HaythamKenway Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Has anybody here read or seen Les Miserables? I was just thinking that someone inspired by Inspector Javert would make a great antagonist for Michael. A police officer/FIB agent who isn't corrupt, who genuinely believes in the mission of his or her occupation, and feels that Michael having gotten away with his crimes and entered witness protection is an affront to justice. This officer/agent could inadvertently push Michael back into a life of crime, drive him past the point of no return. Rockstar sort of done it in Red Dead Redemption. Edgar Ross was a backstabbing, ends-justify-means pr*ck, but he generally believed what he was doing was right, and I personally could agree with some of his opinions. Especially on bringing the civilization to the West and taking out Dutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woggleman Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 What if the main antagonist is somebody that is supposedly an ally but you don't know it until the very end? Somebody keeps screwing the three guys over but they can't find who is doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rare.steak Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Finally, a topic worth discussing. In GTA IV, ever since I saw Dmitiri's face I wanted to put a bullet in between his eyes, I couldn't stand the f*cker since the second I saw him. I don't like the idea of being forced to cope with someone for 40 missions then in the end to kill him. I want to kill someone from the beginning and face consequences. Like if I kill him this happens, if I kill him later that happens, if I don't kill him this or that happens, you know? Give the story a dynamic feeling! Catch my drift? This. Imo story wise R* should have worked on something like this instead of a stupid and lame excuse to take 100 years to make the game "very complex multiple protagonist system". Too bad they're just not creative enough. R* aren't brilliant storytellers to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rjeev142 Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'd be willing to bet that Michael will slowly be revealed as the antagonist. Just something about his story and overall vibe seems sinister to me. You are a thick headed person....probably one of the few people who still believes one of the 3 main playable characters is the enemy even after me and numerous other people debunked that rumor. Youre thick headed. You dont know sh*t about this game so you have "debunked" nothing. Im not sayin its fact, but it could be done elegently. Like haytham in ac3. You dont like it, but they are going a different path. Get off gta kings dick. Youre f*ckin stupid kid. Im not referring to the "antagonist, protagonist" quote. Im fully f*cking aware what that means. Im saying you cant debunk sh*t cuz you know absolutely nothing about the game. So why dont you go to some other site to contribute your stupid f*cking opinions. Ok: i dont know anything about the game either, but as i stated before. Itd be a fresh storyline turn if the bad guy was a good guy. The emotion that gta iv put into their story left the possibility that what the protags are involved in is a bad thing. Marston and bellic both want to be good. I can also see how people have the feeling that michael has the sinister vibe. Gtawiki for michael's character page said michael seems good compared to trevor, but in the end you might find the opposite. They never directly "debunked" the fact that a betrayal could happen So rjeev142.....do us all a favor and shut the f*ck up. Fresh storyline? That happens in EVERY gta game! In gta 3, Salvatore leone betrays you. In vice city, sonny forelli and lance Vance betray you. In San Andreas, Ryder and big smoke, both good guys turn out to be antagonists and betray you. In gta 4, dimitri acts like an ally, but then betrays you. In tlad, Brian betrays you and forms a different faction of the lost. In tbogt, Bulgarian is a buisness partner, but then betrays you. If one of the 3 protagonists betrays the others, it will be one of THE MOST cliche things that rockstar could do. It wouldn't be fresh at all. And considering you're going around saying f this f that f you, then you're obviously the one who needs to contribute your opinion elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deffpony Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 I would really like an antagonist who is known from almost the very beginning. But his threat to the protagonists and our story doesnt become so evident until the game progresses, and as the game goes on he becomes even greater of a threat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaWaveMovement Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 There's always talk about female protagonists what about female antagonists? Could Michael's wife completely turn on him? Dealing with lawyers and divorce proceedings, losing the mansion and cars would certainly bring whole new and hateful kind of enemy to the game I've also though that female cop has a mean ambitious look about her. I would like to see a straight up nemesis as well, no grey areas or doubt about it. Maybe if Trevor had a crazy brother who we end up clashing with. Maybe Franklin knows some rival gang leaders who are already on his case. Also I think a safe assumption will be a corrupt FIB agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deffpony Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'm really against the whole female antagonist thing. I hate the overly c*nty female antagonist cliche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaWaveMovement Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'm really against the whole female antagonist thing. I hate the overly c*nty female antagonist cliche. Don't recall any since Catalina tbh, hardly counts as a cliche ?! The point is an antagonist who attacks you in others ways, rather than the usual business of sending waves of gunmen at you to be taken out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deffpony Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'm really against the whole female antagonist thing. I hate the overly c*nty female antagonist cliche. Don't recall any since Catalina tbh, hardly counts as a cliche ?! The point is an antagonist who attacks you in others ways, rather than the usual business of sending waves of gunmen at you to be taken out. I didn't mean within GTA but movies and such. Every female antagonist is like overly bitchy. Like that ATF agent in soa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rucke Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'd be willing to bet that Michael will slowly be revealed as the antagonist. Just something about his story and overall vibe seems sinister to me. Or, Trevor becomes the GTA equivalent of Waingro? Yeah I've been thinking about that as well. Michael seems to be based on Neil McCauley, and Trevor is definitely based on Waingro. Trevor might lose his temper and do something stupid which puts the group in danger. I don't think Michael will be able to accept that. Franklin seems too ambitious to be trusted. He will probably betray the group for personal gain. Michael is said to be very ego as well, and will probably do the same thing. So I think in the end we will play as both protagonist and antagonist. A very new and fresh concept for Grand Theft Auto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikoBellic1993 Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 (edited) Finally, a topic worth discussing. In GTA IV, ever since I saw Dmitiri's face I wanted to put a bullet in between his eyes, I couldn't stand the f*cker since the second I saw him. I don't like the idea of being forced to cope with someone for 40 missions then in the end to kill him. I want to kill someone from the beginning and face consequences. Like if I kill him this happens, if I kill him later that happens, if I don't kill him this or that happens, you know? Give the story a dynamic feeling! Catch my drift? This. Imo story wise R* should have worked on something like this instead of a stupid and lame excuse to take 100 years to make the game "very complex multiple protagonist system". Too bad they're just not creative enough. R* aren't brilliant storytellers to me. Edit: Not worth my time ! Edited February 16, 2013 by NikoBellic1993 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTA-King Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 (edited) I'd be willing to bet that Michael will slowly be revealed as the antagonist. Just something about his story and overall vibe seems sinister to me. You are a thick headed person....probably one of the few people who still believes one of the 3 main playable characters is the enemy even after me and numerous other people debunked that rumor. Youre thick headed. You dont know sh*t about this game so you have "debunked" nothing. Im not sayin its fact, but it could be done elegently. Like haytham in ac3. You dont like it, but they are going a different path. Get off gta kings dick. Youre f*ckin stupid kid. Im not referring to the "antagonist, protagonist" quote. Im fully f*cking aware what that means. Im saying you cant debunk sh*t cuz you know absolutely nothing about the game. So why dont you go to some other site to contribute your stupid f*cking opinions. Ok: i dont know anything about the game either, but as i stated before. Itd be a fresh storyline turn if the bad guy was a good guy. The emotion that gta iv put into their story left the possibility that what the protags are involved in is a bad thing. Marston and bellic both want to be good. I can also see how people have the feeling that michael has the sinister vibe. Gtawiki for michael's character page said michael seems good compared to trevor, but in the end you might find the opposite. They never directly "debunked" the fact that a betrayal could happen So rjeev142.....do us all a favor and shut the f*ck up. Fresh storyline? That happens in EVERY gta game! In gta 3, Salvatore leone betrays you. In vice city, sonny forelli and lance Vance betray you. In San Andreas, Ryder and big smoke, both good guys turn out to be antagonists and betray you. In gta 4, dimitri acts like an ally, but then betrays you. In tlad, Brian betrays you and forms a different faction of the lost. In tbogt, Bulgarian is a buisness partner, but then betrays you. If one of the 3 protagonists betrays the others, it will be one of THE MOST cliche things that rockstar could do. It wouldn't be fresh at all. And considering you're going around saying f this f that f you, then you're obviously the one who needs to contribute your opinion elsewhere. It would be fresh because it would be the first time that we actually play both the protagonist & the antagonist. Like I pointed out earlier... it's very possible. Especially considering Dan Houser himself said we will play both the antagonist & protagonist. Would certainly be a bold new direction in storytelling. Here's what I said on the previous page in case you missed it: But anyway, it seems that you are confused by the definition of antagonist. Antagonists are the ones that conflict the actions of the protagonists. They basically try to undermine the goals of the protagonist. In V, we have 3 protagonists... because we get to control them all. But that doesn't mean none of them can be the antagonist. For example: if I'm playing as Michael, and there comes a point in the story where you have to betray Franklin or Trevor to the FIB for the well-being of your family, as Michael... that would benefit him & his goals, and us as the player, we view him as the protagonist trying to look out for his family. But, Michael's actions would be considered antagonistic to Franklin & Trevor because his goal undermines theirs. So in that case, he would be the antagonist in THEIR eyes. Something like that is what I'm talking about. Edited February 16, 2013 by GTA-King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaWaveMovement Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'm really against the whole female antagonist thing. I hate the overly c*nty female antagonist cliche. Don't recall any since Catalina tbh, hardly counts as a cliche ?! The point is an antagonist who attacks you in others ways, rather than the usual business of sending waves of gunmen at you to be taken out. I didn't mean within GTA but movies and such. Every female antagonist is like overly bitchy. Like that ATF agent in soa I know what you mean. This franchise has a history of putting cliches to good use though Its doesnt have to be like that as well, Vasquez could be a likable character just doing her job. But still antagonist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAVittorio24 Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 @rjeev You misunderstood or maybe i explained. By good guy, i dont necessarily mean a protag. I mean a good guy. Someone who would be the protag in a cheap Hollywood action flick. Can you deny though that michael has the essence of sinister and good storytelling could elegantly lead him to be at odds with the others. Not really evil. And good storytelling would make it fresh. Although agreed that betrayal is common in gta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsbadreligion Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 (edited) An idea of mine of a good antagonist: A highly specialized highly trained and highly deceptive antagonist that is in a place of big power(like someone with a really high military ranking, leader of swat, police captain, mexican cartel leader/co leader, gang leader, etc.) Someone that is very dangerous and has connects to get him pretty much whatever he wants but he is also very skilled with hand to hand combat, guns, knives, etc. I would also love a psycho antagonist like vaas. Maybe a group of antagonists that you have to take out one by one(maybe around 3-5 of them). I want the antagonist to feel dangerous like somebody not to f*ck with. maybe even a serial killer. I feel like most of the antagonists just run away and hide when they are caught i want a guy crazy enough to end his life before you get a chance to just to let himself know he was unstoppable. Edited February 17, 2013 by gsbadreligion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deffpony Posted February 17, 2013 Author Share Posted February 17, 2013 Something that was sh*tty about IV was you didnt have any kind of contact with or for Dimitri for like 30 missions. It was friggin ridiculous. Who is the antagonist again?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildBrick142 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 I agree with you. But sonny forelli never double crossed you tommy vercetti double crossed him. Actualy, Sonny sent Tommy to kill one man but it ended up with and ambush and Tommy ended in prison. He was later released by Sonny and sent to Vice City to do a deal but he was ambushed by Diaz. Sonny being mad at this and wanting money back he started planning against Tommy and then by the end of game he sent goons to rob Tommy's business and got Lance to backstab Tommy. So actually Sonny double-crossed Tommy since the beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyobo893 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 The antagonist should just start out as a general nuisance and then become more of a threat as the story proceeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mob_Boss Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Yeah I agree this "double crossing" thing is getting old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtremoMania Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 If done correctly, the idea of a friendly character turning out to be the enemy can actually add to the surprise and dramatic impact of the game's storyline. This was particularly with the case of Big Smoke in GTA: San Andreas and Lance in GTA: Vice City - both of whom are seen being friendly and helping out the main protagonist in their respective games and then, suddenly betraying the main protagonists when given the opportunity. Dimitri, on the other-hand, was kind of a given from the very first moment that Niko meets him that he would betray Niko at some stage in GTA IV's storyline. I do agree though that the whole idea of friend becoming foe does become very predictable after a while if it is used very often. Personally, I would like an integrated story in GTA V that is similar to Red Dead Redemption's (minus the ending) where a couple of crooks would have the protagonists do a series of heists in order to get these crooks off their backs. The story would then wind down and become more relaxed before an epic ending and final confrontation with the game's main antagonist. In fact, I could actually see this scenario happening because of Michael's deal with the FIB. This In the sense that in all GTA series, antagonists always start out as a friend then turning out to be an enemy at the same point. Lance Vance, Big Smoke, and Dimitri (although I always predict he would one day betray Niko) being always the most unlikely to be an enemy because they help the protagonist in certain acquaintances. I always think that the friend-or-foe idea best fits in most storyline in GTA series and I believe it doesn't really getting old. Sometimes something has to revamp to work that well and an unpredictable to happen. But for GTA V, I would like to expect the main antagonist being an enemy already like Frank Tenpenny in GTA San Andreas as Michael's deal with the FIB best fits here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clem Fandango Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 This is something that I haven't given much thought to; I've never even really thought about this game having an antagonist. We don't really need one now that I think about it, kind of a bit bored of killing baddies, how about just an insanely daring heist for the last mission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omer19992010 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Since we have 3 different protagonist we're probably Going to have 3 antagonists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody112 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Something that was sh*tty about IV was you didnt have any kind of contact with or for Dimitri for like 30 missions. It was friggin ridiculous. Who is the antagonist again?? Lol. Kinda like Bully, where they would constantly talk about Gary screwing them over, yet not appearing for about 80% of the game. On-topic: Michael's FBI handlers seem like an obvious prediction, but I have a feeling there will be a bit of a war between Michael and Trevor, and Franklin will be the deciding factor in the victor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTA-King Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 (edited) ...I have a feeling there will be a bit of a war between Michael and Trevor, and Franklin will be the deciding factor in the victor. I have that exact same feeling. Michael is the sociopath and Trevor is the psychopath... which means Franklin is the balance of those two traits. So it would make sense, if in the end, Franklin would have to decide who doesn't weigh the most... and kill him. So in that essence, I guess you could say Franklin is the "pure" protagonist, whereas Michael & Trevor are both the protagonists/antagonists... but one of them dies at the end depending on the player's choice. Another ending could be when the protagonists/antagonists win (Michael & Trevor) because they put their differences aside to team up and kill Franklin (the pure protagonist) because they know he's going to kill one of them (kind of like if Dwayne and Playboy X teamed up to kill Niko). Just speculating... Edited February 17, 2013 by GTA-King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTA-King Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 bump, because I find this thread very interesting... and I would like to discuss the possibility of the things mentioned in my previous post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTA fan from the United Kingdom Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 How funny would it be if Trevor was caught f*cking Amanda! Now THAT would be a betrayal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FAH-Q Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 How funny would it be if Trevor was caught f*cking Amanda! Now THAT would be a betrayal! I think Michael would love that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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