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GTA boundaries


LotusRIP

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Rockstar says:

There was never meant to be anything on the other end of the tunnel, we were just playing with ways to make the world feel like it continues past the physical boundary. It’s something that we’ve been pushing in all sorts of ways ever since, making the world you experience as a player feel like it’s part of something bigger. This tunnel was one of our first little baby steps in that direction. 

http://www.rockstargames.com/newswire/arti...911-the-gh.html

 

Did anybody feel like they were part of something bigger in GTAIV? I hope I'm not the only one in saying this, but I felt anything but... it was like a random city in the middle of the water and not belonging to a world of any kind at all.

 

I think this goes against the answer R* have given to this question, because I could say the same about Vice City (San Andreas not so much because at least it felt like a miniature country in itself anyway!). How do you think this way of thinking could be applied to GTAV's boundaries? I've heard all talks about endless mountain ranges and desert to the island theory, but what do you think R* would go for with the above quote in mind?

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JoanCrawford

In previous games, I felt like the water was more of a symbolic boundry instead of a physical one.

G1T
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I was totally trying to find that aspect of GTA IV while I was reading that... But then again, I guess GTA IV gets a pass since it is a more detailed version of NYC, which is indeed a group of islands

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not sure if this belongs here but

 

yes and no - IV was big so it didn't feel TOO strange with all the water but tbh the entire norther shorelines felt too lonely. What should they have done instead? another blocked tunnel? highway to nowhere?

I think it's a question of practicality more then design.

 

What would have been good was to have other cities visible in the distance, like Vice city had with boats on the horizon (there was a mod that enabled this). Or perhaps mountains but then NYC doesnt have mountains. I cant think of what they could have put that would have fited.

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this also adds more to the theory that part of Los Santos will be land-locked by mountains, because there WILL be something beyond the mountains, we just won't know what.

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In previous games, I felt like the water was more of a symbolic boundry instead of a physical one.

Excatly

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this also adds more to the theory that part of Los Santos will be land-locked by mountains, because there WILL be something beyond the mountains, we just won't know what.

Yes, and I can definitely see Red Dead Redemption as an exemplar for that, and their quote about GTA boundaries. If it's the impression of an endless world they want, they certainly achieved it in RDR with unpassable mountains. I'm guessing it will be the same deal in GTAV, especially considering how easy and believable it will be (as mentioned, NYC surrounded by mountains? lol).

 

I think in IV they could have done something similar to GTA3's tunnels you couldn't enter... but I can see myself getting extremely frustrated like in LA Noire or True Crime etc where you know what you're missing out on with a world within reach, but no way to access it. I know the water does work well to give you a sense of freedom, but then again, it's interesting that they would actually want the world to feel it continues... because I don't know if the 2 are possible together.

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GTAWithStyle

GTAV will be surrounded by endless ocean, having mountains too high to fly over would destroy the illusion of an open world. Endless ocean is the best way to do it

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To be honest, I'm getting tired of the water boundary. The more I think about an endless desert, the more I like it. And I'm not bothered by the issue of it not leading anywhere, because the body of water we're always planted in never leads anywhere either. But I like driving in cars way more than I do riding on boats, so I'd have more fun racing my car through an endless desert than doing the same on a boat in an endless ocean.

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To be honest, I'm getting tired of the water boundary. The more I think about an endless desert, the more I like it. And I'm not bothered by the issue of it not leading anywhere, because the body of water we're always planted in never leads anywhere either. But I like driving in cars way more than I do riding on boats, so I'd have more fun racing my car through an endless desert than doing the same on a boat in an endless ocean.

This, nothing is stopping them from creating randomly generated land like they do water. In fact it would be a major improvement really. But I think they should make sure they don't f*ck that up too. Have a highway or two with signs that say to "Phoenix" or to wherever and the highways and roads randomly generate continually too past a certain point on the map. I don't see how that would be very hard, just keep cars, road, a few bushes and land spawning.

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Stoic Intrusion

 

this also adds more to the theory that part of Los Santos will be land-locked by mountains, because there WILL be something beyond the mountains, we just won't know what.

They can't landlock GTA 5 unless they make an invisible border or they respawn the player somewhere. If there are planes and a coast and lets say the mountians are to high to fly over them you could still just fly around the mountians. Thats called logic you know use your brain.

Edited by Kai Jellyboo
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This is interesting. I played RDR but hated every single minute not my cup of tea, but I did notice the unpassable mountains and the unability to swim. I hope that both of these features won't return in GTA V.

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I think if you look all the open-world games they've done since since, they consistently use the endless moat when usable aircraft are featured. (Another answer makes clear sustained Dodo flight in GTA III is a bug, not a feature.) When the player is grounded, as in Bully, Red Dead Redemption or L.A. Noire, they get more creative with boundaries.

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They should have it like a film I once watched. You'll keep going into the horizon then boom you hit a wall! Then you realise your whole life was a TV show.

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I think if you look all the open-world games they've done since since, they consistently use the endless moat when usable aircraft are featured. (Another answer makes clear sustained Dodo flight in GTA III is a bug, not a feature.) When the player is grounded, as in Bully, Red Dead Redemption or L.A. Noire, they get more creative with boundaries.

this,But R* never made LA Noire just published,but since GTA series is now more advance I think we won't be grounded anymore but more of a illusion.

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I always feel a part of something bigger in all GTA games, especially VC and SA. IV was a little different as some places felt so lonely, but I still had a sense of more outside the boundaries.

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I think the island and endless ocean design is fine and has worked well in the past three maps. It has become a staple of the series. Like it has been pointed out already, RDR is not GTA and neither should strive to be like the other. With jets there is no such thing as impassable mountain ranges. Endless desert takes away from believability and makes you think you are in the twilight zone. An island is the best way.

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GRINCH ASS BITCH

I did feel like I was a part of something bigger when playing GTA:III, since there's a large portion of land that's (normally) inaccessible. With the closed tunnels and all, it genuinely felt like there was something "over there."

 

Too bad there wasn't lol.

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FelipeVinhao

That's what I liked on GTA3. Some may think this cut the illusion of freedom, but it makes more believable, makes the city part of the world.

 

GTA5 should take advantage of the natural boundaries of real Los Angeles and limit the scenario this way - endless water on southwest, endless land / mountains on northeast.

 

To not have the need to generate infinite random terrain, they could simply add an "invisible detour" - let's say if you fly your plane too far from the city, the games throws it back to city direction without crashing it.

 

In floor level, some block roads with signs indicating they lead to San Fierro and Las Venturas (just to make some people around here crazy tounge.gif).

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Just curious... has any other game done infinite land/desert before? (apart from Desert Bus)

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Invisible Don
Just curious... has any other game done infinite land/desert before? (apart from Desert Bus)

Minecraft, and Fuel has a very large procedurally generated map. It takes like 3 hours to cross it.

 

Procedurally generated maps tend to get really screwy at big distances though, so it would have to be something very simple if it was actually going to be infinite.

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Invisible Don
I think the map will be surround by water just like gta4.

Since SoCal East of Los Angeles is mostly desert, it seems pretty unlikely. Taking a landlocked, desert region and suddenly turning it into a coast would ruin the feel of it. GTA IV worked as an island because all of the area it covered was coastal. If it had been the whole of New York state, it wouldn't have been the same.

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Just curious... has any other game done infinite land/desert before? (apart from Desert Bus)

Minecraft, and Fuel has a very large procedurally generated map. It takes like 3 hours to cross it.

 

Procedurally generated maps tend to get really screwy at big distances though, so it would have to be something very simple if it was actually going to be infinite.

Well if the rumours are anything to go by (lol, I know) apparently it's endless desert with a lone road going all the way through it. When you get to a certain distance it says "There's nothing out here, and it's a bit scary" or something along those lines if I recall. I think something like that could work, and when it gives you that message it turns you around automatically. I'd live with that very easily - just enough infinity to shred up some dirt with a Sanchez tounge.gif

 

I've never heard of Minecraft or Fuel... but I guess it sounds like it's a possibility then.

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I very much expect Rockstar to use the old tried and tested technique of island in an endless sea.

 

It would be nice if they tried something different. I'm sure there are established techniques for the procedural generation of land. It would make sense to have endless ocean to the West, endless green terrain to the North and endless desert to the East and South. With a Mexican border along the Southern parallel of the map and extending endlessly East with the 6 star wanted level that implies if you cross it or make landfall South of the border. It does mean endless coast running North and endless coast running South; all would have to be procedurally generated.

 

They could use pseudo randomly generated terrain incorporating co-ordinates as seeds to control the topography of the land and placement of landscape elements such as rocks, grasses, Joshua trees, cacti and other desert vegetation. Or they could utilise some kind of fractal geometry. Or a combo of both. Just so long as the landscape is consistently the same in any given spot. Add additional rules to control coastal variations, how it joins up with the main playing area and to stop any impossible topography and you're done. Infinite terrain.

 

But then you run into problems with small scale texture placement. It would need to be intelligent and techniques would be required to make sure adjacent textures do not look unnatural. So perhaps it would be simpler to use "tiles". An endless desert could be created by using huge repeating hand designed "tiles" of landscape (say 1 mile or more square). Each tile would be topographically identical with little hills and gulleys, cleverly designed so that the edges join up with each other. These would be placed outside the main playing area using simple mathematical placement. There would have to be special coastal tiles to provide the boundary between land and sea. You'd soon realise that bits of landscape repeat at regular intervals, but that doesn't matter too much because it's not the main playing area.

 

Or a combination of any of the above techniques could be used. Say a fractal system could control the large scale roll of the land (nothing too dramatic) and the shape of the coast and then the huge hand designed tiles are mapped onto that.

 

It would make a nice change to do endless landscape. But as I say, I'm not expecting it. Island in endless sea is what I think we'll get albeit with some landscaping tricks (i.e. high ground) along the Northern, Eastern and Southern coasts to make it look like there might be more land beyond.

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I never thought of any GTA game as having anything out across the ocean while playing it but when not playing the game and talking about the games I imagine them all being on one earth...

 

Sure, the endless ocean has been done before, but it works. Honestly, I'll be pissed off if the game does attempt to feature a massive immovable object like a mountain as with planes there would always be a way to pass it.

 

Save The Ocean

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Horse With No Name
They should have it like a film I once watched. You'll keep going into the horizon then boom you hit a wall! Then you realise your whole life was a TV show.

The Truman Show biggrin.gif

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They should have it like a film I once watched. You'll keep going into the horizon then boom you hit a wall! Then you realise your whole life was a TV show.

Truman Show,that was great movie.

And best way is keep it simple,what they did in all other GTA's with endless ocean or just invisible wall with out explanation like in some parts of GTA III map.Other solution could be like in Scarface:the World Is Yours where they got two zones;Miami and Bahami islands so when you leaving Miami you just entering Islands,and when leaving Islands they just sent you to Miami.

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