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Will GTA5 PC suffer the same flickering z-buffer/z-fighting issues as


teninchtoenail

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teninchtoenail

I never played GTA4 on console so not sure if it exists there or not, but on GTA4 PC everybody knows there are some issues with flickering textures and shadows, especially on distant objects as they switch LOD models.

 

I did get a chance to play GTA5 on Xbox 360 and didn't notice any of these z-fighting issues, the game had a much cleaner look overall.

 

Do you think Rockstar has solved the z-fighting issues in the engine or is it possible they will make a return in the PC version of GTA5?

 

One of my favorite things to do in GTA5 is just cruise around and take in the sights of the city, that would be ruined if it had the same z-fighting issues as GTA4.

 

Hoping the DX11 renderer is as stable on PC as it is on console.

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Highly unlikely cuz It's not a port

 

This has nothing to do with anything. Z-fighting is a common issue across ANY realtime 3D rasterization engine. If you push view distances to a certain point and increase your distance from point of origin, you are almost always going to experience z-fighting. The question is, did Rockstar come up with techniques to minimize it.

 

And yeah OP I agree 100%, this is something I am very concerned about for V on PC. After playing IV on PC and seeing the clarity of objects in the distance, the z-fighting on the shoreline is atrocious. It just kills the atmosphere in a horrible way.

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Probaly, especially on weaker GPUs.

 

 

wtf has the GPU to do with it??? faster gpu only provides better frame rates

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I didn't see any z-fighting on GTA IV except for when i used trainers to get past the helicopter height limit. That's where the z-fighting starts.

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Well think about this, there was code for the pc version in the old gen files so they have been working on this for next gen since before release of current gen and have had a lot more time on it then the current gta v we have. I expect these issues shouldn't be as much if any problem at all.

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Nah, or at least, we shouldn't accept it as the most likely scenario.

 

R* have improved the engine entirely. V pushes technical limits further than they've ever been pushed. With IV they had to struggle with making an entirely new engine with the budget they had, but with V they have better technology, a bigger budget and they've already GOT the main engine and only have to improve it as needed.

 

Plus, the build logs showed their development around the PC version has been more professional than ever before. So have faith, even though little is needed as these issues are quite an unlikely scenario.

 

 

Next.

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There's no way to prevent this, maybe reduce, but no way to remove it.

 

Now when I think about it, maybe it's possible, but REALLY I mean REALLY time consuming.

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Every 3D game has Z-Fighting. It's only a matter of how far away from things you need to get to experience it.

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I'd love to see that kind of problem gone, but i extremely doubt it will be completely fixed, especially in a game like GTA that depends heavily on LOD meshes and texture overlays on roads and walls. It has nothing to do with whether the game is a port or not, though.

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Probaly, especially on weaker GPUs.

 

 

wtf has the GPU to do with it??? faster gpu only provides better frame rates

Umm, can't this be fixed with depth-buffers and higher precision? (with of course devs work and better drivers?)

Edited by r34ld34l
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oCrapaCreeper

The only notable z-fighting I remember in IV was with water and the beach area.

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It won't. I'm sure they will make GTA V is better than GTA IV, but let see it

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If you push view distances to a certain point and increase your distance from point of origin, you are almost always going to experience z-fighting.

But, the console version with impressive view distance never showed ( may be I didn't notice, if it actually did ) and the likelihood of having such an issue, although possible but the developers would have definitely improved on it esp. impressive draw distance work well with the extremely large scale incl. the surrounding water surface.

 

Though, I could be pointing out something else, so correct me if I'm wrong!

Edited by Osho
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If you push view distances to a certain point and increase your distance from point of origin, you are almost always going to experience z-fighting.

But, the console version with impressive view distance never showed

 

Are you being sarcastic? If not: The console version has some view distance, but it doesn't have any detail in that distance which is what causes most of the z-fighting. A single mountain isn't going to cause z-fighting by itself.

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ravendrölf

Well with the latest patch (1.0.7.0) applied i didn't experience any messy shadows anymore.

 

Maybe its just my graphics card (GTX 570)..

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Are you being sarcastic? If not: The console version has some view distance, but it doesn't have any detail in that distance which is what causes most of the z-fighting. A single mountain isn't going to cause z-fighting by itself.

No, but thanks for correcting me.

I was not sure about z-fighting issue itself, perhaps don't know its function exactly and trying to understand from the topic to relate the experiences so far.

Edited by Osho
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Are you being sarcastic? If not: The console version has some view distance, but it doesn't have any detail in that distance which is what causes most of the z-fighting. A single mountain isn't going to cause z-fighting by itself.

No, but thanks for correcting me.

I was not sure about z-fighting issue itself, perhaps don't know its function exactly and trying to understand from the topic to relate the experiences so far.

 

Watch this:

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NTAuthority

close-up zfighting used to merely be a glitch of some decal shader variations and the zbias in them

 

V handles that somewhat differently

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I noticed it a bit on PS3 when some graffiti lods are trying to load. The buildlog did mention a last gen mode, I can only assume that they have optimized the sh*t out of this game. :)

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no it wont. last gen didnt so new gen will havent

I was glad when I didn't see any of them annoying flickering in V (PS3), but unfortunately lately I noticed quite awful z-fighting several times. I don't know if that has to do anything with the latest patch(es) but I really didn't notice this before. I only hope it is just a last gen issue though.

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GTA V certainly did have z-fighting, it just wasn't nearly as apparent as the atrocious flickering on IV PC version. Praying they solved this, what an immersion killer.

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I have GTA V on Xbox 360 and I can assure all of you that the z-fighting problems are damn near gone.

 

On GTA IV thin surfaces overlapping each other would randomly appear behind or in front of the other in weird fragments. This was most noticable on the wheels of cars, when the wheels intersect the body or when tyres were popped and the compressed bit flickered around the ground.

Comparing that to V I have so far not seen any of that happening. Everything I've seen so far has not had any z-fighting related to the game engine itself apart from a few shorelines here and there getting it but you have to be really far up in the sky for it to show. But to be honest I was actually looking for it, taking a good close look at when it would start occuring. Considering that this is on consoles with ancient hardware I'm sure Rockstar can fix these last few problems easily on PC/NG.

 

If you want to compare the flickering on wheels of cars you can do so yourself. In the first trailer of GTA V a van drives past the camera to reveal some dude hammering a sign into the ground. Try to pause right where you get a close up of the rear wheel. That wheel model is the exact same as on the trucks in IV and V. Then compare that to any truck using the same wheels in IV at a similiar/closer distance and you'll see the nuts and maybe even the centre hub flicker like mad. Graphics settings wont make a difference (to my experience).

 

And regarding the shadows the casting system for that has been changed to something I've never seen before.

Hint: this will get technical...

 

Traditionally shadows in games have different resolutions depending on the distance from the camera, each step in resolution is roughly halved that of the previous starting from the camera and decreases step by step. This is seen in pretty much all games using real-time shadow maps and is spotted by moving back and forth looking for a sudden change in shadow resolution. The highest resolution is always the same no matter the distance below a certain point.

But this is where GTA V surprised me. The shadow casting there doesnt give a damn about camera distance unless you're looking down a scope. It will create a rough bounding volume around the player's size (on foot it's the character, in a vehicle it's the vehicle size) and place that where the shadow is expected to hit. This point will become the area with the highest shadow resolution meaning that no matter how far or close the shadow is to the camera the resolution is the same in that area. Then the further away from that point the shadows are the lower resolution they get.

And this is where it gets really interesting, especially for those that love close ups. If you aim down the scope of a weapon the shadow resolution will adapt to how large the objects near you are expected to be. When doing this details that were rather pixellated before are now nice and crisp in face-meltingly high resolution. I think this is the only time the resolution depends on distance to a certain degree.

 

TL;DR ------------------------------

Flickering surfaces are now rare unless you're scouting the shorelines from space.

Shadows use a new system that I've never seen before. Expect high shadow resolutions where it matters, especially around your own shadow. And I mean HIGH resolution!

Edited by CHILLI
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NTAuthority

Traditionally shadows in games have different resolutions depending on the distance from the camera, each step in resolution is roughly halved that of the previous starting from the camera and decreases step by step. This is seen in pretty much all games using real-time shadow maps and is spotted by moving back and forth looking for a sudden change in shadow resolution. The highest resolution is always the same no matter the distance below a certain point.

But this is where GTA V surprised me. The shadow casting there doesnt give a damn about camera distance unless you're looking down a scope. It will create a rough bounding volume around the player's size (on foot it's the character, in a vehicle it's the vehicle size) and place that where the shadow is expected to hit. This point will become the area with the highest shadow resolution meaning that no matter how far or close the shadow is to the camera the resolution is the same in that area. Then the further away from that point the shadows are the lower resolution they get.

And this is where it gets really interesting, especially for those that love close ups. If you aim down the scope of a weapon the shadow resolution will adapt to how large the objects near you are expected to be. When doing this details that were rather pixellated before are now nice and crisp in face-meltingly high resolution. I think this is the only time the resolution depends on distance to a certain degree.

Shadows use a new system that I've never seen before. Expect high shadow resolutions where it matters, especially around your own shadow. And I mean HIGH resolution!

GTA IV/RAGE have always used a fairly different shadow splitting system from typical games - which had been perfected for the later PC patches coinciding with the EFLC release and RDR later on.

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Murray Bunyan

I don't remember this being as apparent as people are making it. Wasn't this only a big issue with older ATI cards?

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