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Vercetti42

What do you DISLIKE about GTA IV's story?

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Algonquin Assassin
Posted (edited)

What a cool bump (No sarcasm btw lol). To reiterate the point I made in 2014 the way Roman's debts are handled doesn't much sense. It would've been better if we physically had to pay them ourselves which would aleviate some of the uselessness of the in game economy.

 

Also as I'm up to this part in my current save I always thought Broker and Hove Beach in particular should've been a no go zone after Dimitri's betrayal. Niko says that he and Roman had to get away for a few days so I don't get why he'd go back so soon. Going into Broker/Hove Beach should've resulted in Dimitri's men becoming hostile like cars going after Niko every now and then.

 

A bit like Madrazo's guys in GTA V.

Edited by Algonquin Assassin

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Hmmm nice bike

What a cool bump (No sarcasm btw lol). To reiterate the point I made in 2014 the way Roman's debts are handled doesn't much sense. It would've been better if we physically had to pay them ourselves which would aleviate some of the uselessness of the in game economy.

 

Also as I'm up to this part in my current save I always thought Broker and Hove Beach in particular should've been a no go zone after Dimitri's betrayal. Niko says that he and Roman had to get away for a few days so I don't get why he'd go back so soon. Going into Broker/Hove Beach should've resulted in Dimitri's men becoming hostile like cars going after Niko every now and then.

Being able to pay off Roman's debts for him would have been interesting, and maybe as a way for Roman to do favors for you for helping him out (though I can't think of what he'd offer other than the standard free cab rides, or paying for meals when you take him out).

 

Hove Beach becoming a no-go zone would have made sense, it kind of reminds me of what happens to Portland in GTA III. Pretty much every gang there hates you and tries to kill you on sight. Though I think III's was a bit overkill and became too annoying (especially in St. Marks with the mafia guys' shotguns). Maybe in IV, you could have gotten a warning by any Russian gang members who spot you to leave before they attack you, kind of like how they warn you to leave if you bump into them. And maybe after the story ended, once Dimitri is dead (and Bulgarin along with all of their heroin being destroyed, as we'd find out in BOGT), Hove Beach would be safe to visit again due to the Russian mob probably being in shambles by that point.

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Legomanarthur

What a cool bump (No sarcasm btw lol). To reiterate the point I made in 2014 the way Roman's debts are handled doesn't much sense. It would've been better if we physically had to pay them ourselves which would aleviate some of the uselessness of the in game economy.

 

Also as I'm up to this part in my current save I always thought Broker and Hove Beach in particular should've been a no go zone after Dimitri's betrayal. Niko says that he and Roman had to get away for a few days so I don't get why he'd go back so soon. Going into Broker/Hove Beach should've resulted in Dimitri's men becoming hostile like cars going after Niko every now and then.

 

A bit like Madrazo's guys in GTA V.

Yeah it has always bugged me that after Roman's Sorrow we had to go back to Brucie's apartment only to see Roman having fun in creating a lovemeet profile for Niko. I know he's an optimist but this has always seemed a bit off to me.

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Algonquin Assassin

Now you mention it Brucie's missions have always felt a bit awkward when they occur. Amidst the sh*t between Dimitri and Faustin it's weird to start them in the middle of that.

 

That's why I usually start them after Dimitri's betrayal because I picture Niko seeking Brucie as a way for he and Roman to get back on their feet after fleeing to Bohan. Plus they're a bit more lighted after the heavy set Dimitri/Faustin arc. I just wish Brucie was intoduced a tad later is all.

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Official General

Hove Beach becoming a no-go zone would have made sense, it kind of reminds me of what happens to Portland in GTA III. Pretty much every gang there hates you and tries to kill you on sight. Though I think III's was a bit overkill and became too annoying (especially in St. Marks with the mafia guys' shotguns). Maybe in IV, you could have gotten a warning by any Russian gang members who spot you to leave before they attack you, kind of like how they warn you to leave if you bump into them. And maybe after the story ended, once Dimitri is dead (and Bulgarin along with all of their heroin being destroyed, as we'd find out in BOGT), Hove Beach would be safe to visit again due to the Russian mob probably being in shambles by that point.

 

It kind of is anyway. After running away from Broker with Roman, if you notice, the Russian gangsters in Hove Beach are much more hostile to Niko whenever he returns there, for instance if he stands too close to them, they react with violence and aggression much quicker than they did before.

 

I wanted more of the drug-dealing stuff with Elisabeta and the Hispanic gangs. That would have been great.

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Algonquin Assassin

I wanted more of the drug-dealing stuff with Elisabeta and the Hispanic gangs. That would have been great.

 

i didn't mind Elisabeta. She kind of broke the mould up until that point, but yeah some mores missions would've been cool.:)

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Zello
Posted (edited)

Elizabetas arc should have been longer. There needed to be a war between her and another crew for control of Bohan.

 

The same with Faustin I wanted to see the war between him and Kenny Petrovic.

Edited by Zello

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jkim_1

Definitely agree that Elizabeta got arrested too early lol

 

Considering that she was also a part of TLADs story it wouldve been nice to see her as a part of TBOGT, possibly as a rival or an ally for Luis mini crew of him, Henrique, and Armando. Would make more sense due to South Bohans proximity to northern Algonquin.

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Algonquin Assassin

Definitely agree that Elizabeta got arrested too early lol

 

Considering that she was also a part of TLADs story it wouldve been nice to see her as a part of TBOGT, possibly as a rival or an ally for Luis mini crew of him, Henrique, and Armando. Would make more sense due to South Bohans proximity to northern Algonquin.

It would've interesting if she was an ally. That would've made her the only friendly contact in the entire GTA IV/EFLC saga to have worked with Niko, Johnny and Luis.

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Sinner!

The only thing I flat-out dislike about the story is the Michelle plot-twist, in fact, I really dislike it.

 

Reasons being, it makes very little sense.

 

Why is she friends with Mallorie & how did she become friends & when? was her friendship a ploy?

Why is she being forced to work with U.l Paper?

 

It's all too convenient & ambiguous for it to be plausible & her ringing me up sounding suspicious gives it away badly in hindsight.

 

But honestly, outside of that, nothing. I pretty much love everything about the narrative script & characters outside of that.

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RetroMystic

The only thing I flat-out dislike about the story is the Michelle plot-twist, in fact, I really dislike it.

 

Reasons being, it makes very little sense.

 

Why is she friends with Mallorie & how did she become friends & when? was her friendship a ploy?

Why is she being forced to work with U.l Paper?

 

It's all too convenient & ambiguous for it to be plausible & her ringing me up sounding suspicious gives it away badly in hindsight.

 

But honestly, outside of that, nothing. I pretty much love everything about the narrative script & characters outside of that.

 

I often wonder about this when I'm playing the earlier missions. Mallorie and Michelle are established as being friends and her and Niko happen to start dating through Mallorie as a mutual contact. Then all of a sudden she knows he's a criminal, or at the very least has criminal associations (asking questions like do you get involved with bad people and such).

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AmigaMix

I think the game was pretty straightforward with that Michelle-thing:

 

>The IAA uses information they have on Karen (she most likely committed some kind of crime(s)) to blackmail her into "working" with them

>"Working" with the Agency means getting close to some guy to "recruit" him

>Karen "befriends" girlfriend of guys cousin

>girlfriend introduces "single" Karen to guy

>profit?

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Sinner!

It's not straightforward at all.

 

Why befriend Mallorie of all people? coincidence/lucky choice? again, far too convenient if that's the case. also, why is her apartment full of new stuff? is it her house or just a place whilst she's undercover? again none of this explained in a straightforward fashion at all.

 

I think the answer is she was a shoddily written character in an ambiguous & not very well thought-out plot line, and it's certainly not explained in a straightforward fashion.

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RetroMystic
Posted (edited)

I think the game was pretty straightforward with that Michelle-thing:

 

>The IAA uses information they have on Karen (she most likely committed some kind of crime(s)) to blackmail her into "working" with them

>"Working" with the Agency means getting close to some guy to "recruit" him

>Karen "befriends" girlfriend of guys cousin

>girlfriend introduces "single" Karen to guy

>profit?

 

One problem with that bud, you say

 

>Karen "befriends" girlfriend of guys cousin

 

Why would Karen/Michelle know to befriend Roman's girlfriend in order to get closer to Niko? How would the IAA even know about Niko if he's fresh off the boat?

 

also, why is her apartment full of new stuff? is it her house or just a place whilst she's undercover? again none of this explained in a straightforward fashion at all.

 

To be fair to AmigaMix anyone on their second playthrough would infer that it's just a home the IAA setup for Karen while she was operating. If you were undercover you wouldn't take someone into your actual home, especially if you're going to reveal yourself as a government agent.

Edited by RetroMystic

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AmigaMix
Posted (edited)

The IAA probably had most of the information on Niko before he even entered the country, he was, after all, involved in a major human trafficking operation.

Bulgarin, Niko's employer, had a pretty spectacular police record... the chances that mentioned operations were not monitored in some way are rather slim.

 

Edit. Concerning Mallorie: She, like Roman, also has a police record. It's not too unlikely that the IAA told Karen to contact her.

Edited by AmigaMix

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RetroMystic
Posted (edited)

The IAA probably had most of the information on Niko before he even entered the country, he was, after all, involved in a major human trafficking operation.

Bulgarin, Niko's employer, had a pretty spectacular police record... the chances that mentioned operations were not monitored in some way are rather slim.

 

I don't think the IAA would even care for any associates of Bulgarin and would target him directly as opposed to targeting his employees.

 

Edit. Concerning Mallorie: She, like Roman, also has a police record. It's not too unlikely that the IAA told Karen to contact her.

 

I'd argue the IAA would use Mallorie as a pawn to get closer to Elizabeta rather than Niko. That would also somewhat explain how the IAA knew about the Coke deal. Contrived, but it's an interesting connection. I feel like that's reading a little too deep however.

Edited by RetroMystic

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AmigaMix
Posted (edited)

 

I don't think the IAA would even care for any associates of Bulgarin and would target him directly as opposed to targeting his employees.

If the IAA had reason to believe, that those employees could be turned into resourceful assets, they just might.

 

 

I'd argue the IAA would use Mallorie as a pawn to get closer to Elizabeta rather than Niko. That would also somewhat explain how the IAA knew about the Coke deal. Contrived, but it's an interesting connection. I feel like that's reading a little too deep however.

It's possible, but as far as I know, the real life CIA doesn't exactly have a history of stopping drug trafficking... They could use it as leverage against someone, though (which they did in this case).

Edited by AmigaMix

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Algonquin Assassin

 

also, why is her apartment full of new stuff? is it her house or just a place whilst she's undercover? again none of this explained in a straightforward fashion at all.

 

To be fair to AmigaMix anyone on their second playthrough would infer that it's just a home the IAA setup for Karen while she was operating. If you were undercover you wouldn't take someone into your actual home, especially if you're going to reveal yourself as a government agent.

 

 

Also lets keep in mind Michelle says to Niko on their first date that she's from the Midwest and gives the impression she hadn't been in the city for very long. Even if it was her actual home the fact she only just recently moved to the city is more than a good enough reason she'd have new furniture, appliances etc, but as you said it's likely it was setup by the IAA until her case was over.

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Cheatz/Trickz

Michelle/Karen is proof the IAA were on to Niko before he set foot in America. The contact knew Niko was looking for someone, to kill them, so he knew all about Niko's exploits in Europe. It's likely that the IAA checked for any family Niko had in Liberty City and then told Michelle to cosy up to Roman and Mallorie in preparation for Niko's arrival.

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Sinner!

That sounds more like wishful thinking, how would he know Niko wanted revenge 10 years later & how does he even know he's entering the country illegally?

 

I guess you can assume things to make the plot sound more plausible in your own mind.

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SanLiberty

 

What a cool bump (No sarcasm btw lol). To reiterate the point I made in 2014 the way Roman's debts are handled doesn't much sense. It would've been better if we physically had to pay them ourselves which would aleviate some of the uselessness of the in game economy.

 

Also as I'm up to this part in my current save I always thought Broker and Hove Beach in particular should've been a no go zone after Dimitri's betrayal. Niko says that he and Roman had to get away for a few days so I don't get why he'd go back so soon. Going into Broker/Hove Beach should've resulted in Dimitri's men becoming hostile like cars going after Niko every now and then.

Being able to pay off Roman's debts for him would have been interesting, and maybe as a way for Roman to do favors for you for helping him out (though I can't think of what he'd offer other than the standard free cab rides, or paying for meals when you take him out).

 

Hove Beach becoming a no-go zone would have made sense, it kind of reminds me of what happens to Portland in GTA III. Pretty much every gang there hates you and tries to kill you on sight. Though I think III's was a bit overkill and became too annoying (especially in St. Marks with the mafia guys' shotguns). Maybe in IV, you could have gotten a warning by any Russian gang members who spot you to leave before they attack you, kind of like how they warn you to leave if you bump into them. And maybe after the story ended, once Dimitri is dead (and Bulgarin along with all of their heroin being destroyed, as we'd find out in BOGT), Hove Beach would be safe to visit again due to the Russian mob probably being in shambles by that point.

 

Uhh, actually if you go to Hove Beach back in GTA IV, the Russian men will attempt to kill you and have guns.

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