Tomorrow is 9/11

[sivispacem]

My point rather handily proven-several paragraphs of rambling nonsense, spurious claims and character attacks and no attempt made to actually address any of the points made by critics. Thinly veiled anti-semitism disguised as "anti-Zionism", numerous totally illogical and contradictory statements and not a single reference in sight, less of all one with even an ounce of veracity or merit.

 

This, gentlemen, is why arguing with conspiracy theorists is futile. Their logic is so flawed; their rationale so incomprehensible and their disregard for niceties such as rationality, empiricism or even the content of the supposed "evidence" they seek to falsely represent in their arguments so astounding it becomes impossible for anyone endowed with the gifts of logic and reason to actually construct an argument. Even when you manage they just ignore it.

 

Thankfully, the vast majority of society, whether informed or otherwise, thinks they're idiots too, which is at least a small comfort.

Edited September 12, 2013 by sivispacem

[Smith John]

I'm no conspiracy disciple, but one thing I've come to observe whenever having the misfortune to spectate a bickering match between foil hats and non-conspiracy believers, is it's usually the latter who always feel the need to resort to pretencious superiority and childish insulting behaviour.

[K20]

there was this documentary on Channel 4 UK [i think] a few weeks back about the people who worked building the new trade centre. some of them actually worked in offices before 9/11, as office workers. then after 9/11 they worked in construction. it was a good documentary. real good insight.

[sivispacem]

NBHB, that's probably a product of the pure exasperation on the part of sceptics about having any reasonable comment they make either ignored or dismissed off-hand with an unrelated retort, like "well you're an agent of the Zionist overlords" or other such bilge. Also, if you have an issue with observing debates, why not just ignore them or simply not comment? Repeated, pointless peripheral comments about the participants in discussions rather than meaningful contributions was a factor in The Scottish Guy's permanent exile.

[Smith John]

 

 

there was this documentary on Channel 4 UK [i think] a few weeks back about the people who worked building the new trade centre. some of them actually worked in offices before 9/11, as office workers. then after 9/11 they worked in construction. it was a good documentary. real good insight.

 

'Rebuilding the World Trade Centre' was the title of that doc. A few of us in this thread also watched it too, and yes, it was an excellent presentation. The time lapse sequences of the construction, mixed with the ambient music made for a great watch. And the part where they added the spire at the end was almost quite literally the icing on the cake.

 

@sivispacem

 

Whoops, my apologies for giving my opinion on something. I shall try my best to refrain from such atrocious actions in the future.

Edited September 12, 2013 by niko bellic half brother

[sivispacem]

I'm not criticising you for posting your opinion, just wondering why you feel the need to come into topics and tell people their contributions are boring/childish/whatever or that you've got no interest in observing discussions. Hardly constructive.

[BrownBear]

I'm not criticising you for posting your opinion, just wondering why you feel the need to come into topics and tell people their contributions are boring/childish/whatever or that you've got no interest in observing discussions. Hardly constructive.

I gotta say, I do have respect for you as you bring up plenty of good, educated points but I must say, you're extremely bitter. It seems that in every argument you resort to pointing out how others are "dumb, childish conspiracists" as if you're some shining beacon of rational knowledge. This isn't an insult, I'm just wondering why you feel the need to lash out like that, despite acting like you are the master of well mannered arguments.

[Eutyphro]

I'm not criticising you for posting your opinion, just wondering why you feel the need to come into topics and tell people their contributions are boring/childish/whatever or that you've got no interest in observing discussions. Hardly constructive.

 

Trolls tend to mainly focus on metadiscussion, calling lots of people childish or pretentious. It's their standard gameplan. They hardly participate in the discussion itself because it would expose their ignorance.

 

Anyways, I think the 911 conspiracy movement is a complete waste of time, and it is exactly what powerful governments would want us to do. It takes away time from meaningful issues, socioeconomic issues or foreign policy issues.

 

And the 'evidence' is just completely crap. In any controlled scientific experiment you'll have coincidences or unexplained phenomena. And this wasn't even a controlled experiment. So go figure. Real evidence would have been leaked planning for 911. And if there were such planning it sure would have leaked because it would have involved quite a lot of people and these things tend to leak out. George Bush and the other people involved would have ended up in front of a firing squad and it would have been the end of the Republican party.

 

The US has committed and supported atrocities many times larger than 911, but noone really seems as interested in them. Nobody seems to care about the genocide in East Timor under Suharto which had a similar scale as the Murders of Pol Pot. Suharto who was under complete support from the west. But when an atrocity happens on US soil everyone obsesses over it and comes up with the most unfounded theories on it. It's all a complete waste of time.

 

 

you resort to pointing out how others are "dumb, childish conspiracists"

 

It was 'niko bellic half brother' who called people childish. Sivispacem simply pointed out how conspiracy theorists aren't open to rational argument/evidence and act like everyone is part of the conspiracy, which is a completely fair and legitimate point.

Edited September 12, 2013 by gtaxpert

[El Dildo]

It seems that in every argument you resort to pointing out how others are "dumb, childish conspiracists"

 

Sivis does not call someone a childish conspirator in every argument he makes.

 

the odds are that if he's calling you a childish conspirator, it's not because he's bitter.

it's because you're behaving like a childish conspirator

[jln22]

 

 

 

Bin Laden didn't blow up the projects, it was you nigga, tell the truth nigga; Bush knocked down the towers.

What?

 

Hes telling the truth. our government is NOT with us,.dont be decieved, every president is corrupted

 

Prove it with irrefutable evidence.

 

No?

 

Didn't think so. Don't make stupid blanket statements you can't substantiate, it makes you look like an imbecile.

 

It was a f*cking song lyrics, god...

[BrownBear]

 

It seems that in every argument you resort to pointing out how others are "dumb, childish conspiracists"

 

Sivis does not call someone a childish conspirator in every argument he makes.

 

the odds are that if he's calling you a childish conspirator, it's not because he's bitter.

it's because you're behaving like a childish conspirator

 

He's never called me that. I'm not trying to start an argument, I respect him as a member, but from what I've seen he's either very hostile, or attracts a very hostile type.

[El Dildo]

he's not hostile either.

he's just not afraid to call a Spade a Spade.

 

there's a lot of ignorant/young/relatively dumb people on this forum. that's just the way it is.

and when ignorant people get to talking about politics and conspiracies, their ignorance becomes very pronounced.

 

a lot of people ignore or fail to recognize this ignorance.

but some of us (myself included) won't hesitate to call an idiot an idiot or tell someone when they're dead wrong.

 

and this tends to make the ignorant person upset.

[Eutyphro]

Can everyone get back on topic again instead of arguing about who called who childish? Thanks.

[Smith John]

he's not hostile either.

he's just not afraid to call a Spade a Spade.

 

there's a lot of ignorant/young/relatively dumb people on this forum. that's just the way it is.

and when ignorant people get to talking about politics and conspiracies, their ignorance becomes very pronounced.

 

a lot of people ignore or fail to recognize this ignorance.

but some of us (myself included) won't hesitate to call an idiot an idiot or tell someone when they're dead wrong.

 

and this tends to make the ignorant person upset.

 

That might actually hold, if it weren't for the fact that he'll bitch and whine whenever somebody ELSE resorts to the same adolescent rhetoric while engaging with him. But we're all guilty of a little hypocrisy, right?

 

Can everyone get back on topic again instead of arguing about who called who childish? Thanks.

 

Sure thing commander.

 

I remember everything about that sad day. I myself was 17. Had already left school prior to that summer and was working a warehouse job. Coincidentally, I happened to be off that day, and remember my mum interupting my Crazy Taxi session on my recently purchased PS2, and telling me to turn on BBC One. It was just insane. It was weirdly exciting and traumatic at the same time. I immediately wrang up by girlfriend of the time, and my best friend, and told them to turn on their tv's. My gf ended up coming round to watch the whole thing unfold with me. I vividly remember her turning to me and saying this will be the start of WW3, and being honest, I thought the exact same. Just a crazy day of emotion and shock.

Edited September 12, 2013 by niko bellic half brother

[Dale Nixon]

I'm no conspiracy disciple, but one thing I've come to observe whenever having the misfortune to spectate a bickering match between foil hats and non-conspiracy believers, is it's usually the latter who always feel the need to resort to pretencious superiority and childish insulting behaviour.

Very true. sivispacem doesn't realise what an ironic clown he actually is. For someone that claims to dislike 'pointless and delusional ramblings', he sure is a fan of doing it himself.

[Girish]

 

I'm no conspiracy disciple, but one thing I've come to observe whenever having the misfortune to spectate a bickering match between foil hats and non-conspiracy believers, is it's usually the latter who always feel the need to resort to pretencious superiority and childish insulting behaviour.

Very true. sivispacem doesn't realise what an ironic clown he actually is. For someone that claims to dislike 'pointless and delusional ramblings', he sure is a fan of doing it himself.

 

If you're only going to resort to insulting members then don't bother posting at all. Topics are meant for discussion, whether or not you agree with someone's opinions. Insulting them for having a differing opinion is not cool.

[na89340qv0n34b09q340]

^

 

 

There's no point trying to demonstrate anything of scientific or technical merit to conspiracy theorists. They'll just try and bury you under an avalanche of nonsensical drivel, barely comprehensible shouting and thinly veiled insults. You're probably better off teaching an alsatian to tap dance.

 

I realize there's no point. Just wanted to point out that sivispacem wasn't not doing the exact same thing.

Edited September 12, 2013 by zoo3891

[AtomicPunk]

For some reason edit button's not working.

 

@Sivi

So exposing a Zionist is "anti-Semitism"? haha you lose right there.

 

That's as ridiculous as calling someone a 'white-hating racist' if they don't like the KKK. This is exactly how I expect you to operate. Zionism has been proven and laid out very well how they operate. Denying that it exists, and calling someone an anti-Semitic is just a trick to keep people from asking questions. Even vice president Joe Biden admitted that he was a Zionist on shalom TV.

hwCw7Z-aloA

[sivispacem]

Perhaps, but the issue is your aggression does not seem to be targeted at people who exhibit signs of a strong association with Zionism but a wide, varied and disparate group of individuals in multiple nations, the demographic thereof fitting exactly with various militia movement conspiracy theories of the 50s through 90s which were inherently anti-Semitic yet have somehow formed the basis for much of your thesis. The only difference appears to be that the white supremacist militias who spout this kind of drivel have been open and honest about their bigotry whereas you feel the need to disguise yours beneath muddled semantics and disingenuous obfuscation.

 

Until such a time as you can reasonably demonstrate your Zionist conspiracy theories are not identical in all meaningful ways to overtly racist ones as explained above I will continue to claim they are one and the same (because for all intents and purposes, and based on your contributions thus far, they are) and will therefore assume explicit agreement with anti-Semitic ideologies; the only rational conclusion of continuing to support and preserve conspiracy theories which are derived thus.

Edited September 13, 2013 by sivispacem