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Cuz05

Checkpoint Placement Guide

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PlamenVT

One of the crucial checkpoints is the one just before the turn.

 

The checkpoint before the turn ("1" on the graphic) must be positioned as far as possible from the actual turn, but still close enough to be visible.

 

The reason is to give advance warning to the drivers, otherwise they will end up crashing against each other or taking a wrong lane. Also makes it easier to whoever is racing on that track for first time.

 

checkpoints.gif

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deejayb1874

A good visual guide that Plament. Covered in the OP though.

 

'CPs on a high speed straight need to be far enough away from the following corner so that the driver has enough time to react to the corner CP and correct speed.'

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Cornbat

r☆ does use props. Mostly small ramps in bike races. Rest of what you said I agree on. Some drivers don't realize there are brakes in the vehicles.

Which races?

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Cuz05

Off the top of my head, Up the Back Alley, one of the compact races, has some big props.

Can't think of any motorbike races so I'm thinking GMB means pushbikes? The Downtown one has some I believe...

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Cornbat

Off the top of my head, Up the Back Alley, one of the compact races, has some big props.

Can't think of any motorbike races so I'm thinking GMB means pushbikes? The Downtown one has some I believe...

 

Thanks. I just ran Up the Back Alley with time of day set to noon so I could get a good look at the props. That is how propping should be done, when it actually improves a race. Minimal, subtle, props thematically appropriate to location. I had not noticed them previously, when actually navigating the alleys at top speed in competition. And they don't block NPC traffic. I would say the propping in Up the Back Alley is a counterexample to most of the propping I see in user created races.

Edited by Neal Fargo
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stronktank

Though must say 'alleyways' and the monster truck race in the swamp have bad (totally not optimal) checkpoint placement imo. Would be fun to review some of R*'s own tracks actually.

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Fachuro

 

Honestly, if the checkpoint points the right way and the next one is visible properly then it is up to the driver to get it right. I know we try to make things as foolproof as possible but just remember that rockstar uses no props at all. Any props you place to "save" people are bonuses.

 

I imagine if you truely must put something there it would probably work well to use the electric box to glitch a container into the ground as a level surface and then stack your barrier up from there to make it high enough to serve the purpose.

 

It's probably the worst (or best !) corner in the map ! I have a treble chevron check point, and props but even experienced drivers still miss it ! it is due to the next CP being downhill and to the right so very hard to see.

 

Like said gonna play with glitching props and see what happens .... I'll report back if it made a decent variance to non propped, my guess at this point is that it won't stop people missing the corner it will just stop them flying around 30 meters past it and into a wall of props instead ..... not sure which is the more favourable out of the 2 lol !!

 

The image shown have room for improvement though, I don't know if yours have similar placement but CP16 should be at the crest of the downhill part and CP17 just before it levels out. It will still be a very tough corner for racers, and the checkpoints will be stacked, but the road in itself provides additional guidance as long as the crest CP is correct. CP17 must be placed so the arrows on CP16 are sharp enough to force racers to brake, it's better to make them brake too much then too little. Any props I would use on the outer line of the second turn instead of on the downhill part, as players will need more additional guidance on the stacked CP17 then on CP16. After that, it's as Luap says, the players responsibility to learn how to best adjust speed and lines throughout the race. The corner in itself is just tricky, the corkscrew in Laguna Seca is just as difficult but revered as one of the most enjoyable turns to make among racecar drivers worldwide, exactly because it's so hard to learn. I would also recommend mentioning the El Burro corkscrew in the description of your race to make drivers come more prepared. On the bright side, with time more and more people will gain experience with this particular turn as more and more races utilize it, and thus more and more players will learn how to do it properly ;-)

 

Here's an explanation on how to properly adjust the speed on the Laguna Seca corkscrew, I would imagine the same technique could be utilized on the El Burro version ;-)

 

http://www.wimp.com/corkscrewlaguna/

Edited by Fachuro
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MarcusDaze

Country Folks Grand Prix

How do I place checkpoints in the area of CP38&39?

I want to give the driver two choices:

The risky shortcut of the jump.

The safe way around.

 

How do I place the CP's there? Is it possible?

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Fachuro

Country Folks Grand Prix

How do I place checkpoints in the area of CP38&39?

I want to give the driver two choices:

The risky shortcut of the jump.

The safe way around.

 

How do I place the CP's there? Is it possible?

If you want to stick to the guidelines you will need to make a choice pretty much, the safe way around will always be available regardless unless you block it off, but the jump isn't risky enough to make people choose the safe path so you will end up with everyone using the jump regardless. Hopefully R* will come up with a solution that allow multiple choice paths in tracks, but currently the checkpoints can only go one way or the other. You could probably use some props to mark the turn to make it look like more of a multiple choice route, and maybe some police barriers or similar just before the jump to block it off and still let it remain accessible, that would be my best suggestion. That will however make the track no longer follow the CP placement guide, keep in mind though that there's nothing wrong with that so long as you have done your utmost to keep to the guidelines. I imagine it would still work out great ;-)

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Cuz05

I've got a race on that road.

Futality (made for a Futo event we had)

Didn't actually find that the choice at the jump was much of a deal, like Fachuro says, it's not a difficult one and people don't seem to struggle with it. I placed the CPs so that the jump is the indicated course. I believe I rotated the CP so that if you respawn, you're pointed round the road. Still, you don't need much speed to make the jump so I think it's still possible from the respawn. Can't really remember...

Anyway, as has been mentioned before, visibilty of a CP beyond a jump is not a major problem as long as the one leading you to it indicates the direction of travel over it. The jumps themselves are normally laid out in such a way that you are visually guided over it in the right way by the terrain itself.

If people do not choose the jump then the road around it is clear enough, there's simply nowhere else you can go, the corner is propped on the outside, should you hit it too fast. It's one of those where the CPs aren't crucial to navigating it safely.

 

I actually broke the CP guidelines much more seriously on other parts of that road as I wanted to keep the alternative routes along it open. The main one was around your 35-38. On mine there are just 2 CPs there, you can't see the 2nd from the 1st so I placed a couple signs, pointing both left and right. The lower road leads quite nicely into the jump as it goes.

It's not something I'd ever suggest doing but I do think the track works as I've laid it out, I haven't seen people having a hard time with the directions. Possibly it serves as an example of how you can ditch the 'rules' and still make something work. Or possibly it doesn't work as well as I imagine... :p

Worst corner on there for me is where your CP27 is. So easy for people to fly off it.

 

I would just run the race with randoms, follow them and see what they do. It's the best way of understanding how the track works for various people.

 

One more thing, I don't want to make assumptions without being able to play the job (wrong console) but it does look a bit CP heavy in places.... Not OTT, just quite a few more than I'd use on the tarmac sections.

You actually have 9 (27/36) more than me on the bit we have in common but some of those are obviously where the road divides and I've used less than would normally be ideal.

Edited by Cuz05

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Cuz05

Though must say 'alleyways' and the monster truck race in the swamp have bad (totally not optimal) checkpoint placement imo. Would be fun to review some of R*'s own tracks actually.

I loathed that swamp one, CPs had been fired out of a shotgun.

I think it would be quite amusing to review R*s CPs. I remember we ran a compact event a little while ago, we had 4 Red Rum creations and R*s Double Parking. Not to be biased but all agreed that DP had the worst CPs by a fair distance. There was one in particular that several of us missed when taking the fastest, inside line at the corner it served.

Tbf, they are mostly consistent but I think their placement is generally for drivers not racers. If you get me ;)

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LuapYllier

I have had the same feelings about a lot of the Rockstar races.

 

However, I believe the nature of the swamp race, and in fact all of the monster truck races was completely intentional. They very purposefully cause a lot of careening and bouncing, crazy turning to show off the dual axle steering and "I can go anywhere" attitude of the vehicle.

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MarcusDaze

Thanks for the input guys :)

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Cornbat

Can't think of any motorbike races so I'm thinking GMB means pushbikes? The Downtown one has some I believe...

 

American Cycle is the downtown bicycle race. Four ramps. I'm going to suggest that bicycle races are perhaps outliers. Don't see a lot of user created bicycle races.

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Cornbat

Though must say 'alleyways' and the monster truck race in the swamp have bad (totally not optimal) checkpoint placement imo. Would be fun to review some of R*'s own tracks actually.

 

Are you talking about the Rockstar Verified race Alleyways and the new Rockstar Created Liberator race Swamp Monster?

 

Call me a plebeian (go ahead, I won't disagree), but I don't see what's wrong with the checkpoints in either of those. Care to elaborate?

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Cornbat

I've got a race on that road.

Futality

North Calafia Way. It's my favorite road in the game. I also love the Karin Futo, and am a fan of your races. It's no surprise that Futality is one of my favorites. You did a great job with checkpointing the shortcuts and jumps to leave options open for the driver.

 

 

Worst corner on there for me is where your CP27 is. So easy for people to fly off it.

I love that corner. So easy for people to fly off it. :-)
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stronktank

 

Though must say 'alleyways' and the monster truck race in the swamp have bad (totally not optimal) checkpoint placement imo. Would be fun to review some of R*'s own tracks actually.

 

Are you talking about the Rockstar Verified race Alleyways and the new Rockstar Created Liberator race Swamp Monster?

 

Call me a plebeian (go ahead, I won't disagree), but I don't see what's wrong with the checkpoints in either of those. Care to elaborate?

 

 

The main issue imo is that there are mostly too many, some are placed past corners and some turns have two cp's,... All notes made for disapproving cp placement,...

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stronktank

Experienced plenty of examples but the verified race called bad-San Andreas is the perfect example imo. A race like that wouldn't get approved in here. Bad cp's and propping. No offense to the creator but R* seems to be picking too quickly sometimes, maybe just for the sake of the event?

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Gta5KoRn

Do somebody knows, how to put many checkpoints (32 for example) in a small area. I saw this in some lobbys like "RP Lobby, 100.000 RP" or "Unlimited RP" here an example video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CRkNNzXcAo

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Cuz05

Best answer you'll get here-

 

Go to Edit Post.

Delete that sh*t from it.

Have a nice day.

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Azzat10

will someone on ps3 with a mic who has made respected races please look at this race I have made.

 

it's a really nice track and the original had 27 likes and only 1 dislike playing with randomers, but after reading what you guys were saying I decided to redo the checkpoints and I have to say it does feel a lot smoother

 

however there were one or two corners that I found difficult to apply youre rules too so would like a second opinion

 

my psn is AzzaT10 as well so if you add me I should be on most of tonight.

thanks

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Nitty Don

Send me an add I will be online from around 9pm GMT

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Azzat10

Sorry man my Internet said it was down when I clicked to send that.

 

Please add me I'm azzat10

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Azzat10

anyone know how to change the colour of you're text for the job invites

 

I have had a couple of the little invite black boxes that appear on the left in free mode where the writing has been coloured

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S0lo

anyone know how to change the colour of you're text for the job invites

 

I have had a couple of the little invite black boxes that appear on the left in free mode where the writing has been coloured

 

to my knowledge that's only possible by modding. please use the question and answer thread for such questions in the future, thank you.

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Azzat10

Ok bro cool.

 

What do you guys suggest for when a street has 2 lanes but a stretch of grass in the middle.

 

Would you put the CP on the grass allowing both lanes to be used or place it in the middle of the best/correct directions lane ?

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Cuz05

That depends on a lot of things so it's a tricky one to answer, however, I wouldn't place it on the grass. It would sort of direct people onto it. I do try to keep both lanes available in most cases but I would look hard at whether you need a CP in the middle of the street, normally you'd CP the turn into a road and the turn out of it. If keeping it open means you have a longer space between CPs then that's fine as long as the next one is just about visible.

If it is best to CP one lane then you may need to block off the other, or make sure the CP is visible from far enough away that drivers can prepare to move over.

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S0lo

exactly, it always depends on the situation. most of the times though a race is the better the more defined it is. if the racing line needs the left lane, go left, and vise versa. if only we could adjust the size of the checkpoints, that would make this question p much obsolete.

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PlamenVT

Personally I am not a fan of centered checkpoints, especially when there's grass/curb/R* props etc. in the middle of the road.

 

In most cases I've encountered such centered checkpoints lead to more frustration & accidents rather than any help by widening the road.

 

Typically even on wide open roads I like to place to the checkpoints slightly on the side of the best lane.

 

Nowadays, most races are done in non-contact anyway, so therefore I think we can consider the "wide road" as a lower priority. Having a smooth race without many risks of hitting curbs or props is more important.

Edited by PlamenVT

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Nitty Don

As Cuz said all depends on situation, I like to make my races suitable to both contact and non, so centred CP's are best solution for me, plus it gives racers a chance to choose their optimal lines rather than being forced to, agree though that a centred CP should not be directly on or in front of an obstacle, if placed after, it reduces the risks you mention above.

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