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Starting a criminal empire...


Leve-O

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Ok, so it may be true that I watch too much TV. But somedays at work I will day dream about being a drug lord, or a pimp... or something of that nature. It just makes me think, "Man, these guys are living the good life." Which brings me to the topic. Have you ever thought about stuff like this? If so, please elaborate. Also, for the ideas given, discuss ways in which you would go about that certain activity without getting caught. Like the topic says though. Hypothetical, but serious discussion!

Edited by Leve-O

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And now we play the waiting game...

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Indeed you do watch too much TV, and they only portray what's "glamorous". Consider the implications of being a drug lord. The richer/more powerful you get, the more enemies you make and the more people will be looking to taking you down. Thus, you'd live in paranoia of getting killed by anyone you know, cause you can't trust everyone else 100% for each man has it's price.

 

Not to mention that since it's all gained in an illicit way, you'd have to be really, really careful about how you spend your money, and go through a number of banking hoops to make everything appear legit. And of course, you couldn't advertise the fact that you're the lord of a drug empire (not in first world countries at least) or you'd just be painting a target on your chest. Sure, you'd have all the wealth and power, but you'd only have a handful of situations to really enjoy them.

 

And of course, if you do get to be the drug lord, there would in the very least be a ton of blood on your hands. It would be a pretty hard climb, with many possible variables that make it easier to fail rather than succeed at it. And chances are, if you do succeed, you'd die in a decade after achieving the height of your power, living roughly to be middle aged.

 

But of course, it all depends on your definition of "good life". If you think living large is having a pile of money, loads of drugs, all sorts of trashy hos, live in fear of getting taken down, then by all means it's a good life. Me, I'd rather own a proper corporate empire, with more legal money, and a hell of a lot more prestige.

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Indeed you do watch too much TV, and they only portray what's "glamorous". Consider the implications of being a drug lord. The richer/more powerful you get, the more enemies you make and the more people will be looking to taking you down. Thus, you'd live in paranoia of getting killed by anyone you know, cause you can't trust everyone else 100% for each man has it's price.

 

Not to mention that since it's all gained in an illicit way, you'd have to be really, really careful about how you spend your money, and go through a number of banking hoops to make everything appear legit. And of course, you couldn't advertise the fact that you're the lord of a drug empire (not in first world countries at least) or you'd just be painting a target on your chest. Sure, you'd have all the wealth and power, but you'd only have a handful of situations to really enjoy them.

 

And of course, if you do get to be the drug lord, there would in the very least be a ton of blood on your hands. It would be a pretty hard climb, with many possible variables that make it easier to fail rather than succeed at it. And chances are, if you do succeed, you'd die in a decade after achieving the height of your power, living roughly to be middle aged.

 

But of course, it all depends on your definition of "good life". If you think living large is having a pile of money, loads of drugs, all sorts of trashy hos, live in fear of getting taken down, then by all means it's a good life. Me, I'd rather own a proper corporate empire, with more legal money, and a hell of a lot more prestige.

Very true. As of becoming a drug lord, once you become champion, then all that is left is defending your title. But here's a hypothetical situation. You're about 50 years old. You have a mid-life crisis which consists of you thinking that you're whole life prior you've had no fun with it. Never took any chances at all. I for one would want to make alot of money in quick succession.

 

Also let's say at this point in your life you have absolutely no fear of death. You just want to "live fast" in the last decades of your life.

Edited by Leve-O

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And now we play the waiting game...

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Isn't this why we play the RPGames? A really good one would be Fu Manchu.

 

And... It isn't necessary to Quote unanswered postings immediately previous to yours, especially large ones. Please, use theAdd-Reply or Fast-reply buttons at the bottom of the page.

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Ok, so it may be true that I watch too much TV. But somedays at work I will day dream about being a drug lord, or a pimp... or something of that nature. It just makes me think, "Man, these guys are living the good life." Which brings me to the topic. Have you ever thought about stuff like this? If so, please elaborate. Also, for the ideas given, discuss ways in which you would go about that certain activity without getting caught. Like the topic says though. Hypothetical, but serious discussion!

Drug lords don't make it past 35 and all the glamour,wealth and power only last for a short amount of time, i would rather be bill gates and jay z rich then earning my cash the illegal way just to be chase by the rivals and feds. Also ease up on the tv for a while lol.

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Sorry about the immediate quotes lil weasel. I will not do it like that anymore.

 

And OT, I'm just going to stop watching TV for awhile. lol

Edited by Leve-O

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And now we play the waiting game...

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Indeed you do watch too much TV, and they only portray what's "glamorous". Consider the implications of being a drug lord. The richer/more powerful you get, the more enemies you make and the more people will be looking to taking you down. Thus, you'd live in paranoia of getting killed by anyone you know, cause you can't trust everyone else 100% for each man has it's price.

 

Not to mention that since it's all gained in an illicit way, you'd have to be really, really careful about how you spend your money, and go through a number of banking hoops to make everything appear legit. And of course, you couldn't advertise the fact that you're the lord of a drug empire (not in first world countries at least) or you'd just be painting a target on your chest. Sure, you'd have all the wealth and power, but you'd only have a handful of situations to really enjoy them.

 

And of course, if you do get to be the drug lord, there would in the very least be a ton of blood on your hands. It would be a pretty hard climb, with many possible variables that make it easier to fail rather than succeed at it. And chances are, if you do succeed, you'd die in a decade after achieving the height of your power, living roughly to be middle aged.

 

But of course, it all depends on your definition of "good life". If you think living large is having a pile of money, loads of drugs, all sorts of trashy hos, live in fear of getting taken down, then by all means it's a good life. Me, I'd rather own a proper corporate empire, with more legal money, and a hell of a lot more prestige.

Very true. As of becoming a drug lord, once you become champion, then all that is left is defending your title. But here's a hypothetical situation. You're about 50 years old. You have a mid-life crisis which consists of you thinking that you're whole life prior you've had no fun with it. Never took any chances at all. I for one would want to make alot of money in quick succession.

 

Also let's say at this point in your life you have absolutely no fear of death. You just want to "live fast" in the last decades of your life.

You've been watching too much Breaking Bad! tounge.gif

 

Seriously though, I know quite a few people who are involved in the criminal underworld. They're far from ruling an "empire" or something like that. It's a life of paranoia, instability and excess and not really a lot of room for relaxation or tranquility. Some of them just get into this mindset of, "Well, the cops can break down the door any minute now... I might as well make some tacos." If you ever find yourself in a room with a bunch of guys reminiscing jail like they were the best of times, you know what I'm talking about.

 

The reality of it is that... This idea of being a "drug lord" or something like that, there's very little chance of anyone ever actually becoming that. I mean sure, you have your people like Frank Lucas and his partner Nicky Barnes that became pretty much the drug kingpins of New York, but when is the last time you really heard of a story like that?

 

I think that's what gets a lot of young people caught up in the criminal life style. Imagining being the next Pablo Escobar. I mean, hell, walk into any street-level gang bangers house right now, and tell me if you don't find a Scarface poster.

 

 

In all reality though, the number of people who dream about that who will ever become anything like it is about 1 in 1,000,000. Most of the time, the people that blow up and become huge names in the drug/crime world... George Jung, Pablo Escobar, Frank Lucas & Nickey Barnes, etc. None of them started out saying, "I want to be a huge drug lord." At least according to their biographers, most of them started out having no idea of how huge they would become.

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Yeah, I just re-watched all the seasons of Breaking Bad. lol, so that has to be some sort of contribution to the thoughts I've had lately while at work.

 

It could be because I hate my job. I don't know. I'm the kind of person who thinks too much I guess. I find myself thinking how to get away with crimes. Nothing like murder. Like here recently I've been thinking about what it would be like to start a weed grow operation. Weighing the pros and cons of it. Is thoughts like this really bad? I've been going to bed very late for months now, and even while I'm laying on the couch late at night I run different scenarios through my head.

 

lol, I dunno if I'm losing it, or if I should stop watching Weeds.

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And now we play the waiting game...

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Yeah, I just re-watched all the seasons of Breaking Bad. lol, so that has to be some sort of contribution to the thoughts I've had lately while at work.

 

It could be because I hate my job. I don't know. I'm the kind of person who thinks too much I guess. I find myself thinking how to get away with crimes. Nothing like murder. Like here recently I've been thinking about what it would be like to start a weed grow operation. Weighing the pros and cons of it. Is thoughts like this really bad? I've been going to bed very late for months now, and even while I'm laying on the couch late at night I run different scenarios through my head.

 

lol, I dunno if I'm losing it, or if I should stop watching Weeds.

Heh, yeah, I don't think it's really a bad thing to fantasize about that kind of stuff. It's fun... But don't get reality confused with fantasy man. There is literally no one I have seen ever go into "crime" that has made a good go of it, and I know quite a bit of people of that nature because my parents were reformed drug addicts big into AA and so they were always helping other reformed drug addicts/criminals and sh*t. I even knew some guys that tried to rob some banks.

 

It's just a losing game in the end. Personally I think the biggest name ever in respect to the criminal world and drug dealing is Pablo Escobar. The guy kept himself out of jail by paying off the nation's national debt. He practically owned that place. Just read about what happened to him though. I read a biography on him written by his accountant. Turns out he started out as a professional bicycle racer.

 

And yeah, Breaking Bad kicks ass. You should check out The Wire if you haven't.

Edited by SagaciousKJB

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Wow, that's some crazy stuff!

 

In the end, the thoughts in my head will be just that... thoughts. I'm not one of them people that copies what they see in movies or video games. I'm sure everyone has had thoughts like these in their life.

 

@SagaciousKJB: That's like the 10th time someone has told me to watch The Wire. I gotta check it out!

Edited by Leve-O

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Yep, You watch to much TV, but so do I so I can share you're thoughts. Firstly on a serious note, I would never become a serious criminal because although they may live the glamorous life, they also face prison and even death.

 

E.g. Lately one of Italy's most wanted men, Michele Zagaria has been caught hiding in a bunker underground after 16 years on the run. He ran everything from Extortion, Drug trafficking, Prostitution, money laundering operations, he is allegedly one of Italy's top businessmen and has infiltrated much of Italy's politics. With the crime family he oversees worth more than 20 billion euros. Yes, he did live the life of glamour and wealth as it is reported he was so powerfull he used to hold his meetings in police stations and owned many mansions or more like palaces whilst owning many pet tigers. However when the law caught up with him, he was caught only two days ago and now faces life in prison.

 

Some locals actually supported him, they preferred him than the police. Others say that because of the fall of Berlusconi's government his protection ran out. Now they will just try and infiltrate another up and coming party, however not Mari Monti's technocratic government because they are only "Temporary" apparently.

 

I'll try and find the links for proof. Also this explains why although running a criminal empire might be tempting and very profitable and make you powerful, it has many downfalls.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-20...ret-bunker.html

 

http://www.sabotagetimes.com/people/silvio...i-will-be-back/

 

 

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Ok, so it may be true that I watch too much TV. But somedays at work I will day dream about being a drug lord, or a pimp... or something of that nature. It just makes me think, "Man, these guys are living the good life." Which brings me to the topic. Have you ever thought about stuff like this? If so, please elaborate. Also, for the ideas given, discuss ways in which you would go about that certain activity without getting caught. Like the topic says though. Hypothetical, but serious discussion!

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Ok, so it may be true that I watch too much TV. But somedays at work I will day dream about being a drug lord, or a pimp... or something of that nature. It just makes me think, "Man, these guys are living the good life." Which brings me to the topic. Have you ever thought about stuff like this? If so, please elaborate. Also, for the ideas given, discuss ways in which you would go about that certain activity without getting caught. Like the topic says though. Hypothetical, but serious discussion!

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I often find my mind drifting off into some bizarre place where I'm some evil criminal/terrorist guy. I plot bombing different locations all at once and then putting bombs outside so when the survivors rush out they get cut to shreds. Kinda sick, well not kinda, it IS sick. I've thought about what it would be like to bomb a sports stadium, a school, a hospital, shopping centre, airport, bus terminal, train station. God there's something wrong with me.

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Just don't do it when you're a married man.

And certainly not with a broad with a brother in-law in the DEA.

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Ok, so it may be true that I watch too much TV. But somedays at work I will day dream about being a drug lord, or a pimp... or something of that nature. It just makes me think, "Man, these guys are living the good life." Which brings me to the topic. Have you ever thought about stuff like this? If so, please elaborate. Also, for the ideas given, discuss ways in which you would go about that certain activity without getting caught. Like the topic says though. Hypothetical, but serious discussion!

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The only virtue needed to maintain any kind of criminal empire is humility. The cops can tolerate a criminal as long as he does not flaunt his wealth and only harms the 'right sort' of person.

Look at Carlo Gambino. Lived in a small house in a nice neighbourhood, offered FBI agents lemonade, seemed like a kindly old grandfather. Who would have thought he was an immoral, murdering scumbag who dabbled in child porn?

Men like Gambino last far longer than the insane braggarts like Gotti and Escobar. No 'celebrity criminal' ever stayed alive or free long enough to enjoy the fame. All a criminal needs is to make money, save it wisely and be very, very quiet.

I imagine that subtle coercion and intimidation of the press is a necessity too.

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Finn 7 five 11

Well if i were to be a drug dealer, simplest thing you can do to avoid suspicion, home deliveries, when every junkie on the block is coming to your house it's pretty obvious, so you deliver to them...like pizza.

 

As for being a drug lord, well that would be difficult, i not sure how i would go about that, i would do as Typhus suggested, keep it simple, and on the downlow.

 

But yes i have thought about it, and thought it would be cool to have drug wars and such.

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The only virtue needed to maintain any kind of criminal empire is humility. The cops can tolerate a criminal as long as he does not flaunt his wealth and only harms the 'right sort' of person.

Look at Carlo Gambino. Lived in a small house in a nice neighbourhood, offered FBI agents lemonade, seemed like a kindly old grandfather. Who would have thought he was an immoral, murdering scumbag who dabbled in child porn?

Men like Gambino last far longer than the insane braggarts like Gotti and Escobar. No 'celebrity criminal' ever stayed alive or free long enough to enjoy the fame. All a criminal needs is to make money, save it wisely and be very, very quiet.

I imagine that subtle coercion and intimidation of the press is a necessity too.

I agree with this to a certain extent. But Carlo Gambino probably was one of a kind. Who wants to get involved in all these criminal rackets and not spend their money on luxury goods? What's the point of making billions of dollars annually whilst spending you're life in a small house, owning a not so nice car e.t.c.?

 

In my opinion, the best way to avoid prosecution for a criminal, especially for mafia criminals is to simply either use code in case of wire taps which in their case is very common, and just not be a loud mouth. The best way to turn the public's eye away from a criminal like that is to simply deny who the government say you are or just not say anything at all. You're right, John Gotti ruined the Gambino family in his era. If you look today I bet hardly anybody even knows know who runs the Gambino family. That's because he's not a snazzy loudmouth who thinks he's untouchable. Look him up if you want, but apart from the internet, you would probably never even of heard have him. That is really the way it should be.

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The only virtue needed to maintain any kind of criminal empire is humility. The cops can tolerate a criminal as long as he does not flaunt his wealth and only harms the 'right sort' of person.

Look at Carlo Gambino. Lived in a small house in a nice neighbourhood, offered FBI agents lemonade, seemed like a kindly old grandfather. Who would have thought he was an immoral, murdering scumbag who dabbled in child porn?

Men like Gambino last far longer than the insane braggarts like Gotti and Escobar. No 'celebrity criminal' ever stayed alive or free long enough to enjoy the fame. All a criminal needs is to make money, save it wisely and be very, very quiet.

I imagine that subtle coercion and intimidation of the press is a necessity too.

I agree with this to a certain extent. But Carlo Gambino probably was one of a kind. Who wants to get involved in all these criminal rackets and not spend their money on luxury goods? What's the point of making billions of dollars annually whilst spending you're life in a small house, owning a not so nice car e.t.c.?

The power. The thrill of controlling who lives and who dies, the excitement of outfoxing the authorities and making other people fear and respect you. That must be quite an exhilarating feeling.

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@Typhus : Very True.

 

Anyway if I hypothetically were to create a criminal empire, this is probably how I would do it.

 

I'd have to start up first, so I'd probably form a small gang of roughly 10 people and start a robbery crew. The rules would be simple, don't rat, always be careful and don't be loud. I'd also start some extortion rackets on businesses and threaten the owners life's as well as their families if they did anything to upset the flow of things.

 

eventually I'd put the profits I'd made from these previous criminal rackets into larger and more lucrative rackets such as Narcotics trafficking, I'd probably start selling lower class drugs first such as weed and hashish to local street dealers, Also Id probably buy the drugs off larger criminal organizations such as a Mexican cartel or an Italian mafia crime family preferably Montreal because I hear the stuff they get their is really good. I would keep this cycle going and as more people get recruited these criminal rackets would extend further into the area or city.

 

Then it's all about hiding the money, I'd probably do this by opening up a few restaurants and maybe opening up a cement firm supplying construction industries. As a become wealthier I would bribe my lawyer/accountant to help me show a clear income and also allow my businesses to tax evade so this increases my disposable income. since I have the cement firm I obviously would want more companies to buy it, so I would tell them to buy from me, tell the other firms to back off, and if they didn't people would get hurt and things would get destroyed.

 

Hopefully after I generate much profit from this I could maybe bribe a few cops and if I'm lucky I might just be able to find a crooked FBI agent who could tell me where wire taps are and when an indictment would be coming down on my crew. Don't forget that Gambling and loan sharking would be rackets within my now highly enforced crew, and just remember cops and other businessmen gamble like degenerates as well and if they ever fail to pay a debt I can make good use of them as well.

 

Yeah, this cycle would keep on going until I reached further power. I would live in a nice house, buy nice suits and what not, but I would never make fun or jeer the FBI and government and if they ever arrested me I would deny all accusations and keep my head down whilst wearing a crappy pair of tracksuit top and bottoms.

 

All disputes would be solved peacefully if possible to keep the heat off me, but if there ever was a rat or if a guy was getting real out of control, he would be killed making sure that there is no proof of the person killing him.

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It will never happen, especially if you have to talk about it on a message board. Maybe just cut down on the video games a tad.

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@Typhus : Very True.

 

Anyway if I hypothetically were to create a criminal empire, this is probably how I would do it.

 

I'd have to start up first, so I'd probably form a small gang of roughly 10 people and start a robbery crew. The rules would be simple, don't rat, always be careful and don't be loud. I'd also start some extortion rackets on businesses and threaten the owners life's as well as their families if they did anything to upset the flow of things.

 

eventually I'd put the profits I'd made from these previous criminal rackets into larger and more lucrative rackets such as Narcotics trafficking, I'd probably start selling lower class drugs first such as weed and hashish to local street dealers, Also Id probably buy the drugs off larger criminal organizations such as a Mexican cartel or an Italian mafia crime family preferably Montreal because I hear the stuff they get their is really good. I would keep this cycle going and as more people get recruited these criminal rackets would extend further into the area or city.

 

Then it's all about hiding the money, I'd probably do this by opening up a few restaurants and maybe opening up a cement firm supplying construction industries. As a become wealthier I would bribe my lawyer/accountant to help me show a clear income and also allow my businesses to tax evade so this increases my disposable income. since I have the cement firm I obviously would want more companies to buy it, so I would tell them to buy from me, tell the other firms to back off, and if they didn't people would get hurt and things would get destroyed.

 

Hopefully after I generate much profit from this I could maybe bribe a few cops and if I'm lucky I might just be able to find a crooked FBI agent who could tell me where wire taps are and when an indictment would be coming down on my crew. Don't forget that Gambling and loan sharking would be rackets within my now highly enforced crew, and just remember cops and other businessmen gamble like degenerates as well and if they ever fail to pay a debt I can make good use of them as well.

 

Yeah, this cycle would keep on going until I reached further power. I would live in a nice house, buy nice suits and what not, but I would never make fun or jeer the FBI and government and if they ever arrested me I would deny all accusations and keep my head down whilst wearing a crappy pair of tracksuit top and bottoms.

 

All disputes would be solved peacefully if possible to keep the heat off me, but if there ever was a rat or if a guy was getting real out of control, he would be killed making sure that there is no proof of the person killing him.

So you won't be a loud mouth but will threaten countless people and firms? Do you really not think the latter would go to the cops?

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@Typhus : Very True.

 

Anyway if I hypothetically were to create a criminal empire, this is probably how I would do it.

 

I'd have to start up first, so I'd probably form a small gang of roughly 10 people and start a robbery crew. The rules would be simple, don't rat, always be careful and don't be loud. I'd also start some extortion rackets on businesses and threaten the owners life's as well as their families if they did anything to upset the flow of things.

 

eventually I'd put the profits I'd made from these previous criminal rackets into larger and more lucrative rackets such as Narcotics trafficking, I'd probably start selling lower class drugs first such as weed and hashish to local street dealers, Also Id probably buy the drugs off larger criminal organizations such as a Mexican cartel or an Italian mafia crime family preferably Montreal because I hear the stuff they get their is really good. I would keep this cycle going and as more people get recruited these criminal rackets would extend further into the area or city.

 

Then it's all about hiding the money, I'd probably do this by opening up a few restaurants and maybe opening up a cement firm supplying construction industries. As a become wealthier I would bribe my lawyer/accountant to help me show a clear income and also allow my businesses to tax evade so this increases my disposable income. since I have the cement firm I obviously would want more companies to buy it, so I would tell them to buy from me, tell the other firms to back off, and if they didn't people would get hurt and things would get destroyed.

 

Hopefully after I generate much profit from this I could maybe bribe a few cops and if I'm lucky I might just be able to find a crooked FBI agent who could tell me where wire taps are and when an indictment would be coming down on my crew. Don't forget that Gambling and loan sharking would be rackets within my now highly enforced crew, and just remember cops and other businessmen gamble like degenerates as well and if they ever fail to pay a debt I can make good use of them as well.

 

Yeah, this cycle would keep on going until I reached further power. I would live in a nice house, buy nice suits and what not, but I would never make fun or jeer the FBI and government and if they ever arrested me I would deny all accusations and keep my head down whilst wearing a crappy pair of tracksuit top and bottoms.

 

All disputes would be solved peacefully if possible to keep the heat off me, but if there ever was a rat or if a guy was getting real out of control, he would be killed making sure that there is no proof of the person killing him.

So you won't be a loud mouth but will threaten countless people and firms? Do you really not think the latter would go to the cops?

If they care about their families, no they won't. If they do they would have to be put in witness protection programs which is really life devastating because you have to change who you are. That's not being a loud mouth, being a load mouth is bloating and talking to the media, intimidation of this level is needed to put the scare into people otherwise if you ask kindly what do you think they would say...

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