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[spoilers] should Ryder have had...


Lemoyne outlaw

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He shouldn't have betrayed GSF in the first place. Him turning into a traitor went against his passionate, staunch personality in the beginning of the game.

Agreed, that mudafukin busta betrayed the families

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I think it would've been far more interesting having the asshole stay loyal to the protagonist and the 'nice guy' betraying.
You know, it would be unexpected having that guy we all hate... end up being good and loyal while the cheerful and warm one (the one we all love in the beginning of the game) betray the protagonist. VERY unexpected.

Rockstar just missed on a more stable plot.

Edited by CasualSergiu
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I think it would've been far more interesting having the asshole stay loyal to the protagonist and the 'nice guy' betraying.

You know, it would be unexpected having that guy we all hate... end up being good and loyal while the cheerful and warm one (the one we all love in the beginning of the game) betray the protagonist. VERY unexpected.

 

Rockstar just missed on a more stable plot.

Yeah. That would've made the story far less predictable. Everyone would expect the jealous asshole to betray the families and not expect the "nice guy" to turn his back on the protagonist. Then it would be the other way around and add in the irony of the story. That would've been much more clever. CJ and Ryder working together in the Badlands would be kick ass.

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  • 2 months later...
prettydamnbored

Late comment but, I loved Ryder when I first played San Andreas. It's kind of normal for Ryder to call CJ some sh*t because the other guys do so I thought he was going to stay as main character. I think the only thing that made you think he was a bad guy was when Big Smoke and Ryder ditched Sweet and CJ.

Ryder looked like a good guy, but Big Smoke really didn't. Big Smoke looked really like a bad guy since he moved out of the grove, didn't shoot at the Ballas and in the beginning he kind of foreshadowed by throwing the baseball bat onto Beverly's photo (if you count that as foreshadowing). I still, today have thoughts of what Ryder would be like if he helped CJ, Cesar and Sweet.

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Son of Zeus

I think it would've been far more interesting having the asshole stay loyal to the protagonist and the 'nice guy' betraying.

You know, it would be unexpected having that guy we all hate... end up being good and loyal while the cheerful and warm one (the one we all love in the beginning of the game) betray the protagonist. VERY unexpected.

 

Rockstar just missed on a more stable plot.

Exactly bro. It would have been epic if CJ and Ryder would have worked together in SF. Then in the last mission they could have killed Smoke together....... Now that would have been a kickass ending.

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You either die a SP fan or live long enough to see Online enter the series.

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In any group there will always be two who have odds against each other.

Ryder's jealousy of Carl is one, Carl did not give a hoot about Ryder. As he expressed so many times.

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Was Ruder jealous? I thought he just liked critecizing and i guess bullying CJ.

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In any group there will always be two who have odds against each other.

Ryder's jealousy of Carl is one, Carl did not give a hoot about Ryder. As he expressed so many times.

Yay ka boom boom mission: "f*cking Ryder, man. That was my homie...and I killed him".

 

Yeah, don't know how you see it, but that doesn't sound like anyone who "did not give a hoot about Ryder".

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A "Homie" is like a family member, when they get killed you are supposed to express regret even if you hated them.

During all the prior contact between them Carl regardless of what Ryder said hardly had a bad word for him, EXCEPT during the burglary mission Carl said he warned that he would be killing Ryder, which can be viewed as a hint when they were going to take the loot to the garage.

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I didn't know you blew him up. I had a poor grasp of the English language when I played that mission, so I (after many hours) boarded his boat and shot him.

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L71cGcK.png

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A "Homie" is like a family member, when they get killed you are supposed to express regret even if you hated them.

During all the prior contact between them Carl regardless of what Ryder said hardly had a bad word for him, EXCEPT during the burglary mission Carl said he warned that he would be killing Ryder, which can be viewed as a hint when they were going to take the loot to the garage.

Yeah, he saw Ryder as his homie, as a childhood friend. At least until he saw him with some ballas and blew him up.

 

I think CJ didn't felt good with the fact of having to kill them, because he saw tthem as family. Anyway, this whole Ryder thing seems to be bad writing from R*, when we talk about how he was killed.

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A "Homie" is like a family member, when they get killed you are supposed to express regret even if you hated them.

During all the prior contact between them Carl regardless of what Ryder said hardly had a bad word for him, EXCEPT during the burglary mission Carl said he warned that he would be killing Ryder, which can be viewed as a hint when they were going to take the loot to the garage.

CJ never warned Ryder that he would kill him. He said "One day, you gonna wish you hadn't piss me off", which can mean anything. There was never any explicit evidence that CJ hated Ryder. Maybe he was a little annoyed with Ryder at times, but he didn't hate him, especially not as much as he hated Tenpenny, Pulaski, and Catalina. Hell, CJ even rejected Big Smoke's compliment in the mission "Nines and AKs", telling him that he's full of sh*t.

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04SanAndreas04

Ryder was my favourite character so I was absolutely devastated when I first played the game and found out he had betrayed the families!

 

So yeah, in hindsight I agree that he deserved a better death.

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The way that Ryder was portrayed after his betrayal was poorly written. CJ's all concerned about his childhood friend betraying him yet completely ignores his other childhood friend as if he never even heard of him. Then when it's time to kill him, CJ kills him without even a small conversation, as if he was a minor character. Also, when CJ bails Sweet out of jail, Sweet never even asks about Ryder's whereabouts since CJ never mentioned Ryder to Sweet during the Green Sabre mission. It was as if there was never a character named Ryder in the whole game. It's obvious that R* improvised Ryder's betrayal. Otherwise, it would've been better written. I don't care what anyone says. Ryder is the most underrated character in not just San Andreas, but in GTA period. He had that rude early 90s gangsta attitude that made him the most cohesive character of the game. I would much rather have Ryder be the protagonist of the game than CJ. Disagree with me all you want. It's my opinion.

Edited by Paul723
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I do not believe that Ryder was a "childhood friend". I do not recall any conversations between them that indicated any prior close friendship. More like Carl was a hanger on, while Ryder was a deep member of the gang being close to Sweet and Big Smoke's leadership.

It was more like they had just met and Carl was trying to be friendly to him, while Ryder was jealous of Carl's return to "importance" within the gang upon his (Carl's) return to the fold.

Ryder's addled mind due to his hard drug intake was only tempered by his ability (through Tenpenny) to acquire weapons.

Carl was very lenient toward Ryder, in that while Carl was murdering other drug dealers he did not off Ryder earlier.

Edited by lil weasel
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Well maybe Ryder didn't care about CJ, but CJ did care about Ryder, that's why Ryder's dead and Carl's attitude after that felt like very bad scripting.

 

I think this wouldn't bother people that much if R* had gave him a bigger role after The Green Sabre. After that mission he's like a ped, a tiny character in thw game, and many people liked him more than Smoke (including me)

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Lemoyne outlaw

i agree with alot of the posts here and like reading these great ideas.

 

I do not believe that Ryder was a "childhood friend". I do not recall any conversations between them that indicated any prior close friendship.

i think they were childhood friends because in the robbing uncle sam carl mentioned a school memory when ryder put hands on a teacher for wearing ballas colors.

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  • 3 weeks later...

a more dramatic death? i was playing the mission pier 69 and was thinking ryder should have had a cutscene death he was one of my favorite charecters and he just blew up on the boat and i wish he had a last words thing like pulaski. what are your thoughts?

 

That's pretty much the only reason I always do the boat chase instead of sniping him from the pier. To give him the chance to say his last words, even if they aren't at the level of Pulaski's or Smoke's.

 

That was a joke, right? Because anyone who played the game knows that Toreno sent that helicopter as a decoy while he was incognito for a while.

 

I can't remember any moment in the game where it's actually stated. As far as I remember, that's just the most plausible explaination, considering Toreno's background and personality.

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PhillBellic

He had a very poorly developed deatt, to say the least. It would have turned SA's story on its head if Ryder was the one who redeemed himself, and helped you take on the true betrayer, Big Smoke.

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Lance "Ryder Wilson is an awesome character because-

- he has the Napoleon complex

- beat up a teacher for wearing purple clothes (the colour of the Ballas).

- thinks he is too intelligent for school

- one of the best looking NPCs of the game.

- "Busta"

- was a drug dealer since the age of 10.

- OG of Grove Street Families.

- one of the few villains who did not directly attempt to kill the player.

- giving un-forgettable missions. (Ryder, Robbing Uncle Sam, Home Invasion and Catalyst).

 

Yeah, Ryder deserves a better death than that. Though, I remember that in the beta version, he swapped death scenes with T-Bone, but he still deserves a better death.

Edited by Leo2301
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The way that Ryder was portrayed after his betrayal was poorly written. CJ's all concerned about his childhood friend betraying him yet completely ignores his other childhood friend as if he never even heard of him. Then when it's time to kill him, CJ kills him without even a small conversation, as if he was a minor character. Also, when CJ bails Sweet out of jail, Sweet never even asks about Ryder's whereabouts since CJ never mentioned Ryder to Sweet during the Green Sabre mission. It was as if there was never a character named Ryder in the whole game. It's obvious that R* improvised Ryder's betrayal. Otherwise, it would've been better written. I don't care what anyone says. Ryder is the most underrated character in not just San Andreas, but in GTA period. He had that rude early 90s gangsta attitude that made him the most cohesive character of the game. I would much rather have Ryder be the protagonist of the game than CJ. Disagree with me all you want. It's my opinion.

Exactly what I was thinking. So we're supposed to believe a gangster (a true gangster) from the hood that was pretty much down for anything illicit is going to escape via boat despite the fact that he was packing an AK-47 during his arrival at the pier in the cutscene? Not only was his betrayal improvised, but his death and the way it was written was improvised too.

 

I also agree with you that Ryder is the most underrated GTA character of all time.

Edited by 90sGTA
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natetheguitarkid

The way that Ryder was portrayed after his betrayal was poorly written. CJ's all concerned about his childhood friend betraying him yet completely ignores his other childhood friend as if he never even heard of him. Then when it's time to kill him, CJ kills him without even a small conversation, as if he was a minor character. Also, when CJ bails Sweet out of jail, Sweet never even asks about Ryder's whereabouts since CJ never mentioned Ryder to Sweet during the Green Sabre mission. It was as if there was never a character named Ryder in the whole game. It's obvious that R* improvised Ryder's betrayal. Otherwise, it would've been better written. I don't care what anyone says. Ryder is the most underrated character in not just San Andreas, but in GTA period. He had that rude early 90s gangsta attitude that made him the most cohesive character of the game. I would much rather have Ryder be the protagonist of the game than CJ. Disagree with me all you want. It's my opinion.

That is truely the dumbest sh*t ive ever read on this site. But its your opinion. Ryder as the protagonist? Over CJ? Ryder was a dumbass piece of sh*t backstabber. What the f*ck.

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natetheguitarkid

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

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The way that Ryder was portrayed after his betrayal was poorly written. CJ's all concerned about his childhood friend betraying him yet completely ignores his other childhood friend as if he never even heard of him. Then when it's time to kill him, CJ kills him without even a small conversation, as if he was a minor character. Also, when CJ bails Sweet out of jail, Sweet never even asks about Ryder's whereabouts since CJ never mentioned Ryder to Sweet during the Green Sabre mission. It was as if there was never a character named Ryder in the whole game. It's obvious that R* improvised Ryder's betrayal. Otherwise, it would've been better written. I don't care what anyone says. Ryder is the most underrated character in not just San Andreas, but in GTA period. He had that rude early 90s gangsta attitude that made him the most cohesive character of the game. I would much rather have Ryder be the protagonist of the game than CJ. Disagree with me all you want. It's my opinion.

That is truely the dumbest sh*t ive ever read on this site. But its your opinion. Ryder as the protagonist? Over CJ? Ryder was a dumbass piece of sh*t backstabber. What the f*ck. Like I said, you could say whatever the f*ck you like, asshole. If you don't like Ryder, that's fine. But respect the opinions of the people who actually do like him. To me, Ryder was the most cohesive character of the game (before he became a traitor that is)
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Boyz2Society

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

I can't believe you're actually trying to instigate redundant arguments with other users over a f*cking video game character. Edited by Boyz2Society
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Well if you blow up his boat and get out and fire a couple of rounds in his head I'm sure he's dead. They couldn't really let him live because it would be unlogical for some players who did something like that. Same thing for Lance. If I would have killed him and then fired some rounds in his head it would be pretty weird seeing him alive again.

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GTA19somethin

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

How sad. The poor kid is upset because no one else on this topic shares his animosity towards a fictional character from a video game. lol Grow up, desperate loser.
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natetheguitarkid

 

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

How sad. The poor kid is upset because no one else on this topic shares his animosity towards a fictional character from a video game. lol Grow up, desperate loser.

 

I just dont understand the sympathy for him. I can be passionate about a video game if i want to. This is a GTA forum, if you didnt have some interest and passion in the games, why the f*ck are you on here then?

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natetheguitarkid

 

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

I can't believe you're actually trying to instigate redundant arguments with other users over a f*cking video game character.

 

I didnt intentionally 'instigate' anything. If the other person wants to get mad about what i say, thats there fault. I said i felt his opinion was stupid. Like i said to the last person, i can be passionate about what the f*ck i want to be. This forum is dedicated to GTA talk. Do i realize theyre video games characters? Yea, but theyre characters that ive taken interest in and have interest in talking about. If you think thats pathetic or dont like it find a different forum. Youre going to see alot more people then me talking about characters within the game.

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GTA19somethin

 

 

 

You should rename this the "Ryder circle jerk club". You guys make him sound like he had positive traits. He was the stupid one out of the grove street members. And he died that way as well. I would of rather of seen him get his head blown off by an AK and then have his body torched. I cant believe there is people out there taking so much ryder love juice in their mouth.

How sad. The poor kid is upset because no one else on this topic shares his animosity towards a fictional character from a video game. lol Grow up, desperate loser.

 

I just dont understand the sympathy for him. I can be passionate about a video game if i want to. This is a GTA forum, if you didnt have some interest and passion in the games, why the f*ck are you on here then? So maligning others for liking a character you have blatant antipathy for and flagrantly disrespecting their own opinions is defined as "interest and passion in the games"?

 

Makes perfect f*cking sense. (caustically speaking)

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