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greenrock

Michael is the best GTA protagonist of all time

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rjmthe2nd

Are you serious? are you really serious.....Tommy Vercetti is better then Michael. everything in V sucked really. still a good game...but still Tommy is just way better then Michael.

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DJ_Vejeejee

he is fat , old, ugly, and very sh*tty.. WHAT A ROLE MODEL

 

jezus christ

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Nappy

One of the best to me. I haven’t figured the real reason tho, aside from him being misirable and a liar.

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billiejoearmstrong8

He's not the coolest and most awesome and badass protagonist but I think he's definitely one of the most layered and interesting. Seeing both his family/home life side and his professional robber side, a complex backstory with faking his own death and betraying his friends, his conflict with Trevor, how disloyal he's willing to be when pushed. Some really great dialogue and acting too. Up there with the best I'd say.

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Utopianthumbs
Posted (edited)

Michael and Niko fight it out for best protagonist in my opinion. Really like his character and all the contrasts present in him. Michael's a legend professionally in the eyes of people who've worked with him like the heist crew members and even Trevor seems to have made him out to be something of a legend to Ron. But on a personal front he's a miserable wreck whose family hates him though he genuinely cares for them. He can be genuinely kind like he was to Franklin, Solomon, Casey; while he can also be a genuine prick like he was towards Trevor and Brad. He isn't the badass loyal to a fault type other protagonists are which I appreciate, he can be kind when he wants but ultimately he's out for his own interests which to me is a more interesting criminal than the usual protagonist. In a sense Niko and Michael are opposites in character but somehow both feel the most human and interesting to me, both seem like the most interesting to have a deep conversation with. 

 

The one thing I wish was better in Michael's arc was that there should have been more focus on him living his dream job as a movie producer. I really enjoyed the Michael Solomon relationship but it was too short and Michael was really more of a glorified goon than a producer. Not that people play GTA for producing movies but still, the criminal ties of Vinewood could have been explored more through Michael while we get to see him live his dream at the same time. 

Edited by Utopianthumbs
Replaced a comma with a fullstop
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anizawa

Tommy Vercetti, remember the name!

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billiejoearmstrong8
1 hour ago, Utopianthumbs said:

Michael and Niko fight it out for best protagonist in my opinion. Really like his character and all the contrasts present in him. Michael's a legend professionally in the eyes of people who've worked with him like the heist crew members and even Trevor seems to have made him out to be something of a legend to Ron. But on a personal front he's a miserable wreck whose family hates him though he genuinely cares for them. He can be genuinely kind like he was to Franklin, Solomon, Casey; while he can also be a genuine prick like he was towards Trevor and Brad. He isn't the badass loyal to a fault type other protagonists are which I appreciate, he can be kind when he wants but ultimately he's out for his own interests which to me is a more interesting criminal than the usual protagonist. In a sense Niko and Michael are opposites in character but somehow both feel the most human and interesting to me, both seem like the most interesting to have a deep conversation with. 

 

The one thing I wish was better in Michael's arc was that there should have been more focus on him living his dream job as a movie producer. I really enjoyed the Michael Solomon relationship but it was too short and Michael was really more of a glorified goon than a producer. Not that people play GTA for producing movies but still, the criminal ties of Vinewood could have been explored more through Michael while we get to see him live his dream at the same time. 

Yeah my only complaint about him is they made some aspects of the story too goofy and it made him come across as quite a chump at times. Not only are his family over the top caricatures that he lets treat him like a doormat way too much (I get wanting to show him as almost a regular dad with an at times annoying family a la Tony Soprano, but it's too extreme), he also genuinely believes he's a movie producer when he's literally just a hired thug. Not to mention being gullible enough to become a full fledged Epsilonist. Just should've taken a more serious/toned down approach to some of that stuff.  

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Utopianthumbs

@billiejoearmstrong8

 

Yeah his family was too much, I get that that was kinda the point but they were dialled up to 11, should have been toned down at least a bit 

 

I kind of just assume Michael is doing some actual producing work ( probably having some intern guide him ) which isn't being shown in game cause it would probably divert from gameplay. Though of course this is just my assumption and in game he's just a glorified goon lol. 

 

This might be unpopular but I liked that Michael joined the Epsilon cult, mainly cause I been curious about them since San Andreas(though it was ultimately a let down lol) . I don't think he was really dedicated to their cause so much as he viewed it as a form of escapism from his misery, iirc he kinda realizes that it's a sham and even tries to question Marnie as to why she's working for them. He just goes through the motions  before ripping them off big time in the end. 

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billiejoearmstrong8
Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Utopianthumbs said:

@billiejoearmstrong8

 

Yeah his family was too much, I get that that was kinda the point but they were dialled up to 11, should have been toned down at least a bit 

 

I kind of just assume Michael is doing some actual producing work ( probably having some intern guide him ) which isn't being shown in game cause it would probably divert from gameplay. Though of course this is just my assumption and in game he's just a glorified goon lol. 

 

This might be unpopular but I liked that Michael joined the Epsilon cult, mainly cause I been curious about them since San Andreas(though it was ultimately a let down lol) . I don't think he was really dedicated to their cause so much as he viewed it as a form of escapism from his misery, iirc he kinda realizes that it's a sham and even tries to question Marnie as to why she's working for them. He just goes through the motions  before ripping them off big time in the end. 

Yeah I did enjoy the Epsilon stuff. It's just all the things added up make him look quite gullible. If he stood up to his family more and wasn't pretty much just "used" by Solomon as far as we see (just doing goon work and in one mission risking his life to save a film reel when Solomon knew all along it wasn't even necessary, and a credit on a terrible film) he'd look like less of a chump.

 

The natural way of the Epsilon story is for Michael to get ripped off with an old rusty tractor and lose all his money. If you're playing the game for the first time and haven't heard from other people or looked up info about the mission online you're unlikely to realise there's a way to get the money or to know the exact moment you have to do it, it's a very narrow window and then it's too late. Again I do like how it reflects real cults like that but it's also yet another time Michael is fooled and missions are played for no pay off. And I just remembered another one - Michael spending hours collecting submarine parts without properly deciding on payment first and ending up with $10!

 

I don't mind that he gets fooled sometimes and isn't perfect. But it's a bit much. 

Edited by billiejoearmstrong8

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Beato_dim
11 minutes ago, billiejoearmstrong8 said:

Again I do like how it reflects real cults like that but it's also yet another time Michael is fooled and missions are played for no pay off. And I just remembered another one - Michael spending hours collecting submarine parts without properly deciding on payment first and ending up with $10!

That is kind of a general problem for GTA V - too much stuff is done by the protagonists without proper/any compensation.

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Utopianthumbs
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, billiejoearmstrong8 said:

And I just remembered another one - Michael spending hours collecting submarine parts without properly deciding on payment first and ending up with $10!

It's been a while since I played V so correct me if I'm wrong but I kinda remember near some of the parts there were money collectibles that gave thousands of bucks so I figured that made up for the lack of reward in this case

 

You're right in that the more natural choice would be to get fooled by the Epsilon cult, but fooling the cult is required for the gold medal objective iirc. That indicates to me that whether the player chooses it or not, canonically Michael rips them off

Edited by Utopianthumbs
Rephrased a line

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Mohjmz

Michael is my favorite character of all time in all video games. I loved his story. It's different. Without Michael GTA 5's story would be so boring. Some people here said they hate Michael. That's the point for them. Because they feel sorry for Trevor. But Trevor takes his revenge in the mission "Bury the Hatchet". If you disagree play the mission again!

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billiejoearmstrong8
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Utopianthumbs said:

It's been a while since I played V so correct me if I'm wrong but I kinda remember near some of the parts there were money collectibles that gave thousands of bucks so I figured that made up for the lack of reward in this case

 

You're right in that the more natural choice would be to get fooled by the Epsilon cult, but fooling the cult is required for the gold medal objective iirc. That indicates to me that whether the player chooses it or not, canonically Michael rips them off

It's two different missions started from the same place. The one where you buy the "Sonar Collections Dock" (can be bought as any character but probably a lot of people buy it as Michael as he tends to have the most money through the story) and collect nuclear waste in the submarine pays loads. But there's also a Strangers and Freaks mission that appears for Michael after the dock is purchased where a woman asks him to collect parts of a submarine that her husband died in, using the dinghy/scuba diving equipment, and says "I'll make it very worth your while".....and then after Michael does the long and tedious mission she gives him $10 and runs away lmao. 

 

I dunno because a lot of gold medal objectives aren't things that I'd exactly consider canon (eg I don't consider it canon for the protagonist to rush as fast as they can at all times and skip having conversations, as they do for time objectives), it's more to give you extra challenges after you've completed the mission. Almost makes it even more annoying since you can't get the money by replaying for the gold medal. If it was hinted at as an option much more strongly during the mission maybe I'd consider it canon, it's almost like a secret though. But in any case Michael does come off as a bit of a chump to me due to the amount of this stuff that goes on.

3 hours ago, Beato_dim said:

That is kind of a general problem for GTA V - too much stuff is done by the protagonists without proper/any compensation.

True, it's the case in almost every mission and even some heists. I don't mind the joke of doing a bunch of stuff for nothing a couple of times but it wears thin in V.

1 hour ago, Mohjmz said:

Michael is my favorite character of all time in all video games. I loved his story. It's different. Without Michael GTA 5's story would be so boring. Some people here said they hate Michael. That's the point for them. Because they feel sorry for Trevor. But Trevor takes his revenge in the mission "Bury the Hatchet". If you disagree play the mission again!

Yeah but Michael is still ready to betray Trevor again right until the end of the game (in the escape of The Big Score he keeps telling Franklin and the crew if something goes wrong they'll pin it all on Trevor), in one ending he gladly helps to kill him/does kill him if Franklin hesitates, and in another he suggests going to kill him. So he does pretty badly by Trevor. I don't see it as a reason to dislike the character though, it makes things interesting.

Edited by billiejoearmstrong8
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Utopianthumbs
15 minutes ago, billiejoearmstrong8 said:

It's two different missions started from the same place. The one where you buy the "Sonar Collections Dock" (can be bought as any character but probably a lot of people buy it as Michael as he tends to have the most money through the story) and collect nuclear waste in the submarine pays loads. But there's also a Strangers and Freaks mission that appears for Michael after the dock is purchased where a woman asks him to collect parts of a submarine that her husband died in, using the dinghy/scuba diving equipment, and says "I'll make it very worth your while".....and then after Michael does the long and tedious mission she gives him $10 and runs away lmao. 

Apart from the nuclear waste I think when you find the submarine parts there are money and weapon pickups nearby. I remember this being different to the nuclear waste and checking the wiki it also seems to show that, though again I could be wrong. 

 

I still think M ripping off Epsilon is canon just like how the medal objective shows Luis cheating Mr Santo is canon but I cant really substantiate that lol

 

Rest of your points I got no counter to lol. Still, it's cool debating like this, you may not remember but I have had discussions with you and others before bout stuff like Michael and Trevor, heists in V etc and it's almost always quite fun. I guess what I'm tryna say is, all these discussions are really enjoyable and I hope you don't see it as confrontational or anything 

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billiejoearmstrong8
41 minutes ago, Utopianthumbs said:

Apart from the nuclear waste I think when you find the submarine parts there are money and weapon pickups nearby. I remember this being different to the nuclear waste and checking the wiki it also seems to show that, though again I could be wrong. 

 

I still think M ripping off Epsilon is canon just like how the medal objective shows Luis cheating Mr Santo is canon but I cant really substantiate that lol

 

Rest of your points I got no counter to lol. Still, it's cool debating like this, you may not remember but I have had discussions with you and others before bout stuff like Michael and Trevor, heists in V etc and it's almost always quite fun. I guess what I'm tryna say is, all these discussions are really enjoyable and I hope you don't see it as confrontational or anything 

There are the pickups but in story terms it's definitely Michael getting played again haha. Although he can run after her and kill her if he wants. So I guess maybe he isn't necessarily a complete chump in all these circumstances, as there is sometimes the chance for revenge/redeeming himself. 

 

I completely agree that our discussions have been fun! Don't see anything as confrontational. You've slightly changed my mind about how much of a chump Michael is lol

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Nappy

wtf happened here

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Utopianthumbs

Just a friendly debate about the nuances of Michaels character mate. Me and billiejoe even argued bout this on a IV thread 😜

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Nappy

About the profit from movie, seriously what about it? Michael ever got paid for that? Did i miss it?

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Utopianthumbs

Don't think so, I think his reward was being credited as associate producer in the film and so getting to live his dream of being part of a film.

 

As an aside, that means the point I made to @billiejoearmstrong8 was wrong, Michael wasn't actually producing anything but by helping Solomon in ensuring the film screening took place, got specially credited as associate producer. 

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Jowday

Micheal is one of the most developed character (in term of time spent by Rockstar to build his background and story) so he has an advantage that not all characters had.

Trevor figure also helps his character a lot.

 

For sure Micheal was a lot of fun when he begun to spam "Kliffom" during the Epsilon missions.😬

 

But at first glance I loved much more Tommy. Miss you Tommy....

 

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billiejoearmstrong8
Posted (edited)

Because Michael is so starstruck by Solomon and the whole movie industry thing he really does believe he's a movie producer and working in the industry because of what Solomon tells him and the film credit. He's delighted with it because he thinks he's living his dream. Of course the reality is that he's just been a hired thug lol. So I think Solomon is somewhat exploiting his enthusiasm for the industry to get him to do those not exactly legal favours - particularly when he gets him to risk his life to get the film reel back when he didn't even really need it. Michael has a gullible side (see also how his family walks all over him, his therapist rips him off, and he's suckered into Epsilonism). However I do also think Solomon genuinely likes Michael and that he may get to actually be in the industry because of their relationship going forward. We just don't see it before the end of the game. 

Edited by billiejoearmstrong8
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Duhillestpunk
Posted (edited)

Deleted

Edited by Duhillestpunk

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ToastOnCheese

I really liked Michael and Franklin. I liked Trevor, but his story wasn't as compelling as Michael and Franklin's. To be fair, I think a part of that is that for me Trevor felt like wasted potential. The whole TP Enterprises aspect was glanced over, but I'd love being able to actually deal the meth Trevor's side of the story is so focused on. If Trevor had more than just gun running I think I'd like his stuff a lot more. 

 

But in all fairness they're all pretty good.

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Niobium
Posted (edited)

i'm not really crazy about michael like some people are. he's just.... ok. i like the idea of his character, a retired bank robber dragged back into the criminal world. but the story that he is in drags him down, whether it's him constantly bickering with his family, constantly bickering with trevor, or being an errand boy for the FIB.

 

honestly, the game should have been mostly about michael and the pursuit of the almighty dollar. instead we get the awful story we got. at least i don't hate him like trevor.

Edited by Niobium
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jaylen pizarro
Posted (edited)

no

Edited by jaylen pizarro
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Algonquin Assassin

I like Michael because he has the same tastes in clothing as I do.

 

I can picture myself becoming like him in the next 10 years or so.

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Nappy

Did you betray your best friend yet?

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anizawa

Michael is just diet Max Payne mixed in with Tommy Vercetti. I guess he works as a protagonist but he isn't the best GTA protagonist.

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Nappy

He’s not like Max Payne imo(unless we’re talking about that bitch nigga rambo in Max Payne 3).

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Jowday
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Payne said:

He’s not like Max Payne imo(unless we’re talking about that bitch nigga rambo in Max Payne 3).

Micheal and the real Max Payne are completely different stuff.

 

The only thing similar is the Bullet Time.

Edited by Jowday

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