Caped Crusader

Heists and Canon Approaches

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The Caped Crusader

I know that there is no canon options in heists but which approach do you think the protagonists would choose in heists ? For example I think the canon option in the Jewel Store Heist would be the Smart approach.

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WildBrick142

Smart, Offshore, Fire Crew, Subtle

 

They most likely would go for choices that are smart, quiet and that won't kill them while doing the heist.

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Kalerney

Fire crew doesn't seems to be canon, because if the player use this approache, he's not informed why Michael doesn't get any money from the heist.

If you choose the other approach, Michael will explain that point during the flight to the tower.

Edited by Kalerney

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Alec Skorpio

IMO of course

 

Mike would go smart with Jewel Store because he doesn't want any heat at that point

 

Trevor would attack the Tanker cause he hates Merryweather

 

Mike would go rooftop for FIB because (initially) it exposes him and the others less than the Fire Fighter approach does.

 

Mike would go Subtle with Union Depository because it has less collateral damage than drilling into the UD and killing all the cops in the escape. You could also argue he can't resist the idea of having them hand him the gold.

 

That being said, I pick these except for the Big Score which I always pick loud. It's a better game heist as it has a huge shoot out with police and Mike, Frank and Trevor (as well as Lester) all get to use their inherit skills. (Mike as a shooter, Frank as getaway driver and Trevor as a pilot)

 

Of course while there is no "canon", it should be noted that there is artwork for both the jewel store smart approach and the UD loud approach (although iirc it features Trevor as a shooter which doesn't happen in game)

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kevin de santa

Isn't Michael the getaway driver on the loud. Approach for the big one?

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WildBrick142

Isn't Michael the getaway driver on the loud. Approach for the big one?

If I remember correctly, during the shootout, you have a choice of switching to either Michael or Franklin and whoever you end up with will be driving the getaway vehicle. I used Franklin to drive the getwaway vehicle because I remember using his ability to escape.

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universetwisters

Probably whatever's in the trailers.

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TheTechPoTaToCHIP

IMO of course

Mike would go smart with Jewel Store because he doesn't want any heat at that point

Trevor would attack the Tanker cause he hates Merryweather

Mike would go rooftop for FIB because (initially) it exposes him and the others less than the Fire Fighter approach does.

Mike would go Subtle with Union Depository because it has less collateral damage than drilling into the UD and killing all the cops in the escape. You could also argue he can't resist the idea of having them hand him the gold.

That being said, I pick these except for the Big Score which I always pick loud. It's a better game heist as it has a huge shoot out with police and Mike, Frank and Trevor (as well as Lester) all get to use their inherit skills. (Mike as a shooter, Frank as getaway driver and Trevor as a pilot)

Of course while there is no "canon", it should be noted that there is artwork for both the jewel store smart approach and the UD loud approach (although iirc it features Trevor as a shooter which doesn't happen in game)

Not to mention that the loud approach has a larger payout.

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Xerukal

Honestly, all of them seem like something the protagonists would do.

 

The "dumb" approaches, in some instances, aren't really dumb. Just aggressive. I mean, they might be dumb compared to the "smart" stealth option, but I still think they should have kept the "subtle/obvious" labels for each heist, not just The Big Score.

 

I think the subtle approach to The Big Score is more satisfying, walking out of the place with the gold and all, but the obvious approach is definitely more fun and climactic.

Edited by Xerukal

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Alec Skorpio

Honestly, all of them seem like something the protagonists would do.

 

The "dumb" approaches, in some instances, aren't really dumb. Just aggressive. I mean, they might be dumb compared to the "smart" stealth option, but I still think they should have kept the "subtle/obvious" labels for each heist, not just The Big Score.

 

I think the subtle approach to The Big Score is more satisfying, walking out of the place with the gold and all, but the obvious approach is definitely more fun and climactic.

 

You could actually argue that doing things the "smart" way isn't actually Michaels style, as the prologue is a pretty obvious approach, and Lester makes it sound like Michael is doing things different than he usually does when you pick the Smart choice for the Jewel Store job.

 

None of them are actually out of character.

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

The prologue wouldn't be used as a reason for whether it's cannon or not because Michael has changed a lot since then and further because Michael was lying and acting.

 

'Smart' for all the Heists clearly make the most sense because Michael does basically nothing all game but whine about risks, whine about wanting a simple boring life and having his boring life and family back, just wanting to make movies, and in general being completely risk averse. Michael is actually the anti-GTA character and any sort of GTA rampage is almost comletely out of character and in full dissonance with the story. But even that can be justified as being a psycho hot head. Him losing his temper and killing people is probably even more canon than choosing non-subtle heist approaches. It makes sense that he'd flip out and shoot someone in road rage. It makes zero sense he would purposely stage a 100 man shootout.

 

1st Heist is definitely Subtle. You can either easily still a bug van and have a easy risk free heist... or try raid a police vehicle and then bust into a store with live hostages... and stealing the carbines is even harder than the bug van! Subtle is obviously canon because the other way is both illogical, harder, riskier, and worse in every way.

 

2nd heist is obviously the container ship because the off-shore method is borderline 'jumping the shark' in any discussion of canon-ness.

 

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

6th heist is obviously subtle too I mean, seriously, sneak in with almost 0 risk and escape in cars... or kill 100 cops and escape in helicopters? The helicopter way is so silly and unbelievable. Even the shootout in the subtle way feels tacked on, Merryweather just shows up? It feels tacked on just to make sure there's at least a little bit of shooting. It's an awesome shootout but it makes no sense.

 

 

 

Lastly, the dialogue during the heists don't really matter because you can assume the same thing applies to both. Michael's explaination of the heli ride during 5th heist would likely have been said anyhow. Maybe by Lester when he phones the contracted heistmen or when Michael pitches it to them (there's plenty of stuff like that the game doesn't show that obviously takes place).

 

 

Any Heist would be canon for Trevor because he's basically the perfect solution to video game dissonance and basically perfectly representative of GTA -- Trevor is GTA The Character.

 

But clearly there are likely canon approaches for Michael.

 

 

 

That said, none of it's official, and there is concept art showing both approaches to Heist 1, for example. So we'll never know.

 

 

But I've beat the game 6 times now and played the heists cumalatively over 100 times probably now.

 

 

And I also play the game completely realistically and roleplayed to canon character. So, I study the story, and I only do gameplay that makes sense for the characters. And I've spent a lot of time thinking about every single decision. I'll choose all my free roam and in-between-mission activities very carefully. I'll even plan on what clothes I buy, what cars or car upgrades are most realistic.

 

I beat the game with never dying, never getting caught my police, never even having my face seen in free roam mode while commiting a crime, never doing anything that could help the police ID me. I never commit crimes in cars that I purchased with my legal name, I always stole cars and then burned them after. And many many things like this.

 

 

I basically created what I think is the most perfect canon game file that is possible in the GTA V gameplay.

 

And choosing the Heists are one of the biggest decisions and I've spent many hours debating which would be most canon.

 

 

And the above reasons are why I chose them. I think it's very obvious that 1 heist usually makes total sense for canon purposes and the other does not. But of course it's not official.

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Skeever

Not saying these are canon, of course, but this is just my opinion...

The Jewel Store Job: Smart (why would they bust through the front door and risk getting shot by a security guard or ID'd by someone instead of simply knocking them out with tear gas in the vents?)

The Merryweather Heist: Boat (killing military personnel and stealing a helicopter from a military base for an off-shore "super weapon" that they aren't 100% sure of even existing, when they can simply raid a boat for a super weapon they know for sure is there, doesn't sound plausible. Trevor would want to go the route that causes the most damage to Merryweather, anyway)

The Bureau Raid: Loud (Michael says himself that he doesn't want to mop floors in the FIB building, and that he likes the idea of rappeling in there much better; he'd also risk getting ID'd when trying to pass as the janitor, or risk getting caught on camera while planting the explosives)

The Big One: Smart (they'd be crazy not to pose as security guards and have the gold handed right to them instead of risking everyone's lives with the staged robbery in the Depository itself, and the long shootout with cops afterwards that results in dozens of police officer murders on their hands)

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Alec Skorpio

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

In all fairness, Rooftop approach is actually the less riskier option on paper. For the fireman route you have to infiltrate the FIB building without a mask, which is certainly to have a security system that monitors everything on camera, as well as smuggle in explosives to cause an explosion to even get your team in the building.

 

For a guy who says he carefully planned to never get ID'd in the game, this seems like a glaring thing to miss.

Edited by liquidussnake119

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kevin de santa

Not to mention your running through a burning building I think its the more fun approach IMO excellently done heist IMO either way

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

 

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

In all fairness, Rooftop approach is actually the less riskier option on paper. For the fireman route you have to infiltrate the FIB building without a mask, which is certainly to have a security system that monitors everything on camera, as well as smuggle in explosives to cause an explosion to even get your team in the building.

 

For a guy who says he carefully planned to never get ID'd in the game, this seems like a glaring thing to miss.

 

 

When you blow up the FIB building, it takes out the security cameras and destroys any evidence of your being there.

 

Also, Steve Haines and Lester covered your tracks and help destroy any back-up being stored off-site. Remember, they covered up Michael's ID before. They wouldn't do this for a random rampage but they would do it for this heist. Dave Norton was specifically in charge of Michael's file anyhow so they could even make his photo ID look different or something. In any event, their jobs relied on Michael succeeding and not being ID'd so they would deemed it 'safe' to enter a janitor so they must have taken precautions. And it must have worked because the blame was put on Steve, not Dave or Michael.

 

Next, ID process for janitors is pretty weak. They constantly hiring new foreign workers and half of them are probably illegal aliens anyhow so they never really ID them that well.

 

Lastly, you can shave your head and by that time (after being in exile for so long) you have a full beard and no longer are easily ID'ed as Michael.

 

 

 

Anyhow, that's how I justified it lol

 

trust me i thought of that i thought of everything i've been pretty OCD about it :panic:

 

the janitor ID thing was precisely my biggest concern but based on those reasons, compared to the ridiculously crazy shootout going through the roof (which Lester told you would happen), it seems much more safe and fit Michael's personality and risk aversion better.

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Alec Skorpio

Next, ID process for janitors is pretty weak. They constantly hiring new foreign workers and half of them are probably illegal aliens anyhow so they never really ID them that well.

 

But people can personally identify you as you have to go through a checkpoint. The fact that most workers would be "illegal aliens" in your mind further proves that Michael would stand out. (although I think you're incorrect on that, the federal government wouldn't hire illegal immigrants)

 

Just because you get into a shootout doesn't automatically make an approach more risky. Especially when you consider that Michael is an expert marksman and not a trained firefighter.

 

I mean, look at it this way.

 

Rooftop

 

- Drop in through roof

- Kill guards

- Steal HDD

- Get out through roof

 

That was the plan before things went wrong.

 

Compared to

 

- Infiltrate federal building as janitor

- Smuggle in explosives

- Plant explosives

- Exfiltrate federal building as janitor

- Detonate explosives

- Infiltrate burning/exploding building as firefighters

- Find HDD

- Exfiltrate structurally weak building as firefighters

 

I don't remember if the rappelling down a crumbling elevator shaft was part of the plan or not, but it probably should have been at least a pretty likely scenario amongst the group due to the time sensitive nature of the job as well as the fact that elevators are usually disabled in buildings once a fire reaches a certain level of danger.

 

There's also an argument to be made with how the less risky approaches tend to feature a hacker so you can build up their skills for the big score. Fire approach does not feature this so you'd have a disadvantage by the time you reach The Big Score.

Edited by liquidussnake119

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

i think it'd be tough to ID him though cuz they barely paying attention, and michael can disguise himself with a beard

 

plus, even if they file a report after, Steve Haines or Dave Norton likely just deleted or altered in, and/or made sure that it is never compared to Michael de Santa

 

further, getting ID'd is kinda part of the story anyhow... in so far as they the FIB thinks Steve Haines was behind it, so maybe they know either way that his 'de Santa lapdog' was the one.

 

in any case, before the Heist starts, Lester and Michael know there will be a suicidal firefight for 'Roof' but not that the building will collapse at all in 'Fire'. and the janitor part I still assume had to be safe and everything was thought out because Dave Norton's job depends on it, and Michael wouldn't accept it otherwise so I assume the ID thing was not a threat.

 

i just can't see any reason why Michael would ever choose skydiving through a roof to have a 100-cop shootout over just mopping some flows and sneaking through a smoky building (the plan)

 

but i appreciate your points and I'll definitely think about it more!

 

i rethink my Heist choices aaaaaaall the time lol i am most uncertain

 

sometimes i think aggresive for heist 1 may be better cuz lester says "oh still a hot head" and michael maybe isn't that technically proficient. and they're 'talk' on the way to the heist is maybe better for the aggresive method. safe has some cool gameplay details but the aggresive drive talk is cool in a sort of introduction sort of way.

 

but when you choose safe, lester says 'oh wiser with age' and it seems to suit is risk aversion much better.

 

also i think the bug work clothes that match the concept art look super cool especially on your hired guns when they wear the masks and hats backwards.

 

and i hate hate hate how Franklin, once he owns any suit, will sometimes wear a loose work shirt combined with checkered suit pants while riding a bike when you switch to him. it looks so weird. and when you choose the aggresive way, he owns a suit after ;/ so i like to avoid ever buying him suit pants cuz it looks so weird when he's got his bike or he's wearing them with his shirts

 

 

heist 2 and heist 6 i'm pretty certain about just cuz i think the helicopter/cargobob sections are pretty 'out there' and a bit over the top and cheesy. though, the paleto bay massacre JUST to BUY a cargobob is already ridiculous so i consider that too

 

heist 3... no choice and the best shootout by far anyhow lol best part is choosing the getaway location i always like a Vapid/Ford F250 Heavyduty or the Granger/Suburban, and I'll always park it up a couple blocks by the train tracks... i spent like 2-3 hours scouting different locations to seeing which had the best escape routes and which made the most sense.

 

heist 5 best part is the escape vehicle too! i always take the Vapid truck again and park it was the gold smelting location. i figure that's how they discovered that location. and it's out of the way and it seems like a realistic place to torch the firetruck. plus, the best part of this heist, by far of either approach, is the post-heist discussion when Michael is talking about how they'll be legends for their FIB raid with your crew, it's super cool and one of the best 'comraderie' moments in the game. much better than the post-heist ambulance discussion and it's almost much better to see lester and franklin in lester's house than franklin's i think.

 

that actually reminds me, Michael SAYS after the heist that "Michael de Santa" will be one of the names, the rumours, of the FIB raid

 

so he even suggests that getting ID'ed here is not a risk

 

and that he's less worried about getting ID'ed and much more worried about avoiding shootouts

 

i think lol ;p

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

so i started a new game my 7th time now and i'm trying all the "non-canon" heists and doing lots of weird fun stuff just to experiment with the game but also reevaluate my 'canon' file because i want to make it even better on PS4

 

 

and i just realize this morning after i finished heist 2 last night....

 

 

doesn't Heist 2 Offshore totally break the story for Heist 4?

 

i mean, the entire point of the insane (already over the top and a bit ridiculous) Paleto massacre is basically only for a Cargobob.... the entire heist and all the build up, story, killing, and heist is just for the cargobob. there's no other reason, really... you get nothing else for chemical weapon/Monkey Business, really, you basically just swim and stealth in. cheap SMGs. and you get some cash from the heist but i mean that's not why you hit Paleto bay... if it was just for money, M clearly doesn't even want to be taking heists while in exile yet, or certainly not heists like that.

 

basically the only reason the entire Paleto score exists is to buy a cargobob...

 

and yet for Heist 2 Offshore, to get a Cargobob, there isn't a similarly huge story and heist... you just drive a car quickly into Zancudo and fly off

 

 

it's incredibly anticlimactic.

 

i just realize that... why in the world didn't they just quickly steal another cargobob from Zancudo instead of the whole Paleto score though

 

 

 

which is another reason why I think Heist 2 Offshore wouldn't be 'canon' if there ever was 'canon'

 

it's already a ridiculous mission in terms of scope and scale but it totally trivializes and even breaks the story of heist 4

 

 

which is a bit sad because it actually has a super good story dialogue when you drive out to SS Hangar.

 

 

 

 

oh, and i thought of another way to consider the 'most logical' or 'believable/canon' approach.... choose the 1 that the Heist Set-Up focuses on the most

 

like, heist 1 focuses on the vents, so that's why subtle makes sense. heist 2 focuses on the container ship, heist 5 focuses on the janitor and getting the ID. heist 6 i think is the only 1 without a clear focus, maybe it leans a bit to the securicars but not as obvious as others.

 

the heist preparation works too.... stealing the gas and bug van are much more belieavable for M then a crazy shootout with the SWAT granger for the carbines. also, stealing the sub for heist 2 is awesome but stealing a cargobob from Zancudo is probably the most over the top moment in the game. not only does it break the story of heist 4 but zancudo is probably even more dangerous than the union depository. it's such a ridiculous moment in the game ;p heist 3 and 4 don't matter and are absolutely awesome... heist 5... roof has no real prep. fire though you get to steal a firetruck (awesome cuz you get to fake phone 911) and get to plan and customize another getaway and getaway vehicle...

 

when the Heist focuses on 1 approach more for the Set-up, has more realistic or more Preparation steps, it just feels like it was more intended by Rockstar.... like the 'fire' approach feels super unique and hand-crafted... 'roof' feels very tracked on.... it's fun... very fun! and i love the helicopter talk/skydive in... but everytime i do it, it feels like Rockstar just tacked in on because they knew they needed an alternative and didn't have the time to build it into the set-up/preparation stage better.

 

 

 

 

 

all the heists are super fun so please remember this is just for the sake of those who care about trying to really figure out the most logical or realistic approaches.... or what 'SEEMS' most canon to the story. we will likely never know for sure, so it's just meant for fun discussion :) i understand some folks disagree and i don't mean to offend or argue. there are good points about all heists, like the ID thing for Heist 5 Roof or the M admitting about Heist 1 to T for Heist 2 Offshore.

 

one rule i have is that we can probably assume that most of the dialogue (especially that isn't context-specific like M admitting to Vangelico on H2 or M saying why no payment for H5) or even scenes (how M and L firebomb the garment factory) from BOTH APPROACHES is likely canon.... and anything missed non-context scenes or dialogue from other approaches are probably just said or done off-screen. like, if we do Ship into Offshore... I am sure that M still admitted to T about Vangellico, and if we do Fire instead of Roof, I'm sure M still explained to the crew about their pay. things are always a bit rushed or light. i mean these crews basically just meet, plan, and discuss their heist 5 minutes before in begins lol and the entire game has always been super fake about ID, being ID'ed, etc cuz GTA was never meant to be taken canon or seriously

 

it's just GTA V is such a much more serious drama that it can be attempted to be taken seriously and canon... but there are still flaws :p

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kevin de santa

Good point didn't they need more than a chopper tho?

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

not really... they had SMGs, scuba gear, and a small dingee boat... and a trailer truck at the hangar

 

but why would anyone do the Paleto heist for those things they're super cheap and easy to acquire in other ways

 

why would anyone 'buy' any of this stuff for a secret mission too much better to steal

 

 

and almost all the cost is the cargobob... they say doing set-up that the chopper will cost at least 2 mil.

 

and when you drive back from Paleto with M and Lester, they talk about how the chopper is most of the cost at over 2 mil

 

 

 

 

i still don't understand it though cuz the Heist Passed results say the FIB cut is over 6 million

 

but what in the world does Michael, Dave, and Steve in a tiny rubber dingee with wet suits and cheap MP5 SMGs, and a basic trailer truck cost over 4 million dollars?

 

and why would a cargobob cost 2 million, and why would you buy one that is so easily traceable instead of stealing one?

 

did they buy everything from the black market at 25x the normal cost? why not just steal it like you do in Heist 2?

 

 

 

dunno just seems poorly thought out... regardless if you steal a cargobob for Heist 2 or not.... stealing nerve gas from the lab seems incredibly anticlimactic and 'small' in scale compared to the insane Paleto Bay score, 100-man death count, and 8 million dollar heist

 

 

if the game was more realistic, M and T would just steal a cargobob, truck, and boat themselves and keep the 8m lol

 

 

 

i dunno the game has a lot of flaws like this... just fun food for thought :D

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

just finished the game a 7th time last night and i gotta say Paleto Bay and Chemical Plant missions make even less sense than before...

 

so for Heist 6 Obvious... you need a skycrane... basically the most advanced and expensive heli around... a heli that can carry a train locomotive (already unbelievable)... and you also need a secondary frogger heli.. and heck, you even need a train! and what do you do? you just casually steal the train, and Lester effortlessly without any resources or cost just 'sources' the helis. wow... that was easy and trouble free.

 

and for Heist 2 Offshore, you just casually break into Zancudo for a cargobob which is a MILTARY grade heavy rotor chopper

 

but for the Chemical Plant mission where you basically need nothing but a COMMERCIAL grade Jetsam heavy rotor chopper?

 

you do the entire 8 million dollar, 100-deathcount massacre Paleto Bay heist

 

talk about jumping the shark.

 

i think that's really where the GTA V story begins to fall apart after Paleto Bay because the story becomes too disconnected... before Paleto Bay, and especially before Trevor, the story has got a pretty tight focus and the missions play tigher and more linear along two main plots. but after Paleto Bay, the missions become pretty disconnected in terms of plot and basically all the missions aside from the Big One basically appear out of nowhere and essentially they try to 'out do' one another in terms of scale

 

 

i think that's a big reason why I prefer Ship and Subtle for Heists 2 and 6.... because at least they are more conservative and I feel they make Paleto Bay appear much less ludicrous

 

 

there's not much story in Heist 6 Obvious either. Trevor has almost zero role and the post-heist scene is incredibly anticlimactic where has H6 Subtle has huge discussion scenes pre-, mid- and post- gameplay which helps it feel more believable

 

that said, I do love the Die Hard 4 reference haha... Subtle is basically a mix of Fast and Furious 6 and Italian Job, and Obvious is basically Die Hard 4 with helis

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cp1dell

Sorry for the bump, I remember seeing this topic but I didn't have the opportunity to reply.

 

Usually I look at the game's trailers or artwork to use as a base as what in-game choice would be canon. With V though, all heists choices show up in trailers.

 

The way I see it though, is that the canon approach would be whatever the character's are originally setting up for. For example, for the Jewelry Store Heist, Michael and Lester are investigating the building's HVAC system. It's as if they already decided they're going to use the "Smart" approach, and use the BZ Gas. Or the FIB Raid. Michael follows the Janitor home and steals his ID card so he can sneak in as a Janitor. It's as if they have already decided that Michael is going to do the heist approach where he dresses up as a janitor and sneaks in. Again, take the Merryweather Heist for example. Trevor takes pictures and gathers intel on the giant ship at the docks. Once again, it's as if the heist approach has already been determined, and you're preparing for the approach where you board the ship.

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

yeah usually 1 approach is more favoured by the story and production values, and the other seems more like an obvious alternative or even tacked on (looking at Heist 5 Roof)

 

but also gotta consider characters and risk

 

for example, Heist 1... M just needs a couple million bucks, doesn't want to go wild, doesn't want to actually hurt anyone

 

so... he's going to KILL FOUR COPS just to get carbine rifles to do it? lol

 

obviously fun but also obviously unbelievable in the story

 

same for Heist 5... kill people and just sneak into a building as a janitor and fireman.... or have a shootout with 100 cops lol

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Shade04rek

I didn't want to start a new topic, and this place seems right anyway, but I wish there was any other option that kept franklin from driving the front loader in the paleto score, that made no sense, franklin would have been killed easy and it honestly did nothing, they just got in, went 10 feet, then got out.

 

After reading this topic, I do have a more on topic input. I always felt the unlock able heist members were cliche and not really ideal team mates for gigs as sensitive as they were. There is no way that trust could be easily had in any of them at their low prices and past experiences, maybe packie but from Michele's persective, most of them just wouldn't seem trustworthy. That said, I always felt the most canon choices were the most expensive members, using them for every heist whenever I could, I felt like my team was professional, consistent, and would know how to work together since it's always the same people from the beginning, opposed to choosing strangers, newbies, and having some people die and screw stuff up every heist, which that risk simply couldn't be there if frank mike and Trevor wanted to survive on a level that they know they don't have "plot armor".

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wiizardii

Its always different. Lets be honest, the approach wich are considered ''dumb and loud'' are the ones wich are more fun, for one the jewel store robbery wearing bike helmets and suits felt more badass than throwing in knockout gas and then wearing ugly bugsmart suits or whatever its called with gasmasks, same with the merryweather heist, FIB heist, and to top it off, the big score. The obvious approach was MUCH MUCH more fun than the subtle one, subtle was boring in my opinion, all you did was go around with gold, a small shootout, and escape with the gauntlet cars. While in obvious, you drilled with a big ass mission exclusive driller vehicle, had 2/3 great shootouts, one great helicopet pursuit, and one escape route. Also you got payed more on the obvious part. But really, there is none saying that its canon or not, its all on players choice, if alot stuff were canon, it would be scripted and boring + it would not feel like you hade a choice in the missions.

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MonsterCockDude

The prologue wouldn't be used as a reason for whether it's cannon or not because Michael has changed a lot since then and further because Michael was lying and acting.

 

'Smart' for all the Heists clearly make the most sense because Michael does basically nothing all game but whine about risks, whine about wanting a simple boring life and having his boring life and family back, just wanting to make movies, and in general being completely risk averse. Michael is actually the anti-GTA character and any sort of GTA rampage is almost comletely out of character and in full dissonance with the story. But even that can be justified as being a psycho hot head. Him losing his temper and killing people is probably even more canon than choosing non-subtle heist approaches. It makes sense that he'd flip out and shoot someone in road rage. It makes zero sense he would purposely stage a 100 man shootout.

 

1st Heist is definitely Subtle. You can either easily still a bug van and have a easy risk free heist... or try raid a police vehicle and then bust into a store with live hostages... and stealing the carbines is even harder than the bug van! Subtle is obviously canon because the other way is both illogical, harder, riskier, and worse in every way.

 

2nd heist is obviously the container ship because the off-shore method is borderline 'jumping the shark' in any discussion of canon-ness.

 

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

6th heist is obviously subtle too I mean, seriously, sneak in with almost 0 risk and escape in cars... or kill 100 cops and escape in helicopters? The helicopter way is so silly and unbelievable. Even the shootout in the subtle way feels tacked on, Merryweather just shows up? It feels tacked on just to make sure there's at least a little bit of shooting. It's an awesome shootout but it makes no sense.

 

 

 

Lastly, the dialogue during the heists don't really matter because you can assume the same thing applies to both. Michael's explaination of the heli ride during 5th heist would likely have been said anyhow. Maybe by Lester when he phones the contracted heistmen or when Michael pitches it to them (there's plenty of stuff like that the game doesn't show that obviously takes place).

 

 

Any Heist would be canon for Trevor because he's basically the perfect solution to video game dissonance and basically perfectly representative of GTA -- Trevor is GTA The Character.

 

But clearly there are likely canon approaches for Michael.

 

 

 

That said, none of it's official, and there is concept art showing both approaches to Heist 1, for example. So we'll never know.

 

 

But I've beat the game 6 times now and played the heists cumalatively over 100 times probably now.

 

 

And I also play the game completely realistically and roleplayed to canon character. So, I study the story, and I only do gameplay that makes sense for the characters. And I've spent a lot of time thinking about every single decision. I'll choose all my free roam and in-between-mission activities very carefully. I'll even plan on what clothes I buy, what cars or car upgrades are most realistic.

 

I beat the game with never dying, never getting caught my police, never even having my face seen in free roam mode while commiting a crime, never doing anything that could help the police ID me. I never commit crimes in cars that I purchased with my legal name, I always stole cars and then burned them after. And many many things like this.

 

 

I basically created what I think is the most perfect canon game file that is possible in the GTA V gameplay.

 

And choosing the Heists are one of the biggest decisions and I've spent many hours debating which would be most canon.

 

 

And the above reasons are why I chose them. I think it's very obvious that 1 heist usually makes total sense for canon purposes and the other does not. But of course it's not official.

Man, I try to do this to, but missions like Blitz play and the Paleto Bay heist and the accuracy of the AI in this game and some of the things that happen in free roam ( like the annoying scripted police chase ) ruin that for me at a certain point.

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Shade04rek

Its always different. Lets be honest, the approach wich are considered ''dumb and loud'' are the ones wich are more fun, for one the jewel store robbery wearing bike helmets and suits felt more badass than throwing in knockout gas and then wearing ugly bugsmart suits or whatever its called with gasmasks, same with the merryweather heist, FIB heist, and to top it off, the big score. The obvious approach was MUCH MUCH more fun than the subtle one, subtle was boring in my opinion, all you did was go around with gold, a small shootout, and escape with the gauntlet cars. While in obvious, you drilled with a big ass mission exclusive driller vehicle, had 2/3 great shootouts, one great helicopet pursuit, and one escape route. Also you got payed more on the obvious part. But really, there is none saying that its canon or not, its all on players choice, if alot stuff were canon, it would be scripted and boring + it would not feel like you hade a choice in the missions.

 

I agree with this since no matter what you choose the plans get messed up and results in a giant gun battle against cops and you get heat anyway. So might as well be loud all the time and have fun, it almost never matters. If there was less scripted results, it might be as fun to be quiet and "smart".

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S1N0D3UTSCHT3K

 

The prologue wouldn't be used as a reason for whether it's cannon or not because Michael has changed a lot since then and further because Michael was lying and acting.

 

'Smart' for all the Heists clearly make the most sense because Michael does basically nothing all game but whine about risks, whine about wanting a simple boring life and having his boring life and family back, just wanting to make movies, and in general being completely risk averse. Michael is actually the anti-GTA character and any sort of GTA rampage is almost comletely out of character and in full dissonance with the story. But even that can be justified as being a psycho hot head. Him losing his temper and killing people is probably even more canon than choosing non-subtle heist approaches. It makes sense that he'd flip out and shoot someone in road rage. It makes zero sense he would purposely stage a 100 man shootout.

 

1st Heist is definitely Subtle. You can either easily still a bug van and have a easy risk free heist... or try raid a police vehicle and then bust into a store with live hostages... and stealing the carbines is even harder than the bug van! Subtle is obviously canon because the other way is both illogical, harder, riskier, and worse in every way.

 

2nd heist is obviously the container ship because the off-shore method is borderline 'jumping the shark' in any discussion of canon-ness.

 

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

6th heist is obviously subtle too I mean, seriously, sneak in with almost 0 risk and escape in cars... or kill 100 cops and escape in helicopters? The helicopter way is so silly and unbelievable. Even the shootout in the subtle way feels tacked on, Merryweather just shows up? It feels tacked on just to make sure there's at least a little bit of shooting. It's an awesome shootout but it makes no sense.

 

 

 

Lastly, the dialogue during the heists don't really matter because you can assume the same thing applies to both. Michael's explaination of the heli ride during 5th heist would likely have been said anyhow. Maybe by Lester when he phones the contracted heistmen or when Michael pitches it to them (there's plenty of stuff like that the game doesn't show that obviously takes place).

 

 

Any Heist would be canon for Trevor because he's basically the perfect solution to video game dissonance and basically perfectly representative of GTA -- Trevor is GTA The Character.

 

But clearly there are likely canon approaches for Michael.

 

 

 

That said, none of it's official, and there is concept art showing both approaches to Heist 1, for example. So we'll never know.

 

 

But I've beat the game 6 times now and played the heists cumalatively over 100 times probably now.

 

 

And I also play the game completely realistically and roleplayed to canon character. So, I study the story, and I only do gameplay that makes sense for the characters. And I've spent a lot of time thinking about every single decision. I'll choose all my free roam and in-between-mission activities very carefully. I'll even plan on what clothes I buy, what cars or car upgrades are most realistic.

 

I beat the game with never dying, never getting caught my police, never even having my face seen in free roam mode while commiting a crime, never doing anything that could help the police ID me. I never commit crimes in cars that I purchased with my legal name, I always stole cars and then burned them after. And many many things like this.

 

 

I basically created what I think is the most perfect canon game file that is possible in the GTA V gameplay.

 

And choosing the Heists are one of the biggest decisions and I've spent many hours debating which would be most canon.

 

 

And the above reasons are why I chose them. I think it's very obvious that 1 heist usually makes total sense for canon purposes and the other does not. But of course it's not official.

Man, I try to do this to, but missions like Blitz play and the Paleto Bay heist and the accuracy of the AI in this game and some of the things that happen in free roam ( like the annoying scripted police chase ) ruin that for me at a certain point.

 

 

here's my Blitz Play (free aim. No HUD, No Mini-map)

 

I re-did it a lot to make sure I got the "Frankling/street racer event' at the start... and to make sure the 'fire fight' was great

 

check out how I kill the cop in the first approaching cop car hahaha or my propane tank explosions later in the video

 

 

 

i tried to make it look cool and 'fun to watch' (not just a boring gameplay tutorial or Lets Play)

 

i try to pan the camera a lot to make it more cinematic

 

and I even try park the same (so, in the cutscene, the red Premier is always in the background so I parked there.... same with the Trash Truck, it has a default position in the cutscene so I made sure I parked facing west)

 

and of course small stuff like everyone wearing work clothes

 

starting the 9 a.m. on a Friday

 

bonds would likely be delivered early at bank opening

 

and Friday is the most common day for bank robberies in the USA

 

so that's why I made sure the mission started at 9 a.m. Friday

 

 

 

(and I made sure the Trash Truck mission wasn't on a weekend, for example... small details like that)

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MonsterCockDude

 

 

The prologue wouldn't be used as a reason for whether it's cannon or not because Michael has changed a lot since then and further because Michael was lying and acting.

 

'Smart' for all the Heists clearly make the most sense because Michael does basically nothing all game but whine about risks, whine about wanting a simple boring life and having his boring life and family back, just wanting to make movies, and in general being completely risk averse. Michael is actually the anti-GTA character and any sort of GTA rampage is almost comletely out of character and in full dissonance with the story. But even that can be justified as being a psycho hot head. Him losing his temper and killing people is probably even more canon than choosing non-subtle heist approaches. It makes sense that he'd flip out and shoot someone in road rage. It makes zero sense he would purposely stage a 100 man shootout.

 

1st Heist is definitely Subtle. You can either easily still a bug van and have a easy risk free heist... or try raid a police vehicle and then bust into a store with live hostages... and stealing the carbines is even harder than the bug van! Subtle is obviously canon because the other way is both illogical, harder, riskier, and worse in every way.

 

2nd heist is obviously the container ship because the off-shore method is borderline 'jumping the shark' in any discussion of canon-ness.

 

5th heist is fireman route because again Michael would never ever ever choose a 100-man police shootout when he can sneak in as a janitor and fireman with almost zero risk or attention. Further, the heist set-up is all about the fireman approach and the other method feels tacked on.

 

6th heist is obviously subtle too I mean, seriously, sneak in with almost 0 risk and escape in cars... or kill 100 cops and escape in helicopters? The helicopter way is so silly and unbelievable. Even the shootout in the subtle way feels tacked on, Merryweather just shows up? It feels tacked on just to make sure there's at least a little bit of shooting. It's an awesome shootout but it makes no sense.

 

 

 

Lastly, the dialogue during the heists don't really matter because you can assume the same thing applies to both. Michael's explaination of the heli ride during 5th heist would likely have been said anyhow. Maybe by Lester when he phones the contracted heistmen or when Michael pitches it to them (there's plenty of stuff like that the game doesn't show that obviously takes place).

 

 

Any Heist would be canon for Trevor because he's basically the perfect solution to video game dissonance and basically perfectly representative of GTA -- Trevor is GTA The Character.

 

But clearly there are likely canon approaches for Michael.

 

 

 

That said, none of it's official, and there is concept art showing both approaches to Heist 1, for example. So we'll never know.

 

 

But I've beat the game 6 times now and played the heists cumalatively over 100 times probably now.

 

 

And I also play the game completely realistically and roleplayed to canon character. So, I study the story, and I only do gameplay that makes sense for the characters. And I've spent a lot of time thinking about every single decision. I'll choose all my free roam and in-between-mission activities very carefully. I'll even plan on what clothes I buy, what cars or car upgrades are most realistic.

 

I beat the game with never dying, never getting caught my police, never even having my face seen in free roam mode while commiting a crime, never doing anything that could help the police ID me. I never commit crimes in cars that I purchased with my legal name, I always stole cars and then burned them after. And many many things like this.

 

 

I basically created what I think is the most perfect canon game file that is possible in the GTA V gameplay.

 

And choosing the Heists are one of the biggest decisions and I've spent many hours debating which would be most canon.

 

 

And the above reasons are why I chose them. I think it's very obvious that 1 heist usually makes total sense for canon purposes and the other does not. But of course it's not official.

Man, I try to do this to, but missions like Blitz play and the Paleto Bay heist and the accuracy of the AI in this game and some of the things that happen in free roam ( like the annoying scripted police chase ) ruin that for me at a certain point.

 

 

here's my Blitz Play (free aim. No HUD, No Mini-map)

 

I re-did it a lot to make sure I got the "Frankling/street racer event' at the start... and to make sure the 'fire fight' was great

 

check out how I kill the cop in the first approaching cop car hahaha or my propane tank explosions later in the video

 

 

 

i tried to make it look cool and 'fun to watch' (not just a boring gameplay tutorial or Lets Play)

 

i try to pan the camera a lot to make it more cinematic

 

and I even try park the same (so, in the cutscene, the red Premier is always in the background so I parked there.... same with the Trash Truck, it has a default position in the cutscene so I made sure I parked facing west)

 

and of course small stuff like everyone wearing work clothes

 

starting the 9 a.m. on a Friday

 

bonds would likely be delivered early at bank opening

 

and Friday is the most common day for bank robberies in the USA

 

so that's why I made sure the mission started at 9 a.m. Friday

 

 

 

(and I made sure the Trash Truck mission wasn't on a weekend, for example... small details like that)

 

Yeah but no matter what you do or how many little details you put into it, that mission would never be anywhere close to being realistic ( not saying other missions are, but that mission they obviously jumped the shark ) a shootout with 20+ cops, shot down police helicopters, RPG fire, an armored car robbery would leave Michael, Franklin and Trevor as the most wanted men in the country and would be seen as a terrorist act, at this point the game isn't even a crime game any longer. Also the police AI in that mission is dumbed down so much combined with giving the player body armor and highly powered weapons and it turns the mission into bullet sponge shooting gallery.

 

 

The set up of the mission of flipping the truck over is cool, but the shootout is awful in that mission.

 

Especially since the player has little say in attacking the mission tactically or moving around to find better position, basically the game sort of locks you into that small area to have a shootout and you just have to watch the one alley on the left's flank, the street in front of you, the buildings and the helicopters while the dumb AI keeps coming after you and you mow them down.

Edited by MonsterCockDude

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DavidBardock

Does OFFSHORE method actually breaks the story in dialogue sense?

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