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Octavio89

Things GTA IV did better than GTA V

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TheSantader25
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Miamivicecity said:

I'm pretty 90% of players would. I don't know how many times I've gone to crouch in GTA V out of instinct. Maybe sneak/stealth would've been alright in GTA V if it was useful in more than one mission, but as a mechanic it's pretty useless since the majority of the missions are so linear they would never allow for it. Who honestly would spend time improving the "stealth" skill?

 

With GTA IV I consistently use crouch and cover in gunfights.

There are a couple of missions we have the freedom to choose our path and I like using stealth. 

 

Bugstars Equipment(Setup)

Crystal Maze

Friends Reunited

Minisub(Setup)

Mr. Richards

Merryweather Heist(Freighter)

Deep Inside

Sidetracked(Setup)

Architect's plan

The Third Way(The Last Devin bit)

The construction Assassination

 

It also has it's uses in some missions or side missions just for the sake of being quiet and not killing people and it also is useful in hunting. 

 

The problem with the sneak option is that it's only beneficial during stealth. But Crouching can be beneficial in both combat and stealth. So I really don't know why R* picked the less profitable mechanic. As it appears they accepted their mistake in RDR2. 

Edited by TheSantader25

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Davao

I like that that IV had the control system where you could use X or A to drive, it doesn't have it in V.  As I prefer using that control system

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SonOfLiberty
11 hours ago, TheSantader25 said:

There are a couple of missions we have the freedom to choose our path and I like using stealth. 

 

Bugstars Equipment(Setup)

Crystal Maze

Friends Reunited

Minisub(Setup)

Mr. Richards

Merryweather Heist(Freighter)

Deep Inside

Sidetracked(Setup)

Architect's plan

The Third Way(The Last Devin bit)

The construction Assassination

 

It also has it's uses in some missions or side missions just for the sake of being quiet and not killing people and it also is useful in hunting. 

 

The problem with the sneak option is that it's only beneficial during stealth. But Crouching can be beneficial in both combat and stealth. So I really don't know why R* picked the less profitable mechanic. As it appears they accepted their mistake in RDR2. 

Fair points. Ironically I think GTA IV needed stealth more than GTA V because besides the fact Niko's a hitman/hired gun there are a number of missions that would be perfect for stealth sections like Escuela Of The Streets, Late Checkout, Liquidize The Assets, The Snow Storm etc just to name a few.

 

The problem with GTA V's is it's not really treated as "stealth" as such, but it's just gloried sneaking around to create the illusion of stealth. As I said the stealth skill seems like a waste of time to invest in improving it. Has anyone actually maxed it out? I don't know maybe I'm just thinking too deeply because when I think of stealth I think of the Metal Gear Solid games. Hell as disappointing as it was Mafia III had a great stealth system when you could whistle to enemies and lure them in for a kill. 

 

But as you say crouching has its benefits in both combat and stealth. Also the stealth in GTA V makes the protagonists look like the Hunchback Of Notre Dame lol. The Slav Squat crouching looks more natural.

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Samz707

Combat: good god the combat in 5.

 

Melee is just random, the "light" and "Heavy" buttons don't seem to actually have a difference.

 

Gunplay is awful for one simple design philosophy between them with IV's suiting a large open world more.

 

GTA IV is a Third person shooter WITH a cover system.

 

V is A cover shooter.

 

You die quicker in 5, you have health regen that is slower out of cover, Cops blatantly wall-hack you with less than 1 second time between charging around a corner and instantly shooting you, despite not seeing you before hand.

 

While I haven't experienced around enough with IV in recent memory to see if the cops wall-hack, the fact you can take ALOt more damage means you'll have less unfair deaths since getting shot doesn't take away alot of your health.

 

This means open world combat is awful in V, since the entire combat system is simply NOT built for it, Cops respawn too quickly and are too accurate considering how you frequently won't have cover/have to move, it's clearly designed for those linear shootout missions that have lots of cover.

 

Plus IV lets you crouch, for when you want to move away from low cover but not stand up to get completely shot to death or if you're caught out in the open with no cover.

 

Also less scripted missions, yes those annoying scripted chases exist, but for me, Three leaf Clover ended up a chase half-way through LIberty City with alot of car changes and dead cops, this was WAY more statisfying than the escape from the Jewellery store job, which was a boring scripted nonsensical affair. (Yeah load those bikes onto the truck the Cops saw ramming other cops, they TOTALLY won't be looking for it.)

 

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ChengizVlad09
Posted (edited)

I remember someone from R* was being interviewed just before the initial release of V and I think it was Leslie Benzies actually, and if my memory serves me right, he or they glorified something about the ways and means of creating a city from the architectural point of view and how the city of Los Santos is architectural marvel in a way. I mean, it is, there's no doubt about that - it is beautiful. But there's one particular moment in GTA IV where I stood back in awe by seeing all those skyscrapers and the city's outline. It was (and still is) monumental, we are talking biblical proportions here, closest thing to being in NYC without actually being there. Breathtaking view, really.  I get the "architectural marvel" point if compared to 3D Universe games - which, btw, I'm huge fan of, they are still my favorite ones, despite their, well, whatever is on the opposite side of architectural marvels - but honestly, and this could be highly prone to personal tastes, Los Santos feels kinda cramped compared to Liberty City - even though they are pretty much the same in that regard. Throughout the whole franchise beginning from III, I've never felt the city itself can appear so restricted and insignificant in size. Interestingly enough, Rockstar always seemed to find some ' magical ' formulas according to which they would make maps appear bigger and more spacious than they actually are, but not this time around I guess.

In short city itself, and especially its outline, so artistic and pleasing to the eye.

Edited by ChengizVlad09

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0223998743
1 hour ago, ChengizVlad09 said:

I remember someone from R* was being interviewed just before the initial release of V and I think it was Leslie Benzies actually, and if my memory serves me right, he or they glorified something about the ways and means of creating a city from the architectural point of view and how the city of Los Santos is architectural marvel in a way. I mean, it is, there's no doubt about that - it is beautiful. But there's one particular moment in GTA IV where I stood back in awe by seeing all those skyscrapers and the city's outline. It was (and still is) monumental, we are talking biblical proportions here, closest thing to being in NYC without actually being there. Breathtaking view, really.  I get the "architectural marvel" point if compared to 3D Universe games - which, btw, I'm huge fan of, they are still my favorite ones, despite their, well, whatever is on the opposite side of architectural marvels - but honestly, and this could be highly prone to personal tastes, Los Santos feels kinda cramped compared to Liberty City - even though they are pretty much the same in that regard. Throughout the whole franchise beginning from III, I've never felt the city itself can appear so restricted and insignificant in size. Interestingly enough, Rockstar always seemed to find some ' magical ' formulas according to which they would make maps appear bigger and more spacious than they actually are, but not this time around I guess.

In short city itself, and especially its outline, so artistic and pleasing to the eye.

There is too many mountains in GTA 5 that are mostly useless, this space could have been used for something else more useful and important, and as a city based on a real one, Los Santos layout is terrible.

 

7vfP1qR.png

 

map_of_los-angeles.jpg

 

Something like this would have been at least globally similar:

 

the_crew_2_beta_screen_4.jpg

 

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SonOfLiberty

GTA IV's tone is far more consistent. Part of the reason I feel GTA V's story really suffers is it has a tone identity crisis. It can't make up its mind whether it wants to be taken seriously or if it wants to be as silly as a goofy comedy/action movie. I don't know why the game tries so hard to make us care for Franklin's relationship with Tanisha a character so 1 dimensional Eddie Low looks like the best developed character in video game history in comparison to her.

 

Michael's family issues grow tiring and it feels like I'm watching a GTA parody of Jerry Springer. Then of course there's Trevor that flips back and forth being a "crazy psycho" and trying to makes us sympathise with his abandonment issues. Meanwhile amongst all of this the game tries so hard with unfunny gags that just feel forced as f*ck.

 

It's a shame because I can genuinely see moments of brilliance that could be pulled off if it wasn't trying to cover so much ground. Despite what some people say about GTA IV being too "serious" ultimately it's one of the reasons the story is so strong and confident with its conveyance to the audience. Niko's not meant to be some childish idiot that tries to be funny (Ala Trevor). He's hell bent on getting revenge and can see the world for its bullsh*t. Some say he's a "whiner", but he's easily the most convincing protagonist in the whole series because he's deeply broken and cynical of everything he comes across yet ironically he does have a wicked sense of humour buried deep down inside that comes out with his interactions with Vlad, Brucie, Packie etc. 

 

i would rather a serious story sprinkled with some comic relief than the other way around. The serious moments in GTA V just come off as being overly edgy and cringey. It simply tries to hard to blend two different styles of the 3D era and GTA IV and makes a mess of both. 

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ChengizVlad09
Posted (edited)

@Miamivicecity nicely put man. I for one, don't have any issue with either serious or goofy approach to telling a story, as long as there's consistency to it. V does a terrible job in finding it's true character indeed and lacks consistency. Somehow, it seems that Rockstar simply can't implement realistic and goofy elements where they actually belong and you'll often find them totally mixed up and mistaken or unfinished in V and sadly I got to say, just like in RDR2. There's a certain consistency in 'seriousness' of IV, not only in regards to its story but to its mechanics and systems in wholeness of its gameplay, where every element is perfectly intertwined in it (in more serious style) and I respect that.

 

Comparing it all to 3DU games, they are a true work of art for me, because just by using your imagination you can make them appear as goofy or as serious you want them to be, it just depends on your internal approach, some kind of a chameleon with a pinch of realism and goofiness right where they are needed and in the rightly dosed amounts.

Edited by ChengizVlad09

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Davao

When you hanged out with people, you only have drinking, golf, strip clubs, cinema and tennis. In IV, you have more variety of choice

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Ertan Soner
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Davao said:

When you hanged out with people, you only have drinking, golf, strip clubs, cinema and tennis. In IV, you have more variety of choice

Plus you can eat with them. In 5 they could atleast make a simple cutscene which our characters eat and laugh when you enter the marker like in sa.

Edited by Ertan Soner
fix

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0223998743
Posted (edited)

Not only that when you were drunk it was handled by Euphoria..it was and is still very funny.

This is something that is not even in RDR2, go figure..

Edited by anthony

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SonOfLiberty
5 hours ago, anthony said:

Not only that when you were drunk it was handled by Euphoria..it was and is still very funny.

This is something that is not even in RDR2, go figure..

Speaking of getting drunk I think GTA IV does a way better job of creating the sensation of feeling "drunk". Not only does it last a lot longer than GTA V's, but the way the camera blurs creates a a feeling of nausea to mimic what it's like to be actually drunk.

 

But ever since then it's been kinda weak. Red Dead Redemption 2's is pretty good, but in GTA V it looked like being underwater and they didn't stumble around and fall over. I love getting drunk in GTA IV because some of the hang outs particularly with LJ, Roman and Packie are just gold.

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GiveMeLiberty78
On 1/8/2019 at 11:17 PM, Miamivicecity said:

Speaking of getting drunk I think GTA IV does a way better job of creating the sensation of feeling "drunk". Not only does it last a lot longer than GTA V's, but the way the camera blurs creates a a feeling of nausea to mimic what it's like to be actually drunk.

 

<snip>

Imagine that in VR, pretty nauseating I bet!

GTA 4 is indeed an under-rated game in terms of content, story arc, character development, and of course Euphoria! If only Niko had some/all of the attributes of the infamous Agent 47 - I think that Niko would make a good silent assassin, quite a sharp mind, a good head on his shoulders. All we need now are some leather [fingerless?] gloves and some basic training perhaps!

I find it unsurprising that GTA 4 only received a passing kind of nod at its 10 year anniversary. Fortunately there's still a healthy number of people keeping up the madness on the streets of Liberty City in 2019.

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SonOfLiberty
45 minutes ago, GiveMeLiberty78 said:

I find it unsurprising that GTA 4 only received a passing kind of nod at its 10 year anniversary. Fortunately there's still a healthy number of people keeping up the madness on the streets of Liberty City in 2019.

Don't worry brother.

 

GTA IV is like one of those old school punk bands underappreciated in their time, but their heart and soul live on and defy all the odds. GTA V is like a Kardashian, Justin Beiber etc. Loved by millions, but shallow as f*ck under the surface.😉

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SonOfLiberty

GTA IV has vehicle theft side missions which to me are the MOST important side mission in a GRAND THEFT AUTO game. I love how R* totally revamped it for GTA IV. Brucie's exotic exports have variety with different scenarios that randomise on each playthrough that can even randomise the vehicles to be stolen. Stevie's are just brilliant because they're more reminiscent of the 3D era lists, but instead of stealing random cars off the street you given cryptic messages to find specific vehicles at different locations throughout the city with nothing more than a picture and a vague text message. No help from the map.

 

I tell you doing this the first time playing GTA IV was a true test if I paid attention to any of the city's landmarks. I felt like Memphis Raines in Gone in 60 Seconds doing this sh*t. Loved it.

 

But what was GTA V's answer? 5 cars to steal for the Epsilon program. What a sh*t effort. I know there's a point of the story where Weston requires a number of vehicles to be stolen, but there still should've been a proper side mission like every other GTA. I mean right at the start Franklin repossesses vehicles for Simeon so why couldn't this have been extend into free roam? Yes it's only a couple of missions before Franklin's fired, but it could've been handled like the taxi missions in GTA IV. Even if there was only a handful to do it's better than nothing.

 

Hell I could imagine Trevor stealing vehicles just for the sake of it so it's surprises me it's not something included later on. As I said the only thing is 5 for the Epsilon program, but this approach is flawed because not everyone would be bothered to do those  terrible Epsilon program Strangers & Freaks tasks to get that far and it pales in comparison to the 40 GTA IV offered. Of all the things GTA V's misfires with this has always baffled me the most. 😕

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Sootyjared

Fire.

 

Setting a car on fire for example felt like it was on fire. In V it fells like one of those fake flames made from tissue paper and a light.

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SonOfLiberty

-Minigame locations like darts for example are placed more conveniently. In GTA V it's annoying that the only place to play darts is out in the desert. WTF? You're meaning to tell me in a city like Los Santos there wouldn't be a single bar in the city that has a dart board for patrons to play darts. 😒

 

-No tacked on, underdeveloped features like property management.

 

-A game world that feels more organic and spontaneous without the need for "random events"  to occur.

 

-People can say what they like about GTA IV's missions being "repetitive", but atleast the game doesn't employ ridiculous fail states like GTA V does. In most missions I can pre-plan before going to the objective that's been triggered by the mission to stock up on weapons/ammo or in missions like Museum Piece I can blow up the PMP 600s parked out front to stop them chasing later on.

 

In GTA V it's so ball clenching restrictive/linear if you so much as leave the immediate mission area 9 times out 10 it'll fail you for doing anything else other than what the game wants you to do. I don't even mean lacking different ways to approach missions necessarily, but just the way the design feels like it wants to punish the player for the smallest of reasons even if it's by accident. 

 

GTA V's missions might be more "varied" from a cinematic perspective, but it comes at a price. I replay GTA IV's missions because I enjoy I generally feel like I have more input even if the objective is to "Go to place x and kill guy y" or something like that. GTA V's missions get older a lot faster to me and they're less replayable.

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thehambone
1 hour ago, Miamivicecity said:

-People can say what they like about GTA IV's missions being "repetitive", but atleast the game doesn't employ ridiculous fail states like GTA V does. In most missions I can pre-plan before going to the objective that's been triggered by the mission to stock up on weapons/ammo or in missions like Museum Piece I can blow up the PMP 600s parked out front to stop them chasing later on.

The fail states in GTA V are one of my biggest gripes about the game. They make the game feel a lot more linear and less like an open-world (and dare I say "GTA") game.

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Copcaller

Better internet with police database

Better protagonists and side characters

Single player dlc 

Better random characters

Better story

Crouching

Shootouts with Russia mafia in free roam 

Edited by Copcaller

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Ertan Soner
17 hours ago, Copcaller said:

Better internet with police database

Better protagonists and side characters

Single player dlc 

Better random characters

Better story

Crouching

Shootouts with Russia mafia in free roam 

You actually shouldn't include crouching because 5 doesn't have it. This is like saying 4 has better cover mechanics than 3 but 3 doesn't even have cover mechanics.

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TheSantader25
5 minutes ago, Ertan Soner said:

You actually shouldn't include crouching because 5 doesn't have it. This is like saying 4 has better cover mechanics than 3 but 3 doesn't even have cover mechanics.

I think it's a fair criticism. Especially if a "predecessor" has it. Like IV does not have planes and I sure as hell consider it a flaw and I know many do. 

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Copcaller
1 hour ago, Ertan Soner said:

You actually shouldn't include crouching because 5 doesn't have it. This is like saying 4 has better cover mechanics than 3 but 3 doesn't even have cover mechanics.

See the difference with 3 is it came out in early 2000s so I don't mind it lacking bail mechanics or a cover system. But for 4 to have one and 5 not to have it seems pretty weird to me.

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SonOfLiberty
11 hours ago, Ertan Soner said:

You actually shouldn't include crouching because 5 doesn't have it. This is like saying 4 has better cover mechanics than 3 but 3 doesn't even have cover mechanics.

Why not? The GTA V equivalent thread always lists things GTA IV doesn't have. However the lack of crouching in GTA V has always puzzled me because it's been a core mechanic since Vice City and even the Red Dead games have it so it's a major fail on GTA V's behalf if you ask me.

 

It's pretty bad too when you consider GTA V and GTA IV are both created using the same engine/physics so for GTA V to lack a key core mechanic like that is embarrassing, but this is one of the things that really irks me about GTA V. It has a lot of big ticket features people complained about that were "missing" in GTA IV, but then it stiffed a bunch of core mechanics from GTA IV like crouching, pushing peds, parkour, watered down melee combat  etc 

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SonOfLiberty

Peds wont immediately die if they just get shot in the arm or leg. In GTA V they just fall over and die even if a bullet grazes them.  FAIL Especially considering Red Dead Redemption's and Max Payne 3's advancements in this area and GTA V should've followed suit.

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TheSantader25

-Explosion Damage: GTA V is actually the worst game in the series when it comes to this category. Unlike previous GTAs where explosions could kill you or reduce your health based on your distance, in GTA V you will either die OR survive without any damage from the explosions. This applies to non armored vehicles as well. In IV they could be heavily scrapped and damaged and still closely survive. This is an epic fail and one of V's biggest flaws since even 3D era games got this right. 

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billiejoearmstrong8

Giving an NPC a shove so they drop their cigarette on the floor, picking it up (and holding it as one would hold a cigarette between the fingers) and throwing it at them for good measure, watching them stumble and curse at you and having a fight knocking them out with some nice krav maga moves. It's the small details that make the game charming and fun.

 

Another thing I like is the unpredictability of fights. In V after you've played for a while you know exactly how any given NPC will react to starting a fight, whether they'll be armed and what they'll be armed with (can only be a pistol or sometimes a knife and you know who's going to have them). Also if they pull out a knife and stab you once you're dead, boring. And of course all the animations are predictable too, and you know exactly when police will become involved and how they'll act (kill one person and then do anything to another = police every single time).

 

In IV fight reactions are less predictable, there's a wider range of weapons that can come out and you can get genuinely surprised, it can start as a fist fight but then a knife might come out and then they might also have a gun (pistol, shotgun or assaut rifle) if it escalates. And police response can vary widely as it depends on when patrolling police see/hear you and often you can fight large numbers of people before getting a wanted level as long as no guns are used. Watching the police fight NPCs is similarly unpredictable and fun (for example some guy was punching me on a subway platform after I'd shoved him, a cop aimed a gun to arrest him and he pulled a knife and started stabbing the cop) whereas in V it's just shoot to kill in seconds.

 

I'd been playing V for 4 years having skipped IV completely (played the previous GTAs but didn't have a console for IV when it came out) and thought it was great. Playing IV the last few months has blown me away, can't believe what I'd been missing and unfortunately it's shown up V's flaws very starkly by comparison.

Edited by billiejoearmstrong8

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thehambone
6 hours ago, billiejoearmstrong8 said:

*snip*

A direct result of Rockstar focusing too much time on making the game look stunning on the surface and not enough time on functionality (which is what makes a game... well... a game!).

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Ertan Soner
On 1/24/2019 at 10:13 AM, TheSantader25 said:

-Explosion Damage: GTA V is actually the worst game in the series when it comes to this category. Unlike previous GTAs where explosions could kill you or reduce your health based on your distance, in GTA V you will either die OR survive without any damage from the explosions. This applies to non armored vehicles as well. In IV they could be heavily scrapped and damaged and still closely survive. This is an epic fail and one of V's biggest flaws since even 3D era games got this right. 

Your ear also rings after explosion in 4.

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billiejoearmstrong8

A small thing I like is the street names. I love the themes of them (especially the rock/mineral themed street names in Algonquin - Ruby Street, Quartz Street, Feldspar Street etc, and how there's a "Wong Way" in Chinatown lol) and also how Niko says the name of them in the taxi and how you're made aware of them in other ways like Stevie's Car Thefts. Just feels more realistic and like you know the city better when street names are referred to, it's that great attention to detail again. In V street names are rarely mentioned (if ever) and don't stand out or have anything interesting about them, they're even written very small on the screen so you don't notice them.

 

Edited by billiejoearmstrong8

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thehambone
2 minutes ago, billiejoearmstrong8 said:

In V street names are rarely mentioned (if ever) and don't stand out or have anything interesting about them, they're even written very small on the screen so you don't notice them.

I think street names are implemented poorly, if not incorrectly, in GTA V. When you press the down arrow to zoom out the map (and show your neighborhood, street name, etc.) the game almost never tells you which street you're actually on, unlike GTA IV. Instead it shows the next street closest to you.

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