Texture quality/mip mapping

[Fireboyd78]

I'm a bit worried that GTA V is starting to turn into GTA IV. I remember awhile back during the initial previews in November that framerate was reported to be choppy. Obviously those issues have been cleared up, but for a price. That price is texture resolution and therefore, mip mapping.

 

In Franklin's trailer, there is one scene that has been pointed out to take place on two different development versions of GTA V, with some very noticeable differences.

 

Here's the first version, showing quality of mip maps:

 

 

This is the kind of graphics we should expect from GTA V. A nice, crisp draw distance, and no fuzziness or blurriness for textures that are far away.

 

But now, the second version of the game is shown, and there are some pretty big differences:

 

 

While there's some very nice bump mapping and up-close textures, the distant textures now suffer horrendously. The blur is reminscent of GTA IV, you know, the one used to cover up the lack of AA? Obviously V has AA now, but the blur in the background brings back bad memories!

 

Here's another example of how texture quality has degraded over time:

 

 

GTA V is still a beautiful game, don't get me wrong. But I'm honestly tired of seeing so many choppy textures in games, it just reminds you that despite numerous advancements in technology, there's always those stupid limitations that irritate the living sh*t out of people with a keen eye for detail.

 

Obviously you're not going to waste a huge texture on some NPC character, but if you're able to get up close and play in such a beautiful game world, there really shouldn't be any choppy textures. Anywhere. Looking off into those distant mountains just...wow.

 

I hope Rockstar isn't done yet with their rendering methods, because right now things look a little bit out of tune. Way too much emphasis on stuff that's in-your-face, but the distant objects are being ignored. It feels too much like a 3D rendered movie and not a video game. /rant

 

So what does everyone else think? Is the texture quality/mip mapping degrading? Is Rockstar going in the right direction? I'd like to hear what others have to say, especially those with a keen eye for detail.

 

 

[JonRenemy]

I think it's insane to try and complain about irritations like this. There are so many memory limitations with this generation, and they've done an AMAZING job.

 

Infact the blurry distant textures look nothing like GTA IV style blurriness.. it's a different ballpark. The distant textures actually now look like nice out-of-focus camera shots.

 

Nothing to worry or complain about here whatsoever.

[DODI3OG]

I think it's insane to try and complain about irritations like this. There are so many memory limitations with this generation, and they've done an AMAZING job.

 

Infact the blurry distant textures look nothing like GTA IV style blurriness.. it's a different ballpark. The distant textures actually now look like nice out-of-focus camera shots.

 

Nothing to worry or complain about here whatsoever.

First of all, they're not called blur. They're pixelations.

 

This is a good job for RAGE because, we might just get smoother gameplay because of the lack of emphasis on things the camera isn't focused on.

 

THIS IS NOT A FLAW, THIS IS IN FACT A PERFORMANCE BOOST!

[Fireboyd78]

I think it's insane to try and complain about irritations like this. There are so many memory limitations with this generation, and they've done an AMAZING job.

 

Infact the blurry distant textures look nothing like GTA IV style blurriness.. it's a different ballpark. The distant textures actually now look like nice out-of-focus camera shots.

 

Nothing to worry or complain about here whatsoever.

I hope you're right. I'm just really picky about that kind of thing, as I'm a freelance texture artist of sorts, working on a video game project on and off with a friend. I absolutely despise choppy textures.

[agent17]

You can only push consoles so far, save your concerns for the PC release where it matters. 7-8 year gold tech just isn't cutting it anymore.

 

I realize the graphics of GTA:V might seem a little dated compared to other consoles games these days, but keep in mind this is an open world game, Rockstar NEEDS to fit a lot of assets on the screen.

[LeFox]

I personally do not care if it is the same graphics as GTA IV. GTA IV has and still has best graphics to date.

[japse123]

I personally do not care if it is the same graphics as GTA IV. GTA IV has and still has best graphics to date.

What ???

[Chekoloco]

GTA is never about graphics!! STFU

[customkingpimp]

how the hell are we supposed to see what you are even talking about when you put a red line over it. You are an idiot anyways.

[UberVIIX]

Well this is the last straw, I'll just have to get saints row 4 instead...

Edited May 7, 2013 by UberVIIX

[GourangaMaster]

I think it's insane to try and complain about irritations like this. There are so many memory limitations with this generation, and they've done an AMAZING job.

 

Infact the blurry distant textures look nothing like GTA IV style blurriness.. it's a different ballpark. The distant textures actually now look like nice out-of-focus camera shots.

 

Nothing to worry or complain about here whatsoever.

I for one liked the soft focus of the background too and even though it is probably to help perfomance due to the increased draw distance i think it adds a nice cinematic effect like you said.

People need to get to grips with the that fact that with current gen R* can only do much considering they are making such a pefomance demanding game on such a large scale.

The graphcis look great despite that and it will be an incredibly fun game, stop being so nit-picky.

[GTAGuy]

There's only so much you can do with 512mb of memory. Sacrifices have to be made somewhere. It's too bad that Anisotropic Filtering is just not an option with the 360 and PS3 hardware.

 

 

When the PC version comes out you'll be able to apply a 16x AF filter and clean up all of that mipmap mess. Anisotropic Filtering is practically free (no performance impact) on modern graphics cards.

[Lelouch The Zero]

I could care less what the game looks like. As long as i'm having fun, that's what matters the most!

[PhatteeButtz]

Sure, it's possible to focus on background textures when you're looking at a single frame, but it's the sort of stuff that doesn't get noticed during the actual gameplay unless you're actively looking for it, so it doesn't really bother me all that much.

 

I have a friend who's an animation purist who insists everything should be done with keyframes and just won't stop complaining about mo-cap, but it really doesn't bother anyone other than him.

Edited May 7, 2013 by PhatteeButtz

[brian.]

If you really look at these two images, the better quality one is the bottom one. Look at it. The normal maps have been added, they are very noticable on the alleyway wall, maybe we're just seeing sweeps of polish, maybe it's getting better and better. The market in the left background is iterated also. It's being improved. Also, you can account for inconsistencies in the screenshots from different moments of taking them, the camera has depth of field and motion blur, so you're going to see this kind of inconsistency I think.

 

 

 

 

[zombie elvis]

Do you understand that geometry and textures aren't the same thing? Because there's focal blur applied in the second pic, the geometry is blurry. Aside from the vegetation there aren't many discernible textures in either background.

 

 

Here I've taken two matching sections of your ground example and equalised them, I can't remember which is which but I'm sure you can point out the unacceptable one.

 

 

 

Also if you really want to use a compressed video to compare details, you should use the original from the Rockstar site where it hasn't been re-uploaded with extra compression artefacts.

Mines not scaled as big but you can still see more detail on the right. His shoulder logo is still messed up though, so that's something.

 

Edited May 7, 2013 by zombie elvis

[UberVIIX]

Pause your hd tv sometime and tell me how the "texturing" is bud, this is from a video, pausing it is gonna have some effects...

[Fireboyd78]

I love how everybody is thinking I'm attacking the graphics. Guys, I love GTA no matter what. I will not be one of the people to sit there and be "Graphics suck, not buying this game" - I will play GTA V anyways and probably forget I pointed out these flaws in the first place.

 

 

Do you understand that geometry and textures aren't the same thing?"

 

LOL. This is the best comment in this whole thread. What kind of idiot thinks textures and geometry are the same thing? Not me. I work with both.

 

 

Low-poly Plymouth GTX.

Edited May 7, 2013 by CarLuver69

[VATG]

yep, kinda...

[zombie elvis]

 

LOL. This is the best comment in this whole thread. What kind of idiot thinks textures and geometry are the same thing? Not me. I work with both.

 

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6916279.../gtxlowpoly.jpg

Low-poly Plymouth GTX.

Cool I'm just checking you know what you're talking about

 

But you must be able to see they've put a focal blur over the whole background in that pic. They may be worse textures as well, but I can't even see any damn textures, aside from the trees, those may be genuinely worse.

Edited May 7, 2013 by zombie elvis

[kilo73]

I dont know anything about the tech side of graphics, but there is one thing i am certain of. when i put the game in my console, i won't be paying a damn bit of attention to blurry lines. and it will definitely not impede on how much fun i have.

[Grand Theft Savage]

As previously stated, you can only push consoles so far. It isn't Rockstar's fault. It's the current-gen that's limiting them.

[JonRenemy]

That was quite damning.... the already compressed still-frames from the video compared to the other ones.

Essentially it proves one thing... we CANNOT judge the game yet... and we must wait to see how it looks in motion.

 

In motion to us individually that is. I mean put it this way, some people can't tell the difference between a VHS and a DVD.. or even a blu-ray. It's because most people don't know what they're looking for.

 

I'm quite a snob with technology and graphics in games etc... but I certainly don't let it bother me in GTA. GTA is all about atmosphere and enjoyment.

[Johan]

If you're really worried about graphics then this isn't your game, go play The Last Of Us or Watch_Dogs.

 

Or wait for the unconfirmed PC version

 

Plus we don't know which one is the CURRENT build from that trailer, there's no watermark on the trailers that says "Old Build" - "New Build" for all we know that first scene could be the current one.

[zombie elvis]

Or unconfirmed next gen console versions, that might be a thing too.

[Lelouch The Zero]

Or unconfirmed next gen console versions, that might be a thing too.

There won't be a Next-Gen version. Read the previews next time before you post.

[JoyDivision]

i for one hope V does look like IV. the stylistic aesthetics of IV, namely the lighting and colour atmospheres, were fantastic and trancended 'graphics'. you can get a great looking game out of any hardware if you have the right style, and V seems to be even more visually impressive than IV.

[zombie elvis]

 

Or unconfirmed next gen console versions, that might be a thing too.

There won't be a Next-Gen version. Read the previews next time before you post.

You can get GTA III on PS3, you can get GTA III on iphone, but you'll never get GTAV on next gen consoles? I don't expect any announcements until after launch, there's no point talking about things they'd rather keep quiet about until everyone's bought it once already.

[TheJasonGallant]

Or unconfirmed next gen console versions, that might be a thing too.

There won't be a Next-Gen version. Read the previews next time before you post.

You can get GTA III on PS3, you can get GTA III on iphone, but you'll never get GTAV on next gen consoles?

Oh you will... In five years. Have fun waiting.

[Lelouch The Zero]

Or unconfirmed next gen console versions, that might be a thing too.

There won't be a Next-Gen version. Read the previews next time before you post.

You can get GTA III on PS3, you can get GTA III on iphone, but you'll never get GTAV on next gen consoles?

Maybe if it's backwards compatible or up for download. But other than that, no. If you're thinking there will be a better version with better Graphics or more features for Next-Gen, you my friend have another thing coming. And by that I don't mean a Next-Gen version.